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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 7213

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
LightSpectra
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States3220 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-03-28 16:05:30
March 28 2017 16:05 GMT
#144241
On March 29 2017 00:49 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 29 2017 00:20 LightSpectra wrote:
On March 29 2017 00:07 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:




Maybe putting a guy that campaigned and worked for Trump in charge of his investigation was not so good an idea.

Well, for those of us who want straight answers, in any case. It's doubtless that he was put in charge for the very reason that he can obscure/dispose of anything incriminating.

He became chairman of the House Intelligence Committee in January 2015 so no.


The HIC is not the only Congressional committee that could do an investigation about the Trump-Russia allegations.

In any case he should've recused himself on day 1 because of his conflicts of interest.
"don't try to pull a LightSpectra-Trumper"
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
March 28 2017 16:10 GMT
#144242
Are there ever times when canceling a hearing is like...positive, not just negligible? There are clearly times when it is negative, as with Nunes canceling this shit. But I am more so wondering if there is a situation where this would be the proper thing to do for some legal blah blah reason thing. From my ignorant perspective, canceling the hearing is an enormous red flag and a blatant misuse of authority.
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
March 28 2017 16:12 GMT
#144243
Ineptitude among Congressmen is not just common but the norm. There is a reason no sane person approves of Congress these days.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18869 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-03-28 16:58:27
March 28 2017 16:14 GMT
#144244
On March 29 2017 01:10 Mohdoo wrote:
Are there ever times when canceling a hearing is like...positive, not just negligible? There are clearly times when it is negative, as with Nunes canceling this shit. But I am more so wondering if there is a situation where this would be the proper thing to do for some legal blah blah reason thing. From my ignorant perspective, canceling the hearing is an enormous red flag and a blatant misuse of authority.

These decisions of legislative hearing administration are almost purely within the discretion of the chairman of the committee holding the hearings, which is why independent individuals/bodies are usually formed when it comes to this kind of thing.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-03-28 16:22:55
March 28 2017 16:19 GMT
#144245
So it was the White House that ordered Nunes to cancel the hearings.



"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18869 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-03-28 16:24:53
March 28 2017 16:23 GMT
#144246
The presidential communications privilege has never been tested before the Supreme Court, so let's go
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
LightSpectra
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States3220 Posts
March 28 2017 16:26 GMT
#144247
On March 29 2017 01:12 LegalLord wrote:
Ineptitude among Congressmen is not just common but the norm. There is a reason no sane person approves of Congress these days.


If you do a poll of "Do you think Congress is doing a good job?" then the answer is always abysmally low (10-30% region). On the other hand if you do a poll of "Do you think YOUR representatives in Congress are doing a good job?", the mean approval rating usually fluctuates somewhere between 40-60%.
"don't try to pull a LightSpectra-Trumper"
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
March 28 2017 16:26 GMT
#144248
On March 29 2017 01:19 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So it was the White House that ordered Nunes to cancel the hearings.

https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/846751317355872257

https://twitter.com/ericgeller/status/846725410033471489


Technically I don't think it's been shown that the WH ordered Nunes to cancel, but the WH told Yates she needs consent to testify about certain things.
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
March 28 2017 16:57 GMT
#144249
On March 29 2017 01:10 Mohdoo wrote:
Are there ever times when canceling a hearing is like...positive, not just negligible? There are clearly times when it is negative, as with Nunes canceling this shit. But I am more so wondering if there is a situation where this would be the proper thing to do for some legal blah blah reason thing. From my ignorant perspective, canceling the hearing is an enormous red flag and a blatant misuse of authority.

I can't think of any where it would be a positive thing to do; certainly plenty of cases where it'd be negligible/routine.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 28 2017 17:06 GMT
#144250
On March 29 2017 01:26 Doodsmack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 29 2017 01:19 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So it was the White House that ordered Nunes to cancel the hearings.

https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/846751317355872257

https://twitter.com/ericgeller/status/846725410033471489


Technically I don't think it's been shown that the WH ordered Nunes to cancel, but the WH told Yates she needs consent to testify about certain things.


The DOJ did not have any reason to object her to testifying the WH did.

Lawyers for President Donald Trump tried to prevent former acting Attorney General Sally Yates from testifying before the House Intelligence Committee on links between Trump campaign staff and Russian officials, according to correspondence first obtained by The Washington Post.

In a series of letters last week, Yates’ lawyer, David O’Neil, accused the Trump Justice Department of trying to silence Yates by asserting that “all information Ms. Yates received or actions she took in her capacity as Deputy Attorney General and acting Attorney General are client confidences that she may not disclose absent written consent of the department.”

Yates served as deputy attorney general in the Obama administration and then as acting attorney general in the first few weeks of the Trump administration. Trump fired her on Jan. 31, after she refused to enforce the president’s original executive order banning immigrants from seven majority-Muslim countries.

O’Neil went on to write that he and his client disagreed with the idea that her testimony required permission. “We believe that the department’s position in this regard is overbroad, incorrect, and inconsistent with the department’s historical approach to the congressional testimony of current and former officials,’’ he wrote.

“In particular, we believe that Ms. Yates should not be obligated to refuse to provide non-classified facts about the department’s notification to the White House of concerns about the conduct of a senior official,” he wrote. “Requiring Ms. Yates to refuse to provide such information is particularly untenable given that multiple senior administration officials have publicly described the same events.’’

O’Neil emphasized that Yates would not reveal any classified information in the Intelligence Committee hearing.

On Friday, the Justice Department wrote back to say that any approval concerning testimony about communications with the White House needed to come not from the department but straight from the White House. O’Neil then wrote to White House Counsel Don McGahn, told him what the Justice Department had said, and informed him that Yates planned to testify Tuesday, March 28, as originally scheduled.

Within hours after that letter was sent on Friday, Intelligence Committee Chairman Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) canceled the scheduled hearing, which also would have included testimony from top intelligence officials. On Tuesday, the White House denied that it had taken any action to prevent Yates from testifying.

“The Washington Post story is entirely false,” said White House press secretary Sean Spicer in a statement. “The White House has taken no action to prevent Sally Yates from testifying and the Department of Justice specifically told her that it would not stop her and to suggest otherwise is completely irresponsible.”


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-03-28 17:10:44
March 28 2017 17:09 GMT
#144251
Since when did the proposition that only the client has the right to waive the attorney-client privilege become controversial? Isn't that basically the basis for the executive privilege being claimed here?
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 28 2017 17:10 GMT
#144252
Sean Spicer is just going to keep talking so he doesn't get asked questions it seems.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22608 Posts
March 28 2017 17:16 GMT
#144253
On March 29 2017 02:09 xDaunt wrote:
Since when did the proposition that only the client has the right to waive the attorney-client privilege become controversial? Isn't that basically the basis for the executive privilege being claimed here?

Is the President a client of the Attorney General? I thought the WH had its own set of attorneys and that the Attorney General represents the People.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
March 28 2017 17:18 GMT
#144254
On March 29 2017 02:09 xDaunt wrote:
Since when did the proposition that only the client has the right to waive the attorney-client privilege become controversial? Isn't that basically the basis for the executive privilege being claimed here?

i'm pretty sure executive privilege is legally very distinct/different from attorney-client privilege.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18869 Posts
March 28 2017 17:19 GMT
#144255
On March 29 2017 02:16 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 29 2017 02:09 xDaunt wrote:
Since when did the proposition that only the client has the right to waive the attorney-client privilege become controversial? Isn't that basically the basis for the executive privilege being claimed here?

Is the President a client of the Attorney General? I thought the WH had its own set of attorneys and that the Attorney General represents the People.

The Attorney General represents the government at large, which is why this implicates complicated issues of privilege among different government entities.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Krikkitone
Profile Joined April 2009
United States1451 Posts
March 28 2017 17:23 GMT
#144256
On March 29 2017 01:26 LightSpectra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 29 2017 01:12 LegalLord wrote:
Ineptitude among Congressmen is not just common but the norm. There is a reason no sane person approves of Congress these days.


If you do a poll of "Do you think Congress is doing a good job?" then the answer is always abysmally low (10-30% region). On the other hand if you do a poll of "Do you think YOUR representatives in Congress are doing a good job?", the mean approval rating usually fluctuates somewhere between 40-60%.


So that low approval rating for Congress is really a low approval rating for the rest of America.
LightSpectra
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States3220 Posts
March 28 2017 17:25 GMT
#144257
On March 29 2017 02:16 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 29 2017 02:09 xDaunt wrote:
Since when did the proposition that only the client has the right to waive the attorney-client privilege become controversial? Isn't that basically the basis for the executive privilege being claimed here?

Is the President a client of the Attorney General? I thought the WH had its own set of attorneys and that the Attorney General represents the People.


The A.G. represents the whole government. The attorney that's supposed to represent just the POTUS/White House is the White House Counsel.
"don't try to pull a LightSpectra-Trumper"
Krikkitone
Profile Joined April 2009
United States1451 Posts
March 28 2017 17:26 GMT
#144258
On March 29 2017 01:57 zlefin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 29 2017 01:10 Mohdoo wrote:
Are there ever times when canceling a hearing is like...positive, not just negligible? There are clearly times when it is negative, as with Nunes canceling this shit. But I am more so wondering if there is a situation where this would be the proper thing to do for some legal blah blah reason thing. From my ignorant perspective, canceling the hearing is an enormous red flag and a blatant misuse of authority.

I can't think of any where it would be a positive thing to do; certainly plenty of cases where it'd be negligible/routine.


Probably when the hearing is just hassling officials (ie there is no reason to suspect anything going wrong, but we want to force people to jump through hoops, making their lives busy and maybe embarrassing them if we are lucky)
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 28 2017 17:31 GMT
#144259
Sean Spicer just lost control.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10954 Posts
March 28 2017 17:39 GMT
#144260
What happened?
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