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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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JonnyBNoHo
United States6277 Posts
Googling around... Employment is ~500K? (not all insurance employment is healthcare) Market cap is ~$113B? (only HC insurers) *yawn* I mean, you wouldn't want to be cruel towards the newly unemployed and you would compensate asset owners. If you didn't.. lawsuit hell. Beyond that, if the new system works better - good, if worse - bad. | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
Good on Trump. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:01 ticklishmusic wrote: i'd prefer my legislative first step to actually be something that is generally workable. there is a different between a first draft and a final draft of anything, but the first draft should actually be complete before submission. this is not. You are asking to solve the engineering problem before knowing what it is made out of. Even the ACA was a pretty general idea that was fleshed out over a year of hearings and writing. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:04 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Evidence #1,985. If She's not the center of attention she lashes out. You are recycling quotes at this point. All of these are interviews about her book. She did a whole bunch because CNN and the networks asked her to, mostly because they knew people like you would post tweets this. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24389 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:05 Plansix wrote: You are asking to solve the engineering problem before knowing what it is made out of. Even the ACA was a pretty general idea that was fleshed out over a year of hearings and writing. And lobbying, can't forget the lobbying. There was a reason insurers and pharmaceutical companies were on board before we even knew what was in it. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:08 GreenHorizons wrote: And lobbying, can't forget the lobbying. There was a reason insurers and pharmaceutical companies were on board before we even knew what was in it. It helps to tell the industry you are changing how it is being changed and that it is awesome for everyone. | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:05 Plansix wrote: You are asking to solve the engineering problem before knowing what it is made out of. Even the ACA was a pretty general idea that was fleshed out over a year of hearings and writing. I'm aware and open to the fact that changes will happen during the legislative process. But my issue with the current proposal is that it is to me fundamentally incomplete, rather than a document that is not final final. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:14 ticklishmusic wrote: I'm aware and open to the fact that changes will happen during the legislative process. But my issue with the current proposal is that it is fundamentally incomplete, rather than a document that is not final final. So was the ACA. It was a design doc created by the Heritage Foundation. Nothing you are complaining about wasn't there the last time we did this. Laws get really fleshed out when they have a chance of passing. | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
I'd also like to take the opportunity to say Hillary was the one who proposed the individual mandate vs Obama who advocated for subsidies. I was also much younger and less well versed in healthcare at the time of the ACA, but if i knew what I did now I would have the same quibbles over any big open items. I'm largely in agreement with many of the point farva, KwarK, P6 and others are making. But it's a little bit of a different from the cavalier attitude GH is taking towards a revamp of 1/6 of the nation's economy. | ||
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TheTenthDoc
United States9561 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:04 JonnyBNoHo wrote: I feel like Medicare for all's affect on asset markets and employment is being over-hyped here. Googling around... Employment is ~500K? (not all insurance employment is healthcare) Market cap is ~$113B? (only HC insurers) *yawn* I mean, you wouldn't want to be cruel towards the newly unemployed and you would compensate asset owners. If you didn't.. lawsuit hell. Beyond that, if the new system works better - good, if worse - bad. Medicare for all doesn't even really make insurers obsolete. There are dozens/hundreds/thousands(?) of supplemental Medicare part B insurance plans and part D plans still go through insurers. Even "single payer" systems rarely if ever completely nuke health insurance from orbit, supplemental plans still stick around. | ||
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:34 Nevuk wrote: Killing the public option will probably go down as one of the greatest political miscalculations by the healthcare industry. The ACA is not functional in rural, low population density areas without it. That so much of the country only has 1 provider available is a pretty damning indictment of the current system. With the public option in play I doubt Medicare for all would be so well received by the public. it wasn't really the insurers who killed it. it was fucking joe lieberman (and others and other factors, but point is the insurers were kind of okay with it). they benefit from have the government putting pressure on providers to lower prices, improve quality and standardize systems which makes their jobs easier and their costs lower. | ||
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Ghostcom
Denmark4783 Posts
This should be good. | ||
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
Want to market Nazi memorabilia, or recruit marchers for a far-right rally? Facebook’s self-service ad-buying platform had the right audience for you. Until this week, when we asked Facebook about it, the world’s largest social network enabled advertisers to direct their pitches to the news feeds of almost 2,300 people who expressed interest in the topics of “Jew hater,” “How to burn jews,” or, “History of ‘why jews ruin the world.’” To test if these ad categories were real, we paid $30 to target those groups with three “promoted posts” — in which a ProPublica article or post was displayed in their news feeds. Facebook approved all three ads within 15 minutes. After we contacted Facebook, it removed the anti-Semitic categories — which were created by an algorithm rather than by people — and said it would explore ways to fix the problem, such as limiting the number of categories available or scrutinizing them before they are displayed to buyers. “There are times where content is surfaced on our platform that violates our standards,” said Rob Leathern, product management director at Facebook. “In this case, we’ve removed the associated targeting fields in question. We know we have more work to do, so we’re also building new guardrails in our product and review processes to prevent other issues like this from happening in the future.” Facebook’s advertising has become a focus of national attention since it disclosed last week that it had discovered $100,000 worth of ads placed during the 2016 presidential election season by “inauthentic” accounts that appeared to be affiliated with Russia. Like many tech companies, Facebook has long taken a hands off approach to its advertising business. Unlike traditional media companies that select the audiences they offer advertisers, Facebook generates its ad categories automatically based both on what users explicitly share with Facebook and what they implicitly convey through their online activity. Traditionally, tech companies have contended that it’s not their role to censor the Internet or to discourage legitimate political expression. In the wake of the violent protests in Charlottesville by right-wing groups that included self-described Nazis, Facebook and other tech companies vowed to strengthen their monitoring of hate speech. Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg wrote at the time that “there is no place for hate in our community,” and pledged to keep a closer eye on hateful posts and threats of violence on Facebook. “It’s a disgrace that we still need to say that neo-Nazis and white supremacists are wrong — as if this is somehow not obvious,” he wrote. [...] https://www.propublica.org/article/facebook-enabled-advertisers-to-reach-jew-haters | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On September 15 2017 09:11 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: https://twitter.com/AP/status/908479615974477825 University of Virginia students protesting the one-month anniversary of a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville desecrated "sacred" ground when they covered a statue of Thomas Jefferson with a black tarp, school President Teresa Sullivan says. Dozens of students carrying signs reading "End Hate Now," "Black Lives Matter," and "TJ was a racist and rapist" rallied Tuesday outside the Rotunda, a university building inspired by Rome's Pantheon and designed by Jefferson, the university's founder. The group chanted “No Trump, no KKK, no racist UVA.” "As part of this demonstration, they shrouded the Jefferson statue, desecrating ground that many of us consider sacred," Sullivan said in an email to alumni. "I strongly disagree with the protesters’ decision to cover the Jefferson statue." Jefferson statue shrouded A monument commemorating “Star-Spangled Banner” author Francis Scott Key was vandalized in downtown Baltimore, officials said Wednesday. Photographs show the monument, at 1200 N. Eutaw St., covered with red paint and the words “racist anthem” written in black. Anthony McCarthy, a spokesman for Baltimore Mayor Catherine E. Pugh (D), said police were investigating and determining the best way to remove the graffiti. “The mayor thinks it’s very unfortunate that this took place,” he said. “Certainly we respect people’s right to express an opinion, but there certainly has to be a better and more productive way to express yourself than criminal activity and vandalism.” Francis Scott Key statue vandalized I was told it was just about the thrill racists got with Confederate generals. Apparently not. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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Ghostcom
Denmark4783 Posts
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Wulfey_LA
932 Posts
On September 15 2017 08:19 ticklishmusic wrote: ACA has the three legged stool figured out. And a public option, may it RIP. I'd also like to take the opportunity to say Hillary was the one who proposed the individual mandate vs Obama who advocated for subsidies. I was also much younger and less well versed in healthcare at the time of the ACA, but if i knew what I did now I would have the same quibbles over any big open items. I'm largely in agreement with many of the point farva, KwarK, P6 and others are making. But it's a little bit of a different from the cavalier attitude GH is taking towards a revamp of 1/6 of the nation's economy. A revamp without associated taxes and no CBO score. Just yolo aspirational posturing. But hey, if the proletariat wants to hear it, you gotta say it. That was the big lesson with Trump. The people wanted to hear WALL. Look what it got them, DACA. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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