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Canada13407 Posts
On September 05 2012 02:59 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 02:57 Brahoono wrote:On September 05 2012 02:56 Wildmoon wrote:On September 05 2012 02:55 Natespank wrote:Oracles' cloak field ability was deleted, They undid most of the cool additions that could have enriched the game. I won't buy it if those patch notes are real. I don't see anything cool about that ability. You like the new copied scan ability more? I like detection in my stargate builds for PvP, yes. Anything that does not may the entire opening of the match up center around DTs and if my opponent may have them is good for the match up.
So you would prefer to open stargate, make one or two oracles and build energy for a detection ability that if you use and miss or the DTs walk away from you lose later?
This won't replace the observer 100% I dont think. Not unless you can regen energy and cast it over and over and over again.
The oracle also won't help against blink builds, or twilight in general.
The reason people go star then robo is not only because of detection, but also because of the ability to defend an attack by using the beefy immortal should you scout some sort of blink attack or all in which is otherwise very very hard to stop. the oracle would be better off with cloak so that you could cloak your stuff and hold off blink without obs or prevent DTs from straight up killing you while the robo is building. Since the robo would cloak the DT can't straight up kill you.
The options of oracle cloak are greater than the option of oracle scan.
If I get in the beta, I will work damn hard to get a more interesting ability in than oracle scan that feels more protossy
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On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much.
Star2 is turning into this UMS where you pick units and send them away to counter what your opponent is sending out, and they walk a straight line towards the opponents base, and somewhere in the middle the units clash, and based on what you picked you either win or lose. What is the name of that UMS? Is it Marine Arena, or something? I never played so much UMS in Star2.
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I personally get an error when I try to open the editor, it says I don't have all the files downloaded or something silly like that;
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On September 05 2012 02:55 imPermanenCe wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. replay/observer onlyyyyyyyyy.
From the man himself:
On September 04 2012 18:12 MavercK wrote:Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 18:09 Lineridarz wrote:
Well, now that you've told us, can you post instructions on how to do the same thing you did? maybe later, im not in the mood to write guides right now. in short. i extracted the hots mpqs. merged them into a sc2mod file. opened a map. added my new modfile as dependency. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/fW7Qnl.jpg) so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP.
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On September 05 2012 03:03 HowardRoark wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. Star2 is turning into this UMS where you pick units and send them away to counter what your opponent is sending out, and they walk a straight line towards the opponents base, and somewhere in the middle the units clash, and based on what you picked you either win or lose. What is the name of that UMS? Is it Marine Arena, or something? I never played so much UMS in Star2.
ignorance.
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I'm extremely excited about this.
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yeah can someone please upload the custom map so we can play with the new units? I tried but failed everytime since I know like nothing about the editor T.T
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On September 05 2012 03:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 02:55 imPermanenCe wrote:On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. replay/observer onlyyyyyyyyy. From the man himself: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 18:12 MavercK wrote:On September 04 2012 18:09 Lineridarz wrote:
Well, now that you've told us, can you post instructions on how to do the same thing you did? maybe later, im not in the mood to write guides right now. in short. i extracted the hots mpqs. merged them into a sc2mod file. opened a map. added my new modfile as dependency. so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP.
may have something to do with the editor. i played hots at gamescom and there was no worker count. i doubt they changed it.
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so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP.
this feature is so dumb. News on Hots are like the opposite of hype right now.
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On September 05 2012 03:02 Brahoono wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 02:59 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2012 02:57 Brahoono wrote:On September 05 2012 02:56 Wildmoon wrote:On September 05 2012 02:55 Natespank wrote:Oracles' cloak field ability was deleted, They undid most of the cool additions that could have enriched the game. I won't buy it if those patch notes are real. I don't see anything cool about that ability. You like the new copied scan ability more? I like detection in my stargate builds for PvP, yes. Anything that does not may the entire opening of the match up center around DTs and if my opponent may have them is good for the match up. So you cut an ability which might actually be cool in every matchup to make one situation in one matchup more convenient? Seems legit.
The cloak ability always seemed to powerful, since it can come pre-hive and cloak a large number of units. In a PvP match up, it could make stargate vs stargate opening beyond stupid. Two cloaked armies in the other base with neither side having reliable detection.
I would rather have detection and be allowed to use phoenixes more freely in the match up. Also, since fungle and EMP both deal with cloaking, while storm does not, does put each race at 3 forms of detection.
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On September 05 2012 03:07 ShoWTimE94 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 03:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:On September 05 2012 02:55 imPermanenCe wrote:On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. replay/observer onlyyyyyyyyy. From the man himself: On September 04 2012 18:12 MavercK wrote:On September 04 2012 18:09 Lineridarz wrote:
Well, now that you've told us, can you post instructions on how to do the same thing you did? maybe later, im not in the mood to write guides right now. in short. i extracted the hots mpqs. merged them into a sc2mod file. opened a map. added my new modfile as dependency. so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP. may have something to do with the editor. i played hots at gamescom and there was no worker count. i doubt they changed it.
Oh yeah I also doubt that they may have changed something between a build that is atleast a month old and now....
There is an option to turn it on/off so I doubt it has anything to do with the editor.
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Just to stop some of the bitching about worker amounts only being in spectator mode:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Lm1dL.jpg)
[Screenshot from the new menu]
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On September 05 2012 02:58 Sikly wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 02:47 PauseBreak wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. Its already well known that the skill cap for SC2 is much lower, and mainly so new people can jump aboard quickly and learn and have fun with the game instead of losing all the time. And without getting into race balance, some races are easier and harder for some people to use. I think right now, since its still a new game and expansions will be coming out new people will still be playing. And with the Arcade patch it keeps the casuals still bound to the game. But give it a few years and the true SC community will have stayed with the game and passer-by's will have moved on to another MMO, FPS, or RPG. Give it 4 or 5 years, the game will be much different and the real skill will begin to shine! Not some no-name beating a well rooted pro at some tournament. Once the game is thought to be all drained out, there will be someone to teach us a new way of playing. Right now, things don't look all that promising. But its the future of the game that excites me the most. Broodwar has last well over 10 years in competitive gaming. Tell me what other game has truly hit that prestige? FPS games comes and go every year! MMO's are the "every-body wins", and RPG's are just getting more and more watered down. Keep up hope. People really need to learn the difference between a skill cap and a skill floor. The skill cap is lower true, but it doesn't help lower level play out at all. The best players in the world will never be able to hit the true skill cap. It isn't humanly possible to perfectly play this game. What a lot of these things do is help the skill floor. Worker auto rally, worker counts, easier unit movement, bigger command groups all make take out ways for you to be worse at the game. Really only worker auto rally reduced the skill cap, as easier unit movement and bigger command groups only make it so your shit dies to people who control their armies properly compared to your 1a attacks. There will still be a distinct difference between players. I can understand complaining about the Tempest not making the game any more challenging or interesting, or the warhound being to "deathbally", but everyone needs to start using the correct terms and stop worrying about the skill cap. The game would have to be massively changed for the skill cap to be achievable.
People need to realize that the skill cap of any not turn based game is infinite. You can clearly see this when you watch all the bots that get made with 'perfect micro'. Just like you have the concept infinity, you can still have something as 8 times infinity in math. BW had a lot more potential for units. Reaver with shuttle, scourges, mutalisks, wraiths, vultures,........... all have potential for perfect micro. There's no secret potential in a collussus, phoenix, void rays, sentries, archon (sc2), mutalisk (sc2),...
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On September 05 2012 03:07 ShoWTimE94 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 03:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:On September 05 2012 02:55 imPermanenCe wrote:On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. replay/observer onlyyyyyyyyy. From the man himself: On September 04 2012 18:12 MavercK wrote:On September 04 2012 18:09 Lineridarz wrote:
Well, now that you've told us, can you post instructions on how to do the same thing you did? maybe later, im not in the mood to write guides right now. in short. i extracted the hots mpqs. merged them into a sc2mod file. opened a map. added my new modfile as dependency. so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP. may have something to do with the editor. i played hots at gamescom and there was no worker count. i doubt they changed it.
I think we should take the word of the person who played the build of the game, rather than the image created through some vodoo using the client and some other nonsense. I mean, look at that UI, it is missing like 14 buttons.
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can some one give us link to this hots mpqs mode to download it?
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So much tweaking to do. Still extremely skeptical that the oracle will end up having much use beyond some gimmics. Without hte cloak ... it just doesn't add too much. The harass will be very early game centered and frankly the idea behind slowing mining rather than destroying actual mining outpiut is flawed. I can understand the thought process. This is a unique ability that /will/ affect mules heavily, but against zerg it looks like it will be almost worthless and it doesn't help you chip your way back into the game like a money reaver shot does (Nor frankly does it look very entertaining which is already a giant problem with WoL).
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On September 05 2012 03:11 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 03:07 ShoWTimE94 wrote:On September 05 2012 03:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:On September 05 2012 02:55 imPermanenCe wrote:On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. replay/observer onlyyyyyyyyy. From the man himself: On September 04 2012 18:12 MavercK wrote:On September 04 2012 18:09 Lineridarz wrote:
Well, now that you've told us, can you post instructions on how to do the same thing you did? maybe later, im not in the mood to write guides right now. in short. i extracted the hots mpqs. merged them into a sc2mod file. opened a map. added my new modfile as dependency. so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP. may have something to do with the editor. i played hots at gamescom and there was no worker count. i doubt they changed it. I think we should take the word of the person who played the build of the game, rather than the image created through some vodoo using the client and some other nonsense. I mean, look at that UI, it is missing like 14 buttons.
Thats the new noob UI where you dont get any more buttons. Also an option you can now turn on in the Hots client. Worker counting on townhalls is real and an option you can turn on or off.
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On September 05 2012 03:11 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 03:07 ShoWTimE94 wrote:On September 05 2012 03:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:On September 05 2012 02:55 imPermanenCe wrote:On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. replay/observer onlyyyyyyyyy. From the man himself: On September 04 2012 18:12 MavercK wrote:On September 04 2012 18:09 Lineridarz wrote:
Well, now that you've told us, can you post instructions on how to do the same thing you did? maybe later, im not in the mood to write guides right now. in short. i extracted the hots mpqs. merged them into a sc2mod file. opened a map. added my new modfile as dependency. so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP. may have something to do with the editor. i played hots at gamescom and there was no worker count. i doubt they changed it. I think we should take the word of the person who played the build of the game, rather than the image created through some vodoo using the client and some other nonsense. I mean, look at that UI, it is missing like 14 buttons.
NO!
People have to whine about everything before they're even sure it's in the game!
EVERYTHING MUST BE WHINED ABOUT.
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On September 05 2012 03:14 SgtCoDFish wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 03:11 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2012 03:07 ShoWTimE94 wrote:On September 05 2012 03:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:On September 05 2012 02:55 imPermanenCe wrote:On September 05 2012 02:47 Za7oX wrote:On September 05 2012 02:36 roym899 wrote:
What I really hate about what we've seen yet, is the fact that they seem to make the skill ceilling even smaller. The new functions like auto rally and worker display just take away some things good players had in favor of them against worse players, now that this isn't there anymore the level in the bronze league for example will be so much higher now.
All of this is also the reason why the Kespa players where able to catch up so fast. You can reach the end of the skill ceiling pretty fast. And I think everyone in Master league could make it to GM level in 1 month of very hard training with a coach who will tell you your mistakes. im normaly on the side of "it's a newer game, ofc there will be interface improvements" but the worker counter seems abit too much. replay/observer onlyyyyyyyyy. From the man himself: On September 04 2012 18:12 MavercK wrote:On September 04 2012 18:09 Lineridarz wrote:
Well, now that you've told us, can you post instructions on how to do the same thing you did? maybe later, im not in the mood to write guides right now. in short. i extracted the hots mpqs. merged them into a sc2mod file. opened a map. added my new modfile as dependency. so worker count is ingame. not spectator only. i couldn't find the auto start mining option? also you can see the select army units icon. thats there in MP. may have something to do with the editor. i played hots at gamescom and there was no worker count. i doubt they changed it. I think we should take the word of the person who played the build of the game, rather than the image created through some vodoo using the client and some other nonsense. I mean, look at that UI, it is missing like 14 buttons. NO! People have to whine about everything before they're even sure it's in the game! EVERYTHING MUST BE WHINED ABOUT.
Naw only the things that are bad which apparently are a lot right now.
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On September 05 2012 03:09 Illiterate wrote:Just to stop some of the bitching about worker amounts only being in spectator mode: [Screenshot from the new menu]
Well that is much better than the other "proof" people have provided. Although I am upset that my hours of learning to box workers to make sure I have 16-20 have been wasted, I am not sure it is going to move me to the next level of gameplay.
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EPT
