EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 462
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
edit: it's true that the primary effect of ME involvement has been to strengthen china's geopolitical position. This is because, yes, we are incompetent empire builders. It doesn't mean we aren't trying to build empire. Were just trying and failing. Which is worse. | ||
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Roe
Canada6002 Posts
On September 21 2013 09:22 sc2superfan101 wrote: And what countries have we done this to? Colony building is one of the best ways of forcing the issue. If Iraq and Afghanistan are our benchmarks than we've done a pretty piss-poor job at building our empire so far. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/03/world/middleeast/china-reaps-biggest-benefits-of-iraq-oil-boom.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0 A better question: what country haven't you done this to? | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On September 21 2013 09:53 sam!zdat wrote: sure. Not the case in iraq, where we do things like lock iraqi workers out of factories and then bring in foreign nationals to employ in the 'reconstruction' edit: it's true that the primary effect of ME involvement has been to strengthen china's geopolitical position. This is because, yes, we are incompetent empire builders. It doesn't mean we aren't trying to build empire. Were just trying and failing. Which is worse. china is reallly the big problem because they run their empire so well, boots on the neck of the people and mindcontrol too. if the U.S. really is an evil empire, then they should really take lessons | ||
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
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Sermokala
United States14137 Posts
we didn't even have to invade the whole world like the british and macedonia or struggle to bring civilization to the barbarians like the romans and mongols. We just gave them a few peaces of paper and said it had value. | ||
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Sermokala
United States14137 Posts
On September 21 2013 03:42 Jormundr wrote: It would make more sense to do away with it entirely (I'm not against that). Your a horrible person if you honestly think this. Step away from the logic and reason you think will bring you what you want and go talk to someone whos actualy 75 and see if they're able to work and survive like a 30 or 20 year old. | ||
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
edit@below: oh man that's what I'd be doing right now if my FUCKIN COMPUTER weren't broken. Life in the first world is so hard | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On September 21 2013 10:37 Sermokala wrote: I would say the opposite really. we're really good at creating empires. The whole world is now economically culturally and politically (as in government) exactly like america. In the nations that arn't exactly like us its considered a problem and the people cry out to be more like america (even if they don't think its what they mean). we didn't even have to invade the whole world like the british and macedonia or struggle to bring civilization to the barbarians like the romans and mongols. We just gave them a few peaces of paper and said it had value. empire is autocratic. what the u.s. has is, if you are talking about culture etc, is a sphere of influence. play some civ yo | ||
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Sermokala
United States14137 Posts
I mean shit just look at the EU and tell me it doesn't remind you of the early american government. | ||
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
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Sermokala
United States14137 Posts
On September 21 2013 10:50 sam!zdat wrote: china does not have american style capitalism So Liberal jesus saw his chinese people struggling and opening up zones for free economy and said "let there be efficent industry" and so it was acording to sam. | ||
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BioNova
United States598 Posts
On September 20 2013 10:00 Sub40APM wrote: Yes. It is much more believable that a guy with an MBA from the 1970s who runs a website that sells subscriptions to 'alternative statistics' is on the level. Mr. Krugman received his B.A. from Yale University in 1974 and his Ph.D. from MIT in 1977. Wut? I suppose suppose the next step is to slander where he graduated. Once again Try not to generalize. Economics is pretty specific, so the slander should be too. You know. More than a feeling? Also from the 70's So many people have come and gone Their faces fade as the years go by Yet I still recall as I wander on As clear as the sun in the summer sky It's more than a feeling More than a feeling!!! | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On September 21 2013 09:49 oneofthem wrote: since imperialism as defined by a country's place in teh global economic circuit is universal enough to be a background assumption, at this point it is more helpful to differentiate imperialist situations that will improve over time and those that won't. i think everyone would agree that exploitative regimes and bad "circuits" of (dis)accumulation in the dominated countries can create development traps, while there are also examples of places that have managed to move in a more virtuous cycle towards hgiher value production and more democratic culture. the latter is a beneficial though not always realized feature of cultural imperialism I think a far better definition of imperialism is one where a country exerts control in diplomatic or military fashion. If your nation is rather large with high GDP and technological sophistication, it could give you a measure of pre-eminence amongst global economies. It cannot be implied that an economic powerhouse must necessarily be imperialistic. Far from, it can be reclusive and non-interventionist. Calling this and that economic imperialism and cultural imperialism robs the word of meaning, in my opinion. | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On September 21 2013 10:50 sam!zdat wrote: china does not have american style capitalism yea it is way worse | ||
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Roe
Canada6002 Posts
On September 21 2013 10:55 Sermokala wrote: So Liberal jesus saw his chinese people struggling and opening up zones for free economy and said "let there be efficent industry" and so it was acording to sam. what? I don't get this sentence at all, but nevertheless china's economy is more of a mutated form of state-capitalism. the real estate is a clear exemplar of this. | ||
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
On September 21 2013 10:55 Sermokala wrote: So Liberal jesus saw his chinese people struggling and opening up zones for free economy and said "let there be efficent industry" and so it was acording to sam. wut danglars it is not possible for a capitalist power to be reclusive and isolationist | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
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sam!zdat
United States5559 Posts
but that would just make life too easy for sam I suppose | ||
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DoubleReed
United States4130 Posts
On September 21 2013 10:48 Sermokala wrote: Is it not? Kpop jpop romanian pop and indian pop are generally the same pop music that was started in america. China got its economic "strength" by using american style capitalist policies. Even now its struggling as much as it can to repeat the creation of a middle class much exactly like america post WW2. I mean shit just look at the EU and tell me it doesn't remind you of the early american government. Considering that American Pop came out of European harmonies mixed with African rhythms... It's true that this musical style has caught on like wildfire, subsuming everything in its path. Kind of awesome, really. But there are cultural variations of it. It's not like pop music has made the world have less variety. That wouldn't be accurate. It's more that cultures have mixed and blended and generated new forms of music. But really, you're just kind of saying anything that is secular, democratic, or capitalist is "American." You're kind of rigging the language when you do that (not to mention Ethnocentric). If I'm not mistaken, most new democracies are modeled more on the South African constitution rather than ours. | ||
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