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While I understand that there's a need to discuss this matter, this thread has way too many trash posts in it. Please think carefully about what you want to say. Ad hominem attacks on Swedish people in general, calling you fellow Starcraft fans idiots etc etc will be dealt with with harsher punishment from here on out. Keep it civil people.
Page 230: Here's some more stuff that'll get you banned!
- Conspiracy theory mongering about MLG and GOM
- Comparing people to Hitler
- Posting useless one liners of arguments that have already been repeated ad nauseum. |
On December 14 2011 22:37 Darksoldierr wrote:
I cant understand whats the big uproar, he was banned for only one season. The world not going to end. And i totally agree with GOM's decision.
Naniwa need to learn some respect towards the league he plays in. ( joke tournament at mlg anyone? )
He is not even banned. He can still go through Code A qualifier and through Code A and get into Code S.
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On December 14 2011 22:37 Pwnographics wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:36 Algol wrote:
This is such a bad decision by GOM. Had he just cannon-rushed or used any other super quick cheese no one would have have cared but the end result of the game would have been the same.
In many foreigner tournaments players forfeit games all the time (Stefano 6pools cloud twice in a row at dreamhack, Idra forfeited all his group stage games at IPL). To me this seems like a culture difference between the Korean and foreigner starcraft community. GOM needs to specify rules against this kind of things beforehand, not punishing players who may not even be that familiar with the unspoken "Korean way of a progamer".
To revoke Naniwa's code S spot is more of a spit in the face of the foreigner community by GOM. Naniwa is forced to play a meaningless match, which he at any foreigner tournament would have just forfeited.
Anyone know a good way to reach out to GOM and let them know my/our discontent with this decision? Once again, he never had a fucking Code S spot to begin with.
Pardon me but then exactly what is the punishment he's getting? He's clearly getting some form of punishment and it doesn't really matter if he earned a spot through MLG or was going to get an invite. Without this event he would be playing in Code S next season. If not then he's not really getting punished (which he clearly is).
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On December 14 2011 22:42 dolvlo wrote:
I mean this wholeheartedly: I hope GOM fails as a company, and another more professional organization takes over in Korea.
+1
Maybe Starcraft in South Korea will manage to get out of the "KespA" system.
The situation reminds me the atmosphere of Starcraft 1 when Grrrrr... played in South Korea and won the GSL.
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lol that poll..
TL is unbelievably conservative. That is something that REALLY blows my mind.
How can young people be like that ? And probably im even older than most people here..
Now, for real, if you think GOM is right, you should change something in your life. I dont know what, but something. And fast.
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GOMTv can really go fuck themselves. This has to be the worst decission made by any tournament up to date.
I have bought a season ticket for all GSL seasons so far but never again.
User was warned for this post
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Good, glad they did it, it's well deserved.
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Imagine that gom cancelled the match because it was pointless and everyone is pissed. What mania did was based on rage, but should not go unpunished.
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On December 14 2011 22:41 drinkpepsi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:40 baoluvboa wrote:On December 14 2011 22:39 drinkpepsi wrote:On December 14 2011 22:35 Hubris wrote:
Am I the only one reading some the racist, ignorant, and BM posts by people "boycotting" GOM's events feeling happy that these sort of people aren't going to be in the audience? I think I'm more inclined to buy tickets knowing that the fan base should be more mature than usual. I find it ironic many people here acting a fool are just as BM as Naniwa's actions at that, and previous tournies. The real irony here is that the biggest perpetrator of racism in this instance is GOM. How does this even make sense.. From past precedents, Korean players are treated just as harshly. No, they are not. And here's the thing; Naniwa didn't actually break rules. People have posted tons of incidents in this thread where a Korean actually broke the rules and wasn't punished. Naniwa 6 probe rushed. He used a bad strategy. Are we to ban incontrol from every tournament?
No. You're wrong.
If a Korean player did this at GSL, I have no doubt that he would have been banned outright or kicked off his progaming team.
The Korean crew at GSL (including mr. chae) probably tried to mitigate the situation ESPECIALLY because Naniwa is a foreign player. They don't want to step on too many foreigner toes unless they feel they have to. And apparently they feel they have to.
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On December 14 2011 22:44 Xax wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:42 Vardant wrote:On December 14 2011 22:41 Pwnographics wrote:On December 14 2011 22:40 Vardant wrote:On December 14 2011 22:37 Pwnographics wrote:On December 14 2011 22:36 Algol wrote:
This is such a bad decision by GOM. Had he just cannon-rushed or used any other super quick cheese no one would have have cared but the end result of the game would have been the same.
In many foreigner tournaments players forfeit games all the time (Stefano 6pools cloud twice in a row at dreamhack, Idra forfeited all his group stage games at IPL). To me this seems like a culture difference between the Korean and foreigner starcraft community. GOM needs to specify rules against this kind of things beforehand, not punishing players who may not even be that familiar with the unspoken "Korean way of a progamer".
To revoke Naniwa's code S spot is more of a spit in the face of the foreigner community by GOM. Naniwa is forced to play a meaningless match, which he at any foreigner tournament would have just forfeited.
Anyone know a good way to reach out to GOM and let them know my/our discontent with this decision? Once again, he never had a fucking Code S spot to begin with. So MLG casters, staff and even Tasteless is not enough to prove you otherwise? You're a lost cause... The fact that I don't see any up-and-down invites tells me that GOM has proven them all wrong. How is that tied to Code S seeds? It isn't, you're just grasping at straws. MLG-GSL Exchange. Exchange. Exchange.
Were there Korean invites for MLG Providence?
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I think suspending was taking it waaay too far, a warning would've been sufficient for something as trivial as not wanting to play a game that had absolutely no meaning to it.
But this is what pisses me off the most:
"Mr.Chae has announced that they made Code S seeds for a professional minded pro-gamer not for an amateur prize money hunter. It is official that Naniwa is given a punishment"
Talk about shooting yourself in the foot, kicking out NaNi cuz he ain't proffesional enough and then lower yourself to trash talking and lying....
Nice move GOM.
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On December 14 2011 22:44 GodZo wrote:
I disagree with GOM this time.
1) What about "Mules Throws" at the end of game?
2) What about many games thrown in less evident mode.
What about Stephano vs Cloud in DreamHack? Stephano didn't throw his games? This is just an example
Caution! Big money can ruin a game. SC2 is always a game, and that specific match was not important for most people.
I think is much worse when one player lose, simulating to play normally. This happens, this is a game, the other question is:
3) Could be a right of a player, to waste a match? or simply one player could not to play at his best.
I disapproved the rush of Naniwa but really was not important for the tourmanet and it was an entertaining match, very funny.
I hope GOM tolerate more in future, that remains a game. That match was not important, and Naniwa has not done anything serious.
In the end.
Just Naniwa played a bad strategy, that's all.
When you pay someone $840 just to show up and play games for a tournament you'd at least expect them to play them out in full.
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On December 14 2011 22:44 Xax wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:42 Vardant wrote:On December 14 2011 22:41 Pwnographics wrote:On December 14 2011 22:40 Vardant wrote:On December 14 2011 22:37 Pwnographics wrote:On December 14 2011 22:36 Algol wrote:
This is such a bad decision by GOM. Had he just cannon-rushed or used any other super quick cheese no one would have have cared but the end result of the game would have been the same.
In many foreigner tournaments players forfeit games all the time (Stefano 6pools cloud twice in a row at dreamhack, Idra forfeited all his group stage games at IPL). To me this seems like a culture difference between the Korean and foreigner starcraft community. GOM needs to specify rules against this kind of things beforehand, not punishing players who may not even be that familiar with the unspoken "Korean way of a progamer".
To revoke Naniwa's code S spot is more of a spit in the face of the foreigner community by GOM. Naniwa is forced to play a meaningless match, which he at any foreigner tournament would have just forfeited.
Anyone know a good way to reach out to GOM and let them know my/our discontent with this decision? Once again, he never had a fucking Code S spot to begin with. So MLG casters, staff and even Tasteless is not enough to prove you otherwise? You're a lost cause... The fact that I don't see any up-and-down invites tells me that GOM has proven them all wrong. How is that tied to Code S seeds? It isn't, you're just grasping at straws. MLG-GSL Exchange. Exchange. Exchange.
Did you see Koreans at Providence, cause I sure did. They were there, because they got seeded into the pool at one point or another.
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On December 14 2011 22:44 nam nam wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:37 Pwnographics wrote:On December 14 2011 22:36 Algol wrote:
This is such a bad decision by GOM. Had he just cannon-rushed or used any other super quick cheese no one would have have cared but the end result of the game would have been the same.
In many foreigner tournaments players forfeit games all the time (Stefano 6pools cloud twice in a row at dreamhack, Idra forfeited all his group stage games at IPL). To me this seems like a culture difference between the Korean and foreigner starcraft community. GOM needs to specify rules against this kind of things beforehand, not punishing players who may not even be that familiar with the unspoken "Korean way of a progamer".
To revoke Naniwa's code S spot is more of a spit in the face of the foreigner community by GOM. Naniwa is forced to play a meaningless match, which he at any foreigner tournament would have just forfeited.
Anyone know a good way to reach out to GOM and let them know my/our discontent with this decision? Once again, he never had a fucking Code S spot to begin with. Pardon me but then exactly what is the punishment he's getting? He's clearly getting some form of punishment and it doesn't really matter if he earned a spot through MLG or was going to get an invite. Without this event he would be playing in Code S next season. If not then he's not really getting punished (which he clearly is).
He's basically getting a warning.
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On December 14 2011 22:45 ChowChillaCharlie wrote:I think suspending was taking it waaay too far, a warning would've been sufficient for something as trivial as not wanting to play a game that had absolutely no meaning to it. But this is what pisses me off the most: Show nested quote +"Mr.Chae has announced that they made Code S seeds for a professional minded pro-gamer not for an amateur prize money hunter. It is official that Naniwa is given a punishment" Talk about shooting yourself in the foot, kicking out NaNi cuz he ain't proffesional enough and then lower yourself to trash talking and lying.... Nice move GOM.
It has meaning when you paid him $840 just to show up and play games to please viewers.
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Australia8532 Posts
On December 14 2011 22:42 Mirror0423 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:37 bkrow wrote:
What an outrageous and ridiculous decision from GOM. Way to react to the knee-jerk responses from an online community. Naniwa said he was not in a position to play his best, so did a strategy that he thought would be quick and easy. The worst part is now GOM has set a precedent that allows them to decide how much effort a player must put in to avoid getting banned.
Was Nani's build "unethical"? Yes. Was it wrong? No. I feel that players should be able to play the way the wish - no matter if it is cheesing, probe rushing or a long macro game. As long as Nani isn't actually cheating then why should he get punished for what he did? This is a pretty stupid infringement on Nani's rights as a player Then you would approve of a player who's "mad" not leaving the game, and just building pylons all over the map delaying the inevitable since that's how he 'wants to play"? Where do you draw the line? It's better to have a vague line than no line at all imo. I don't want Naniwa staying in a game after his main is trashed and his opponent has 12 bases, while naniwa just runs around the map building pylons all over the place untill he's eliminated.
If a player gets mad and builds pylons all over the map are they going to lose their Code S seed? What a ridiculous idea!
The players should be able to play any way that they like; if it impacts the players image negatively he will suffer the consequences. It is not necessary for GOM to get involved.. at all.
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Calling him an amateur prize money hunter is indeed very respectful and professional. I really wonder how this fits into the high standards.
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On December 14 2011 22:44 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:37 Darksoldierr wrote:
I cant understand whats the big uproar, he was banned for only one season. The world not going to end. And i totally agree with GOM's decision.
Naniwa need to learn some respect towards the league he plays in. ( joke tournament at mlg anyone? ) He is not even banned. He can still go through Code A qualifier and through Code A and get into Code S.
You could say he's banned from Code S. He won't play any Code S matches until earliest the gsl after the next one (Considering the change in format this is a fairly long time).
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On December 14 2011 22:39 Darksoldierr wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:38 hacky wrote:On December 14 2011 22:35 Hubris wrote:
Am I the only one reading some the racist, ignorant, and BM posts by people "boycotting" GOM's events feeling happy that these sort of people aren't going to be in the audience? I think I'm more inclined to buy tickets knowing that the fan base should be more mature than usual. I find it ironic many people here acting a fool are just as BM as Naniwa's actions at that, and previous tournies. This! Cleaner LR threads? Still unlikely, but I'll take a few less wtf posts any day. Agree 100%
So because something isn't what you believe in it is immature? Cultural difference goes only one way? In sweden we are not as sensitive as for example in korea. We don't have such a militaristic way of living. In sweden we say what we think not what we want people to hear. If you said what you wanted to say in korea you would probably be crucified.
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On December 14 2011 22:23 dakalro wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 22:06 ethos wrote:
What is so difficult about this.
Naniwa was disrespectful. Naniwa was sent to the corner.
You shouldn't be sad for Naniwa, you should be sad that it seems that esports has to raise other people's children.
You don't get on their stage and then in the middle of it decide not to play by their rules because your feelings are hurt, and then get away with it scot-free (this isn't even that big of a punishment, its only a month, unless I'm mistaken).
Gom has to be sure that the decisions that they make for the sake of the fans (format) are adhered to by the players that take their stage, even when you get the shitty end of the stick.
We all have to sacrifice sometimes.
Such is (adult) life.
Naniwa gets a free pass why? Because you like him? Yes he was disrespectful but they cheated and lied to send him to the corner. That rule/reason for punishing him is nowhere near fitting for what he did. They simply had no official reason to punish him and they just used something that they thought was close but not actually anywhere near fitting. Last I knew abusive != offensive. It just showed they can stoop pretty low when it suits them and that's what I don't like. It's about losing respect and abusing the respect you have. Nothing to do with Naniwa, he's a child and needs to grow up still, just like Idra.
Look, Gom is a good organization. They aren't very draconic like KESPA, they are just asking for a little respect from the players that take their stage.
And essentially saying that if you want to act like a two-year old you have no business being on it. This is good for the sport.
I will agree that the rule was a little open to interpretation, but I don't consider it abuse if it was deserved.
More rules are the last thing we need, unless you want another KESPA on our hands.
I don't care how they interpret their rules as long as their judgement is sound.
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EPT
