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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 3574

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-04-08 11:53:34
April 08 2016 11:45 GMT
#71461
stiglitz probably would endorse sanders but he is also advising hillary in an unofficial capacity. im not aware of any official connection he has to sanders campaign. he is involved with the roosevelt institute tho

the importance of a candidate's and for that matter campaign's role in picking the right people to run the enormously influential executive branch cannot be overstated. this simply disqualifies sanders.
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
April 08 2016 11:52 GMT
#71462
On April 08 2016 19:52 Soularion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 08 2016 11:05 Lord Tolkien wrote:
On April 08 2016 09:45 TheFish7 wrote:
BREAKING NEWS: Hillary doesn't know how to swipe a metrocard! Not a true new yorker!! Well, to be fair, those things can be finicky sometimes.

http://nypost.com/2016/04/07/hillary-has-to-take-five-swipes-with-metrocard-to-ride-subway/

Well, in the same vein, Sanders doesn't know that they discontinued tokens for the metro yet.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/bernie-sanders-not-savvy-subway-rider-article-1.2585761

But either way, this is mostly just silly.


The question is can Bernie win a 10+% margin in NY with two weeks left in a closed primary state. Gut says no, and I find that

Regarding the Daily News interview, you could honestly just listen to the interview yourself and form your own opinions.


Well, he only needs to win by 4% in order to be on track according to 538's predictions, so even if he just ties it'll still be -possible- albeit quite improbable. 4% is still going to be an uphill fight, but it's not 10% which is almost impossible.

That would be before getting massacred in the South. He needs larger margins in later states to make up for high margin losses and underperformance early.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Deleted User 137586
Profile Joined January 2011
7859 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-04-08 11:57:18
April 08 2016 11:56 GMT
#71463
On April 08 2016 20:52 Lord Tolkien wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 08 2016 19:52 Soularion wrote:
On April 08 2016 11:05 Lord Tolkien wrote:
On April 08 2016 09:45 TheFish7 wrote:
BREAKING NEWS: Hillary doesn't know how to swipe a metrocard! Not a true new yorker!! Well, to be fair, those things can be finicky sometimes.

http://nypost.com/2016/04/07/hillary-has-to-take-five-swipes-with-metrocard-to-ride-subway/

Well, in the same vein, Sanders doesn't know that they discontinued tokens for the metro yet.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/bernie-sanders-not-savvy-subway-rider-article-1.2585761

But either way, this is mostly just silly.


The question is can Bernie win a 10+% margin in NY with two weeks left in a closed primary state. Gut says no, and I find that

Regarding the Daily News interview, you could honestly just listen to the interview yourself and form your own opinions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAKWgjBfmH8

Well, he only needs to win by 4% in order to be on track according to 538's predictions, so even if he just ties it'll still be -possible- albeit quite improbable. 4% is still going to be an uphill fight, but it's not 10% which is almost impossible.

That would be before getting massacred in the South. He needs larger margins in later states to make up for high margin losses and underperformance early.


The 4 points come from the fivethirtyeight calculation which took the early mauling into account. Because NY isn't favourable to Sanders, he has a relatively low % there, as compared to 48 points in Oregon and 56 points in North Dakota...
Cry 'havoc' and let slip the dogs of war
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
April 08 2016 12:00 GMT
#71464
On April 08 2016 20:56 Ghanburighan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 08 2016 20:52 Lord Tolkien wrote:
On April 08 2016 19:52 Soularion wrote:
On April 08 2016 11:05 Lord Tolkien wrote:
On April 08 2016 09:45 TheFish7 wrote:
BREAKING NEWS: Hillary doesn't know how to swipe a metrocard! Not a true new yorker!! Well, to be fair, those things can be finicky sometimes.

http://nypost.com/2016/04/07/hillary-has-to-take-five-swipes-with-metrocard-to-ride-subway/

Well, in the same vein, Sanders doesn't know that they discontinued tokens for the metro yet.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/bernie-sanders-not-savvy-subway-rider-article-1.2585761

But either way, this is mostly just silly.


The question is can Bernie win a 10+% margin in NY with two weeks left in a closed primary state. Gut says no, and I find that

Regarding the Daily News interview, you could honestly just listen to the interview yourself and form your own opinions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAKWgjBfmH8

Well, he only needs to win by 4% in order to be on track according to 538's predictions, so even if he just ties it'll still be -possible- albeit quite improbable. 4% is still going to be an uphill fight, but it's not 10% which is almost impossible.

That would be before getting massacred in the South. He needs larger margins in later states to make up for high margin losses and underperformance early.


The 4 points come from the fivethirtyeight calculation which took the early mauling into account. Because NY isn't favourable to Sanders, he has a relatively low % there, as compared to 48 points in Oregon and 56 points in North Dakota...

Ah, it comes from March.

I stand corrected, though I've looked at a number of other predictions requiring much higher NY margins, mostly because they tamp down on the extreme margins in some other states.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-04-08 12:26:24
April 08 2016 12:15 GMT
#71465
Edit: already posted
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Deleted User 137586
Profile Joined January 2011
7859 Posts
April 08 2016 12:19 GMT
#71466
Lord, you're not having a good day.
Cry 'havoc' and let slip the dogs of war
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23238 Posts
April 08 2016 12:21 GMT
#71467
On April 08 2016 21:19 Ghanburighan wrote:
Lord, you're not having a good day.


Isn't that like the second time this has happened in a week (maybe not Lord)?
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
SpiritoftheTunA
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States20903 Posts
April 08 2016 12:23 GMT
#71468
i like that krugman article it sounds about right
posting on liquid sites in current year
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-04-08 12:27:31
April 08 2016 12:26 GMT
#71469
On April 08 2016 21:19 Ghanburighan wrote:
Lord, you're not having a good day.

Just woke up. Not a morning person. Eh.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23238 Posts
April 08 2016 12:47 GMT
#71470
SIOUX FALLS - TransCanada estimates 16,800 gallons may have leaked from the Keystone Pipeline into a field south of Freeman.

The leak was first spotted by a landowner on Saturday, but it's still not clear how long the pipeline was leaking before it was caught.

For now, the entire pipeline remains shut down while officials investigate and clean-up.

The leak is a nightmare scenario for many landowners in the area, which is why groups of them continue to fight the prospect of the Keystone XL Pipeline in state court.

The Keystone XL Pipeline may be dead for now, but a lawsuit to fight it is alive and well.

Earlier this year, President Obama blocked construction of the controversial pipeline weeks before the South Dakota Public Utilities Commission re-certified the project.

Keystone XL Pipeline protesters believe a recent leak in Freeman gives them new fuel in their fight against the state.

Attorney Peter Capossela said "many tribes, and non-Indians continue to press their concerns on the possibility of constructing the Keystone XL Pipeline, particularly in light of the recent spill."


Source
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands21694 Posts
April 08 2016 13:04 GMT
#71471
On April 08 2016 21:47 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
SIOUX FALLS - TransCanada estimates 16,800 gallons may have leaked from the Keystone Pipeline into a field south of Freeman.

The leak was first spotted by a landowner on Saturday, but it's still not clear how long the pipeline was leaking before it was caught.

For now, the entire pipeline remains shut down while officials investigate and clean-up.

The leak is a nightmare scenario for many landowners in the area, which is why groups of them continue to fight the prospect of the Keystone XL Pipeline in state court.

The Keystone XL Pipeline may be dead for now, but a lawsuit to fight it is alive and well.

Earlier this year, President Obama blocked construction of the controversial pipeline weeks before the South Dakota Public Utilities Commission re-certified the project.

Keystone XL Pipeline protesters believe a recent leak in Freeman gives them new fuel in their fight against the state.

Attorney Peter Capossela said "many tribes, and non-Indians continue to press their concerns on the possibility of constructing the Keystone XL Pipeline, particularly in light of the recent spill."


Source

Why do pipes in the US always leak...
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23238 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-04-08 13:19:31
April 08 2016 13:15 GMT
#71472
On April 08 2016 22:04 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 08 2016 21:47 GreenHorizons wrote:
SIOUX FALLS - TransCanada estimates 16,800 gallons may have leaked from the Keystone Pipeline into a field south of Freeman.

The leak was first spotted by a landowner on Saturday, but it's still not clear how long the pipeline was leaking before it was caught.

For now, the entire pipeline remains shut down while officials investigate and clean-up.

The leak is a nightmare scenario for many landowners in the area, which is why groups of them continue to fight the prospect of the Keystone XL Pipeline in state court.

The Keystone XL Pipeline may be dead for now, but a lawsuit to fight it is alive and well.

Earlier this year, President Obama blocked construction of the controversial pipeline weeks before the South Dakota Public Utilities Commission re-certified the project.

Keystone XL Pipeline protesters believe a recent leak in Freeman gives them new fuel in their fight against the state.

Attorney Peter Capossela said "many tribes, and non-Indians continue to press their concerns on the possibility of constructing the Keystone XL Pipeline, particularly in light of the recent spill."


Source

Why do pipes in the US always leak...


Because regulations kill jobs, and when we have them we don't enforce them with any teeth.

One big question is whether TransCanada should get waivers to use thinner pipes on Keystone XL than is normally required in the United States.

The Transportation Department’s Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration, which oversees oil pipelines, gave such waivers to TransCanada for the first two Keystone pipelines. TransCanada says the thinner pipes have been allowed in Canada for decades and pose no extra risk.

But Cesar de Leon, a former deputy administrator of the pipeline and safety administration who is now an independent pipeline safety engineer, said the thinner standard is appropriate only if pipelines are being aggressively monitored for deterioration. Although the safety administration required such monitoring in the Keystone permits, it “didn’t have the people to monitor compliance,” he said.

In a report in March on the agency’s broader permitting practices, the Transportation Department’s inspector general found that, in many cases, the agency had failed to check the safety records of permit applicants and had not checked to verify that permit terms were being followed.


Source

What blows my mind is that we can't even make it where it's more profitable to pay your own inspectors than it is to spill 10's of thousands of gallons of oil.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
kwizach
Profile Joined June 2011
3658 Posts
April 08 2016 13:59 GMT
#71473
On April 08 2016 19:57 Ghanburighan wrote:
4% + 2 delegates worth from WI, whatever that might mean in %.

Someone recently said that Krugman and Stiglitz support Sanders, but Krugman just posted this:

Show nested quote +

From the beginning, many and probably most liberal policy wonks were skeptical about Bernie Sanders. On many major issues — including the signature issues of his campaign, especially financial reform — he seemed to go for easy slogans over hard thinking. And his political theory of change, his waving away of limits, seemed utterly unrealistic.

Some Sanders supporters responded angrily when these concerns were raised, immediately accusing anyone expressing doubts about their hero of being corrupt if not actually criminal. But intolerance and cultishness from some of a candidate’s supporters are one thing; what about the candidate himself?

Unfortunately, in the past few days the answer has become all too clear: Mr. Sanders is starting to sound like his worst followers. Bernie is becoming a Bernie Bro.

Let me illustrate the point about issues by talking about bank reform.

The easy slogan here is “Break up the big banks.” It’s obvious why this slogan is appealing from a political point of view: Wall Street supplies an excellent cast of villains. But were big banks really at the heart of the financial crisis, and would breaking them up protect us from future crises?

Many analysts concluded years ago that the answers to both questions were no. Predatory lending was largely carried out by smaller, non-Wall Street institutions like Countrywide Financial; the crisis itself was centered not on big banks but on “shadow banks” like Lehman Brothers that weren’t necessarily that big. And the financial reform that President Obama signed in 2010 made a real effort to address these problems. It could and should be made stronger, but pounding the table about big banks misses the point.

Yet going on about big banks is pretty much all Mr. Sanders has done. On the rare occasions on which he was asked for more detail, he didn’t seem to have anything more to offer. And this absence of substance beyond the slogans seems to be true of his positions across the board.

You could argue that policy details are unimportant as long as a politician has the right values and character. As it happens, I don’t agree. For one thing, a politician’s policy specifics are often a very important clue to his or her true character — I warned about George W. Bush’s mendacity back when most journalists were still portraying him as a bluff, honest fellow, because I actually looked at his tax proposals. For another, I consider a commitment to facing hard choices as opposed to taking the easy way out an important value in itself.

But in any case, the way Mr. Sanders is now campaigning raises serious character and values issues.

It’s one thing for the Sanders campaign to point to Hillary Clinton’s Wall Street connections, which are real, although the question should be whether they have distorted her positions, a case the campaign has never even tried to make. But recent attacks on Mrs. Clinton as a tool of the fossil fuel industry are just plain dishonest, and speak of a campaign that has lost its ethical moorings.

And then there was Wednesday’s rant about how Mrs. Clinton is not “qualified” to be president.

What probably set that off was a recent interview of Mr. Sanders by The Daily News, in which he repeatedly seemed unable to respond when pressed to go beyond his usual slogans. Mrs. Clinton, asked about that interview, was careful in her choice of words, suggesting that “he hadn’t done his homework.”

But Mr. Sanders wasn’t careful at all, declaring that what he considers Mrs. Clinton’s past sins, including her support for trade agreements and her vote to authorize the Iraq war — for which she has apologized — make her totally unfit for office.

Sign Up for the Opinion Today Newsletter
Every weekday, get thought-provoking commentary from Op-Ed columnists, The Times editorial board and contributing writers from around the world.

This is really bad, on two levels. Holding people accountable for their past is O.K., but imposing a standard of purity, in which any compromise or misstep makes you the moral equivalent of the bad guys, isn’t. Abraham Lincoln didn’t meet that standard; neither did F.D.R. Nor, for that matter, has Bernie Sanders (think guns).

And the timing of the Sanders rant was truly astonishing. Given her large lead in delegates — based largely on the support of African-American voters, who respond to her pragmatism because history tells them to distrust extravagant promises — Mrs. Clinton is the strong favorite for the Democratic nomination.

Is Mr. Sanders positioning himself to join the “Bernie or bust” crowd, walking away if he can’t pull off an extraordinary upset, and possibly helping put Donald Trump or Ted Cruz in the White House? If not, what does he think he’s doing?

The Sanders campaign has brought out a lot of idealism and energy that the progressive movement needs. It has also, however, brought out a streak of petulant self-righteousness among some supporters. Has it brought out that streak in the candidate, too?

Source

I'm participating in a conference for which Krugman will deliver the keynote speech next week, I'll make sure to go shake his hand and thank him for being a voice of reason in this primary

By the way, I don't know if it's been posted:

Obama warns Dems against 'Tea Party mentality

President Obama on Thursday warned Democrats against adopting a “Tea Party mentality” that could lead to deep divisions within the party and harm its chances of winning national elections.

Following the rise of the Tea Party and Donald Trump, Obama said infighting within the Republican Party is much worse than it is on the Democratic side.

But he urged his party’s voters to be mindful of that danger in the midst of a heated primary battle between Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders.

“The thing Democrats have to guard against is going in the direction that the Republicans are much further along on, and that is this sense 'we are just going to get our way, and if we don’t, then we’ll cannibalize our own, kick them out and try again,' ” he said at a town-hall meeting with law students in Chicago.

In that scenario, Democrats could “stake out positions so extreme, they alienate the broad public,” Obama added. “I don’t see that being where the Democrats go, but it’s always something we have to pay attention to.”

Obama’s comments come amid a major dustup between Clinton and Sanders that has Democrats concerned about keeping their party unified.

Sanders on Wednesday accused Clinton of being not “qualified” to serve as president because of her willingness to use a super-PAC and support for the Iraq War and free trade agreements.

The president did not name Clinton or Sanders. But he offered a staunch defense of his incrementalist view of politics, which has sometimes come under fire from the Vermont senator.

"That’s how change generally happens,” he said, citing the example of his signature healthcare law.

“It’s not perfect. There is no public option, not single-payer,” he said. “If I was designing a system from scratch, it would have been more elegant. But that’s not what was possible in our democracy."

Source

He also defended Clinton through his press secretary as obviously qualified.
"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions." -- Stephen Colbert
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15690 Posts
April 08 2016 14:34 GMT
#71474
The big issue with the tea party mentality is that it doesn't account for the diversity of our country. Bernie or bust doesn't consider the fact that many democrats, even when they hear Bernie out, still disagree and still want Clinton. The tea party mentality does not encourage unity and instead celebrates disagreement as an opportunity to finally stamp out the opposition and reign supreme. But it isn't realistic and only leads to infighting. It's just so destructive and it is sad to see this divisive culture be romanticized as empowering.
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
April 08 2016 16:52 GMT
#71475
On April 08 2016 22:04 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 08 2016 21:47 GreenHorizons wrote:
SIOUX FALLS - TransCanada estimates 16,800 gallons may have leaked from the Keystone Pipeline into a field south of Freeman.

The leak was first spotted by a landowner on Saturday, but it's still not clear how long the pipeline was leaking before it was caught.

For now, the entire pipeline remains shut down while officials investigate and clean-up.

The leak is a nightmare scenario for many landowners in the area, which is why groups of them continue to fight the prospect of the Keystone XL Pipeline in state court.

The Keystone XL Pipeline may be dead for now, but a lawsuit to fight it is alive and well.

Earlier this year, President Obama blocked construction of the controversial pipeline weeks before the South Dakota Public Utilities Commission re-certified the project.

Keystone XL Pipeline protesters believe a recent leak in Freeman gives them new fuel in their fight against the state.

Attorney Peter Capossela said "many tribes, and non-Indians continue to press their concerns on the possibility of constructing the Keystone XL Pipeline, particularly in light of the recent spill."


Source

Why do pipes in the US always leak...

Because pipes everywhere always leak, we just have an activist media on that issue.
Freeeeeeedom
Naracs_Duc
Profile Joined August 2015
746 Posts
April 08 2016 16:57 GMT
#71476
On April 09 2016 01:52 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 08 2016 22:04 Gorsameth wrote:
On April 08 2016 21:47 GreenHorizons wrote:
SIOUX FALLS - TransCanada estimates 16,800 gallons may have leaked from the Keystone Pipeline into a field south of Freeman.

The leak was first spotted by a landowner on Saturday, but it's still not clear how long the pipeline was leaking before it was caught.

For now, the entire pipeline remains shut down while officials investigate and clean-up.

The leak is a nightmare scenario for many landowners in the area, which is why groups of them continue to fight the prospect of the Keystone XL Pipeline in state court.

The Keystone XL Pipeline may be dead for now, but a lawsuit to fight it is alive and well.

Earlier this year, President Obama blocked construction of the controversial pipeline weeks before the South Dakota Public Utilities Commission re-certified the project.

Keystone XL Pipeline protesters believe a recent leak in Freeman gives them new fuel in their fight against the state.

Attorney Peter Capossela said "many tribes, and non-Indians continue to press their concerns on the possibility of constructing the Keystone XL Pipeline, particularly in light of the recent spill."


Source

Why do pipes in the US always leak...

Because pipes everywhere always leak, we just have an activist media on that issue.


Infrastructure never breaks. Just like racism, once something is installed it will never regress and there will never be a problem again so stop accusing me of that.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15690 Posts
April 08 2016 16:57 GMT
#71477
On April 09 2016 01:52 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 08 2016 22:04 Gorsameth wrote:
On April 08 2016 21:47 GreenHorizons wrote:
SIOUX FALLS - TransCanada estimates 16,800 gallons may have leaked from the Keystone Pipeline into a field south of Freeman.

The leak was first spotted by a landowner on Saturday, but it's still not clear how long the pipeline was leaking before it was caught.

For now, the entire pipeline remains shut down while officials investigate and clean-up.

The leak is a nightmare scenario for many landowners in the area, which is why groups of them continue to fight the prospect of the Keystone XL Pipeline in state court.

The Keystone XL Pipeline may be dead for now, but a lawsuit to fight it is alive and well.

Earlier this year, President Obama blocked construction of the controversial pipeline weeks before the South Dakota Public Utilities Commission re-certified the project.

Keystone XL Pipeline protesters believe a recent leak in Freeman gives them new fuel in their fight against the state.

Attorney Peter Capossela said "many tribes, and non-Indians continue to press their concerns on the possibility of constructing the Keystone XL Pipeline, particularly in light of the recent spill."


Source

Why do pipes in the US always leak...

Because pipes everywhere always leak, we just have an activist media on that issue.


There are pipes all over the world which are considered "must not leak under any circumstances", which accomplish their goals. For any situation, you can make sure the pipe doesn't burst. It's just a matter of how much you want to spend on the pipe. If it's too expensive to be safe, it is too expensive to be built, IMO.
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
April 08 2016 17:21 GMT
#71478
Well, you must not drive then. Or bike. Or anything.

An oil spill on land is a de minimus environmental cleanup project. And pipelines have incredibly low failure rates when compared to other means of transporting fossil fuels per barrel moved.

Those pipes that are super secret double must not leak have constant inspections, are secured. This pipeline is designed so Moose and Reindeer can travel under it and bears. Probably also random people can walk up and touch it. Also its in Canada, so the "America hurr durr" criticism is, in itself, idiotic.
Freeeeeeedom
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 08 2016 17:28 GMT
#71479
Since I have zero faith in government regulation while the GOP controls both houses, I see no reason to trust the Keystone pipeline to be regulated or built properly. And I have zero trust for any oil company where massive litigation is just a write off and extra PR expense.. The last 16 years have taught me that regulation only functions if the people in power want it to and are willing to hold a company's feed to the fire.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
m4ini
Profile Joined February 2014
4215 Posts
April 08 2016 17:33 GMT
#71480
Also its in Canada, so the "America hurr durr" criticism is, in itself, idiotic.


So would be the argument "pipes leak everywhere all the time". They don't. And it's not just the superdeluxe 9000 pipelines that go through prime ministers bathrooms etc that don't leak.

Oh, and it's not just that pipelines generally leak less often everywhere else in the world, you want to go into regulations etc in north carolina?

GreenHorizons is spot on. "Regulations suck" and "the few we have are not enforced". You might want to add on top of that laughable punishments and fines, with attached loopholes to get them even lower. THAT is why you have constant oil spills. Because no one gives a shit, it's cheaper to pay the fines than to make sure shit doesn't happen in the first place.
On track to MA1950A.
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