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On December 26 2011 21:44 corvaleur wrote:
SC2 isn't SC1, it has become a global community and not a single nation-centric sport like BW. The non-Korean scene provides much more high quality standards and Koreans are finally forced to acknowledge that and start to integrate themselves. We don't need 'em, but they need us.
In what way has non-Korean scene provide much more high quality standards? The standards/level of play is still highest in GSL. The production time is still higher in GSL. The exposure is still highest in GSL. Korea is only tapping the foreign market because there's an opportunity to make a profit but the truth is SC2 can become self sustainable like many other games that's practically only touched in Asia.
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The Korean gom is filled with ads. So take it as you wish.
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On December 26 2011 21:23 BLinD-RawR wrote:
why did you remake this thread, it will still be closed.
Think it only got closed due to fomos content.
However I would like to see more into this, OP
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ALLEYCAT BLUES51102 Posts
On December 26 2011 21:50 Herper wrote:
The Korean gom is filled with ads. So take it as you wish.
I'd rather watch ADs than look at a blank stage with the production crew moving around.
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On December 26 2011 21:47 BLinD-RawR wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:44 Lavi wrote:On December 26 2011 21:38 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:35 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:30 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:29 ravemir wrote:On December 26 2011 21:18 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:14 bmml wrote:On December 26 2011 21:10 Primadog wrote:
GOMTV is watched in over 180 countries, and MLG in 175. I'd rather SC2 to win in 174 countries and fail in 1, than win in 1 and fail in 174. How about a fairer allocation of wealth then, stop the majority of fans paying for the minority's content? #occupyGOM Also fuck their ghetto ass stream. Do you know the Korean stream of GSL is free, completely HD, along with free VOD? Not sure if trolling...can anyone confirm this? ALSO: GSL entry are always free, in fact, they give you pizza and thundersticks. Again, can you confirm free HD vods? Where are you getting this information from exactly? The live stream is free for foreigners, but the korean version is on television which (I admit I don't know for sure) is not a free public channel. Also, foreign money pays for foreign production. You do realize GSL has a lot of sponsors that pays for shit like prize money/etc? the ones they show on TV channels like anibox are basically highlights/rebroadcasts not the actual live thing. yes the korean stream and vods are free. this is 100% true. I take it you need to use a korean proxy to view those? you need it to watch on your PC, but for your smartphone if you have the korean gomtv app, you can watch the vods on it without any trouble. Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:45 GrungyMunchy wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Silidons wrote:
couldn't you tell already due to the fact that SC2 is full of failed sc1 pro's?
not trying to hurt the players...but it's the truth
i want sc1 to keep doing well...i enjoy both playing and watching it. i'm just too noob to be good at it >_< Yes, Boxer, July and Nada were complete failures at BW. they were really really bad when they switched. I'll correct him by saying that its full of failed SC1 players and washed up pros.
I find it interesting that the korean GOM site has a million hits for the blizzard cup finals. (around 700k for the GSL finals). But where are these fans when it comes to being at the live events?
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1.aion
OH noes !!! how could they ???
Can we take Korea even seriously after reading the first line ??? Perhaps we should initiate some quarentene procedures XD
Joke aside, we dont know how accurate the data is and what this ranking actually measured. And you should define something measureable that determines fail and success from your point of view and explain it.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES51102 Posts
On December 26 2011 21:54 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:47 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Lavi wrote:On December 26 2011 21:38 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:35 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:30 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:29 ravemir wrote:On December 26 2011 21:18 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:14 bmml wrote:On December 26 2011 21:10 Primadog wrote:
GOMTV is watched in over 180 countries, and MLG in 175. I'd rather SC2 to win in 174 countries and fail in 1, than win in 1 and fail in 174. How about a fairer allocation of wealth then, stop the majority of fans paying for the minority's content? #occupyGOM Also fuck their ghetto ass stream. Do you know the Korean stream of GSL is free, completely HD, along with free VOD? Not sure if trolling...can anyone confirm this? ALSO: GSL entry are always free, in fact, they give you pizza and thundersticks. Again, can you confirm free HD vods? Where are you getting this information from exactly? The live stream is free for foreigners, but the korean version is on television which (I admit I don't know for sure) is not a free public channel. Also, foreign money pays for foreign production. You do realize GSL has a lot of sponsors that pays for shit like prize money/etc? the ones they show on TV channels like anibox are basically highlights/rebroadcasts not the actual live thing. yes the korean stream and vods are free. this is 100% true. I take it you need to use a korean proxy to view those? you need it to watch on your PC, but for your smartphone if you have the korean gomtv app, you can watch the vods on it without any trouble. On December 26 2011 21:45 GrungyMunchy wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Silidons wrote:
couldn't you tell already due to the fact that SC2 is full of failed sc1 pro's?
not trying to hurt the players...but it's the truth
i want sc1 to keep doing well...i enjoy both playing and watching it. i'm just too noob to be good at it >_< Yes, Boxer, July and Nada were complete failures at BW. they were really really bad when they switched. I'll correct him by saying that its full of failed SC1 players and washed up pros. I find it interesting that the korean GOM site has a million hits for the blizzard cup finals. (around 700k for the GSL finals). But where are these fans when it comes to being at the live events?
GOM be fudging numbers?
then again the Jin Air OSL finals had about 3.4 mil in the chinese stream...which was later revealed as bullshit.
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SCII will never diverge away from korea, no matter how unpopular it is there. Of course the level of skill is higher there even for SC2, but besides that blizzard is looking at a potential giant piece of the pie in korea. Even today BW could still potentially be a billion dollar industry (probably)... and just for perspective it 'only' cost activision 18 billion to buy blizzard in the first place.
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On December 26 2011 21:45 GrungyMunchy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:33 Sawamura wrote:On December 26 2011 21:27 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:24 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:10 Primadog wrote:
GOMTV is watched in over 180 countries, and MLG in 175. I'd rather SC2 to win in 174 countries and fail in 1, than win in 1 and fail in 174. Combine all those countries and it's still far less than what BW is in korea. That's besides the point. Even if SC2 die tomorrow, BW's glory days won't come back. The viewership that tune in to StarCraft 2 today will just move on to the mobas or the MMOs. I am still awe struck that nearly two years in, TL is still having this conversation. BW is downsizing because of reasons other than the sequel, a decline that begun in 2005 or so that hasn't reversed its course. So stop. Remember BW fans, the site you spent your time hating on SC2 fans on is bankrolled by SC2 fans. Whose hating sc2 fans ? I will support any sc2 fan as long they acknowledge that broodwar is the one which start the ball rolling for their awesome game . As long proleague is kicking , I will never stop watching broodwar . Um... what? First, I don't see anyone denying that a game with a fucking 2 on its title comes from the success of a previous game. Second, why is that so important for you? Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:44 Silidons wrote:
couldn't you tell already due to the fact that SC2 is full of failed sc1 pro's?
not trying to hurt the players...but it's the truth
i want sc1 to keep doing well...i enjoy both playing and watching it. i'm just too noob to be good at it >_< Yes, Boxer, July and Nada were complete failures at BW.
there are a few exceptions. also forgg was good. BUT, the current scene is FULL of the not-so-good ones...MC for example. obviously there are a FEW exceptions, but then we see that these players are not on the top of their game...also boxer hasn't been a full-time player, nada has been opening up his store etc, but yeah i guess if you want you can say the sc2 pro scene is full of bonjwa's if you want to.
name me more than 5 people who were good at sc1 and now play sc2 ?
july nada boxer forgg ?
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On December 26 2011 21:54 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:47 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Lavi wrote:On December 26 2011 21:38 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:35 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:30 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:29 ravemir wrote:On December 26 2011 21:18 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:14 bmml wrote:On December 26 2011 21:10 Primadog wrote:
GOMTV is watched in over 180 countries, and MLG in 175. I'd rather SC2 to win in 174 countries and fail in 1, than win in 1 and fail in 174. How about a fairer allocation of wealth then, stop the majority of fans paying for the minority's content? #occupyGOM Also fuck their ghetto ass stream. Do you know the Korean stream of GSL is free, completely HD, along with free VOD? Not sure if trolling...can anyone confirm this? ALSO: GSL entry are always free, in fact, they give you pizza and thundersticks. Again, can you confirm free HD vods? Where are you getting this information from exactly? The live stream is free for foreigners, but the korean version is on television which (I admit I don't know for sure) is not a free public channel. Also, foreign money pays for foreign production. You do realize GSL has a lot of sponsors that pays for shit like prize money/etc? the ones they show on TV channels like anibox are basically highlights/rebroadcasts not the actual live thing. yes the korean stream and vods are free. this is 100% true. I take it you need to use a korean proxy to view those? you need it to watch on your PC, but for your smartphone if you have the korean gomtv app, you can watch the vods on it without any trouble. On December 26 2011 21:45 GrungyMunchy wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Silidons wrote:
couldn't you tell already due to the fact that SC2 is full of failed sc1 pro's?
not trying to hurt the players...but it's the truth
i want sc1 to keep doing well...i enjoy both playing and watching it. i'm just too noob to be good at it >_< Yes, Boxer, July and Nada were complete failures at BW. they were really really bad when they switched. I'll correct him by saying that its full of failed SC1 players and washed up pros. I find it interesting that the korean GOM site has a million hits for the blizzard cup finals. (around 700k for the GSL finals). But where are these fans when it comes to being at the live events?
VOD numbers, when not behind a paywall, may not necessarily mean that much in term of inferring audience size. For example, this random IEM vod has over 1m views.
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On December 26 2011 21:54 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:47 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Lavi wrote:On December 26 2011 21:38 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:35 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:30 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:29 ravemir wrote:On December 26 2011 21:18 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:14 bmml wrote:On December 26 2011 21:10 Primadog wrote:
GOMTV is watched in over 180 countries, and MLG in 175. I'd rather SC2 to win in 174 countries and fail in 1, than win in 1 and fail in 174. How about a fairer allocation of wealth then, stop the majority of fans paying for the minority's content? #occupyGOM Also fuck their ghetto ass stream. Do you know the Korean stream of GSL is free, completely HD, along with free VOD? Not sure if trolling...can anyone confirm this? ALSO: GSL entry are always free, in fact, they give you pizza and thundersticks. Again, can you confirm free HD vods? Where are you getting this information from exactly? The live stream is free for foreigners, but the korean version is on television which (I admit I don't know for sure) is not a free public channel. Also, foreign money pays for foreign production. You do realize GSL has a lot of sponsors that pays for shit like prize money/etc? the ones they show on TV channels like anibox are basically highlights/rebroadcasts not the actual live thing. yes the korean stream and vods are free. this is 100% true. I take it you need to use a korean proxy to view those? you need it to watch on your PC, but for your smartphone if you have the korean gomtv app, you can watch the vods on it without any trouble. On December 26 2011 21:45 GrungyMunchy wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Silidons wrote:
couldn't you tell already due to the fact that SC2 is full of failed sc1 pro's?
not trying to hurt the players...but it's the truth
i want sc1 to keep doing well...i enjoy both playing and watching it. i'm just too noob to be good at it >_< Yes, Boxer, July and Nada were complete failures at BW. they were really really bad when they switched. I'll correct him by saying that its full of failed SC1 players and washed up pros. I find it interesting that the korean GOM site has a million hits for the blizzard cup finals. (around 700k for the GSL finals). But where are these fans when it comes to being at the live events?
You know you can watch the whole finals in the Korean site right? That's how I watched the Blizzard Cup finals, otherwise I could only watch the first set.
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On December 26 2011 21:59 Primadog wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:54 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:47 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Lavi wrote:On December 26 2011 21:38 BLinD-RawR wrote:On December 26 2011 21:35 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:30 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:29 ravemir wrote:On December 26 2011 21:18 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:14 bmml wrote:
[quote]
How about a fairer allocation of wealth then, stop the majority of fans paying for the minority's content? #occupyGOM Also fuck their ghetto ass stream. Do you know the Korean stream of GSL is free, completely HD, along with free VOD? Not sure if trolling...can anyone confirm this? ALSO: GSL entry are always free, in fact, they give you pizza and thundersticks. Again, can you confirm free HD vods? Where are you getting this information from exactly? The live stream is free for foreigners, but the korean version is on television which (I admit I don't know for sure) is not a free public channel. Also, foreign money pays for foreign production. You do realize GSL has a lot of sponsors that pays for shit like prize money/etc? the ones they show on TV channels like anibox are basically highlights/rebroadcasts not the actual live thing. yes the korean stream and vods are free. this is 100% true. I take it you need to use a korean proxy to view those? you need it to watch on your PC, but for your smartphone if you have the korean gomtv app, you can watch the vods on it without any trouble. On December 26 2011 21:45 GrungyMunchy wrote:On December 26 2011 21:44 Silidons wrote:
couldn't you tell already due to the fact that SC2 is full of failed sc1 pro's?
not trying to hurt the players...but it's the truth
i want sc1 to keep doing well...i enjoy both playing and watching it. i'm just too noob to be good at it >_< Yes, Boxer, July and Nada were complete failures at BW. they were really really bad when they switched. I'll correct him by saying that its full of failed SC1 players and washed up pros. I find it interesting that the korean GOM site has a million hits for the blizzard cup finals. (around 700k for the GSL finals). But where are these fans when it comes to being at the live events? VOD numbers, when not behind a paywall, may not necessarily mean that much in term of inferring audience size. For example, this random IEM vod has over 1m views.
That video has been around for over a year and youtube is much more accessible than the GOM vods, especially when you factor in the fact that korea is just 1 country, and youtube videos can attract a lot of non sc2 viewers. Of course the paywall is a deterrent, but 700k-1 million hits is a lot more than what most people would have expected from korea.
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Korea has established TV producers and shit. Of course it'll take a few years before the shift even begins.
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Wc3 UMS's are worlds ahead of any other UMS, Don't know how that happened or why but my guess its a combination of acceptable graphics and a game engine that is good enough to not have retard errors (dragoons anyone?) but not so "advanced" ur battle groups naturally try to become balls no matter what u do.
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On December 26 2011 21:12 GrungyMunchy wrote:
Starcraft, with SC2, isn't about Korea anymore. It's about the whole world.
We play even less SC2 in China than in Korea.
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wow, Lineage1 still so much played :O
i was sad when they closed the ''NA'' servers (rest of the world more like it)
but couldn't find a way to play on a KR server (because of social ID needed to make acc)
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Fifa Online 2 in the top3? What the...
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Because in all PC bangs you dont need to pay separately for MMORPG games and obviously wc3,LOL, sc1 is free. While u gotta pay for your sc2 account so basically in order to play sc2. In pc bang u gotta first purchase sc2 then hourly rate. Isnt it obvious why sc2 is not on the list LOL?. Im sure most sc2 users play the game from home.
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On December 26 2011 21:59 Silidons wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2011 21:45 GrungyMunchy wrote:On December 26 2011 21:33 Sawamura wrote:On December 26 2011 21:27 Primadog wrote:On December 26 2011 21:24 Itsmedudeman wrote:On December 26 2011 21:10 Primadog wrote:
GOMTV is watched in over 180 countries, and MLG in 175. I'd rather SC2 to win in 174 countries and fail in 1, than win in 1 and fail in 174. Combine all those countries and it's still far less than what BW is in korea. That's besides the point. Even if SC2 die tomorrow, BW's glory days won't come back. The viewership that tune in to StarCraft 2 today will just move on to the mobas or the MMOs. I am still awe struck that nearly two years in, TL is still having this conversation. BW is downsizing because of reasons other than the sequel, a decline that begun in 2005 or so that hasn't reversed its course. So stop. Remember BW fans, the site you spent your time hating on SC2 fans on is bankrolled by SC2 fans. Whose hating sc2 fans ? I will support any sc2 fan as long they acknowledge that broodwar is the one which start the ball rolling for their awesome game . As long proleague is kicking , I will never stop watching broodwar . Um... what? First, I don't see anyone denying that a game with a fucking 2 on its title comes from the success of a previous game. Second, why is that so important for you? On December 26 2011 21:44 Silidons wrote:
couldn't you tell already due to the fact that SC2 is full of failed sc1 pro's?
not trying to hurt the players...but it's the truth
i want sc1 to keep doing well...i enjoy both playing and watching it. i'm just too noob to be good at it >_< Yes, Boxer, July and Nada were complete failures at BW. there are a few exceptions. also forgg was good. BUT, the current scene is FULL of the not-so-good ones...MC for example. obviously there are a FEW exceptions, but then we see that these players are not on the top of their game...also boxer hasn't been a full-time player, nada has been opening up his store etc, but yeah i guess if you want you can say the sc2 pro scene is full of bonjwa's if you want to. name me more than 5 people who were good at sc1 and now play sc2 ? july nada boxer forgg ?
Lol, yeah Boxer isn't playing full-time, especially now he's in Code S. Ditto for Nada.
That's a really shitty point to have, how many BW players are actually good? In comparison, how many never accomplished anything? The vast majority, no? Btw you can only answer these questions in relation to the first year of BW, where games were incomparably shittier than the first year of SC2.
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you can't compare a game that's been out for like 13 years to a game thats 1½ years old. Also, sc2 is international, and im pretty fucking sure it has a larger audience overall.
edit: bw is still great though
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EPT
