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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15690 Posts
July 26 2017 18:24 GMT
#164001
Feels like he's just throwing out bait for the religious right. I have a hard time he just suddenly had some awakening and realized he's incredibly religious and needs to keep the trans folks (gays are too accepted nowadays) out of military.

Honestly, it feels like a desperate attempt for higher support.
Wulfey_LA
Profile Joined April 2017
932 Posts
July 26 2017 18:28 GMT
#164002
On July 27 2017 03:24 Mohdoo wrote:
Feels like he's just throwing out bait for the religious right. I have a hard time he just suddenly had some awakening and realized he's incredibly religious and needs to keep the trans folks (gays are too accepted nowadays) out of military.

Honestly, it feels like a desperate attempt for higher support.


It may actually be dumber and more cynical than it initially appeared. The new trans ban has something to do with a congressional republican fight about funding for DJT priorities and gender reassignment surgery funding. The politico story backs up my thesis that DJT didn't do any of the detail work on this ban it does not exist as an executable DOD policy.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/07/26/trump-transgender-military-ban-behind-the-scenes-240990
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7242 Posts
July 26 2017 18:40 GMT
#164003
'Murica

What a trainwreck we have become. Its unbelievable this idiot cant just stay off of twitter
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
July 26 2017 18:41 GMT
#164004
On July 27 2017 03:28 Wulfey_LA wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2017 03:24 Mohdoo wrote:
Feels like he's just throwing out bait for the religious right. I have a hard time he just suddenly had some awakening and realized he's incredibly religious and needs to keep the trans folks (gays are too accepted nowadays) out of military.

Honestly, it feels like a desperate attempt for higher support.


It may actually be dumber and more cynical than it initially appeared. The new trans ban has something to do with a congressional republican fight about funding for DJT priorities and gender reassignment surgery funding. The politico story backs up my thesis that DJT didn't do any of the detail work on this ban it does not exist as an executable DOD policy.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/07/26/trump-transgender-military-ban-behind-the-scenes-240990


I find it a little ironic that Trump is now threatening to torpedo the budget bill by doing this.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
ZerOCoolSC2
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
8986 Posts
July 26 2017 18:43 GMT
#164005
Something something, separation of church and state, something something.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 26 2017 18:49 GMT
#164006
On July 27 2017 03:10 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2017 03:02 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
On July 27 2017 02:45 Plansix wrote:


Edit: Mattis is on vacation from reports. I'm sure he heard about this on twitter.

But Trump said he discussed it with his generals and military experts. Do you think he would even lie about something trivial like that?

Also praise be to the lord of caps-lock


Is that a troll account?

The 4chan candidate in his full glory.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
PhoenixVoid
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Canada32740 Posts
July 26 2017 18:52 GMT
#164007
I thought it was a retweet from that Christians4Trump bot account or whatever it is. Nope, turns out it was made by our Tweeter-in-Chief. Whenever Trump attempts to apply the good old appeal to the religious right tactic it makes me chuckle a bit, mostly because Trump is anything but an ideal Christian candidate and the closest thing to God Trump knows is Trump himself.
I'm afraid of demented knife-wielding escaped lunatic libertarian zombie mutants
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
July 26 2017 18:52 GMT
#164008
Do Trump supporters care about the State Department? Where is Ben Ghazi when you need him?

zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
July 26 2017 18:59 GMT
#164009
On July 27 2017 03:52 PhoenixVoid wrote:
I thought it was a retweet from that Christians4Trump bot account or whatever it is. Nope, turns out it was made by our Tweeter-in-Chief. Whenever Trump attempts to apply the good old appeal to the religious right tactic it makes me chuckle a bit, mostly because Trump is anything but an ideal Christian candidate and the closest thing to God Trump knows is Trump himself.

it's sad and rather hypocritical just how much support he got from the religious right during the election
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
July 26 2017 19:05 GMT
#164010
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
m4ini
Profile Joined February 2014
4215 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-26 19:09:42
July 26 2017 19:07 GMT
#164011
So that ban, what is that actually about? Just pure transphobia (not sure if that's the correct term)?

I mean, it obviously can't be the monies considering the DoD spends hundreds of millions of dollars on viagra and other penis pills.

edit:

"Sarah Huckabee Sanders just announced she won't take any more questions about the ban on transgender service members today"

Guess by WH standards everything is sufficiently explained on twitter. Should rename his motto to "MA1950A".
On track to MA1950A.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-26 19:10:13
July 26 2017 19:09 GMT
#164012
This is why the Admin doesn't like Cameras at the briefings anymore.

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-26 19:12:04
July 26 2017 19:11 GMT
#164013
On July 27 2017 04:07 m4ini wrote:
So that ban, what is that actually about? Just pure transphobia (not sure if that's the correct term)?

I mean, it obviously can't be the monies considering the DoD spends hundreds of millions of dollars on viagra and other penis pills.


Transphobia is the right term. It is totally unclear what lead to these tweets, but the pentagon wasn’t given a heads up. Apparently they were concerned he was about to announce a military strike via twitter.

Just a reminder that nothing hard has happened yet. Just wait till the like the BP oil spill or something real hits.

Edit: I like Sander’s yelling “I will turn this briefing around if you don’t behave. I only answer the questions I like and you can’t keep asking the same one.”
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-26 19:11:56
July 26 2017 19:11 GMT
#164014
Yep...

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Kickstart
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States1941 Posts
July 26 2017 19:13 GMT
#164015
Is there any evidence that he consulted anyone in the DoD about this? From what I've gathered the military has been rolling out training and has policy concerning trans service members that they've been operating under for some time now. Then today their Commander in Chief just threw everything up in the air in a twitter post.

I think there is an argument to be had about the trans service-member issue, but to just reverse policy through twitter without informing anyone is just ..... why?
m4ini
Profile Joined February 2014
4215 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-26 19:14:22
July 26 2017 19:14 GMT
#164016
Guess that sounds reasonable, a distraction of sorts. Doesn't really make sense otherwise. Sidenote, i'd love to see Trump facing that transgender Navy SEAL that called him out.

Actually, in general i'm at the point where i just want to see someone beat the living shit out of him. Transgender SEAL would be just the icing.
On track to MA1950A.
Deleuze
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United Kingdom2102 Posts
July 26 2017 19:17 GMT
#164017
On July 27 2017 03:10 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2017 03:02 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
On July 27 2017 02:45 Plansix wrote:


Edit: Mattis is on vacation from reports. I'm sure he heard about this on twitter.

But Trump said he discussed it with his generals and military experts. Do you think he would even lie about something trivial like that?

Also praise be to the lord of caps-lock

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/890260758050856961

Is that a troll account?


It would be quite good it if was a 30 minute Friday night comedy show.
“An image of thought called philosophy has been formed historically and it effectively stops people from thinking.” ― Gilles Deleuze, Dialogues II
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
July 26 2017 19:23 GMT
#164018
Ssssssssshhhhhhhocking:

Let’s back up a moment. Remember the summer of 2013, when the “Defund Obamacare Tour” drove the news cycle all through Congress’s August recess? The town halls organized by the political arm of the Heritage Foundation enlivened the base and furthered what had been the GOP’s core message since 2010—that Obamacare was bad and, if Americans helped Republicans hold both chambers, it could be repealed.

[Eric] Cantor helped create that perception. Earlier that summer—after many failed attempts over the years to shred the law piecemeal—Cantor promised colleagues that the House would vote on a “full repeal.” But even after it did, the measure was dead on arrival in the Democratic-controlled Senate. Cantor—in Congress 13 years and, fairly or unfairly, once thought to be above electoral reproach—paid the price. His 2014 avenger, now-congressman David Brat, bludgeoned him for being soft on Obamacare, among other things. But the failure to make a dent in the law landed a bigger blow on the party. After seven years of pledging they could dismantle Obamacare, if only they had control of Congress and the White House, Republicans—at last in charge of both—have faced deep divisions over a replacement.

Asked if he feels partly responsible for their current predicament, Cantor is unequivocal. “Oh,” he says, “100 percent.”

He goes further: “To give the impression that if Republicans were in control of the House and Senate, that we could do that when Obama was still in office . . . .” His voice trails off and he shakes his head. “I never believed it.”

He says he wasn’t the only one aware of the charade: “We sort of all got what was going on, that there was this disconnect in terms of communication, because no one wanted to take the time out in the general public to even think about ‘Wait a minute—that can’t happen.’ ” But, he adds, “if you’ve got that anger working for you, you’re gonna let it be.”


Source.
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-26 19:24:33
July 26 2017 19:23 GMT
#164019
Reminder that you should never trust anonymous sources per the Trump administration's own policy, so you should assume Trump made up the military generals who told him to do this until he gives names.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
July 26 2017 19:24 GMT
#164020
After a week sparring with his attorney general and steaming over the Russia investigation consuming his agenda, President Donald Trump was closing in on an important win.

House Republicans were planning to pass a spending bill stacked with his campaign promises, including money to build his border wall with Mexico.

But an internal House Republican fight over transgender troops was threatening to blow up the bill. And House GOP insiders feared they might not have the votes to pass the legislation because defense hawks wanted a ban on Pentagon-funded sex reassignment operations — something GOP leaders wouldn’t give them.

They turned to Trump, who didn’t hesitate. In the flash of a tweet, he announced that transgender troops would be banned altogether.

Trump’s sudden decision was, in part, a last-ditch attempt to save a House proposal full of his campaign promises that was on the verge of defeat, numerous congressional and White House sources said.

The president had always planned to scale back President Barack Obama-era policies welcoming such individuals in combat and greenlighting the military to pay for their medical treatment plans. But a behind-the-scenes GOP brawl threatening to tank a Pentagon funding increase and wall construction hastened Trump’s decision.

Numerous House conservatives and defense hawks this week had threatened to derail their own legislation if it did not include a prohibition on Pentagon funding for gender reassignment surgeries, which they deem a waste of taxpayer money. But GOP leaders were caught in a pinch between those demands and moderate Republicans who felt the proposal was blatantly discriminatory.

“There are several members of the conference who feel this really needs to be addressed,” said senior House Appropriations Committee member Robert Aderholt (R-Ala.) on Tuesday. “This isn’t about the transgender issue; it’s about the taxpayer dollars going to pay for the surgery out of the defense budget."

That’s why House lawmakers took the matter to the Trump administration. And when Defense Secretary James Mattis refused to immediately upend the policy, they went straight to the White House. Trump — never one for political correctness — was all too happy to oblige.

“[P]lease be advised that the United States Government will not accept or allow Transgender individuals to serve in any capacity in the U.S. Military,” Trump tweeted Wednesday morning. "Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail.”

The president’s directive, of course, took the House issue a step beyond paying for gender reassignment surgery and other medical treatment. House Republicans were never debating expelling all transgender troops from the military.

"This is like someone told the White House to light a candle on the table and the WH set the whole table on fire,” said one senior House Republican aide. The source said that while GOP leaders asked the White House for help, they weren't expecting — and got no heads up on — Trump's far-reaching directive.

While Democrats and centrist Republicans are already blasting the move, one White House official said the decision would be "seen as common-sense" by millions — though likely vociferously protested by others.

"It's not the worst thing in the world to have this fight," the administration official said.

The announcement, multiple sources said, did not sit well with Mattis, who appeared to be trying to avoid the matter in recent weeks. Congressional sources say Rep. Vicky Hartzler (R-Mo.), the original author of the House’s transgender proposal, tried numerous times to phone Mattis to discuss the transgender issue.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
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