• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 18:09
CET 00:09
KST 08:09
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners11Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11
Community News
Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada3SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA8StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon!45$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship7[BSL21] RO32 Group Stage4
StarCraft 2
General
Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada Craziest Micro Moments Of All Time? SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close"
Tourneys
Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest Tenacious Turtle Tussle Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions Where's CardinalAllin/Jukado the mapmaker?
Tourneys
[BSL21] RO32 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO32 Group C - Saturday 21:00 CET [ASL20] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Current Meta PvZ map balance How to stay on top of macro? Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Dyadica Gospel – a Pulp No…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1362 users

Patch 1.4 PTR Notes (updated 9/8) - Page 423

Forum Index > Closed
9040 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 421 422 423 424 425 453 Next
Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne

There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55
Misere
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada23 Posts
September 15 2011 18:13 GMT
#8441
On September 16 2011 02:48 Havefa1th wrote:
I just have a hard time taking anyone who says that "Infestors deserve to be nerfed because they're good against everything" seriously. Look at Zerg units! There's almost no synergy between any of the units, besides Infestor-BL, and that's the reason why it's so effective. If you looked at BW days, there was a great synergy between lurker/ling and defiler/ultra/ling, and that's why it was so effective in a variety of matchups. Zerg doesn't really have that, except for one build that finds itself into every non-mirror matchup, because it's the only one that works super late game.

I remember the days when Protoss were crushing PvZ and every thread in the Strategy section was how to beat the deathball. Before Infestors came into style, the general consensus was to kill the Protoss before they got to that stage. That's outright admitting that Protoss had a superior mid and late game army.... yet no one was crying for nerfs at that point.

The Zerg got creative... players took units that horrible (previously) efficiency against mostly armored P units in banelings and dropped them on the "deathball". Does anyone else see how fucking creative that is? Then there's the whole metagame of the mutalisk that Nestea and friends are throwing around, even though there are a ton of P units that counter the mutalisk... The ZvP metagame has changed so much from the beginning that they've earned the right to be successful in this matchup.

There hasn't been any similar breakthroughs in PvZ. Instead of finding a way to beat infestors through player skill (I don't know, try spreading your HT. I heard fungal doesn't work all that great with they can't fungal everything in one hit) and exploiting timings, like Zerg has been doing, Protoss players have suddenly seen the matchup flip into something they can't beat by 1a-ing and think this patch is well deserved, instead of taking the time to figure out how to beat it without a nerf.

Ok, maybe that's a bit harsh, but that's how I see it. PvZ hasn't seen any huge developments, where ZvP has seen advancements from your usual Roach-Hydra-Corruptor, with and without Infestors. It's sad to see all that advancement be shoved back to the Corruptor, which only Zerg players know how much it really sucks.


Its funny how all that zerg "advancement" in the metagame happened right after infestors got buffed, right? Coincidence I guess...
MattyClutch
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States711 Posts
September 15 2011 18:15 GMT
#8442
On September 16 2011 03:11 Antisocialmunky wrote:
8 would make more sense. 7 is too much.



I dunno about that. I was actually in favor of the change, but I don't have access to the data Blizzard does. Maybe Zergs were getting destroyed. I think if they are going to go with a range thing it needs to be low, 7 seems ok. Ill have to get on there and see. It might enable the SLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW HTs to actually feedback in situations where you didn't know well in advance that an engagement was eminent.
Nihn'kas Neehn
Beardedclam
Profile Joined September 2010
United States839 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-15 18:16:56
September 15 2011 18:16 GMT
#8443
On September 16 2011 03:08 SafeAsCheese wrote:
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/3182509584

NP change removed, 9->7 range instead =/


Does any zerg nerf ever actually get into the game? Lol

Although the massive unit nerf was pretty stupid, I think fungal shouldn't root massive units instead.
"bye bye" - genius "#$@% you" - Idra------------|Genius|DRG|Keen|---------Breakfast.213
Tsubbi
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany7996 Posts
September 15 2011 18:18 GMT
#8444
doesn't look like we'll see any more terran changes in 1.4 :/
Piski
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Finland3461 Posts
September 15 2011 18:18 GMT
#8445
On September 16 2011 03:16 Beardedclam wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2011 03:08 SafeAsCheese wrote:
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/3182509584

NP change removed, 9->7 range instead =/


Does any zerg nerf ever actually get into the game? Lol

Although the massive unit nerf was pretty stupid, I think fungal shouldn't root massive units instead.


Range 9 > 7 is a Zerf nerf.
-_-
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States7081 Posts
September 15 2011 18:18 GMT
#8446
Well done! If there's still problems with neural, they can address it later. Just a nice, solid, gradual change!
Elefanto
Profile Joined May 2010
Switzerland3584 Posts
September 15 2011 18:20 GMT
#8447
So Archons can still be neural parasited : l

Dear lord Protoss players surely do something wrong.
We got so many upgrades / tools removed without compensation or lessing of the nerf.
It's ridiculous.
wat
Fig
Profile Joined March 2010
United States1324 Posts
September 15 2011 18:20 GMT
#8448
Much better!!!!
What they've done is leave infestors as very versatile units, but made it so more tactics can be used to decrease this versatility.

Plus I really liked using graviton beaming an infestor and then cancelling it multiple times to cancel up to 4 neurals with a single phoenix, and now I still get to do that! More fun for everyone!
Can't elope with my cantaloupe
BeeNu
Profile Joined June 2011
615 Posts
September 15 2011 18:20 GMT
#8449
Well, on the plus side NP can still be used to combat Thors, although using it against Siege Tanks is even worse now, which at 9 range NP vs Siege Tanks was already pretty rough. NP vs Colossus is going to be reaaally rough to manage.

SafeAsCheese
Profile Joined June 2011
United States4924 Posts
September 15 2011 18:21 GMT
#8450
This will mean that if you NP a colossus, a colossus BEHIND the first colossus can shoot the infester to free the first one

Obviously if you can get all the colossus, it won't matter, but it will help protoss to focus fire the infesters.... at 7 range even stalkers will be pretty close to them.
Beardedclam
Profile Joined September 2010
United States839 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-15 18:23:52
September 15 2011 18:22 GMT
#8451
On September 16 2011 03:18 Piski wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2011 03:16 Beardedclam wrote:
On September 16 2011 03:08 SafeAsCheese wrote:
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/3182509584

NP change removed, 9->7 range instead =/


Does any zerg nerf ever actually get into the game? Lol

Although the massive unit nerf was pretty stupid, I think fungal shouldn't root massive units instead.


Range 9 > 7 is a Zerf nerf.


It's still on PTR. If you are including PTR then that is actually a buff from NP not being able to target massive units.
"bye bye" - genius "#$@% you" - Idra------------|Genius|DRG|Keen|---------Breakfast.213
arto
Profile Joined April 2010
United States59 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-15 18:27:23
September 15 2011 18:24 GMT
#8452
On September 16 2011 02:50 BeeNu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2011 02:40 arto wrote:
Its alot harder to click on units, and making sure you click enough for them to die but not wasting to much time clicking. then just spam click in a general area.


Broodlords and Ultras are pretty large easy targets, but whatever you can make up silly little excuses all day if you want to, no skin off my nose if you don't want to play better.


Exactly in order to use snipe I have to play better then using infested terran ( in terms of clicking).

-edit- I guess i should point out I'm being sarcastic but my point still stands that you do have to put more effort and concentration then casting infested terran to snipe (regardless of how much easier or harder terran is to play overall)
Jermstuddog
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2231 Posts
September 15 2011 18:26 GMT
#8453
On September 16 2011 03:22 Beardedclam wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2011 03:18 Piski wrote:
On September 16 2011 03:16 Beardedclam wrote:
On September 16 2011 03:08 SafeAsCheese wrote:
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/3182509584

NP change removed, 9->7 range instead =/


Does any zerg nerf ever actually get into the game? Lol

Although the massive unit nerf was pretty stupid, I think fungal shouldn't root massive units instead.


Range 9 > 7 is a Zerf nerf.


It's still on PTR. If you are including PTR then that is actually a buff from NP not being able to target massive units.


ROFL, I love that response.

Infestors got buffed on the PTR, OMG!!!
As it turns out, marines don't actually cost any money -Jinro
PrObeLife
Profile Joined September 2011
Australia22 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-15 18:32:53
September 15 2011 18:32 GMT
#8454
nvm
BeeNu
Profile Joined June 2011
615 Posts
September 15 2011 18:33 GMT
#8455
On September 16 2011 03:32 PrObeLife wrote:
Ok zergs you dodged a bullet here. NP change is NOT going through as stated on blizzard forums.

BBQ Sauce:

http://sea.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/163266335#1


dropping NP down 2 range is still a pretty big bullet to bite.
Q8_Devil
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom63 Posts
September 15 2011 18:35 GMT
#8456
On September 16 2011 03:33 BeeNu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2011 03:32 PrObeLife wrote:
Ok zergs you dodged a bullet here. NP change is NOT going through as stated on blizzard forums.

BBQ Sauce:

http://sea.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/163266335#1


dropping NP down 2 range is still a pretty big bullet to bite.

but the new np steals the upgrades too.

Matrix
Jermstuddog
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2231 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-15 18:40:08
September 15 2011 18:39 GMT
#8457
I think it was all a ploy.

They wanted to reduce the cast range by 2 all along, but that is a pretty sizable nerf considering the size and speed of the infestor.

So they come up with this idiotic change so that they can generate 200+ pages in this TL thread, that way Zergs are HAPPY to have range 7, now we get to see pages explaining how it's "not that bad" instead of "OMG BUT MY FATASS INFESTORS WILL DIE BEFORE THEY MAKE IT THAT CLOSE!!!"

It's all about the marketing.
As it turns out, marines don't actually cost any money -Jinro
Striding Strider
Profile Joined February 2011
United Kingdom787 Posts
September 15 2011 18:40 GMT
#8458
On September 16 2011 03:08 SafeAsCheese wrote:
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/3182509584

NP change removed, 9->7 range instead =/


Zerg whine is pretty imba.
I have a beard. I'm unprofessional.
KonohaFlash
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada1590 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-15 18:46:56
September 15 2011 18:42 GMT
#8459
How the hell can zerg be able to whine and have changes made, yet when toss and terran do the same nothing happens. Jesus christ.
Tsubbi
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany7996 Posts
September 15 2011 18:44 GMT
#8460
On September 16 2011 03:39 Jermstuddog wrote:
I think it was all a ploy.

They wanted to reduce the cast range by 2 all along, but that is a pretty sizable nerf considering the size and speed of the infestor.

So they come up with this idiotic change so that they can generate 200+ pages in this TL thread, that way Zergs are HAPPY to have range 7, now we get to see pages explaining how it's "not that bad" instead of "OMG BUT MY FATASS INFESTORS WILL DIE BEFORE THEY MAKE IT THAT CLOSE!!!"

It's all about the marketing.


this is exactly how i feel about this too

and it retracts from the lack of terran nerf too, brilliant
Prev 1 421 422 423 424 425 453 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
23:00
PiGosaur Cup #55
CranKy Ducklings38
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
White-Ra 265
ProTech123
JuggernautJason117
SpeCial 91
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 3580
Shuttle 674
Artosis 219
Counter-Strike
Foxcn178
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox721
AZ_Axe54
PPMD22
Other Games
summit1g8363
Grubby3116
shahzam489
Liquid`Hasu241
Skadoodle151
Maynarde119
ViBE80
C9.Mang079
fpsfer 3
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 20 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• RyuSc2 78
• Hupsaiya 73
• musti20045 29
• Adnapsc2 11
• Migwel
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 36
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• Ler45
League of Legends
• imaqtpie3071
• TFBlade953
Other Games
• WagamamaTV388
• Shiphtur277
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
9h 51m
OSC
12h 21m
Kung Fu Cup
12h 51m
Classic vs Solar
herO vs Cure
Reynor vs GuMiho
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
23h 51m
The PondCast
1d 10h
RSL Revival
1d 10h
Solar vs Zoun
MaxPax vs Bunny
Kung Fu Cup
1d 12h
WardiTV Korean Royale
1d 12h
PiGosaur Monday
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Classic vs Creator
Cure vs TriGGeR
[ Show More ]
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
herO vs Gerald
ByuN vs SHIN
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
IPSL
3 days
ZZZero vs rasowy
Napoleon vs KameZerg
BSL 21
3 days
Tarson vs Julia
Doodle vs OldBoy
eOnzErG vs WolFix
StRyKeR vs Aeternum
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Reynor vs sOs
Maru vs Ryung
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
4 days
BSL 21
4 days
JDConan vs Semih
Dragon vs Dienmax
Tech vs NewOcean
TerrOr vs Artosis
IPSL
4 days
Dewalt vs WolFix
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
Wardi Open
5 days
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-07
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.