Why is Protoss easy? - Page 17

On January 06 2009 02:35 petzergling wrote:


1. DTs are the most overpowered unit in the game, they do more damage then battlecruisers and are permanently cloaked. If I could build permanently cloaked battlecruisers instead of wraiths It would be totally overpowered. If you dont scout it (impossible because protoss just blocks ramp with 1 goon and you always scout them last on python) and you prepare for it they never actually do dts, and its much more difficult for a learning player to use proper ebay timing based off of scouting information then it is for toss to go citadel->templar archives (add robo bay if u pylon block urself or forget ur 1 dragoon). The only reason you die if you dont scout 2 fact is because ur micro is bad. Terran siege tank/mine micro is so much more unforgiving then goon micro dont even pretend like 2 facting is cheese.

2. Yeah because protoss units are imbalanced and it is impossible for zerg to win without cheese. 2 years ago I'm sure u were playing fastest so cry about imbalance more scrub

3. Happens to me all the time. Do you never see games that say 1v1 [rank] NO P, because thats exactly what it is.

4. Yeah I fuck around on iccup a shitton, and if you knew some of the builds that I do (nuke rush, battlecruiser rush, SK terran vrs protoss(lol emp), trying to win games with only manner buildings/probes, ling slowdrop, proxy hatchery, proxy barracks fake FD, vulture mine + lockdown tvp, archon only zvp, starship troopers, firebat+valkyrie+tank tvz, cloak wraith + m&m obs killing tvp, omg the list goes on) you would laugh that my win rate is so good. Honestly I'm not saying I'm good (yeah I make new accounts and D-C- bash all day, I never plan on putting the dedication in to play super competitively) If u honestly think iccup stats matter check my stats account -- petzergling597 . 1v1 faggot?

On January 06 2009 12:16 OneOther wrote:

....SOMEBODY CLOSE THIS DAMNED THREAD ALREADY BEFORE IT GETS WORSE

On January 06 2009 12:26 daz wrote:
4. I have no fucking clue what your talking about in the first part of this paragraph, but I never said ICCUP stats matter, i suggested Iccup rank matters. And i guess i should have rephrased that to if you ever got past C-, oh well big deal i was one rank off. I would love to 1v1 you, if your seriously challenging me, shoot me a pm

On January 06 2009 11:53 ZeKk wrote:

Out of argue so raped lol

On January 05 2009 22:42 0xDEADBEEF wrote:


EasiER, not easy. This is a very important distinction here. Obviously high-level P playing requires lots of speed and skill which only very few players will reach AT ALL. But among these few players who DO reach this level, there are ~60-70% Protoss players. And THAT is the problem.

I'm sure most of the players complaining about P wouldn't complain about them if it was just 1 or 2 P gosus (e.g. Bisu and Stork) dominating. We're used to 1 or 2 bonjwas at a time - Boxer/Yellow, July/Oov, Savior, Bisu.
But today, it's not just one or two. It's fucking SIX of them ("the six dragons" - sounds nice, but in fact it's a huge problem for SC). And all of them are in the top 10 KeSPA. And on top foreigner level the majority is Protoss too. If you STILL argue that P is only easy at low levels, you're just really retarded or ignorant or didn't look how well all P players are doing at the moment.
Once you look at the actual race distributions you have to notice that something's definitely wrong.

But I guess P players will always say that P is only the easiest at low levels, which is just PART of the truth (the truth is that it's also the easiest on top foreign level and now *apparently* even the easiest in Korea too), after all who wants to be laughed at for playing the easiest race?

Anyway. P will continue to dominate in 2009 if it goes on like this, and this discussion will pop up again and again. Sometimes, the majority is right after all...

We'll probably need new maps which nerf Protoss, or a new balance patch (which won't happen). Or maybe no one even cares anymore about the state of SC and it'll just go on like this until SC2 is released and SC1 dies. Maybe the vast majority of SC players and fans like Protoss that they don't care.

On January 06 2009 12:26 daz wrote:


1. Lets not even start talking about individual unit statistics becuase thats stupid as shit and can go back and forth forever, let me give you an example. you can make a unit that has such long range it can shoot my units from off the screen, deals more damage then any 3 of my units combined, and its SPLASH damage. I am NOT saying 2fac is cheese, I'm saying DTs arent any cheesier then 2fac or even facport. If you scout a protoss and he has a goon blocking his ramp, make a fucking ebay, because every good protoss will send their goons out to pressure you as soon as they get them, and if they dont, MAKE A FUCKING EBAY. Also, no amount of goon micro in the world will allow 1gate goons to hold a 2fac.

On January 06 2009 02:35 petzergling wrote:


1. DTs are the most overpowered unit in the game, they do more damage then battlecruisers and are permanently cloaked. If I could build permanently cloaked battlecruisers instead of wraiths It would be totally overpowered. If you dont scout it (impossible because protoss just blocks ramp with 1 goon and you always scout them last on python) and you prepare for it they never actually do dts, and its much more difficult for a learning player to use proper ebay timing based off of scouting information then it is for toss to go citadel->templar archives (add robo bay if u pylon block urself or forget ur 1 dragoon). The only reason you die if you dont scout 2 fact is because ur micro is bad. Terran siege tank/mine micro is so much more unforgiving then goon micro dont even pretend like 2 facting is cheese.

2. Yeah because protoss units are imbalanced and it is impossible for zerg to win without cheese. 2 years ago I'm sure u were playing fastest so cry about imbalance more scrub

3. Happens to me all the time. Do you never see games that say 1v1 [rank] NO P, because thats exactly what it is.

4. Yeah I fuck around on iccup a shitton, and if you knew some of the builds that I do (nuke rush, battlecruiser rush, SK terran vrs protoss(lol emp), trying to win games with only manner buildings/probes, ling slowdrop, proxy hatchery, proxy barracks fake FD, vulture mine + lockdown tvp, archon only zvp, starship troopers, firebat+valkyrie+tank tvz, cloak wraith + m&m obs killing tvp, omg the list goes on) you would laugh that my win rate is so good. Honestly I'm not saying I'm good (yeah I make new accounts and D-C- bash all day, I never plan on putting the dedication in to play super competitively) If u honestly think iccup stats matter check my stats account -- petzergling597 . 1v1 faggot?

On January 06 2009 12:45 MyLostTemple wrote:
oh and i'm not saying terran is easier at high levels either

On January 06 2009 12:44 koreasilver wrote:

lol, since you went out of your way to be the first idiot from TL.net to send me a pm for disagreeing with your obviously clueless arguments, I'll play along with you.

One of the basic rule of thumbs in PvT is that if the Terran and Protoss are at equal bases, the Terran has the advantage. If a Protoss is getting a significantly greater amount of resources than you at equal bases than either the Protoss has a far superior ability to macro than you, your macro fucking blows, or both.

A Terran doesn't need to secure all the expos on Python to beat a Protoss. The nat is extremely easy for the Terran to defend on the map and I have often seen Terrans beat a Protoss with a lesser amount of bases. From my limited understanding as a Zerg player, the advantage that the Protoss has against the Terran becomes smaller as the game goes under "normal" circumstances due to the extremely low supply cost of Terran units and the ridiculous increase in power from upgrades compared to Protoss units.

But even before all that, if you're letting the protoss take ALL the expos and you aren't punishing him for it, then you have no one to blame but yourself for your obvious shortcomings.

For so many years Protoss was considered the worst race, and now that the metagame has shifted in their favour, which will likely only be temporary, you think that the entire game is unbalanced in favour of Protoss? Have you ever even taken into consideration the most imbalanced matchup in the game that is in favour of Terran?

On January 06 2009 12:11 TheTruthTeller wrote:
hum....ok . This needs to stop. We have a consensus here that Protoss is the easiest race at low levels (obviously).

What most people fail to realize however is that Protoss is also the easiest race at the highest levels of gaming. The gap of relative difficulty between the 3 races might be narrower at this level but some facts remain;

1.High HP Unit, Limited Unit special-Abilities ...easier micro
2.Longer unit build time, easier macro
3.Easy expansion setup, easier macro
4.Ability to hotkey your entire army in control groups, easier micro
5.Ability to freely mix your unit composition in each group, easier micro

Do you think that these 5 points do not apply at the pro-gaming level? The intensity of the game is higher, but these facts remain. The difference is that progaming Protosses are doing simple tasks at a higher speed and with better precision whereas progaming T and Z users are doing hard tasks at an insane speed with still higher precision. To say that at the highest level of Starcraft, all 3 races are equally difficult to play is simply inaccurate. Yes, the difference in relative difficulty might not be as blatant as it is at the lower levels, but Protoss remains the easiest race at all levels of play.