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On January 10 2017 09:07 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2017 09:04 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:49 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:39 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:33 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:24 Gorsameth wrote:On January 10 2017 08:19 GreenHorizons wrote:In my view, the media spends too much time treating politics like a baseball game, a personality contest or a soap opera. We need to focus less on polls, fundraisers, gaffes and who's running for president in four years, and more on the very serious problems facing the American people -- problems which get relatively little discussion. I hope that's what our town meeting on CNN tonight will accomplish.
There are a lot of important questions to talk about, including:
How do we stop the movement toward oligarchy in our country in which the economic and political life of the United States is increasingly controlled by a handful of billionaires?
Are we content with the grotesque level of income and wealth inequality that we are experiencing?
Should the top one-tenth of 1 percent own almost as much wealth as the bottom 90 percent?
Should one family in this country, the Waltons of the Walmart retail chain, own as much as the bottom 40 percent of our people?
Should 52 percent of all new income be going into the pockets of the top 1 percent?
While the very rich become much richer, are we satisfied with having the highest rate of childhood poverty of almost any major country on earth?
Can a worker really survive on the current federal minimum wage of $7.25 an hour? How can a working-class family afford $15,000 a year for childcare? How can a senior citizen or a disabled veteran get by on $13,000 a year from Social Security?
What can be done about a political system in which the very rich are able to spend unlimited sums of money to elect candidates who represent their interests? Is that really what democracy is about? Why, in the year 2017, do we still have state governments trying to suppress the vote and make it harder for poor people, young people and people of color to participate in the political process?
Why is the richest country in the history of the world the only major country not to provide health care to all as a right, despite spending much more per capita? Why are we one of the very few countries on earth not to provide paid family and medical leave? With the five major drug companies making over $50 billion in profits last year, why do we end up paying, by far, the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs?
How do we succeed in a competitive global economy if we do not have the best educated workforce in the world? And how can we have that quality workforce if so many of our young people are unable to afford higher education or leave school deeply in debt? Not so many years ago, we had the highest percentage of college graduates in the world. Now we don't even rank in the top ten. What can we do to make sure that every American, regardless of income, gets all of the education he or she needs? Source Again, the media shows what people want to see. People want to see a baseball game, not boring policy. If you want the media to not follow the money then the government needs to pay them instead. Which brings it's own problems. lol, just with how Americans look at baseball, it makes for a poor analogy, but point taken. If we're chicken and egging it, it's obvious that politicians (leaders) should be the ones steering the media and their constituents away from that, not leaning into it for their advantage. Would be nice if Democrats didn't look at Bernie like a pariah, simply because he actually wants to talk about the issues instead of harping on Trump's grade school tweets. which democrats treated bernie like a pariah for that reason? all the ones i'm aware of that did it (which is only some) did it for entirely different reasons. I'm talking about right now, they should all be praising Bernie for talking about the issues and trying to make progress, instead they are sitting with their thumbs up their ass waiting for Republicans to come up with their ACA repeal plan. plenty of people have talked about issues, why should they be praising bernie in particular? what actions has bernie been taking in the past month that are especially praise-worthy? also, there's a big difference between not actively praising someone, and treating someone like a pariah, which was your initial claim. Who on the national stage is discussing the issues laid out in that piece? many are, many aren't. people bring up those points all the time. they get brougth up often enough in house/senate debates. it just doesn't get covered as much in media, cuz it's boring policy stuff. It's easy to mention the problems, we all know what they are, it's the solutions, and the coalition building to implement the solutions, that's the hard part. it is good that he's mentioning those things, but it's not some tremendously praiseworthy thing. it's just a decent job (if it actually translates into something). my dispute was with when you said: "like a pariah, simply because he actually wants to talk about the issues instead of harping on Trump's grade school tweets." so again, SPECIFY the democrats that are treating him wrongly, and provide some documentation thereof. I mean I get what you're after, but I think Mag's "I can't tell if you're talking about Trump or Bernie" sums up the sentiment I'm describing. Like I said, when a population desperately needs politicians dragging them back to the issues despite the media, no one's doing a better job than Bernie and they should be rallying around him, not sitting on their asses waiting on Republicans.
i'll take that as a retraction of the statement I objected to.
I gloss over mag's posts a lot. and he's just some random forumer.
why should they rally around bernie in particular though, rather than simply sit down adn do their work?
how do you know they aren't actually working on the issues, and you're just not hearing about it as much?
alot of the real work of governing is less obvious and less talked about, but it's still there if you care to look and do so.
also, bernie was chastising the MEDIA for not focusing on important issues, he said nothing about the actual people of congress ignoring them.
is bernie ACTUALLY getting people to focus on the substantive issues, or is he merely talking about, without actually changing the nubmer of people seriously engaged?
they also can agree with him, without rallying around him.
i'm sure a few are also a bit bitter at what he did to the democrats (I know you feel otherwise).
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On January 10 2017 09:07 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2017 09:04 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:49 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:39 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:33 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:24 Gorsameth wrote:On January 10 2017 08:19 GreenHorizons wrote:In my view, the media spends too much time treating politics like a baseball game, a personality contest or a soap opera. We need to focus less on polls, fundraisers, gaffes and who's running for president in four years, and more on the very serious problems facing the American people -- problems which get relatively little discussion. I hope that's what our town meeting on CNN tonight will accomplish.
There are a lot of important questions to talk about, including:
How do we stop the movement toward oligarchy in our country in which the economic and political life of the United States is increasingly controlled by a handful of billionaires?
Are we content with the grotesque level of income and wealth inequality that we are experiencing?
Should the top one-tenth of 1 percent own almost as much wealth as the bottom 90 percent?
Should one family in this country, the Waltons of the Walmart retail chain, own as much as the bottom 40 percent of our people?
Should 52 percent of all new income be going into the pockets of the top 1 percent?
While the very rich become much richer, are we satisfied with having the highest rate of childhood poverty of almost any major country on earth?
Can a worker really survive on the current federal minimum wage of $7.25 an hour? How can a working-class family afford $15,000 a year for childcare? How can a senior citizen or a disabled veteran get by on $13,000 a year from Social Security?
What can be done about a political system in which the very rich are able to spend unlimited sums of money to elect candidates who represent their interests? Is that really what democracy is about? Why, in the year 2017, do we still have state governments trying to suppress the vote and make it harder for poor people, young people and people of color to participate in the political process?
Why is the richest country in the history of the world the only major country not to provide health care to all as a right, despite spending much more per capita? Why are we one of the very few countries on earth not to provide paid family and medical leave? With the five major drug companies making over $50 billion in profits last year, why do we end up paying, by far, the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs?
How do we succeed in a competitive global economy if we do not have the best educated workforce in the world? And how can we have that quality workforce if so many of our young people are unable to afford higher education or leave school deeply in debt? Not so many years ago, we had the highest percentage of college graduates in the world. Now we don't even rank in the top ten. What can we do to make sure that every American, regardless of income, gets all of the education he or she needs? Source Again, the media shows what people want to see. People want to see a baseball game, not boring policy. If you want the media to not follow the money then the government needs to pay them instead. Which brings it's own problems. lol, just with how Americans look at baseball, it makes for a poor analogy, but point taken. If we're chicken and egging it, it's obvious that politicians (leaders) should be the ones steering the media and their constituents away from that, not leaning into it for their advantage. Would be nice if Democrats didn't look at Bernie like a pariah, simply because he actually wants to talk about the issues instead of harping on Trump's grade school tweets. which democrats treated bernie like a pariah for that reason? all the ones i'm aware of that did it (which is only some) did it for entirely different reasons. I'm talking about right now, they should all be praising Bernie for talking about the issues and trying to make progress, instead they are sitting with their thumbs up their ass waiting for Republicans to come up with their ACA repeal plan. plenty of people have talked about issues, why should they be praising bernie in particular? what actions has bernie been taking in the past month that are especially praise-worthy? also, there's a big difference between not actively praising someone, and treating someone like a pariah, which was your initial claim. Who on the national stage is discussing the issues laid out in that piece? many are, many aren't. people bring up those points all the time. they get brougth up often enough in house/senate debates. it just doesn't get covered as much in media, cuz it's boring policy stuff. It's easy to mention the problems, we all know what they are, it's the solutions, and the coalition building to implement the solutions, that's the hard part. it is good that he's mentioning those things, but it's not some tremendously praiseworthy thing. it's just a decent job (if it actually translates into something). my dispute was with when you said: "like a pariah, simply because he actually wants to talk about the issues instead of harping on Trump's grade school tweets." so again, SPECIFY the democrats that are treating him wrongly, and provide some documentation thereof. I mean I get what you're after, but I think Mag's "I can't tell if you're talking about Trump or Bernie" sums up the sentiment I'm describing. Like I said, when a population desperately needs politicians dragging them back to the issues despite the media, no one's doing a better job than Bernie and they should be rallying around him, not sitting on their asses waiting on Republicans.
Because if politicians talk about policy 24/7 the media will simply be reporting on something Kardassian did instead.
You don't hear all the other politicians who, like Bernie, are trying to talk policy because no one gives a shit about them.
The reason your hearing about it a bit from Bernie is because CNN thought they might get a few views from supporters of him from his Primary run.
In a few more weeks/months its back to 'not worth covering'.
Welcome to America.
This is why the rest of the world has state payed networks. So the actual news can get covered.
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On January 10 2017 08:18 LegalLord wrote:
Apparently the Venezuelan Parliament is trying to throw out Maduro? Does anyone from the Spanish-speaking world have any more useful insight into what is happening there?
My neck of the woods is too Mexican-heavy, so all the news out here is the looting, blockades, and violent protests from that Peña Nieto gasoline price hike at all the Pemex's. And of course the blame on Trump destabilizing shit (One of the lines Univision was peddling).
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On January 10 2017 09:15 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2017 09:07 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 09:04 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:50 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:49 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:44 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:39 zlefin wrote:On January 10 2017 08:33 GreenHorizons wrote:On January 10 2017 08:24 Gorsameth wrote:On January 10 2017 08:19 GreenHorizons wrote:[quote] Source Again, the media shows what people want to see. People want to see a baseball game, not boring policy. If you want the media to not follow the money then the government needs to pay them instead. Which brings it's own problems. lol, just with how Americans look at baseball, it makes for a poor analogy, but point taken. If we're chicken and egging it, it's obvious that politicians (leaders) should be the ones steering the media and their constituents away from that, not leaning into it for their advantage. Would be nice if Democrats didn't look at Bernie like a pariah, simply because he actually wants to talk about the issues instead of harping on Trump's grade school tweets. which democrats treated bernie like a pariah for that reason? all the ones i'm aware of that did it (which is only some) did it for entirely different reasons. I'm talking about right now, they should all be praising Bernie for talking about the issues and trying to make progress, instead they are sitting with their thumbs up their ass waiting for Republicans to come up with their ACA repeal plan. plenty of people have talked about issues, why should they be praising bernie in particular? what actions has bernie been taking in the past month that are especially praise-worthy? also, there's a big difference between not actively praising someone, and treating someone like a pariah, which was your initial claim. Who on the national stage is discussing the issues laid out in that piece? many are, many aren't. people bring up those points all the time. they get brougth up often enough in house/senate debates. it just doesn't get covered as much in media, cuz it's boring policy stuff. It's easy to mention the problems, we all know what they are, it's the solutions, and the coalition building to implement the solutions, that's the hard part. it is good that he's mentioning those things, but it's not some tremendously praiseworthy thing. it's just a decent job (if it actually translates into something). my dispute was with when you said: "like a pariah, simply because he actually wants to talk about the issues instead of harping on Trump's grade school tweets." so again, SPECIFY the democrats that are treating him wrongly, and provide some documentation thereof. I mean I get what you're after, but I think Mag's "I can't tell if you're talking about Trump or Bernie" sums up the sentiment I'm describing. Like I said, when a population desperately needs politicians dragging them back to the issues despite the media, no one's doing a better job than Bernie and they should be rallying around him, not sitting on their asses waiting on Republicans. Because if politicians talk about policy 24/7 the media will simply be reporting on something Kardassian did instead. You don't hear all the other politicians who, like Bernie, are trying to talk policy because no one gives a shit about them. The reason your hearing about it a bit from Bernie is because CNN thought they might get a few views from supporters of him from his Primary run. In a few more weeks/months its back to 'not worth covering'. Welcome to America. This is why the rest of the world has state payed networks. So the actual news can get covered.
cspan, while not state run, does a good job of covering the actual news. or at least the actual business of government.
of course almost nobody watches it.
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oh the democrats,now banking on trump to mess up big time so that their old party elite will have a shot next time. Anything but Bernie, or bust.
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On January 10 2017 11:24 pmh wrote:
oh the democrats,now banking on trump to mess up big time so that their old party elite will have a shot next time. Anything but Bernie, or bust.
well, banking on trump messing up isn't exactly bad odds.
I feel unsure about what point you're trying to make with your bernie remark.
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Do mainstream democrats really dislike Bernie that much? I think a lot of people have pegged me as a Hillary supporter, but I honestly didn't have a lot of opinions in the Democratic primary. For my preferences there were the Democratic candidates, then a little beloe them the Republican candidates, and then miles below that, Trump. + Show Spoiler [aside] +Election went pretty well for me, huh?
I imagine plenty of Hillary supporters don't much like a lot of Bernie supporters, either for not supporting Hillary in the election or for the relentless shitspew that's been thrown their way since the election. But Bernie himself has been notably uninvolved in either of those trends. I know he specifically and vocally disagreed with the former, I don't know if he's talked at all about the latter.
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Democrats already lost once to Trump as a result of something that very much looks like arrogance. Best not to risk a repeat performance.
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On January 10 2017 11:24 pmh wrote:
oh the democrats,now banking on trump to mess up big time so that their old party elite will have a shot next time. Anything but Bernie, or bust.
There's pretty much literally no strategy at all from the democratic side. All of their old elite are going to be much too old to run in 2020. This is what groupthink panicking as a collective and sticking their heads in the sand looks like.
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I didn't see the townhall thing on cnn with bernie. did anyone see it and have comments on it?
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On January 10 2017 12:54 zlefin wrote:
I didn't see the townhall thing on cnn with bernie. did anyone see it and have comments on it?
Best thing that's been on CNN in a while. Really should have at least one a week with someone (I wouldn't mind Bernie every week personally).
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On January 10 2017 13:41 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2017 12:54 zlefin wrote:
I didn't see the townhall thing on cnn with bernie. did anyone see it and have comments on it? Best thing that's been on CNN in a while. Really should have at least one a week with someone (I wouldn't mind Bernie every week personally).
I really feel town halls are the future of politics. great way to communicate with people and make them feel like you care.
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On January 10 2017 11:54 Nevuk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2017 11:24 pmh wrote:
oh the democrats,now banking on trump to mess up big time so that their old party elite will have a shot next time. Anything but Bernie, or bust. There's pretty much literally no strategy at all from the democratic side. All of their old elite are going to be much too old to run in 2020. This is what groupthink panicking as a collective and sticking their heads in the sand looks like.
They want to manufacture a new Obama, but it just doesn't work that way. People with that kind of natural charisma can't just be randomly created.
Julian Castro and Cory Booker are the past two failed attempts that were dead on arrival but the DNC didn't notice.
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On January 10 2017 14:41 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2017 11:54 Nevuk wrote:On January 10 2017 11:24 pmh wrote:
oh the democrats,now banking on trump to mess up big time so that their old party elite will have a shot next time. Anything but Bernie, or bust. There's pretty much literally no strategy at all from the democratic side. All of their old elite are going to be much too old to run in 2020. This is what groupthink panicking as a collective and sticking their heads in the sand looks like. They want to manufacture a new Obama, but it just doesn't work that way. People with that kind of natural charisma can't just be randomly created. Julian Castro and Cory Booker are the past two failed attempts that were dead on arrival but the DNC didn't notice.
The current attempt seems to be to beg Michelle Obama into changing her mind.
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I mean the GOP wanted to manufacture a new Obama too. That's what Paul Ryan was for in 2012 and Marco Rubio was for in 2016.
Turns out they were focusing on the wrong aspect (the "young wunderkind" aspect) and completely neglected the "connects with people" aspect, though it obviously worked out okay for them when they were invaded by an old billionaire who managed it.
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On January 10 2017 14:49 Nevuk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2017 14:41 LegalLord wrote:On January 10 2017 11:54 Nevuk wrote:On January 10 2017 11:24 pmh wrote:
oh the democrats,now banking on trump to mess up big time so that their old party elite will have a shot next time. Anything but Bernie, or bust. There's pretty much literally no strategy at all from the democratic side. All of their old elite are going to be much too old to run in 2020. This is what groupthink panicking as a collective and sticking their heads in the sand looks like. They want to manufacture a new Obama, but it just doesn't work that way. People with that kind of natural charisma can't just be randomly created. Julian Castro and Cory Booker are the past two failed attempts that were dead on arrival but the DNC didn't notice. The current attempt seems to be to beg Michelle Obama into changing her mind.
Am I the only person whose opinion on Michelle Obama is "no fucking thanks?"
She's just not the presidential type, and she knows it.
On January 10 2017 14:58 TheTenthDoc wrote:
I mean the GOP wanted to manufacture a new Obama too. That's what Paul Ryan was for in 2012 and Marco Rubio was for in 2016.
Turns out they were focusing on the wrong aspect (the "young wunderkind" aspect) and completely neglected the "connects with people" aspect, though it obviously worked out okay for them when they were invaded by an old billionaire who managed it.
The Democrats focused on "young minority" instead of "connects with working class people" as well. Mistake from both sides.
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On January 10 2017 11:45 ChristianS wrote:Do mainstream democrats really dislike Bernie that much? I think a lot of people have pegged me as a Hillary supporter, but I honestly didn't have a lot of opinions in the Democratic primary. For my preferences there were the Democratic candidates, then a little beloe them the Republican candidates, and then miles below that, Trump. + Show Spoiler [aside] +Election went pretty well for me, huh? I know there are people out there who actually liked Hillary for Hillary, but I bet even a lot of them would have been happy enough with Bernie. I imagine plenty of Hillary supporters don't much like a lot of Bernie supporters, either for not supporting Hillary in the election or for the relentless shitspew that's been thrown their way since the election. But Bernie himself has been notably uninvolved in either of those trends. I know he specifically and vocally disagreed with the former, I don't know if he's talked at all about the latter.
To give you an understanding; Pantsuit Nation initially was popular because people could hide from Bernie supporters. That is how much shitspewing comes out from the Bernie camp. Democrats literally had to hide from his supporters until after the primaries.
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Now here's something...
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Senate Democrats will challenge President-elect Donald Trump's pick for attorney general, Sen. Jeff Sessions, when he appears before the Senate Judiciary Committee over his hard-line stand on immigration, past record on civil rights and whether he supports community policing.
The Alabama lawmaker is known as one of the most staunchly conservative members of the Senate, and has already drawn opposition from at least two Democrats, New Jersey Sen. Cory Booker and Ohio Sen. Sherrod Brown.
In a dramatic turn, Booker — one of three black senators — said he will testify against Sessions on Wednesday, marking a rare instance in which a senator has testified against a colleague seeking a Cabinet post. In a statement, Booker accused Sessions of having a "concerning" record on civil rights and criminal justice reform and called his decision "a call to conscience."
Democrats don't have the power to block Sessions' nomination since Republicans control the Senate and only need a simple majority to confirm the four-term senator. However, they can use the two days of confirmation hearings beginning Tuesday to cast Sessions as out of the mainstream on issues critical to the party's core voters — Hispanics, African Americans and women — ahead of the 2018 election cycle.
Source
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/read-donald-trumps-tweet-black-171917161.html
I don't get trump anymore. He has won what more does he want? Responding to streep is fine but this tweet is just so incredibly childish,it accomplishes absolutely nothing but negative things. Why does he even bothers with this.
4 years with tweets like this every other day? To him its one big show I guess,i doubt he will even make one single decision himself,just a front man for the hardcore conservatives.
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On January 10 2017 22:52 pmh wrote:https://www.yahoo.com/news/read-donald-trumps-tweet-black-171917161.htmlI don't get trump anymore. He has won what more does he want? Responding to streep is fine but this tweet is just so incredibly childish,it accomplishes absolutely nothing but negative things. Why does he even bothers with this. 4 years with tweets like this every other day? To him its one big show I guess,i doubt he will even make one single decision himself,just a front man for the hardcore conservatives.
He is a deeply disturbed man.
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EPT
