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On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before.
Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers:
Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares
After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares
The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too.
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
On June 20 2012 23:15 Catyoul wrote:
Previous numbers for loots in act 3 and act 4 :
ilvl 62 was ~25%
ilvl 63 was ~20%
New numbers for act 3 and 4 :
ilvl 62 is 16.1%
ilvl 63 is 8.0%
Here are the independent sources I used for reference :
I sampled my spider/azmo runs for the past week and these were my results:
Total Runs: 33
Total Rares: 483
Total Ilvl 63: 101
Avg Rares (per run): 14.64
Avg Ilvl 63 (per run): 3.00
Ilvl 63 Drop %: 20.91%
Not just you. I keep pretty detailed records of my runs. I've recorded 714 yellows pre-patch. Out of which:
136 were iLVL 63 (19%)
181 were iLVL 62 (25%)
Did not record stats for lower level items.
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Inferno makes a lot more sence now. I play demon hunter and previously it felt like you had to kill everything in a matter of seconds before it 1-shot you. I prepared well for the patch sitting on 40k hp and 500+ resistances and have yet to be 1-shot by anything. At the same time the fix to nether tentacles makes fights a lot longer so fights are a lot more fun. I die less while clearing time is about the same, maybe a bit longer due to the lack of dps but with less starting from checkpoint my time is better spent.
While dmg got reduced a lot of abilities and bosses were made harder which is great. What you have to do is a bit more complicated but also more forgiving. Mortars shoots from waaay out of the screen but I am not getting 1 shotted by it so there is room for error.
Tried Cydaea yet ? Went from a lootbag to take me 8 attempts but found a functional tac that should make it repeatable. Love the fight. In contrast Azmodan went from an extremely unforgiving bloodphase to an utter lootbag.
From a demon hunter who didnt play faceroll glasscannon I am overall very pleased with the changes to the class(even though we got nerfed(fixed!) hard) and inferno difficulty. It is much more enjoyable and sensible now. It just feels more right. Still not perfect I'd say though, would expect a lot of changes to happen in the comming months.
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You get way more rares now, so they had to nerf the droprate on ilvl61-63s. I get at least 150% more rares now, which makes the number of ilvl63s the same as before. And of course, a ton more of everything else.
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On June 21 2012 01:36 Catyoul wrote:Show nested quote +On June 20 2012 23:37 Big G wrote:On June 20 2012 23:15 Catyoul wrote:
Previous numbers for loots in act 3 and act 4 :
ilvl 62 was ~25%
ilvl 63 was ~20%
New numbers for act 3 and 4 :
ilvl 62 is 16.1%
ilvl 63 is 8.0%
Source? It was possible before the patch to know if an item was ilvl 62 or 63 from the name/skin. Those numbers were collected from independent people stats on reddit.
Alright, I second this based on my experience. I just did 3 full runs and got 6 bags full of some level 51 shit, got 1 yellow 63 and 1 yellow 62, maybe 5 rare 61s and that's it! All of the rare stuff that drops is <61 garbage! I've farmed only what I collected as gold. Considering increased repair costs, I'm probably up 60k in 2 hours and one questionable rare that I put up for 20k. That really sucks compare to pre-patch. Really. Going back to SC2 ^^
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too.
Nobody would do 20 elites + 1 boss before patch, they would do 5 elites + boss, with 2 guaranteed rares on the boss, which was much faster. Your comparison is flawed.
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On June 21 2012 01:45 crms wrote:It doesn't because the precendent of the diablo franchise is about efficiently farming loot. It's the only reason the game lasted 10+ years. Do you think killing mephisto 900,000,000 would have been 'fun' if the loot didn't drop? Looting, trading, selling, that's it, that's diablo.
That is your interpretation. I know a "lot" of people play diablo ONLY for the loot. I'm aware of this, and some of those people will be disappointed with this patch.
Killing mephisto 900,000,000 times WASN'T fun for me, that is one of many reasons I STOPPED playing diablo 2 (bots, dupes, etc. also), at least in a multiplayer setting, where after a few years the only remaining people on BNET were bots or people that played that way.
Different people find different things entertaining. For me, playing JUST for loot is boring and, when I think about it, sort of stupid. Killing monsters with somewhat interesting combat, trying new builds, trying new classes, playing with friends, getting loot. Those are the kinds of things I enjoy about Diablo 3. However, I think a lot of people only focus on just the loot. That is fine, different people like different things. Opinions work like that. This patch makes me enjoy the game more, because it seems geared more towards my way of having fun (but that is just my interpretation of it).
Just because you only focus on the loot aspect, doesn't mean everyone else does.
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On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too.
Sure, but no one ever did 20 elites + 1 boss pre-patch.
I frequented one of the most lucrative farming sites - heart of sin, cydea/azmodan run. 7 elites + 2 bosses in about 20-25 min. I'd average about 12-15 rares per game.
I gave the new MF system a new whirl last night. Started from the breached keep (as there are no bosses before ghom), and spent three and a half hours clearing the entirety of act 3 including 3 goblins, 2 resplendent chests, 4 bosses, and 52 elite packs for a total of 97 rares.
Rares/time spent seems to be roughly the same pre and post patch (well, obviously it's a bit more in favor of pre-patch due to experience). I could probably speed that run up a bit more after I get a bit more familiar with monster mechanics, but regardless, there's no way I could possibly approach the amount of ilvl 63 items I was getting pre-patch.
Oh, and after the dust settled, I earned about 100k gold the entire time I spent in act3 - and I vendor everything that doesn't give me exquisite essences. Seems a bit harsh, I died once every two to three elite packs on average ...
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On June 21 2012 01:53 Catyoul wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too. Nobody would do 20 elites + 1 boss before patch, they would do 5 elites + boss, with 2 guaranteed rares on the boss, which was much faster. Your comparison is flawed.
Then change how you farm? 20 elites + 1 boss (post patch) takes less time than 4 runs of 5 elites + 1 boss (pre patch), and thanks to having 5NV for longer will probably have given comparable drops even before patch.
EDIT: Hot damn Phael, how much base MF do you have? I was getting roughly 1 rare every 3 elite packs pre-patch with 5NV and no base MF, but you were averaging more than 1 rare per pack :o
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On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too.
First, your numbers make 0 sense. 1 run of 20 elites and a boss? Who does this? How about you use actual values of 7 elites (on average) + 2 bosses, which was what the old cydea-azmodan runs actually entailed. And then consider ~25% of those rares generally were ilvl63. I'm glad you mathematically found a breaking point of 20 elites and 1 boss that makes the farming equal. I sure hope you enjoy your hour long runs and entire zone clearing searching for 20 packs, 15 of which would actually have the bonus.
Cydea - 2-4 rares
Azmodan 2-4 rares
Elites 3-5 per clear
low range 7 rares, 1.75 being ilvl63 @ 25%
low range 7 rares, .056 being ilvl63 @ 8%
high range 13 rares, 3.25 being ilvl63 @ 25%
high range 13 rares, 1.04% being ilvl63 @ 8%
That is a much more accurate portrayl of the massive nerf.. 20 elites and a boss.. the fuck?
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On June 21 2012 01:53 Catyoul wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too. Nobody would do 20 elites + 1 boss before patch, they would do 5 elites + boss, with 2 guaranteed rares on the boss, which was much faster. Your comparison is flawed.
There is no guaranteed like that, I had 5 stacks and 140% mf and still had none with Siegebreaker. However last night me and my friends run about 15 elites and later on the drop rate were pretty good even without mf gear on, it was all 3 rare items for any elite packs from 10th to 15th.
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On June 21 2012 01:59 crms wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too. First, your numbers make 0 sense. 1 run of 20 elites and a boss? Who does this? How about you use actual values of 7 elites (on average) + 2 bosses, which was what the old cydea-azmodan runs actually entailed. And then consider ~25% of those rares generally were ilvl63. I'm glad you mathematically found a breaking point of 20 elites and 1 boss that makes the farming equal. I sure hope you enjoy your hour long runs and entire zone clearing searching for 20 packs, 15 of which would actually have the bonus. Cydea - 2-4 rares Azmodan 2-4 rares Elites 3-5 per clear low range 7 rares, 1.75 being ilvl63 @ 25% low range 7 rares, .056 being ilvl63 @ 8% high range 13 rares, 3.25 being ilvl63 @ 25% high range 13 rares, 1.04% being ilvl63 @ 8% That is a much more accurate portrayl of the massive nerf.. 20 elites and a boss.. the fuck?
I farmed by doing sections of acts with my friend (monk + barb). We'd go from start of "Find Kulle's blood" Q and finish with Kulle + rare serpent magus pack just before Belial. Didn't usually do Belial because it took us near 15 minutes (and there's no way we could do him now with enrage).
Looks like post patch, I don't have to change my farming pattern at all.
EDIT: When Blizzard give a massive buff to farming elites with 5NV and you choose not to take advantage of that by using a sub-optimal farming routine, that's your problem. Not anyone else's, and certainly not mine 
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On June 21 2012 01:50 Yaotzin wrote:
You get way more rares now, so they had to nerf the droprate on ilvl61-63s. I get at least 150% more rares now, which makes the number of ilvl63s the same as before. And of course, a ton more of everything else.
The problem with increased rare drops is that in act3-4 almost all the rares I get are sub lvlv61, which are all trash.
Also increased repair costs really fucked me hard, built glass-cannon DH, it's so fucking expensive to do runs now, it's actually not worth it. Also item prices have been dropping unreasonably low, so now my Crafting of 6-property belts doesn't yield any return at all.
overall this patch, I fucking hate it.
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For glass cannon playing I honestly just recommend invest in unbreakable gear in all the spots with only 1-2 otherwise desirable stats.
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On June 21 2012 01:53 Catyoul wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too. Nobody would do 20 elites + 1 boss before patch, they would do 5 elites + boss, with 2 guaranteed rares on the boss, which was much faster. Your comparison is flawed.
old siegebreaker run: 5 elites + boss: 2 guaranteed rares, ~16 items that MF decides.
new run: 20 elites + boss: 21 guaranteed rares, ~46 items that MF decides.
I'm ignoring the gradual gaining of valor in this because I can't be arsed.
For the old run to be better in terms of ilvl 63, it must gain >40% of the rares of the new system. Obviously in the above comparison the new run takes longer, but the old run gets 9.5%-27% of the rares of the new one (only guaranteed rares to all rares). So in conclusion, to match the old numbers, you need to do the old run in 25%-67.5% of the time of new run, in order to match it.
For me personally, this adds up to pretty much a wash. At the very least, the nerf isn't nearly as clear-cut as simply looking at 8% to 20%.
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On June 21 2012 01:54 HardlyNever wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:45 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:25 HardlyNever wrote:
Hope that makes some sense. It doesn't because the precendent of the diablo franchise is about efficiently farming loot. It's the only reason the game lasted 10+ years. Do you think killing mephisto 900,000,000 would have been 'fun' if the loot didn't drop? Looting, trading, selling, that's it, that's diablo. That is your interpretation. I know a "lot" of people play diablo ONLY for the loot. I'm aware of this, and some of those people will be disappointed with this patch. Killing mephisto 900,000,000 times WASN'T fun for me, that is one of many reasons I STOPPED playing diablo 2 (bots, dupes, etc. also), at least in a multiplayer setting, where after a few years the only remaining people on BNET were bots or people that played that way. Different people find different things entertaining. For me, playing JUST for loot is boring and, when I think about it, sort of stupid. Killing monsters with somewhat interesting combat, trying new builds, trying new classes, playing with friends, getting loot. Those are the kinds of things I enjoy about Diablo 3. However, I think a lot of people only focus on just the loot. That is fine, different people like different things. Opinions work like that. This patch makes me enjoy the game more, because it seems geared more towards my way of having fun (but that is just my interpretation of it). Just because you only focus on the loot aspect, doesn't mean everyone else does.
This is not MMORPG. This is ARPG. I dont play Diablo 3 for interesting combats, playing with friends. I play Diablo 3 because I want to loot the boss corpse. Diablo 3 is utter crap now because of these WoW dipshits cried about how hard Inferno is. Inferno is supposed to be hard, not a walk in the park for you. Alot of people I know farmed like crazy before they can progress in Inferno. Before 1.0.3, a monk friend has problem with champion/elite pack. After 1.0.3, he just lolstand and tank. Inferno is easy now.
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On June 21 2012 02:02 dmfg wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:59 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too. First, your numbers make 0 sense. 1 run of 20 elites and a boss? Who does this? How about you use actual values of 7 elites (on average) + 2 bosses, which was what the old cydea-azmodan runs actually entailed. And then consider ~25% of those rares generally were ilvl63. I'm glad you mathematically found a breaking point of 20 elites and 1 boss that makes the farming equal. I sure hope you enjoy your hour long runs and entire zone clearing searching for 20 packs, 15 of which would actually have the bonus. Cydea - 2-4 rares Azmodan 2-4 rares Elites 3-5 per clear low range 7 rares, 1.75 being ilvl63 @ 25% low range 7 rares, .056 being ilvl63 @ 8% high range 13 rares, 3.25 being ilvl63 @ 25% high range 13 rares, 1.04% being ilvl63 @ 8% That is a much more accurate portrayl of the massive nerf.. 20 elites and a boss.. the fuck? I farmed by doing sections of acts with my friend (monk + barb). We'd go from start of "Find Kulle's blood" Q and finish with Kulle + rare serpent magus pack just before Belial. Didn't usually do Belial because it took us near 15 minutes (and there's no way we could do him now with enrage). Looks like post patch, I don't have to change my farming pattern at all. EDIT: When Blizzard give a massive buff to farming elites with 5NV and you choose not to take advantage of that by using a sub-optimal farming routine, that's your problem. Not anyone else's, and certainly not mine
thanks for admitting defeat and that your proposed 20 elite strategy is not only a farce but complete bullocks. Farming efficiently for everyone who was good enough to do act 3/4 was severly nerfed into the ground. That's the point and you've been easily rebuked. Have a good day, enjoy act2.
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On June 21 2012 02:05 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:50 Yaotzin wrote:
You get way more rares now, so they had to nerf the droprate on ilvl61-63s. I get at least 150% more rares now, which makes the number of ilvl63s the same as before. And of course, a ton more of everything else. The problem with increased rare drops is that in act3-4 almost all the rares I get are sub lvlv61, which are all trash.
No, 52% of the rares are sub ilvl 61. Unless you want to make a case that Blizzard are lying about those numbers?
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On June 21 2012 02:09 Yaotzin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 01:53 Catyoul wrote:On June 21 2012 01:48 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:43 crms wrote:On June 21 2012 01:39 dmfg wrote:On June 21 2012 01:03 crms wrote:
To clarify, that isn't 25% chance an ilvl63 rare will drop, it's 25% chance that when a rare drops it's ilvl63. However, now it's only 8% in the hardest acts of the game. I run with very little MF, and I am getting much more than 3 times as many rares dropping as I did before (thanks to guaranteed rare from 5NV). Admittedly I only farmed A2 before, but gonna try A3 when my internet next becomes playable. I think people went into this patch thinking that if they were suicide farming A3 before, they could now get 3 times as much good gear dropping every run which is not even close to what the patch is trying to achieve. it doesn't matter how many rares you get if none of them are ilvl63... I'd take 5 ilvl63s over 25 ilv60-62s. Also nobody expected what you said, they straight up nerfed the act3/4 drop rate of ilvl63s. Nobody in act3 will be getting as good of gear, at least as efficiently as before. Let me put it in numbers for you. Assuming you're right about the numbers: Before patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~8 rares drop, 25% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares After patch: 1 run of 20 elites + 1 boss: ~23 rares drop, 8% are ilvl 63 so in total I get 2 ilvl 63 rares, plus a ton more ilvl 61 and 62 rares The number of ilvl 63 rares is unchanged (and that's assuming your numbers are right, which tbh sound too high pre-patch). You just get more other stuff too. Nobody would do 20 elites + 1 boss before patch, they would do 5 elites + boss, with 2 guaranteed rares on the boss, which was much faster. Your comparison is flawed. old siegebreaker run: 5 elites + boss: 2 guaranteed rares, ~16 items that MF decides. new run: 20 elites + boss: 21 guaranteed rares, ~46 items that MF decides. I'm ignoring the gradual gaining of valor in this because I can't be arsed. For the old run to be better in terms of ilvl 63, it must gain >40% of the rares of the new system. Obviously in the above comparison the new run takes longer, but the old run gets 9.5%-27% of the rares of the new one (only guaranteed rares to all rares). So in conclusion, to match the old numbers, you need to do the old run in 25%-67.5% of the time of new run, in order to match it. For me personally, this adds up to pretty much a wash. At the very least, the nerf isn't nearly as clear-cut as simply looking at 8% to 20%.
Except the fact that thew new runs are way longer than old runs. the yield of ilvl63 per hour is way lower in patch 1.03
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On June 21 2012 02:11 Yaotzin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2012 02:05 wei2coolman wrote:On June 21 2012 01:50 Yaotzin wrote:
You get way more rares now, so they had to nerf the droprate on ilvl61-63s. I get at least 150% more rares now, which makes the number of ilvl63s the same as before. And of course, a ton more of everything else. The problem with increased rare drops is that in act3-4 almost all the rares I get are sub lvlv61, which are all trash. No, 52% of the rares are sub ilvl 61. Unless you want to make a case that Blizzard are lying about those numbers?
Before patch 1.03, I rarely got a rare below 61, most were 62-63.
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EPT
