Now that there are a whole load of new people getting into this Starcraft community, a very signifcant number of which coming from communities such as DotA, Warcraft, Command&Conquer, etc., I'm noticing that everybody is also bringing their cultures and attitudes along with them... namely their bad attitudes.
I've been lurking here since 2003 and I know that we have our own version of trolls and whatnot... but I think that when you compare to the other communities, we're pretty tame and conservative. That's just the opinion I've gotten over the years. I could be wrong.
I'm curious to know how you guys think we should handle those bad-mannered people who come here from places like DotA and WC3 and C&C, if at all. Since there are many of them, they might socially change the way we do business here, if you know what I mean.
Oh c'mon... climb down from your ivory tower. People are people. There are jerks in every community, and the reason TL tends to be more civil is due to the strict rules and good moderation. Those same rules apply to newcomers. Has nothing to do with SC players being more civil than other gamers.
Well, except Xbox Live jerks... but we know none of them come here
I have noticed an increasing number of new posters posting... low-quality posts... But it hasn't become anything significant enough to "socially change the way we do business here," as you put it.
On March 29 2010 00:16 muzzy wrote: Well, except Xbox Live jerks... but we know none of them come here
Yeah -- I have every confidence in our moderators and all that jazz, but we can't be sure that all of those new people will rely on this community when establishing this new StarCraft game as an eSport. They can just make their own community and develop their own culture, saying that what we have here is old and outdated.
I'm watching this GLHF.tv broadcast now, and I see nothing but trolls from WC3, CNC, and DotA doing their usual hateful criticism of the commentators and I'm just like "what the hell? this is supposed to be starcraft..." and all of a sudden, I'm the minority and a noob. I just doesn't make any sense.
edit - @synapse: Obviously it doesn't seem that way now, but I'm looking into the [relatively speaking] near-future here as the game becomes more popular, and after the beta is over and the game is finished... you see where I'm going with this thought?
No dude I'm not trying to troll here — I've followed TL and SC for a long time and I'm seeing these foreigners come in with their bm attitudes and I just don't want to see what we have here become what they are.
I've never played sc. I've played wc3 for over 5 years and I wouldn't consider myself as being bm or ruining your community. It's frustrating when some sc players group ALL wc3 players together to suggest we're all bad mannered and low skilled.
I'm not saying that all foreigners are bad... I don't think I ever said that here. I'm just saying that there are an awful lot of them who are bad-mannered that are outside of this community and who will, in the future at least, be trying to play bigger roles in the community that we have, at least up until this point in this almost 10-year history.
On March 29 2010 00:25 Solitude wrote: I've never played sc. I've played wc3 for over 5 years and I wouldn't consider myself as being bm or ruining your community. It's frustrating when some sc players group ALL wc3 players together to suggest we're all bad mannered and low skilled.
Agreed.
If you want to go by stereotypes, there are a ton of bad mannered SC players as well.
Team Liquid is a good community, it has nothing to do with the game they play.
On March 29 2010 00:30 Jyvblamo wrote: Man, when did the TL community get so xenophobic? Oh noes, more FANS will destroy the purity of our race- err community!
lol i was just thinking that.
TL already has a huge rep for being very elitist (which is fine imo)
as a long time lurker i have to admit this thread is a little harsh. i think we should welcome others with open arms and should they choose to stay they WILL eventually conform to our rules
that said by saying that our community in general will deteriorate is going overboard as long as the original TLers remember their manners and are willing to show new commers how things are here
For a game like starcraft not unreasonable to think there's a higher quality of people as it's followers. People have been playing the game for a decade so the crowd is older and it's extraordinarily hard to play game that takes a lot of effort. Not something a lot bm kids can handle. sc2 is a easier game to play and the people who aren't bw players have some questionable tastes to begin with...
Well I dont think the OP wants to bash all WC3, DOTA, etc players. Its just that there seams to be an increasingly number of low quality posts by people with a very low post count in the SC2 forum. I noticed that too and think it is a problem that cant be solved easily by baning a few people.
I've laddered WC3 for years and it's just full of bad-mannered cheaters. ^^' SC1-ppl are huge elitists, but they're IMO friendlier, very active with pushing the community forwards etc. than in many other communities.
And as far as C&C-Community goes: If you're playing such a shitty game, sth is bound to be wrong with u. ^^'
On March 29 2010 00:51 hp.Methos wrote: TL is gonna be like America. A huge melting pot of many different communities. Pretty awesome that we're gonna get a bunch more new people.
I have to agree. I hate to sound so cynical, but it gets kind of boring just hearing the same people around here talk about the same stuff and have the same opinions and attitudes. It'll be interesting to have some new faces, some new attitudes (assuming they are at least relatively positive or ambivalent) to spice it up.
On March 29 2010 00:51 hp.Methos wrote: TL is gonna be like America. A huge melting pot of many different communities. Pretty awesome that we're gonna get a bunch more new people.
I have to agree. I hate to sound so cynical, but it gets kind of boring just hearing the same people around here talk about the same stuff and have the same opinions and attitudes. It'll be interesting to have some new faces, some new attitudes (assuming they are at least relatively positive or ambivalent) to spice it up.
One of the problems might be that C&C-commentators that don't know anything about starcraft end up commentating the Zotac-Cup#5. ^^'
IMO SC1 players just have a much better understanding of the game. While players may just copy builds and still be good, the real good palyers or commentators should at least know SC kinda well...
Dota players r like cs players they r all like idra man....Wc3 i dont rly know i guess they are alright. But starcraft is a game were ppl aren't a complete douchbag when u lose, unlike those other games. I remember around 3 yrs ago i was trying my hand on iccup and went 4-96 lol. But i kept going and noone was bm to me because i was bad. partly because i never cheesed. but now im a solid player but i wouldn't of continued if ppl were as mean as dota and cs players.
ps. What pisses me off the most tho is WoW players, the dead giveaway is when they say a race is faceroll...ERR!@!!!
I really disagree with Frus. I think that what we have here is 100% fine and has been that way since we were obsessing over the Emperor.
edit -- yeah kickinhead... i'm gonna talk to those guys after their broadcast is over to explain some stuff about sc1. hopefully that will help them out.
i do think it will be a better community once they learn the rules tho because the adims r rly good at banning people....especially kenniget.....perma banning me for 2 accounts (
On March 29 2010 01:17 wanderer wrote: edit -- yeah kickinhead... i'm gonna talk to those guys after their broadcast is over to explain some stuff about sc1. hopefully that will help them out.
Make them watch all the Day9-daily's about SC2 and a lot of them about SC1... Should help with knowing strategies and how those games are played. xD
On March 29 2010 01:20 Daldus wrote: i do think it will be a better community once they learn the rules tho because the adims r rly good at banning people....especially kenniget.....perma banning me for 2 accounts (
I've only played Dota. I like the game but didn't really like the community. Random keep scold me for no reason.
Because I am a girl, that why sometimes my style is much more simpler and I have my own way of thinking. I just want to play for fun. Then when losing or mistakes happen, they scold me. And then they laugh because I didn't play the normal way.
Sometimes I feel I play much better than them.
It is so angry sometimes, there are people who didn't play really well but still able to scold me so much. They cannot find their own mistake but keep finding my mistake, sometimes I didnt make any mistake yet get scolding.
Ask me buy this, do that. I keep say Okay. Okay. In the end keep get scold.
There is 1 time I get so mad I really BM back. Then ask me go "Insert Location". Meet Real Life and talk. Or "Insert number". Talk on phone.
On March 29 2010 01:27 XiaoJoyce- wrote: I've only played Dota. I like the game but didn't really like the community. Random keep scold me for no reason.
Because I am a girl, that why sometimes my style is much more simpler and I have my own way of thinking. I just want to play for fun. Then when losing or mistakes happen, they scold me. And then they laugh because I didn't play the normal way.
Sometimes I feel I play much better than them.
It is so angry sometimes, there are people who didn't play really well but still able to scold me so much. They cannot find their own mistake but keep finding my mistake, sometimes I didnt make any mistake yet get scolding.
Ask me buy this, do that. I keep say Okay. Okay. In the end keep get scold.
There is 1 time I get so mad I really BM back. Then ask me go "Insert Location". Meet Real Life and talk. Or "Insert number". Talk on phone.
The Teamplay-Community is often very bad, I've seen it in HoN, DotA and LoL: All those group-effect's come into play like ppl always thinking they have to worst team ever and flaming all others when the team is loosing, but it's also much easier to have an idiot in the game, just because there are more players in a game than in 1v1-games like SC2...
On March 29 2010 01:27 XiaoJoyce- wrote: I've only played Dota. I like the game but didn't really like the community. Random keep scold me for no reason.
Because I am a girl, that why sometimes my style is much more simpler and I have my own way of thinking. I just want to play for fun. Then when losing or mistakes happen, they scold me. And then they laugh because I didn't play the normal way.
Sometimes I feel I play much better than them.
It is so angry sometimes, there are people who didn't play really well but still able to scold me so much. They cannot find their own mistake but keep finding my mistake, sometimes I didnt make any mistake yet get scolding.
Ask me buy this, do that. I keep say Okay. Okay. In the end keep get scold.
There is 1 time I get so mad I really BM back. Then ask me go "Insert Location". Meet Real Life and talk. Or "Insert number". Talk on phone.
Ya that all true dota has a horrible community. And most of the time they blame other people over themselves. But the excuse that your a girl means u think simpiler and play diffrently at games is a lame excuse. Man and women can probably play video games equally well, innate muscular differences doesent mean anything in a video game. Get confident in yourself and youll always be fine even if u lose.
As a new poster(not from any game, just loved TLO performance and had to say something), I would say to the OP not to worry about it at all. Let the moderators do their job. They seem pretty good at it.
On March 29 2010 01:43 frequency wrote: I played Warcraft III since 2004 and DotA since 2006.
I don't think I'm bad mannered?
He isn't saying everybody from the communities are BM but in general Teamliquid has had a very low number of trolls and idiots on here the ban thread would average maybe 1 ban a day whereas now every time I look somebody new is banned.
Of course we had people who padded our ban thread's stats and whatnot (Looking at you TDot) but I don't think there were ever so many people banned each day for such an extended period of time.
I think people need to just stop thinking in terms of "This player is from WC" "This guy is SC" "This dude is C&C". We're all coming together to be Starcraft 2. If we stop separating ourselves, we'll be able to make a better community. I feel like some cheesy lifetime movie now.
On March 29 2010 01:43 frequency wrote: I played Warcraft III since 2004 and DotA since 2006.
I don't think I'm bad mannered?
I've heard that before.
That time I was talking about the same thing with an aquaitance I've met at the free access lab. He asked me did I play any games. I said used to play dota. Then he ask why did you quit.
I told him the same thing. And he replied roughly the same way you did.
A good start would be not making threads like this...... The SC1 scene is/was nowhere near as perfect as you remember it, especially if you consider what public custom games looked.
And if it is any better, then that's likely because the game is 12 years old and you tend to grow up a bit in that time.
Well tbh SC1 scene wasn't perfect as well, not with all those "elitists" and "wannabe elitists". Will be cool to see how this fusion of different gamers will go for SC2.
The difference in a 1v1 game community and a team game community has been mentioned and it's one of the biggest reasons behind bad mannerism in game and in discussions of it.
One other point which I find quite significant for Teamliquid and starcraft overall is the age of the game and the age of the gamers. Afaik the average age here on TL is around 19-22 and it seems to stay around there. Not too many 14 year old players start playing a game they and their "gaming culture" find old and perhaps ugly. With the exception of players like Kolll and Mana, who ended up playing starcraft through the temptation of learning the most complex Rts ever.
There's a genuine challenge in choosing the most difficult of strategical games and not the easier ones. I think we can find a common motivation among the Starcraft players here. The quest for the deepest and most difficult challenge. Anything else might feel like cheating yourself and choosing the easy way out and not the most rewarding one.
I hope this didn't get to messy and perhaps some of u can relate to this. I don't want to say that wc3 or any other rts is a bad game. It's all relative and up to the player do decide. But one thing that is quite clear is, that to become the best starcraft player in the world would take u a lot more time than any other rts game.
p.s Welcome to TL, let your lurking experience begin!
EPT
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