On February 14 2012 11:47 sunprince wrote: Personally, as a polyamorous guy with a high sex drive, I'm happy with the multiple open long-term relationships I currently have. Since I do want a family at some point, I plan to eventually settle down with one or two girls, marry her/them (in spirit if the latter, since legally impossible under US law), and have kids.
Give me one single God damn reason why you would ever want to get married. Seriously, what is one single benefit a man gets out of marriage? If you can't lock a girl in with normal game, then an expensive blood diamond on her finger isn't going to make a difference. Marriage is the ultimate shit test for me - a huge DLV.
Taxes. It's a pretty damn sweet deal as a business proposition.
On February 14 2012 11:54 Greater Spire wrote:Give me one single God damn reason why you would ever want to get married. Seriously, what is one single benefit a man gets out of marriage? If you can't lock a girl in with normal game, then an expensive blood diamond on her finger isn't going to make a difference.
Basically, there's a number of tax and other legal/financial benefits related to having a partner and children (joint property, spousal privilege, estate issues, next-of-kin status, extending federal employee benefits, etc.). Locking in a girl has nothing to do with it.
On February 14 2012 11:54 Greater Spire wrote:Marriage is the ultimate shit test for me - a huge DLV.
There's academic research showing that married men are considered more desirable. Essentially, you display pre-selection as well as financial means, so it's far from DLV. Put that together with an open-minded bisexual wife, and it should help your sex life, not hurt it.
Marriage is only a DLV if you're doing it on someone else's terms rather than voluntarily, or if you marry the wrong woman.
On February 14 2012 10:35 HardlyNever wrote: I've lurked on this thread for several months (its great for lols)
It is indeed great for lols. Then I realized that squattin is a pretty cool guy and is probably one of the more helpful people on TL and then the thread also became great to learn some pointers and whatnot.
On February 14 2012 10:35 HardlyNever wrote:My question is this: What is the sort of "end goal" of this? By that I mean, how would you describe this phase of your life to the woman you end up being with long term (marriage, or something like it)? How would you explain what you did? Could you be honest about it? Do you ever even see yourself being in a relationship like that (is it interesting to you)?
Everyone's goals are different. Some guys want one night stands for the rest of their lives, other guys are just trying to develop the skills to find an awesome woman to marry, etc.
Personally, as a polyamorous guy with a high sex drive, I'm happy with the multiple open long-term relationships I currently have. Since I do want a family at some point, I plan to eventually settle down with one or two girls, marry her/them (in spirit if the latter, since legally impossible under US law), and have kids.
On February 14 2012 10:35 HardlyNever wrote:Also, how would you explain it if you met that girl through "pick up?" That there are certain techniques, tricks, patterns (however you want to define PU), and that you used these on her in order for her to be more attracted to you (with the underlying goal that she would sleep with you, if you want)?
It makes no difference. If a girl starts dating a guy partly from using flirting tips she found in Cosmo, would you consider that relationship different in any way?
That comparison doesn't work for me. That is like saying a pond and an ocean are both "just bodies of water." If a girl read Cosmo once or twice, and happened to remember a few things she read and did them on a date that is one thing. If a girl read every issue of Cosmo since she was twelve, went out once a week (at least) with the expressed purpose of using all the things she read in Cosmo to get guys to sleep with her (and did some of the things in Cosmo WHILE doing the "sleeping" lol), then told me about that, that would definitely not be the long term girl for me (that is a personal opinion). "You can't turn a whore into a house-wife" as my friend says. (As a side note, it is interesting to notice the double standard, but that is whole different topic).
A more apt comparison and honest answer would be appreciated. If long-term isn't for you, that is fine, but playing off what you are doing as something normal and that most guys do, or is comparable to what most girls do, is not true.
On February 14 2012 11:54 Greater Spire wrote:Give me one single God damn reason why you would ever want to get married. Seriously, what is one single benefit a man gets out of marriage? If you can't lock a girl in with normal game, then an expensive blood diamond on her finger isn't going to make a difference.
Basically, there's a number of tax and other legal/financial benefits related to having a partner and children (joint property, spousal privilege, estate issues, next-of-kin status, extending federal employee benefits, etc.). Locking in a girl has nothing to do with it.
On February 14 2012 11:54 Greater Spire wrote:Marriage is the ultimate shit test for me - a huge DLV.
There's academic research showing that married men are considered more desirable. Essentially, you display pre-selection as well as financial means, so it's far from DLV. Put that together with an open-minded bisexual wife, and it should help your sex life, not hurt it.
Marriage is only a DLV if you're doing it on someone else's terms rather than voluntarily, or if you marry the wrong woman.
I'd argue the risky legal/property consequences of a divorce far outweigh the benefits.
On February 14 2012 12:00 upperbound wrote:Taxes. It's a pretty damn sweet deal as a business proposition.
Such a poor argument. In order to gain any tax benefits at all, and make no mistake they are extremely meager, you must file jointly for income taxes. Filing jointly means that, at best, the two of you have merged your incomes and at worst means that you have merged all of your assets. Guess what is going to happen now if you two happen to get a divorce. Pretty much guaranteed to be absolute hell with lawyers like crazy, and she WILL get half of what you own now and own in the future, even if it is an at-fault divorce.
"Pretty damn sweet deal"? You're out of your mind kid.
On February 14 2012 11:54 Greater Spire wrote: Give me one single God damn reason why you would ever want to get married. Seriously, what is one single benefit a man gets out of marriage? If you can't lock a girl in with normal game, then an expensive blood diamond on her finger isn't going to make a difference. Marriage is the ultimate shit test for me - a huge DLV.
There is a lot of truth in this, especially if your reason for marrying is to lock a girl in lol.
To people asking about what the long-term goal is: (my personal answer)
Finding this stuff (and realizing selective bits of it really work) before you're 20 is absolute gold. The long term? I've got a while before I need to figure that out, but as far as I can tell, most of the stuff here and in related places is not so much about getting good with women, but getting good with people, usually by either improving the life you bring into an encounter, or your ability to make that encounter an enjoyable and memorable one.
Clearly, this has a lot of application, including for: Job interviews/workplace relations Social networking Business (especially on a smaller scale, unofficial level) Personal happiness (being able to make friends or get a boy/girlfriend without too many problems)
Given a large majority of the advice on how to improve ALL of this is available online for free, and isn't arduous to attempt in your everyday life, seems stupid not to develop it as a life skill. =) =)
On February 14 2012 07:12 squattincassanova wrote: No, more people are offended by Oriental than Asians. Name 10 countries that don't include Asians or 20% of the people that dont include Asians and might have a slight chance at a point.
What's your problem with Oriental? I'm an Asian and i definitely have no problem with it. The term is a bit weird though as i never hear people use it.
For more racist terms, i think gook, zipperhead, chink etc are worse.
People worry too much about the implications, the morals, the end goal of pickup and too less on the actual getting good part. Dude, whether there is pickup or not, theres always gonna be rape, cheating, gold diggers, players, prostitution, pimps, domestic abuse. That shits always going to be around. Me talking to girls in clubs and getting blown out, is the least of Earths fucking worries. These chicks aren't even going to remember your fucking faces in the morning.
In terms of end goals, figure that shit along the way. Isn't: "hey I want to be better with women" not enough to get started? I mean its not like you wake up the next day as a fucking Casanova, and you have no idea how to get rid of hordes of women waiting outside your house lol. Shit takes a long time to get good, you have plenty of time to figure out your end goal. Hell.... your goals might even change. I thought some day I would marry an Asian girl.... but it seems like the more Asian girls I talk to, the more I don't like most Asian girls. See... things change, your taste changes.
As you become sophisticated, you realize what you thought you wanted in your ideal bubble isn't truly what you wanted. Most people don't know what they want in life. You have to experience it to know what your options are.
On February 14 2012 10:35 HardlyNever wrote: I have no real issues you with doing what you're doing, or the reasoning behind it, or whatever. Whether "PUA" techniques are effective or not I don't think has been "proven" via this thread, but that isn't really that important. What I do agree with is that if you are out there grinding out encounters and dates with girls, approaching girls you don't know in clubs, and generally putting yourself out there with women, you WILL have more experience with women and have a better understanding of what (if anything) makes attraction for them. I'd chalk that up to the mere fact that as humans do ANYTHING a lot, they tend to get better at it over time, and not necessary because of "pick-up," but that isn't really my question.
This is true. A lot of pickup is motivational talk. Its not the gimmicks, the card play, the routines that get you good. Its the encouragement, its the idea that you have a glimmer of hope to ride on, its those things.... those crutches that get you out of your fucking house and actually talk to girls.... because ultimately, being good with girls require actually interacting with them!! If mainstream pickup never came about, making the jump to go to the club with no fucking game plan would have been too hard for me. People wont get out of their houses. But now if you have gimmicks at LEAST you are going out. And going out alone will make you good. If I never read "The Game", I could not even fathom going up to a girl. But after reading it... it made me get out of my comfort zone and at least attempt to approach.
So I agree with you quite a bit here. Its not the gimmicks themselves that get you good. Its simply a motivational crutch to get you started. Now once you actually get decent.... you actually have to work on your core and focus on being a cool guy with awesome hobbies. Which is why, instead of learning more routines, I am working out, traveling, taking acting, doing photography, taking improv comedy, learning as much cool shit as possible. Because guess what? Once you run out of routines... that chick is going to realize you are a lame guy.
On February 14 2012 10:35 HardlyNever wrote: Also, how would you explain it if you met that girl through "pick up?" That there are certain techniques, tricks, patterns (however you want to define PU), and that you used these on her in order for her to be more attracted to you (with the underlying goal that she would sleep with you, if you want)?
Hey man... you don't have to tell your girl you used to do pick up. Why does she have to know everything in your past. As far as shes concerned, you were just a cool fucking dude since high school . Because when you get really good, it all looks natural.
Jesus, what is your problem with admitting you invested time into Pickup?
It's fine that you're ashamed of it, but it's not fine to advice others that it's a great idea.
As I said earlier in this thread, most of the girl I had affairs with since my "pickup time" knew what I was doing, how I was doing it and loved the fact that it worked. Heck, my gf knows that I originally just aimed to have something short with her. So what? We got to know each other and something serious developed.
It is absolutely fine to invest time into improving yourself. It is absolutely fine to tell a girl that you invested time into getting better with girls.
Learn to display some honesty and pride, yo.
Edit: The whole "OMG MARRIAGE IS SUCH A SHIT TEST / DLV" is pretty stupid as well. Yeah, most marriages fail because people marry to save their relationship/face/children. Yeah, most marriages fail because both sides decide to get fat and lazy and then wonder why the other part fucks his/her boss/secretary (great film btw).
If your (long-term) relationship worked well and was properly framed in aspects that play a role in a marriage I see no problem whatsoever. Sadly I only know 3 guys in the PUA scene who I consider successfull and married, the sample size isn't exactly huge when you want those two factors in there. =P
On February 11 2012 08:42 Rekrul wrote: cassanova u say u got laid 12 times last year, but considering all the time you've spent 'approaching sets,' studying, foruming, recording vids, posting them for comments and self analysis, online dating site stuff, that number is actually ridiculously low
especially in san diego, it's just an extremely low success rate, especially given how much you hype up the PUA approach, and the fact that you're a big ripped dude and girls love that
i'm confused
Well....all I can say is this. A measure of success is not necessarily the end result after 1 year, but how far you come. I was the stereotypical Asian nerd who played Starcraft all day long. I had over 10,000 games of Starcraft under my belt. I also logged ridiculous hours in Team Fortress 2, Heroes of Newerth, Diablo 2, Counter Strike and a crap load of other games. In college, I studied engineering and worked 3 jobs. I never had the chance to socialize.
My lay count before last year was 2. Now going from 2 lay count to 12 additional lay count in one year, I would consider that a MAJOR change. People say, well your lay to effort ratio is terrible. And I say who cares? If I didn't put in that effort, I would have gotten ZERO lays. And being buff doesn't mean shit if you don't have game because I was buff before I got into the game.
Also, keep in mind, I live 70 miles from San Diego where I game, and this shit happens all the time where the girl is down but I can't get the logistics in my favor. This video happened last week and it happens ALLLLL the time. Was the girl down? 200% yes.... but did logistics cock block me? Absolutely. Did my skills increase over the year? X1000%. Getting the girl and adding the lay count doesn't mean much. I could fuck a buncha fatties but that doesn't make me happier or better at game, nor will it help me find my perfect 10.
Random question, but how do you manage to get all these chicks you have just met to pose in suggestive ways and let you take pictures of them?
The reason why I intend to get married (I'm 21 atm so should be a while) is to have and raise children. If I died without having at least one child I would feel like my life were incomplete. If I find a woman who is cool with committing to life but without marriage, great, but I imagine this would be hard. Even then, NZ law treats two people living together as de facto partners anyway, giving each party the same rights as would occur under marriage, which sucks imo. Is this not the case in the US?
I don't like the idea of raising children in two separate homes, or in one home but with only one parent (whether that be me or her).
Question to those against marriage: Do you have/want kids? If so, how do you feel not being married would affect the family dynamic? Are you comfortable with having less than maximum contact with your children? My parents split when I was 7 and I know the situation well. My father only saw us on weekends, I stayed with my Mum most of the time. He didn't seem to mind, but I'm not sure I would like that as a father. Being in a long-term/life-time relationship with the mother of my children would, I feel, allow me to be the father I want to be.
On February 14 2012 19:59 CaptainCharisma wrote: On marriage -
The reason why I intend to get married (I'm 21 atm so should be a while) is to have and raise children. If I died without having at least one child I would feel like my life were incomplete. If I find a woman who is cool with committing to life but without marriage, great, but I imagine this would be hard. Even then, NZ law treats two people living together as de facto partners anyway, giving each party the same rights as would occur under marriage, which sucks imo. Is this not the case in the US?
I don't like the idea of raising children in two separate homes, or in one home but with only one parent (whether that be me or her).
Question to those against marriage: Do you have/want kids? If so, how do you feel not being married would affect the family dynamic? Are you comfortable with having less than maximum contact with your children? My parents split when I was 7 and I know the situation well. My father only saw us on weekends, I stayed with my Mum most of the time. He didn't seem to mind, but I'm not sure I would like that as a father. Being in a long-term/life-time relationship with the mother of my children would, I feel, allow me to be the father I want to be.
So you want to contribute to overpopulation when you could easily adopt one of the millions of parentless African children, or alternatively help foster thousands of abused NZ children (having one of the highest rates of child abuse in the OECD).
As for de facto relationships - that only comes into effect if you've had a partnership for over two years. With marriage it becomes instant. So it's like - hey, the law allows you a two year trial period before applying to you... But you're willing to circumvent the two year period by signing a contract signing away your right to a two year trial period before relationship property is split upon divorce.
Good job comparing someone who instantly marries a random girl for whatever reasons with people who actually select their girl and don't grab one out of desperation. If your goal for a relationship is to marry the first one that comes around you prolly have not much to do with pickup in the first place.
On February 14 2012 19:57 Ryder. wrote: Random question, but how do you manage to get all these chicks you have just met to pose in suggestive ways and let you take pictures of them?
lol. obviously the women talking isn't the one on the picture. The real one's probly fat.
On February 14 2012 19:57 Ryder. wrote: Random question, but how do you manage to get all these chicks you have just met to pose in suggestive ways and let you take pictures of them?
lol. obviously the women talking isn't the one on the picture. The real one's probly fat.
Yeah mang. Probably both fat and ugly. What ever makes you feel better haha. Sour grapes for the win.
Been a while since I last posted. The chick I asked out flaked the next day, but she was still flirty the next time I saw her irl. That might've slowly developed to a full blown oneitis, even when I tried avoiding it, but thankfully she started dating some other guy who's got money, looks and most likely way better game. That really made me care a lot less about her, since I finally got some closure.
This whole thing with this chick really motivated me though. The urge to talk to girls really skyrocketed for some reason and I managed to setup some chicks to possibly chill with in future parties. Not that it really means shit, but hey it's better than nothing.
I'm going to build up the motivation to really start approaching soon. There's like this invisible force made of deep emotional shit I just either have to get over or ignore. A few years ago I barely talked to chicks and pretty much never asked anyone out. Now I talk to girls way more and get positive responses, but just can't really seal the deal and I don't move nearly fast enough with girls that show interest. Also my social circles are kinda starting to run out of potential chicks.
I'm going to two parties this week. I'll probably post about them next week. Not expecting to get laid (logistics would make that pretty much impossible anyway), but maybe a few phone numbers and at least some decent conversations.
On an another note, been going to the gym since the start of january 3-4 times a week and so far my motivation to lift just keeps growing and I'm seeing some decent progress. Most of the people I know actually doubted me and told me I'd probably quit in a few weeks. It's funny how people project their own weaknesses to others. Now I just got to do the same thing with approaching.
EPT
. Because when you get really good, it all looks natural.
