In the beginning I was not sure, if I can handle the cast, but, after 7 weeks of improving, it's a lot better. I think in round 4 the casters will be really good, so gl and hf in the future

Misacampo

167 Posts

January 21 2013 17:16 GMT

#242

I just want to say, I really appreciate SNM regardless of all the hate. His insight into the korean culture and translation is awesome.

Advocado

Denmark994 Posts

January 21 2013 17:18 GMT

#243

I like the insight and korean on the fly translating. I dislike the playbyplay and strategy analysis they are giving. This can be redeemed, but will it be done fast? Hard to say. SNM needs caster training and perhaps even more english lessons to make his casting more coherent.

Keep working on it, itll come.

SummaDuality

United States17 Posts

January 21 2013 17:29 GMT

#244

I'd like to echo the point: SNM is fairly unbearable to listen to. Whiplash is good and would benefit greatly with a partner that facilitates synergy. They lack the essence of casting as a duo - synergy.

Special Endrey

Germany1929 Posts

January 21 2013 17:30 GMT

#245

I REALLY like those guys, I dont like a lot of casters actually, but I'm okay with those 2.

z0rz

United States350 Posts

January 21 2013 17:40 GMT

#246

I lost my shit when this happened last week (5:00-5:10 in the VOD): http://www.twitch.tv/sc2proleague/c/1835733?t=5m

Sola transfers 6 drones from his main to his third ~7 minutes into the game and Whiplash thinks Sola is pulling drones to go all-in?!

WHAT?!

It would have been funny if he said it as a joke "OH MAN HERE COMES THE 7-MINUTE 6-DRONE-PULL ALL-IN I TALKED ABOUT!!" (this is why Tasteless is so good-- his understanding of the pro metagame is pretty poor as well, but he knows enough to turn his ignorance into comedy)... but Whiplash wasn't joking.

I can't fathom how anyone that follows professional SC2 would assume all-in rather than standard drone maynarding.

llIH

Norway2147 Posts

January 21 2013 17:45 GMT

#247

I think they got a lot better in the last couple of casts. But I think they still need to work on improving their knowledge of the game.

Thurken

961 Posts

January 21 2013 17:47 GMT

#248

I think Whisplash is doing a good job given the circumstances (I guess they are not pro), but SNM is really a big problem for the show. I'm sorry to say that and I have nothing personnal against him. His knowledge of the game his not good but the worst part is what he says outside the game analysis.

tomatriedes

New Zealand5356 Posts

January 21 2013 17:56 GMT

#249

One thing to improve would just be general awareness of what's happening. I remember one ZvT SNM was ranting on and on about how one spore crawler won't be enough to stop the banshees, which would have been fine if it wasn't for the fact that you could clearly see on the screen the zerg was building about 6 spore crawlers already, something which went completely unacknowledged. Then another game he called some storms terrible for missing the ground army when in fact they were hitting a big bunch of clumped up vikings. Maybe that's just something that comes with practice but it's really important, viewers shouldn't feel like banging their heads on the table because a caster is missing obvious stuff like that.

fer

Canada375 Posts

January 21 2013 17:57 GMT

#250

It feels like they are very inexperienced with the game, and sometimes, it's very hard to ignore. When that's the case, I usually mute the stream, but then the stream becomes very flat and bland. I don't doubt they will improve with time though, if management decides to keep them casting, and they give their best effort.

On a somewhat unrelated note, I really have to give a huge shoutout to Nathanias for providing additional commentary for the Proleague games. It's been literally thanks to him that I've been able to follow most of the Proleague teams and matches besides EG-TL. And since then, I've become more emotionally attached with players, teams, and the league itself. LOV U 4-EVER DARK NATHANIAS

Lkemas

Statyk

Canada41 Posts

January 21 2013 18:14 GMT

#251

I honestly can't vote for anything other than "I dislike it". I feel a little guilty however because Whiplash is actually a decent caster. SNM has no personality and is at least partially responsible for killing eSports.

I think the situation would be salvagable if Whiplash was able to mute SNM's mic before the match; I would prefer periods of silence to hearing SNM's uninformed, or often outright wrong, analysis of what's going on.

User was warned for this post

Bagration

United States18282 Posts

January 21 2013 18:14 GMT

#252

It's getting better I suppose. But one thing that does bother me is when the two of them begin arguing over stuff (someone says something, the other corrects, the original caster then tries to defend himself and retorts). Very unprofessional

And there is the issue of having a good casting voice. Some people just have good casting voices. SNM does not sadly. Do I recommend voice lesson or something? I don't know.

Still, I don't think the casting is up to the standards that I would expect from a premier teamleague.

c0ldfusion

United States8293 Posts

January 21 2013 18:23 GMT

#253

On January 22 2013 03:14 Bagration wrote:
Still, I don't think the casting is up to the standards that I would expect from a premier teamleague.

That's a big part of it I think. The fans hold proleague to a high standard because it is _the_ team league.
If these guys were doing some one-off tournament I don't think they'd receive a shred of criticism.

E.H Eager

United States227 Posts

January 21 2013 18:26 GMT

#254

I like both of them fine as personalities, just something about their casting style seems off to me.

I'll watch the cast and I will enjoy it, but it seems a little haphazard/forced. I know this isn't very constructive as criticism goes, but this is just what comes to mind when I think of the casts. It just seems a little bit awkward.

I'm sure it'll get better over time and I hope to see both of them get much better!

edlover420

349 Posts

January 21 2013 18:26 GMT

#255

On January 22 2013 03:14 Statyk wrote:
SNM has no personality and is at least partially responsible for killing eSports.

C'mon son get da zealot outta here with that marinepoop!

Jedclark

United Kingdom903 Posts

January 21 2013 18:28 GMT

#256

It was silly to hire them. For the most professional and respected team league in SC2, you don't hire casters and say, "Oh, don't worry. They'll get to the required level in time" - they're either at that level, or they don't get the job.

Cel.erity

United States4890 Posts

January 21 2013 18:32 GMT

#257

On January 22 2013 03:28 Jedclark wrote:
It was silly to hire them. For the most professional and respected team league in SC2, you don't hire casters and say, "Oh, don't worry. They'll get to the required level in time" - they're either at that level, or they don't get the job.

I'm guessing there are no more than 3-4 qualified individuals who are willing to accept the job. What's with all these posts that assume there are waves of casters lining up to quit their job/schooling, move to the other side of the world, and get paid slightly more than minimum wage?

ACrow

Germany6583 Posts

January 21 2013 18:43 GMT

#258

I watched the first two weeks with sound, afterwards I just muted them and listened to music while watching the matches.
What I found is that they commented very dull, and basically went play by play only, without giving any valuable insights into the playstyles or builds that we see. If they try to predict or interpret what's strategically happening, they are usually very far off. They lack any kind of synergy and did not add any entertainment value. What they did and what they put much emphasis on, is providing BW background of the players and how they performed in the past SPLs. Unfortunately, I couldn't care less about that (I never followed BW, and if someone sucks at SC2, what's the relevance if they did well in a Proleague three years ago?).
Of course that is all my personal perspective and that might have totally changed by now, as I haven't listened to them in the last few weeks. So I might give them another try, considering there are quite a few here saying that they have improved.
What's more important to me however, is that the observer they use is not very good (the one on English VODs, don't know about the Korean one, at least compared to Legend and Adebisi). He is often missing important parts of engagements while looking at very unimportant stuff and is in general not highlighting interesting stuff enough.

TheDougler

Canada8309 Posts

January 21 2013 18:43 GMT

#259

On January 22 2013 01:01 y0su wrote:

Show nested quote +

Although I agree and prefer that style of casting (and do it myself), the community is pretty split on the issue. Lots of people will say "I can see what's going on, give me analysis" instead. =/

Can't please everyone!

You actually can though.

You can have one caster for analysis and one for play by play. Starcraft, other e-sports, and regular sports have been doing this for a LONG time. Artosis and Tasteless (GSL Code S), Rotterdam and Mr. Bitter (NASL), and previously Wolf and DOA (GSL Code A), and later DOA and Cats PJs (IPL) are all examples of an analyst and a play by play caster combo.

StarMoon

Canada682 Posts

January 21 2013 18:44 GMT

#260

On January 22 2013 03:32 Cel.erity wrote:

Show nested quote +

Doa and... others (don't recall) were going to cast PL, and then KESPA fucked them over. Doa even made a post about it because he thought they wouldn't have an English cast at all.

Afterwards, they gave the casting over to the foreign scene (EG, TL, IPL) and they did a good job at first. I wish they just continued to do this. I'll take random IPL casters over these guys.