EPTSo once again, has Blizzard said anything about it?
Patch 1.4 PTR Notes (updated 9/8) - Page 348
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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 | ||
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SonicTitan
United States249 Posts
So once again, has Blizzard said anything about it? | ||
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ma70
253 Posts
On September 10 2011 05:58 SonicTitan wrote: Considering I'm a low-level scrub, I'm going to check my first "wtf" response to the NP change. The reasons against the change have already been articulated enough, as well as reasons for it. I'll only ask - has Blizzard themselves released any justification for the change? NP WAS a viable strategy against both Thor and Collosus, and especially with Collosus, no other unit composition could really match the power of NP. The change is worrisome, is all, and as far as I can see it was never asked for or talked about. So once again, has Blizzard said anything about it? Maybe they did the NP change because if NP units get the upgrades (which did not occur last patch) then they will be THAT much stronger against your own army. I mean, it's not perfect, but at least the units you "steal" from them (should you use NP) will be stronger....but anyways, you can always just not research it and use Fungal (which is powerful in its own right) and Infested Terrans. | ||
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HowardRoark
1146 Posts
That would be cool IMO and enhance the spectator experience: Imagine Nestea kidnapping probes to make Zerg Photons, or SCVs etc. Or steal a Sentry to keep the entrence guarded by Forcefields. It will give a reason for the Infestor to be called Infestor. | ||
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clownzim
Brazil267 Posts
if u guys watch destiny stream u guys will notice that even with hes mass infestor plan he almost never uses NP, he research it but really rarely he uses it. FG + IT is much more useful than NP. for real i never saw a NP WINS a fight, sure it helps u NP and target the funged stalkers with it. or some thors so take tanks/funged bio/air. u guys still can NP tank/immortals still, remember? | ||
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tntrieu
United States19 Posts
On September 10 2011 05:58 Jerubaal wrote: See, NP was never actually used outside of bronze because it's so easy to avoid it and kill the infestors. It totally was not a super powerful spell and is easily mitigated if you aren't a 1 control group a-mover. Regardless, it's still going to break the game for zerg and make PvZ totally unwinnable. /shrugface? Watch some of destiny's games. If toss goes gateway + colossus and zerg goes ling + infestor, it is basically an auto win for the zerg. | ||
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SuperYo1000
United States880 Posts
On September 10 2011 05:58 Jerubaal wrote: See, NP was never actually used outside of bronze because it's so easy to avoid it and kill the infestors. It totally was not a super powerful spell and is easily mitigated if you aren't a 1 control group a-mover. Regardless, it's still going to break the game for zerg and make PvZ totally unwinnable. /shrugface? i dont understand your reasoning here..first you say NP sucks so bad that no one used it effectively outside of bronze then your next line says pvz will be unwinnable for zerg.... are you trolling me | ||
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TotalNightmare
Germany139 Posts
On September 10 2011 05:38 Belial88 wrote: Infestors are an every-tool just like stalkers and marines. If you think infestors are too versatile, then nerf marines and stalkers. Stupid, right? And then there's ghosts and HT, which immediately kill infestors, where ghosts and HT can still attack/Archon. And dont tell me FG counters HT, because unless you ball them up + leave them out of position, they always kill. And FG/NP have to chained/channeled to work, so losing 10 infestors to 2 HT just to get one FG off on an army is riduclous. Not to mention HT are cheaper, come out faster, are faster to tech to, then infestors. Whoever said Protoss should play more reactionary than massing up some rigid build order for a timing attac, sounds great. You are pretty mutch wrong. Infestors are no "every-tool", or at least not supposed to be one. They are a spellcaster that is supposed to do huge amounts of damage and then hang around. So why do you complain when they are not good against EVERYTHING anymore BESIDES because you are biased? Also the thing with the HTs. They are supposed to counter infestors, yes. But they aren't really good at it. If you want to counter mass infestors you need to spend nearly the same amount of Gas on HTs since they have no energy upgrade that gets them closer to being able to Feedback twice. And you don't have that gas as Protoss. Also High Templar are not easier to get. Protoss has o linear techpath like the other races, they have to choose. And usually they choose robo for obvious reasons and that denies Templar for some time. And IF you get those Templar you are far away from killing the infestors because to feedback a target the target has to have energy, so if the infestors have allready cast their spells the High templar are useless unless you have enough energy to storm and the enemy has a unit composition that can be effectively stormed. Not to mention the research. | ||
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Lomak
United States311 Posts
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Noocta
France12578 Posts
On September 10 2011 05:31 mFour wrote: I can't believe how many Zerg players believe that mass Infestor should be viable. I'm happy about the NP nerf and hope it goes through..BUT Blizz needs to buff Hydras to give Zerg more options. I don't understand why it should not be. :s A race having a strategy revolving around caster as main unit with the support of dps units ( most of the time it's the other way around ) is a nice concept. And it work at the moment. You just need to tweak them litely, not make them bad enough to force zerg to make corruptor again because this unit is just plain awfull. | ||
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CeriseCherries
6170 Posts
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Uhh Negative
United States1090 Posts
Disappointed there was no hydra buff. I cannot remember the last time I saw a zerg use hydras in non ZvZs and even then its not common. | ||
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izgodlee
Canada133 Posts
On September 10 2011 05:34 ClutchSC wrote: I don't think blizzard realizes what they are doing. By nerfing infestors as much as they are, they will ensuring that zerg players won't use them as often. This would be fine if they were counteracting this by making other units effective against protoss, however this has not happened yet. Also, since infestors will not be on the field as much anymore, suddenly zerg has no antiair since Hydras are not a viable unit in high-level matches. This would not neccessarily be the worst thing, except that warp prisms are getting a 60 shield buff and now zerg won't have antiair to deal with them. So thank you blizzard, your lack of forsight is once again evident. By nerfing infestors, they are effectively going to improve toss win rates from the current 30%. good change blizzard ^_^~~ | ||
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Lomak
United States311 Posts
On September 10 2011 06:01 tntrieu wrote: Watch some of destiny's games. If toss goes gateway + colossus and zerg goes ling + infestor, it is basically an auto win for the zerg. Destiny is a mediocre zerg who plays against other mediocre players on the NA ladder. Nothing should be read into regarding the zerg race when it comes to the games you see on his stream. | ||
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hitpoint
United States1511 Posts
As a zerg player I thought reapers needed a nerf when the game came out, but what Blizzard did was too much. Blizzard over nerfed the reaper, I said so then and I'm still saying so now. They are a fucking cool unit and I wish they were viable, same with the carrier. Now they're over nerfing NP also. There are slowly becoming fewer viable units available to players and I think it's bad for the game. If infestors need a nerf there are other ways to go about it. NP could cost more energy, more money to upgrade, more time to upgrade. It could have a shorter duration, or a shorter duration to massive. Hell, I'd rather them nerf fungal even more. Infestors with NP are how I dealt with terran mech. Broodlords and ultras still won't be out in time to stop it. That leaves us with two choices that I can see - mass roach - and mass muta to the point where they can kill the thors. Both of those are TERRIBLE options. | ||
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mFour
United States25 Posts
On September 10 2011 06:04 Lomak wrote: Destiny is a mediocre zerg who plays against other mediocre players on the NA ladder. Nothing should be read into regarding the zerg race when it comes to the games you see on his stream. I think Destiny is better than people give him credit for, but when the talk happens to be Infestors he should be the first name to pop into your head. | ||
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conz
United Kingdom163 Posts
If it breaks the game then it'll be sorted out within a few patches, I welcome the challenge and I roll zerg  | ||
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darmousseh
United States3437 Posts
On September 10 2011 05:48 Crisium wrote: If Zergs still choose to upgrade and use NP at this point, it seems like Immortals and Siege Tanks are the targets of choice. Not quite as good as also having Colossi and Thors as options, so I can see why many will ignore this spell. Units that can be NP usefully. Protoss: Immortals, void rays Terran: Tanks, ravens, banshees The spell removed a lot of viable things that could be NP'd cost efficiently, but the thing is, even with the fungal growth nerf, they were still too effective against protoss. The other idea is to lower the time to like 6 or 9 seconds. That would work for me. | ||
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Joseph123
Bulgaria1144 Posts
On September 10 2011 06:08 darmousseh wrote: Units that can be NP usefully. Protoss: Immortals, void rays Terran: Tanks, ravens, banshees The spell removed a lot of viable things that could be NP'd cost efficiently, but the thing is, even with the fungal growth nerf, they were still too effective against protoss. The other idea is to lower the time to like 6 or 9 seconds. That would work for me. you definitely forgot the most important - high templars | ||
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Lomak
United States311 Posts
On September 10 2011 06:06 mFour wrote: I think Destiny is better than people give him credit for, but when the talk happens to be Infestors he should be the first name to pop into your head. Really why is that? Sure he uses them all the time but to be honest I've seen a lot better infestor control out of the likes of Idra (the few times he's used them in pro games) and other zergs. The only reason people see infestor and think destiny is because that's all he uses. Same reason people see void ray + collosus and think Cruncher. | ||
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FromUndaChz
United States7 Posts
Infestors' neural parasite ability no longer works on massive units. As a Terran, I appreciate this change... but I can't really say it's been much of a problem so I'm unsure what Blizzard is after here. Can't wait to see Raven/Seeker Missile used more!! | ||
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