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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 1132

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
JonnyBNoHo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States6277 Posts
June 22 2014 20:25 GMT
#22621
On June 23 2014 05:12 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 03:44 KwarK wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:42 Simberto wrote:
Why is getting a work permit that hard? Don't they WANT you to do something useful and work legally? That sounds like something the government would want people to do. That is pretty much all people who don't want immigration complain about here: "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!".

I must honestly say i am kind of happy i don't have any plans of emigrating somewhere. The whole thing sounds like a bureaucratic nightmare. I guess getting into the EU isn't easy either.

Nope. I should add that I also need a sponsor to guarantee that I won't be a burden to the government and be legally responsible for any costs I may accrue while here and that that sponsor pretty much can't be on minimum wage or have any dependents already.



But we can't change/update any of those laws without securing the Mexican border first... Because...... well just because...

It makes total sense to make immigrants from all over the world go through a ridiculous and archaic system because of the Mexican Border...

I guess if we are supposed to have the same rules for anyone in the world it makes some sense, but if immigrants from different countries can/should be treated differently than why the hell can't we change the laws about immigrating from India, UK, China, Etc.. Without having to do anything about the southern border?

IDK, somewhere along the line a lot of people decided that immigration reform should be 'comprehensive'.
Jormundr
Profile Joined July 2011
United States1678 Posts
June 22 2014 20:42 GMT
#22622
On June 23 2014 05:08 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 03:42 Simberto wrote:
Why is getting a work permit that hard? Don't they WANT you to do something useful and work legally? That sounds like something the government would want people to do. That is pretty much all people who don't want immigration complain about here: "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!".

I must honestly say i am kind of happy i don't have any plans of emigrating somewhere. The whole thing sounds like a bureaucratic nightmare. I guess getting into the EU isn't easy either.

The worry here is that they'll take your job for less.

What's wrong with that?
Capitalism is beneficial for people who work harder than other people. Under capitalism the only way to make more money is to work harder then your competitors whether they be other companies or workers. ~ Vegetarian
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23946 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-06-22 20:49:03
June 22 2014 20:45 GMT
#22623
On June 23 2014 05:25 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 05:12 GreenHorizons wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:44 KwarK wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:42 Simberto wrote:
Why is getting a work permit that hard? Don't they WANT you to do something useful and work legally? That sounds like something the government would want people to do. That is pretty much all people who don't want immigration complain about here: "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!".

I must honestly say i am kind of happy i don't have any plans of emigrating somewhere. The whole thing sounds like a bureaucratic nightmare. I guess getting into the EU isn't easy either.

Nope. I should add that I also need a sponsor to guarantee that I won't be a burden to the government and be legally responsible for any costs I may accrue while here and that that sponsor pretty much can't be on minimum wage or have any dependents already.



But we can't change/update any of those laws without securing the Mexican border first... Because...... well just because...

It makes total sense to make immigrants from all over the world go through a ridiculous and archaic system because of the Mexican Border...

I guess if we are supposed to have the same rules for anyone in the world it makes some sense, but if immigrants from different countries can/should be treated differently than why the hell can't we change the laws about immigrating from India, UK, China, Etc.. Without having to do anything about the southern border?

IDK, somewhere along the line a lot of people decided that immigration reform should be 'comprehensive'.


Well Republicans want to fix immigration for those countries right? Why not propose something along those lines? Make Dems not take it up if they want to stop it?

Obviously the house does whatever it wants regardless of Democrats. If they can make time to vote to repeal a law 50+ times that was never going to get signed, surely they can take some time and write immigration reform pertaining to non-South American countries? Unless they just don't want to bother fixing something they know is broken?

On June 23 2014 05:42 Jormundr wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 05:08 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:42 Simberto wrote:
Why is getting a work permit that hard? Don't they WANT you to do something useful and work legally? That sounds like something the government would want people to do. That is pretty much all people who don't want immigration complain about here: "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!".

I must honestly say i am kind of happy i don't have any plans of emigrating somewhere. The whole thing sounds like a bureaucratic nightmare. I guess getting into the EU isn't easy either.

The worry here is that they'll take your job for less.

What's wrong with that?


Yeah I mean it's fine for a company to send the job to an immigrants origin country, but when they come here to work and pay taxes suddenly that's supposed to be a problem?

Sounds like a form of human protectionism. Seems strange that people would support that type of protectionism but not at a global corporate level.

What's worse about taking a job for a lower wage in the US, than taking that same job and doing it in a foreign country and avoid paying any US taxes?

"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
June 22 2014 20:56 GMT
#22624
Rand Paul is opening a new frontier in his quest to broaden his brand: Voting rights.

The Kentucky senator is introducing this week a bill that restores voting rights to nonviolent ex-felons in federal elections. It’s part of a concerted effort to get minorities, young people and civil libertarians excited about Republicans — and Paul himself, a libertarian-flavored GOP star who is considering a 2016 presidential run.

Paul is also pursuing drug sentencing reform in the Senate and is mulling efforts aimed at easing nonviolent criminals back into the job market. He also wants to redefine some drug offenses currently classified as felonies to misdemeanors.

Paul won’t deny that his criminal justice portfolio is motivated by politics, but in the same breath argues he’s inspired by a sense of justice.

“I believe in these issues. But I’m a politician and we want more votes,” he conceded in an interview. “Even if Republicans don’t get more votes, we feel like we’ve done the right thing.”


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22359 Posts
June 22 2014 21:02 GMT
#22625
On June 23 2014 05:56 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
Rand Paul is opening a new frontier in his quest to broaden his brand: Voting rights.

The Kentucky senator is introducing this week a bill that restores voting rights to nonviolent ex-felons in federal elections. It’s part of a concerted effort to get minorities, young people and civil libertarians excited about Republicans — and Paul himself, a libertarian-flavored GOP star who is considering a 2016 presidential run.

Paul is also pursuing drug sentencing reform in the Senate and is mulling efforts aimed at easing nonviolent criminals back into the job market. He also wants to redefine some drug offenses currently classified as felonies to misdemeanors.

Paul won’t deny that his criminal justice portfolio is motivated by politics, but in the same breath argues he’s inspired by a sense of justice.

“I believe in these issues. But I’m a politician and we want more votes,” he conceded in an interview. “Even if Republicans don’t get more votes, we feel like we’ve done the right thing.”


Source

/headdesk

No your job is not about getting more votes, its about serving your f*ing country.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
JonnyBNoHo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States6277 Posts
June 22 2014 22:29 GMT
#22626
On June 23 2014 05:42 Jormundr wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 05:08 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:42 Simberto wrote:
Why is getting a work permit that hard? Don't they WANT you to do something useful and work legally? That sounds like something the government would want people to do. That is pretty much all people who don't want immigration complain about here: "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!".

I must honestly say i am kind of happy i don't have any plans of emigrating somewhere. The whole thing sounds like a bureaucratic nightmare. I guess getting into the EU isn't easy either.

The worry here is that they'll take your job for less.

What's wrong with that?

Well there's nothing wrong with having that worry, but there isn't a whole lot of evidence that immigrants push down wages. For skilled workers using H1B visas, a little downward pressure could be beneficial for the country, assuming it happened at all.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States43985 Posts
June 22 2014 22:59 GMT
#22627
On June 23 2014 06:02 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 05:56 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Rand Paul is opening a new frontier in his quest to broaden his brand: Voting rights.

The Kentucky senator is introducing this week a bill that restores voting rights to nonviolent ex-felons in federal elections. It’s part of a concerted effort to get minorities, young people and civil libertarians excited about Republicans — and Paul himself, a libertarian-flavored GOP star who is considering a 2016 presidential run.

Paul is also pursuing drug sentencing reform in the Senate and is mulling efforts aimed at easing nonviolent criminals back into the job market. He also wants to redefine some drug offenses currently classified as felonies to misdemeanors.

Paul won’t deny that his criminal justice portfolio is motivated by politics, but in the same breath argues he’s inspired by a sense of justice.

“I believe in these issues. But I’m a politician and we want more votes,” he conceded in an interview. “Even if Republicans don’t get more votes, we feel like we’ve done the right thing.”


Source

/headdesk

No your job is not about getting more votes, its about serving your f*ing country.

Restoring the voting rights of nonviolent ex felons seems about as close to serving the country and its people as you can get. He's actually trying to help return people who should be within society to society rather than ostracise them and create a cycle of alienation, pretty much a no brainer.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22359 Posts
June 22 2014 23:06 GMT
#22628
On June 23 2014 07:59 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 06:02 Gorsameth wrote:
On June 23 2014 05:56 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Rand Paul is opening a new frontier in his quest to broaden his brand: Voting rights.

The Kentucky senator is introducing this week a bill that restores voting rights to nonviolent ex-felons in federal elections. It’s part of a concerted effort to get minorities, young people and civil libertarians excited about Republicans — and Paul himself, a libertarian-flavored GOP star who is considering a 2016 presidential run.

Paul is also pursuing drug sentencing reform in the Senate and is mulling efforts aimed at easing nonviolent criminals back into the job market. He also wants to redefine some drug offenses currently classified as felonies to misdemeanors.

Paul won’t deny that his criminal justice portfolio is motivated by politics, but in the same breath argues he’s inspired by a sense of justice.

“I believe in these issues. But I’m a politician and we want more votes,” he conceded in an interview. “Even if Republicans don’t get more votes, we feel like we’ve done the right thing.”


Source

/headdesk

No your job is not about getting more votes, its about serving your f*ing country.

Restoring the voting rights of nonviolent ex felons seems about as close to serving the country and its people as you can get. He's actually trying to help return people who should be within society to society rather than ostracise them and create a cycle of alienation, pretty much a no brainer.

The acts might be good. the reason for those actions are not.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States43985 Posts
June 22 2014 23:16 GMT
#22629
On June 23 2014 08:06 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 07:59 KwarK wrote:
On June 23 2014 06:02 Gorsameth wrote:
On June 23 2014 05:56 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Rand Paul is opening a new frontier in his quest to broaden his brand: Voting rights.

The Kentucky senator is introducing this week a bill that restores voting rights to nonviolent ex-felons in federal elections. It’s part of a concerted effort to get minorities, young people and civil libertarians excited about Republicans — and Paul himself, a libertarian-flavored GOP star who is considering a 2016 presidential run.

Paul is also pursuing drug sentencing reform in the Senate and is mulling efforts aimed at easing nonviolent criminals back into the job market. He also wants to redefine some drug offenses currently classified as felonies to misdemeanors.

Paul won’t deny that his criminal justice portfolio is motivated by politics, but in the same breath argues he’s inspired by a sense of justice.

“I believe in these issues. But I’m a politician and we want more votes,” he conceded in an interview. “Even if Republicans don’t get more votes, we feel like we’ve done the right thing.”


Source

/headdesk

No your job is not about getting more votes, its about serving your f*ing country.

Restoring the voting rights of nonviolent ex felons seems about as close to serving the country and its people as you can get. He's actually trying to help return people who should be within society to society rather than ostracise them and create a cycle of alienation, pretty much a no brainer.

The acts might be good. the reason for those actions are not.

Why not? Because it seems like some kind of transaction where the politicians do something the people want and in return the people vote for them? That's pretty much the foundation of the system, that's the principle on which it works.
Politician A: "I'm going to pass meaningful legislation that improves the lives of the people".
The people: "Politician A benefited me, I think I'll vote for some more of that".
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
June 23 2014 00:29 GMT
#22630
The plight of working parents forced to choose between taking unpaid leave to care for a sick child or paying the bills will be presented to President Barack Obama on Monday, as the White House hosts it first summit to address the workplace policies.

The event, which follows Obama's State of the Union promise to do away with employment practices that “belong in a Mad Men episode," will also turn attention to inadequate maternity and paternity leave — an issue in which the United States lags woefully behind other countries.

Among those attending the event will be Arlyssa Heard, an activist and working mother of two from Detroit, Michigan. She said she felt compelled to travel to Washington, D.C., to attend the summit and make her voice heard.

“My biggest thing is having paid sick days for families that need it," she said. “I consider myself out on the battlefield."

Her comments echo that of Obama himself, who in January’s State of the Union address said: “A mother deserves a day off to care for a sick child or sick parent without running into hardship — and you know what, a father does too.”

Heard will be among those hoping that those lofty words translate into action, and a change in workplace legislation.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Livelovedie
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States492 Posts
June 23 2014 01:14 GMT
#22631
Republicans are counting on ex-cons being a significant voting block in the future .
Yoav
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1874 Posts
June 23 2014 01:20 GMT
#22632
On June 23 2014 08:06 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 07:59 KwarK wrote:
On June 23 2014 06:02 Gorsameth wrote:
On June 23 2014 05:56 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Rand Paul is opening a new frontier in his quest to broaden his brand: Voting rights.

The Kentucky senator is introducing this week a bill that restores voting rights to nonviolent ex-felons in federal elections. It’s part of a concerted effort to get minorities, young people and civil libertarians excited about Republicans — and Paul himself, a libertarian-flavored GOP star who is considering a 2016 presidential run.

Paul is also pursuing drug sentencing reform in the Senate and is mulling efforts aimed at easing nonviolent criminals back into the job market. He also wants to redefine some drug offenses currently classified as felonies to misdemeanors.

Paul won’t deny that his criminal justice portfolio is motivated by politics, but in the same breath argues he’s inspired by a sense of justice.

“I believe in these issues. But I’m a politician and we want more votes,” he conceded in an interview. “Even if Republicans don’t get more votes, we feel like we’ve done the right thing.”


Source

/headdesk

No your job is not about getting more votes, its about serving your f*ing country.

Restoring the voting rights of nonviolent ex felons seems about as close to serving the country and its people as you can get. He's actually trying to help return people who should be within society to society rather than ostracise them and create a cycle of alienation, pretty much a no brainer.

The acts might be good. the reason for those actions are not.


Which matters why exactly? I mean, I care about my friends motives and I think God cares about everybody's motives, but I'll take my politicians doing what I like and not worry too much about the motives.
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
June 23 2014 01:21 GMT
#22633
On June 23 2014 10:14 Livelovedie wrote:
Republicans are counting on ex-cons being a significant voting block in the future .


First step: lock everybody up.
second step: turn them into voters for your party

that is a truly machiavellian plan
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
June 23 2014 01:26 GMT
#22634
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16121 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-06-23 03:25:57
June 23 2014 03:24 GMT
#22635
On June 23 2014 10:26 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qW6dWbbaylo


On this topic: http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/210149-iraq-dredges-up-painful-memories-for-gop

Iraq dredges up painful memories for GOP:

For Republicans still smarting from the Bush years, this week’s Iraq deja vu brought back painful memories.

Amid the renewed chaos in the country, key figures from George W. Bush’s administration have reemerged in the public spotlight, bringing fresh attention to past mistakes the GOP would rather forget.

Now, as Republicans eye a Senate majority in an increasingly favorable political climate, Republican strategists say it would be better if the architects of the 2003 invasion of Iraq stayed off television.

“Whenever the conversation is on Iraq, it’s not good news for Republicans,” said John Ullyot, a GOP strategist and former Senate aide. “That’s not helped at all over the last week by a bunch of people who we hadn’t heard from in several years — Republican figures associated with Iraq from the Bush administration — who were suddenly back on major shows discussing the current state of affairs in Iraq.

“It was not a helpful reminder,” he added. “They probably should have stayed off the shows.”

Democrats gleefully welcomed back former Vice President Dick Cheney to the national conversation. They pounced on their familiar punching bag after he wrote an op-ed in the Wall Street Journal slamming Obama’s Iraq policy as a failure and claiming, “rarely has a U.S. president been so wrong about so much at the expense of many.”

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) called Cheney “the chief architect of the war” on the Senate floor and declared, “if there is one thing this country does not need, it’s that we should be taking advice from Dick Cheney on wars.

“To the architects of the Iraq war who are now so eager to offer their expert analysis, I say… thanks but no thanks,” Reid added.

Cheney also faced some hostile questioning from Fox News anchor Megyn Kelly.

“[T]ime and time again, history has proven that you got it wrong as well, sir,” she told him in a pointed response to his op-ed.

Steven Smith, a political science professor at Washington University in St. Louis, said there is a risk that the GOP hawks in will come to define the party’s image at a time when the public does not support greater involvement in Iraq.

“The fact that [Cheney] came out swinging the other day is disappointing to some Republicans because it does nothing but encourage people to remember that this was Bush’s war,” he said of the controversial former vice president’s recent public statements.

“So they do risk putting themselves into a position where on one of the few salient issues of the day they’re not on the right side,” he said of the GOP.

It wasn’t just Cheney making the television rounds, but other key players current party strategists would rather forget about.

Paul Bremer, who oversaw the reconstruction of Iraq starting in 2003 as Bush’s envoy, and Paul Wolfowitz, who served as Bush’s deputy defense secretary, received hostile grillings in two recent television interviews.

"A lot of people are watching you right now and they're —they're hearing you give your ideas of what to do. And they're saying, 'but aren't you the guy who got us in this mess?'" CNN’s Erin Burnett asked Bremer.

Bremer disputed Burnett’s sour view of Bush’s legacy in Iraq, arguing it now has the Arab world’s most progressive constitution and has conducted six democratic elections since the U.S. invasion.

CNN host Chris Cuomo called Wolfowitz the “architect” of the war in another interview and said it was unfair for Republicans to blame President Obama for problems in Iraq because Bush made the decision to invade.

But it’s renewed interest in Cheney that could be the most consequential. His daughter was briefly a Senate candidate this year and he’s fundraised for and endorsed candidates, but Republicans are split over whether he reflects well on the GOP because of his close association with the decision to invade Iraq.

“I think there’s a real divided opinion about Vice President Cheney,” said Matt Mackowiak, a Republican strategist and former Senate aide. “In part of the party he’s deeply respected as a serious voice on national security and foreign policy, but there’s also a realization that Iraq was a mess and it cost more than we thought it would.

“It was much tougher than we thought it would be and it didn’t end up as well as we thought it might,” he added.

GOP strategists say Obama has shown weak leadership in response to threat posed by extremist Sunni militants in Iraq but caution the issue is not a political winner for Republicans.

Mackowiak said the Iraq war is “generally” a problem for their side.

“I don’t think Iraq is helpful to the Republican Party. I don’t think that issue is,” he said. “It’s now an issue that’s both not good for Republicans and not good for Democrats.”

For this reason, most Republicans have been wary about criticizing Obama’s cautious response to the string of military victories won by extremist Sunni militants formerly affiliated with al Qaeda.

A handful of Senate Republicans such as Sens. John McCain (R-Ariz.) and Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.), however, have framed the rise of the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) as a serious national security threat. They have called for an aggressive military response short of putting a large contingent of U.S. troops back in Iraq.

But for the most part, GOP lawmakers have hesitated to lay out their own detailed roadmap, instead putting the onus on the president.

“What raises the concerns most is putting more American troops into Iraq and if the situation continues to deteriorate, the question is what will Obama do next? Most Republicans are rallying around Speaker [John] Boehner’s [R-Ohio] call for Obama to present a comprehensive Iraq strategy," said Ron Bonjean, a GOP strategist and former Senate and House leadership aide.


Of particular interest in this article for me is this line.

“I don’t think Iraq is helpful to the Republican Party. I don’t think that issue is,” he said. “It’s now an issue that’s both not good for Republicans and not good for Democrats.”


I disagree. I think keeping Iraq relevant in the current political atmosphere is a very needed reminder of the kinds of things the Republicans did when they were in power.

I think keeping that information relevant is a good thing for the Democrats.
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
June 23 2014 03:45 GMT
#22636
Honeybees are dying off, and now a team of environmental regulators has been tasked with determining why.

On Friday, President Barack Obama announced plans for a task force to help save the bees. The team, which will be co-chaired by Secretary of Agriculture Tom Vilsack and Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Gina McCarthy, will investigate the causes of bee losses and develop a strategy to promote the health of pollinators.

In a memorandum released by the White House, the administration said:

Honey bee pollination alone adds more than $15 billion in value to agricultural crops each year in the United States. Over the past few decades, there has been a significant loss of pollinators, including honey bees, native bees, birds, bats, and butterflies, from the environment. The problem is serious and requires immediate attention to ensure the sustainability of our food production systems, avoid additional economic impact on the agricultural sector, and protect the health of the environment.

Since 2006, the number of honeybees worldwide has rapidly declined. The most recent data from the U.S. Department of Agriculture indicates that 23 percent of managed bee colonies were lost over the winter season between 2013 and 2014, Reuters reports.

Under the presidential order, the task force will have 180 days to formulate a federal strategy to protect the bees and prevent further population loss. As part of the plan, regulators will assess the effects of pesticides on pollinators -- something that is believed to be a factor in many of the deaths. One class of chemicals in particular, neonicotinoid pesticides, has been shown to be harmful to honeybees and other pollinators.

While the push for a federal strategy to protect the bees calls for significant input from various government agencies, some environmentalists contend that the plan does not go far enough. Erich Pica, president of the international activist network Friends of the Earth, suggested that Obama should ban neonicotinoids completely.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Introvert
Profile Joined April 2011
United States4951 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-06-23 05:02:03
June 23 2014 04:57 GMT
#22637
On June 23 2014 05:12 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 03:44 KwarK wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:42 Simberto wrote:
Why is getting a work permit that hard? Don't they WANT you to do something useful and work legally? That sounds like something the government would want people to do. That is pretty much all people who don't want immigration complain about here: "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!".

I must honestly say i am kind of happy i don't have any plans of emigrating somewhere. The whole thing sounds like a bureaucratic nightmare. I guess getting into the EU isn't easy either.

Nope. I should add that I also need a sponsor to guarantee that I won't be a burden to the government and be legally responsible for any costs I may accrue while here and that that sponsor pretty much can't be on minimum wage or have any dependents already.



But we can't change/update any of those laws without securing the Mexican border first... Because...... well just because...

It makes total sense to make immigrants from all over the world go through a ridiculous and archaic system because of the Mexican Border...

I guess if we are supposed to have the same rules for anyone in the world it makes some sense, but if immigrants from different countries can/should be treated differently than why the hell can't we change the laws about immigrating from India, UK, China, Etc.. Without having to do anything about the southern border?

Show nested quote +
The worry here is that they'll take your job for less.


There's plenty of the "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!" too....

Show nested quote +
"Once these minors come to the U.S., they are eligible for a wide array of benefits and it will be years before their case is ever heard in court," said GOP Rep. Bob Goodlatte of Virginia, chairman of the House Judiciary Committee.

Source

Show nested quote +
One such measure, promoted by Republican Sen. Kelly Ayotte of New Hampshire, would offset costs by "rein[ing] in fraud among illegal immigrants taking advantage of child tax credits."


Source


Sorry I can't be more in depth, I'm away from home. But these are some good examples of why security should be a priority. Besides the obvious: that we should run a good legal immigration that doesn't require us to forgive line cutters and lawbreakers. In a country that prides itself on " the rule of law," such things are antithetical to our system. I don't know if I will get to respond, I don't have access to a computer.

http://www.examiner.com/article/arizona-warns-residents-with-signs-against-hiking-region-near-mexico-border

http://p.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/aug/31/signs-in-arizona-warn-of-smuggler-dangers/?page=all

There are newer storires, but these are the ones I have esiest access to.
"But, as the conservative understands it, modification of the rules should always reflect, and never impose, a change in the activities and beliefs of those who are subject to them, and should never on any occasion be so great as to destroy the ensemble."
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23946 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-06-23 08:51:52
June 23 2014 08:14 GMT
#22638
On June 23 2014 13:57 Introvert wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 05:12 GreenHorizons wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:44 KwarK wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:42 Simberto wrote:
Why is getting a work permit that hard? Don't they WANT you to do something useful and work legally? That sounds like something the government would want people to do. That is pretty much all people who don't want immigration complain about here: "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!".

I must honestly say i am kind of happy i don't have any plans of emigrating somewhere. The whole thing sounds like a bureaucratic nightmare. I guess getting into the EU isn't easy either.

Nope. I should add that I also need a sponsor to guarantee that I won't be a burden to the government and be legally responsible for any costs I may accrue while here and that that sponsor pretty much can't be on minimum wage or have any dependents already.



But we can't change/update any of those laws without securing the Mexican border first... Because...... well just because...

It makes total sense to make immigrants from all over the world go through a ridiculous and archaic system because of the Mexican Border...

I guess if we are supposed to have the same rules for anyone in the world it makes some sense, but if immigrants from different countries can/should be treated differently than why the hell can't we change the laws about immigrating from India, UK, China, Etc.. Without having to do anything about the southern border?

The worry here is that they'll take your job for less.


There's plenty of the "The lazy foreigners just come to not do anything useful and abuse our social system!" too....

"Once these minors come to the U.S., they are eligible for a wide array of benefits and it will be years before their case is ever heard in court," said GOP Rep. Bob Goodlatte of Virginia, chairman of the House Judiciary Committee.

Source

One such measure, promoted by Republican Sen. Kelly Ayotte of New Hampshire, would offset costs by "rein[ing] in fraud among illegal immigrants taking advantage of child tax credits."


Source


Sorry I can't be more in depth, I'm away from home. But these are some good examples of why security should be a priority. Besides the obvious: that we should run a good legal immigration that doesn't require us to forgive line cutters and lawbreakers. In a country that prides itself on " the rule of law," such things are antithetical to our system. I don't know if I will get to respond, I don't have access to a computer.

http://www.examiner.com/article/arizona-warns-residents-with-signs-against-hiking-region-near-mexico-border

http://p.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/aug/31/signs-in-arizona-warn-of-smuggler-dangers/?page=all

There are newer storires, but these are the ones I have esiest access to.


The question is: what does any of that have to do with immigrants from the rest of the world?

Beyond that, it's not like those cartels are selling anything we don't want?

Europe consumes most of the worlds Heroin and the US most of the worlds Cocaine (excluding pharmaceutical grade products.)

What you see with cartels is just the natural outsourcing process... Just so happens the good they are selling is inexplicably outlawed.


Meanwhile billions are made off of much more deadly and addictive drugs sold by major US corporations.'

The 'Drug War' is little more than an excuse to incarcerate people. It's literally done nothing to reduce consumption.

Despite tough anti-drug laws, a new survey shows the U.S. has the highest level of illegal drug use in the world.

The World Health Organization's survey of legal and illegal drug use in 17 countries, including the Netherlands and other countries with less stringent drug laws, shows Americans report the highest level of cocaine and marijuana use.

For example, Americans were four times more likely to report using cocaine in their lifetime than the next closest country, New Zealand (16% vs. 4%),


Source

But hey, people are ignorant of reality and the only sensible thing is to wait for them to realize it, regardless of how many lives they ruin while sane people wait right.....?
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Adreme
Profile Joined June 2011
United States5574 Posts
June 23 2014 08:20 GMT
#22639
On June 23 2014 09:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
The plight of working parents forced to choose between taking unpaid leave to care for a sick child or paying the bills will be presented to President Barack Obama on Monday, as the White House hosts it first summit to address the workplace policies.

The event, which follows Obama's State of the Union promise to do away with employment practices that “belong in a Mad Men episode," will also turn attention to inadequate maternity and paternity leave — an issue in which the United States lags woefully behind other countries.

Among those attending the event will be Arlyssa Heard, an activist and working mother of two from Detroit, Michigan. She said she felt compelled to travel to Washington, D.C., to attend the summit and make her voice heard.

“My biggest thing is having paid sick days for families that need it," she said. “I consider myself out on the battlefield."

Her comments echo that of Obama himself, who in January’s State of the Union address said: “A mother deserves a day off to care for a sick child or sick parent without running into hardship — and you know what, a father does too.”

Heard will be among those hoping that those lofty words translate into action, and a change in workplace legislation.


Source


You know when the president said earlier in the year he had a pen and he wasn't afraid to use it he really wasn't kidding. I don't know whether to be impressed that he finally got tired of being spit in the face every time he tried to offer a hand of corporation or if I should be concerned it took him so long to realize they wanted nothing to do with him but it is interested that he actually got the message.

I have no idea whether this specific thing was going to happen regardless or not but since its yet another issue that I had been hearing about for years and yet nothing was done but yet all of a sudden this year something is finally happening I am going to just file this in the large list of stuff where the president is using his pen.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
June 23 2014 16:07 GMT
#22640
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Supreme Court is making it tougher for investors to join together to sue corporations for securities fraud.

The justices said Monday that companies should have a chance at the early stages of a lawsuit to show that any alleged fraud was not responsible for a drop in the company's stock price.

The ruling is a partial victory for Halliburton Co., which is trying to block a class-action lawsuit claiming the energy services company inflated its stock price.

It is also a modest win for business groups that hoped to make it more difficult for plaintiffs to bring class-action cases. But the high court rejected Halliburton's request to overturn a quarter-century-old precedent that has made it easier for plaintiffs to negotiate billions of dollars in legal settlements.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
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