This one is looking awesome... also, does anyone else think it's funny that you have JangBi vs. Fantasy (silver medal) and Stork vs. Bisu (gold medal)?
With all the talk about the Taek-Bang era lately you would almost think T1 and Khan made an agreement to put Bisu and Stork on the same map for more hype/viewers
Really looking forward to that match! However the PvPs on Requiem so far this season have been very short onesided games ending with 2 gate zealots 3 gate goon, DTs and such, and that would suck. If the game is longer, no doubt it has potential to be fun given the play the map encourages lategame.
On December 20 2008 04:02 OneOther wrote: Jangbi Great Stork
OR
Jangbi Hyuk Stork BeSt Stork > Bisu
no chance for the coaches to send bisu or stork on Colosseum II... hi there btw
what so you say they would send odin and thezerg in there, right? both teams' by far the best players are toss, none has good enough "non-p vs p" players, map's not bad for toss. it's 90% likely we'll see a PvP and you're saying there won't be neither bisu nor stork? yeah, right
JangBi > fantasy on Sin Chupung-Ryeong Hades > Hyuk on Medusa Stork < Bisu on Neo Requiem firebathero < BeSt on Destination Stork < Bisu on Colosseum II
Jangbi's PvT is better than fantasy's TvP Hades..is..ok...Hyuk..is..terrible? Stork is good..Bisu is better (Bisu for bonjwa) FBH's TvP is not bad..but it doesnt stand up to S-class Toss players..
and for the ace match the 2 best each team can offer
STORK VS BISU
i honestly dont know who will win both of those players are on the top of their games
On December 20 2008 04:02 OneOther wrote: Jangbi Great Stork
OR
Jangbi Hyuk Stork BeSt Stork > Bisu
no chance for the coaches to send bisu or stork on Colosseum II... hi there btw
what so you say they would send odin and thezerg in there, right? both teams' by far the best players are toss, none has good enough "non-p vs p" players, map's not bad for toss. it's 90% likely we'll see a PvP and you're saying there won't be neither bisu nor stork? yeah, right
how many games had Bisu on this map for the PL? how about Stork? So you really think that after fantasy and best playing the entire season on this map, all of a sudden SKT coaches will send Bisu? You can say the same about stork. Most of the players are specialists on a given map, Bisu takes always NR and Medusa for example. there is nothing random , if you follow up the scene closely you can guess the line-up with great success only by looking at the map poll
is there a liquibet for this? SOmehow i missed this and the OZ and OGN, and i cant find them
btw that Bisu vs Stork gonna be intresting. They didnt play on Neo R against each other yet. It's gonna be awesome. i feel if the game gonna be decided with early zealots Stork gonna take it, if not than Bisu. But nobody can predict this, they are so good
Yea i thought Oz v KTF was gunna be good and look how shitty that one turned out This zvz match between Hades and Hyuk is very important, whoever wins this game i think will win the whole match. I cant wait to watch this O_O
There are so few players capable of taking games off Jangbi PvT. Fantasy is definately one of them. Still, YoungMoo is strong. The YoungMoo -_-;; is mighty.
Great vs Hyuk is so close, and ZvZ is hard to predict. I believe in my team's Zerg though. Hyuk will win one. He is the main zerg of the team now so...
Requiem - O my, another tough one. My opinion is if SKTT1 is up 2-0, they will clutch and win. Stork will crumble and Bisu too clutch. And I believe Bisu's multi and micro may serve him better than Stork on requiem.
Best is undefeatable. So.. 3-1 SKTT1. Samsung is cake.
Every single matchup is amazing, except game 2. Haha =P Basically anything can happen because the players playing are both so good lol.
my predictions: jangbi > fantasy despite his msl loss jangbi is still strong and his pvt is his best matchup i believe. fantasy on the other hand, could take this but i really feel like his tvp isn't enough to take down jangbi. but you never know, he did give stork a run for his money.
hades > hyuk i think hades is by.great and iirc he has beeen bringing some good results. hyuk, on the other hand...lol. hades should win with ease.
stork < bisu bisu is ON fire right now. but stork is still great in pvp and anything can happen here, again.
firebathero < best best is another protoss who is just so great at the pvt matchup. firebathero also revamped his tvp play but will it be enough to take down best? he has a good chance, but it's def. not guaranteed
edit: i find it interesting that im looking at the proleague schedules and thezerg wont b played this wek nor their next match.... if u bought him y not use him? im sure coaches know betetr than i do thou
WTF? Why so many people predicting Hyuk will win? Seriously Hyuk beating by.Great would qualify IMO as a bigger upset than FBH over Best.
Anyway, I think either 3-0 Khan or 3-2 T1. Stork's PvP looks very shaky lately, which does not bode well for Khan no matter which of Bisu/Best to send in Ace. I personally expect both PvTs to be rape in favor of the toss.
On December 20 2008 08:59 Railz wrote: Why did they put FBH down so far. SKT would not risk a zerg 4th and Fantasy has been one of their 3 openers for awhile now.
SKT has sent out a zerg 4th before, but you're right, I was surprised they sent fbh so late.
I find just it amusing that stork and bisu ARE playing each other; it can't be coincidence...
On December 20 2008 09:22 iLoveKTF wrote: wow the lineups make me think that this match is pre-planned. :D anyway, i think whoever wins the zvz will win the match.
lol the coaches were like, "no one cares about our zergs anyway, want to just make them play each other?"
that being said, the favorites in the other matches are jangbi, bisu (though barely), and best, so if hades wins there's a good chance of an ace match.
On December 20 2008 09:22 iLoveKTF wrote: wow the lineups make me think that this match is pre-planned. :D anyway, i think whoever wins the zvz will win the match.
lol the coaches were like, "no one cares about our zergs anyway, want to just make them play each other?"
that being said, the favorites in the other matches are jangbi, bisu (though barely), and best, so if hades wins there's a good chance of an ace match.
I doubt it will end 3:0 for SKT. Samsung has a good chance to take any of the first three games. I would risk even saying that they will in a lead after 3 games (2:1) and then Best should bring it to 2:2. For Ace Jangbi and Best.
fantasy>jangbi - i think everyone underestimates fantasy. i'm giving him the edge here in a toss-up. hyuk<hades - lol hyuk. i mean, he has a shot to win at least, not 0% like most people are predicting bisu<stork - to be honest i think bisu may have an edge on stork in pvp, especially right now, but i'm picking stork here because i bet the coaches had predicted a bisu appearance, and prepared something special specifically against bisu. again a toss-up. best>fbh - best is as much of a favorite as hades. ace: stork<best - best gets revenge in a straight-up, macro pvp.
On December 20 2008 10:32 Sandster wrote: i will be SO MAD if skt sends out fantasy for ace again. i still can't believe they killed their win streak last time by sending him out.
I will as well, OMFG. We lost to WeMade! -_-. BeSt would've DESTORYED Mind... god.
SKT T1 is ease house. Time to start up another winning streak
On December 20 2008 13:42 gk_ender wrote: when I click the link it says i need a plugin but when i install it says no plugins available help? thank you
You need to enable ActiveX plug-in in IE for this link to work.
On December 20 2008 13:42 gk_ender wrote: when I click the link it says i need a plugin but when i install it says no plugins available help? thank you
You need to enable ActiveX plug-in in IE for this link to work.
Can i do it in firefox?
Edit: Nvm I just opened my chrome browser. Huge TY though
i think we will have either a 3-0 in khans favor (bisu vs storks a tossup) and although fbhs tvp isnt that great, i think best has a tendency to choke.
fantasy getting sci facility for vessels hes prolly gonna move out with vessels 8 vults moving around being a pain JB with slick goon mine micro JB taking 10
fantasy going for drop again but goons are alrdy there JB with a pure goon/lot army with arbs NICE STASIS gets 3 tanks vessel 2 MANY TANKS FOR FANTASY THOU!!!
4 vult drop in main doesnt do much but take out a lot EMP gets 2? arbs vults arent very effective JB has 2 cannons at liek every base JB on 4 bases fantasy on 3
On December 20 2008 14:32 EvilTeletubby wrote: Finally linked up to a nice daum stream, this is perfect... thanks again mazar! I'll have to figure out how you got that link later.
Right click in the wmp window in firefox, properties, went to location and copy pasted that into vlc and it worked
both players just moving armies around JB has 2 do something if its split map its fantasy's advantage JB going for a recall it seems geez every spot is spotted by fantasy's greta positioning
woah liek 6 arbs going for recall RECALL ON TOP OF FACTS BUT 4 UNITS DIE 2 MINES armory gets taken out WHILE RECALL HAPPENS JB MOVE OUT 2 BREAK CONTAIN
Jangbi keeps throwing arbiters away like they don't take a ton of resources and time to build. Also, stop using stasis on the tanks in the front please.
On December 20 2008 14:31 RaGe wrote: ventrilo://208.100.40.20:3805/servername=sc2gg.com => channel Starcraft 101 Room 2 for live audio!
Why can´t I get this to work? I get autodisconnected from the server when I try to connect with my ventrilo, should I connect in some über-gosu way without ventrilo to be able to connect ?
at least 20 unist got stasisd and fantasy non stasisd units still outnumberd JB standing army finally JB gg's very patient playing by fantasy playing split map is good for the T
Incredible! Jangbi sent in 1 arbiter and 3 hallucinations of arbiters into the north edge of Fantasy's main. Fantasy had *2* Science Vessels waiting there. He EMP'd away 2 of the hallucinations (which I didn't know was possible) and then EMP'd the real arbiter and hallucation away, so Jangbi couldn't recall this huge force.
On December 20 2008 14:44 EvilTeletubby wrote: Holy shit Fantasy is fucking amazing
at camping?
anyways i think skt has a stronger chance to win this now. esp best > fbh i think it's in best's favor. and bisu is amazing right now, but you never know because stork is just as good.
On December 20 2008 14:32 EvilTeletubby wrote: Finally linked up to a nice daum stream, this is perfect... thanks again mazar! I'll have to figure out how you got that link later.
Right click in the wmp window in firefox, properties, went to location and copy pasted that into vlc and it worked
I don't think Fantasy was camping. He did what Terran have to do nowadays against Protoss lategame, squatting on the expansions on the middle of the map and starving Jangbi out.
On December 20 2008 14:46 OneOther wrote: All I know is I am never going to play a PvT ever again on that POS
Carriers perhaps? I know it wasn't an option anymore after his templar opening, but Jangbi's ground army looked like they were running around headless for the entire game.
On December 20 2008 14:44 EvilTeletubby wrote: Holy shit Fantasy is fucking amazing
at camping?
anyways i think skt has a stronger chance to win this now. esp best > fbh i think it's in best's favor. and bisu is amazing right now, but you never know because stork is just as good.
i think T's are smart enough 2 check teh proxy spot since when the map 1st came otu it was quite common 2 proxy 1 gate... the new version im not sure if u can proxy gate in teh same spot but i doubt itll work the same way.... i think its just the expo back thing thats changed
On December 20 2008 14:48 gk_ender wrote: if janbi woulda stasised the ramp during that first recall woulda been gg, its easy to notice when they go back over the game
On December 20 2008 14:44 EvilTeletubby wrote: Holy shit Fantasy is fucking amazing
at camping?
anyways i think skt has a stronger chance to win this now. esp best > fbh i think it's in best's favor. and bisu is amazing right now, but you never know because stork is just as good.
Who cares if he camped... He won the game.
of course, a win is a win and you can't change that fact, it's just that those games are really really boring.
On December 20 2008 14:44 EvilTeletubby wrote: Holy shit Fantasy is fucking amazing
at camping?
anyways i think skt has a stronger chance to win this now. esp best > fbh i think it's in best's favor. and bisu is amazing right now, but you never know because stork is just as good.
Who cares if he camped... He won the game.
of course, a win is a win and you can't change that fact, it's just that those games are really really boring.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
On December 20 2008 14:48 gk_ender wrote: if janbi woulda stasised the ramp during that first recall woulda been gg, its easy to notice when they go back over the game
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do a lot of damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do a lot of damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
blue storm
lol fuck blue storm too. bad memories on that map.
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
On December 20 2008 14:47 dongfeng wrote: it was a good game but fantasy was too passive maybe he was afraid of jangbi's most psi storm ever version 2
pimpest play 2008: jangbi's recall fail
he did what he had to do vs fast arbitertech on this map.. :/
i should have added "to watch" after too passive it was effective play yes perfect defence i still liked the game with the mines and the temp sniping and the hallucinations tho
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
yes fantasy played well and i said i give him credit for that. but a pvt without protoss doing damage early/early-mid game is imbalanced. that's all i am saying.
On December 20 2008 14:53 sung_moon wrote: how do people enjoy dynasty warriors blows my mind...
It is a fun game if you have been playing it from the original and following the story. I swear I've beat Dynasty Warriors 3 at least 100 times per character.
Jangbi has made some bad decisions. He strength is definitely not on build orders. No excuses. i think Samsung got overconfident due to their recent forms
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
"that map is so fucking imba" is a completely inaccurate way to describe PvT on there
there's on way it can be "so fucking imba" in favor of Terran when it's 19-13 PVT IN FAVOR OF PROTOSS
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
"that map is so fucking imba" is a completely inaccurate way to describe PvT on there
there's on way it can be "so fucking imba" for TvP when it's 19-13 PVT IN FAVOR OF PROTOSS
that's all i'm saying
stop using chupung tlpd stats. a lot of pvts were won with proxy gate zeals, surprise dt drops, reaver, and other builds oriented that way. a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced. yes, jangbi failed to do damage with dts. yes, fantasy played it well. but that cannot be denied.
and "that map is fucking imba" was probably an exaggeration but that game brings back horrible memories on that piece of shit map + blue storm. haha.
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
"that map is so fucking imba" is a completely inaccurate way to describe PvT on there
there's on way it can be "so fucking imba" for TvP when it's 19-13 PVT IN FAVOR OF PROTOSS
that's all i'm saying
stop using chupung tlpd stats. a lot of pvts were won with proxy gate zeals, surprise dt drops, reaver, and other builds oriented that way. a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced. yes, jangbi failed to do damage with dts. yes, fantasy played it well. but that cannot be denied.
saying "a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced" is like me saying "a ZvT going into late game when the Zerg has 4+ gas is imbalanced"
you cant put preconditions on matchups, so what if PvTs were won with those builds? that has to be factored into the equation on the balance of the map, you can't just ignore all games except ones where terrans sustain no early/midgame damage and say "well THOSE are imba"
that's like a Z doing a 2 hatch build, doing no damage, then me saying well if a Zerg can't do early game damage with his 2 hatch, it's IMBA TVZ. doesn't make sense, threat and execution of those proxy / dt drops / reaver builds are a large part of PvT you can't simply ignore them. by that definition every TvP on any map is imbalanced in favor of Terran then (imposing your "sustained no damage until late game" conditions).
regardless, even if the map has tough terrain late game, if you consider all the ways P can win and hurt the Terran it's not "so fucking imbalanced"
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
"that map is so fucking imba" is a completely inaccurate way to describe PvT on there
there's on way it can be "so fucking imba" for TvP when it's 19-13 PVT IN FAVOR OF PROTOSS
that's all i'm saying
stop using chupung tlpd stats. a lot of pvts were won with proxy gate zeals, surprise dt drops, reaver, and other builds oriented that way. a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced. yes, jangbi failed to do damage with dts. yes, fantasy played it well. but that cannot be denied.
and "that map is fucking imba" was probably an exaggeration but that game brings back horrible memories on that piece of shit map + blue storm. haha.
When you let your emotions get in the way of your arguments you can't expect no one to take a stand against what you say.
So just stop. In every thread I see with you go over the top and manage to piss everyone off, excluding those on your side.
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
"that map is so fucking imba" is a completely inaccurate way to describe PvT on there
there's on way it can be "so fucking imba" for TvP when it's 19-13 PVT IN FAVOR OF PROTOSS
that's all i'm saying
stop using chupung tlpd stats. a lot of pvts were won with proxy gate zeals, surprise dt drops, reaver, and other builds oriented that way. a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced. yes, jangbi failed to do damage with dts. yes, fantasy played it well. but that cannot be denied.
saying "a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced" is like me saying "a ZvT going into late game when the Zerg has 4+ gas is imbalanced"
you cant put preconditions on matchups, so what if PvTs were won with those builds? that has to be factored into the equation on the balance of the map, you can't just ignore all games except ones where terrans sustain no early/midgame damage and say "well THOSE are imba"
that's like a Z doing a 2 hatch build, doing no damage, then me saying well if a Zerg can't do early game damage with his 2 hatch, it's IMBA TVZ. doesn't make sense, threat and execution of those proxy / dt drops / reaver builds are a large part of PvT you can't simply ignore them. by that definition every TvP on any map is imbalanced in favor of Terran then (imposing your "sustained no damage until late game" conditions).
LOL a pvt going into standard mid-late/late game is NOTHING like saying zvt is imba with zerg getting 4+ gas. hahaha, on a balanced pvt map, pvt should be fair going into mid-late/late game without protoss doing any damage. seriously, your examples are awful man. if a zerg does 2 hatch build and does no damage, then it's the zerg player's fault. if the protoss and terran play standard going into the late game, and the game favors terran, then yeah, my point stands. why? because it would be fair on any other map. 2 hatch/zerg getting 4 gas has nothing to do with this because that solely depends on the players. a protoss player should not be forced to deal damage before mid-late game by the map.
On December 20 2008 15:09 sung_moon wrote: if great can hold off a lil longer i think he could win but im not good at ZvZ hyuk has a shitton mutas thou
hyuk has more mutas, and now his natural is up/running.
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
"that map is so fucking imba" is a completely inaccurate way to describe PvT on there
there's on way it can be "so fucking imba" for TvP when it's 19-13 PVT IN FAVOR OF PROTOSS
that's all i'm saying
stop using chupung tlpd stats. a lot of pvts were won with proxy gate zeals, surprise dt drops, reaver, and other builds oriented that way. a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced. yes, jangbi failed to do damage with dts. yes, fantasy played it well. but that cannot be denied.
saying "a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced" is like me saying "a ZvT going into late game when the Zerg has 4+ gas is imbalanced"
you cant put preconditions on matchups, so what if PvTs were won with those builds? that has to be factored into the equation on the balance of the map, you can't just ignore all games except ones where terrans sustain no early/midgame damage and say "well THOSE are imba"
that's like a Z doing a 2 hatch build, doing no damage, then me saying well if a Zerg can't do early game damage with his 2 hatch, it's IMBA TVZ. doesn't make sense, threat and execution of those proxy / dt drops / reaver builds are a large part of PvT you can't simply ignore them. by that definition every TvP on any map is imbalanced in favor of Terran then (imposing your "sustained no damage until late game" conditions).
LOL a pvt going into standard mid-late/late game is NOTHING like saying zvt is imba with zerg getting 4+ gas. hahaha, on a balanced pvt map, pvt should be fair going into mid-late/late game without protoss doing any damage. seriously, your examples are awful man. if a zerg does 2 hatch build and does no damage, then it's the zerg player's fault. if the protoss and terran play standard going into the late game, and the game favors terran, then yeah, my point stands. why? because it would be fair on any other map. 2 hatch/zerg getting 4 gas has nothing to do with this because that solely depends on the players.
if a P goes fast DT or DT drop and doesn't do damage and is behind going into late game don't blame it on a map "being so fucking imba"
it boggles my mind that you'd stretch so far to make excuses for Jangbi getting owned
On December 20 2008 14:45 OneOther wrote: That map is so fucking imba =/ But gotta give Fantasy for playing it perfectly
Psh don't make excuses, Sin Chupung only has 3 games and it's 3-0 TvP, but Chupung is P>T (19-10) accourding to TLPD.
Dunno what the changes are from regular Chupung to Sin, but i doubt it completely swung it imba in favor Terran.
Fantasy played extremely well, Jangbi played average. That's what happens.
On December 20 2008 14:46 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Sin Chupung-Ryeong TvZ: 4-0 (100%) PvT: 0-3 (0%) (0-4 after this game)
wonder when teams choose only Terran this map :D
yes, your ginormous sample size of 3 games. look at the original chupung please
chupung is awful pvt if you don't do some damage early game, or harassment. a lot of protoss players have done things like proxy to gain advantage, but i guess nothing went right for jangbi. if the game goes into midgame without toss doing any damage it gets really hard, as you saw. what other map can you do that shit as terran
look at the stats, its 19-13 P>T shit's not imba
jangbi lost because fantasy played better, don't make excuses because of the map
fuck i never said fantasy didn't play well. but the only reason why he was able to camp and abuse emp like that was because of the map. jesus
"that map is so fucking imba" is a completely inaccurate way to describe PvT on there
there's on way it can be "so fucking imba" for TvP when it's 19-13 PVT IN FAVOR OF PROTOSS
that's all i'm saying
stop using chupung tlpd stats. a lot of pvts were won with proxy gate zeals, surprise dt drops, reaver, and other builds oriented that way. a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced. yes, jangbi failed to do damage with dts. yes, fantasy played it well. but that cannot be denied.
saying "a pvt going into standard macro mid-late/late game is imbalanced" is like me saying "a ZvT going into late game when the Zerg has 4+ gas is imbalanced"
you cant put preconditions on matchups, so what if PvTs were won with those builds? that has to be factored into the equation on the balance of the map, you can't just ignore all games except ones where terrans sustain no early/midgame damage and say "well THOSE are imba"
that's like a Z doing a 2 hatch build, doing no damage, then me saying well if a Zerg can't do early game damage with his 2 hatch, it's IMBA TVZ. doesn't make sense, threat and execution of those proxy / dt drops / reaver builds are a large part of PvT you can't simply ignore them. by that definition every TvP on any map is imbalanced in favor of Terran then (imposing your "sustained no damage until late game" conditions).
LOL a pvt going into standard mid-late/late game is NOTHING like saying zvt is imba with zerg getting 4+ gas. hahaha, on a balanced pvt map, pvt should be fair going into mid-late/late game without protoss doing any damage. seriously, your examples are awful man. if a zerg does 2 hatch build and does no damage, then it's the zerg player's fault. if the protoss and terran play standard going into the late game, and the game favors terran, then yeah, my point stands. why? because it would be fair on any other map. 2 hatch/zerg getting 4 gas has nothing to do with this because that solely depends on the players.
if a P goes fast DT or DT drop and doesn't do damage and is behind going into late game don't blame it on a map "being so fucking imba"
it boggles my mind that you'd stretch so far to make excuses for Jangbi getting owned
yeah but the fact that the protoss player is often forced to go dts/proxy/whatever basically summarizes my point. let's drop this and move on though.
On December 20 2008 15:18 wombo combo wrote: i think hyuk should've killed the temple, built a high ground hatch, and sunken pushed into great's main from above
On December 20 2008 15:18 wombo combo wrote: i think hyuk should've killed the temple, built a high ground hatch, and sunken pushed into great's main from above
then why doesnt he just hatch outside the nat and sunken in? or just proxy sunken?
if it was against JD or better Z, he wouldn't have FE. This is so risky. His mutas were late, better Z would have micro and pick off those spore colonies.
hyuk has the worst muta micro of any progamer ive seen in while, july/jaedong/any competant zerg would of won that game handily from the position he was in the midgame
On December 20 2008 15:21 Kuja900 wrote: hyuk has the worst muta micro of any progamer ive seen in while, july/jaedong would of won that game handily from the position he was in the midgame
QFT. That was all I could think of while watching his terrible attempts at microing.
if it was against JD or better Z, he wouldn't have FE. This is so risky. His mutas were late, better Z would have micro and pick off those spore colonies.
i'm so confused about the fact that he made a lair, then took drones off gas (so no muta, and no advantage of 2gas from the expo), and then didn't mass lings to finish the game, instead making spores all over the place.
if it was against JD or better Z, he wouldn't have FE. This is so risky. His mutas were late, better Z would have micro and pick off those spore colonies.
i'm so confused about the fact that he made a lair, then took drones off gas (so no muta, and no advantage of 2gas from the expo), and then didn't mass lings to finish the game, instead making spores all over the place.
he needed teh mins 2 gets spores... had he tried to get mutas he wouldnt of had proper defences since hyuk had the unit advantage
if it was against JD or better Z, he wouldn't have FE. This is so risky. His mutas were late, better Z would have micro and pick off those spore colonies.
i'm so confused about the fact that he made a lair, then took drones off gas (so no muta, and no advantage of 2gas from the expo), and then didn't mass lings to finish the game, instead making spores all over the place.
he knew the sunks would be there and this allowed his muties to come much sooner.
if it was against JD or better Z, he wouldn't have FE. This is so risky. His mutas were late, better Z would have micro and pick off those spore colonies.
i'm so confused about the fact that he made a lair, then took drones off gas (so no muta, and no advantage of 2gas from the expo), and then didn't mass lings to finish the game, instead making spores all over the place.
He has less drones than mineral patches, so take off gas and mine minerals to make many spores. He was waiting for mid game where he can settle down and put down the 2nd gas.
if it was against JD or better Z, he wouldn't have FE. This is so risky. His mutas were late, better Z would have micro and pick off those spore colonies.
i'm so confused about the fact that he made a lair, then took drones off gas (so no muta, and no advantage of 2gas from the expo), and then didn't mass lings to finish the game, instead making spores all over the place.
He has less drones than mineral patches, so take off gas and mine minerals to make many spores. He was waiting for mid game where he can settle down and put down the 2nd gas.
i just found it weird since hades had only slightly later lair; i was honestly expecting a mass ling attack since hyuk only had 1 sunk. definitely not the norm in zvz, though i don't know much about the mu.
by the way, i can't believe that commercial turned out to be about funions or something.
On December 20 2008 15:51 EvilTeletubby wrote: C'mon FBH take the next game! I'm an SKT1 fan but I love FBH and wouldn't mind seeing an ace match here.
Bisu had a very good sense of what Stork was doing the whole time. Having a few goons at both bases to prevent drops was what decided to big part of the game. And let's not forget that imbalanced contain.....
On December 20 2008 15:51 EvilTeletubby wrote: C'mon FBH take the next game! I'm an SKT1 fan but I love FBH and wouldn't mind seeing an ace match here.
On December 20 2008 15:51 EvilTeletubby wrote: C'mon FBH take the next game! I'm an SKT1 fan but I love FBH and wouldn't mind seeing an ace match here.
On December 20 2008 15:51 EvilTeletubby wrote: C'mon FBH take the next game! I'm an SKT1 fan but I love FBH and wouldn't mind seeing an ace match here.
yeah I think it's hard not to love FBH
On this website???
it used to be a lot harder, but even back then some people still loved fbh
On December 20 2008 15:55 sung_moon wrote: i cant believe im putting my faith in FBH
FBH TvZ/T is godlike. It is only his TvP where he is somewhat lacking.
i dont mean it as skill-wise which TvT/Z FBH has lots of, i mean it as a savior fan.....
You claim to be a savior fan but you are rooting for KHAN? POSER. you are simply somebody who thinks savior is a decent guy. True fanboys only watch Khan games to have them stomped.
On December 20 2008 15:55 sung_moon wrote: i cant believe im putting my faith in FBH
FBH TvZ/T is godlike. It is only his TvP where he is somewhat lacking.
i dont mean it as skill-wise which TvT/Z FBH has lots of, i mean it as a savior fan.....
You claim to be a savior fan but you are rooting for KHAN? POSER. you are simply somebody who thinks savior is a decent guy. True fanboys only watch Khan games to have them stomped.
Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
On December 20 2008 16:01 abakben wrote: Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
Yes, but people are lazy and don't, and it's a shocking spoiler too. Maybe we're just lonely in the other thread and want to entice you over?
On December 20 2008 16:01 abakben wrote: Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
On December 20 2008 16:01 abakben wrote: Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
wtf they are in spoiler tags and yes i do want to know without switching to the other thread.
On December 20 2008 16:01 abakben wrote: Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
are u fucking kidding me there are spoiler tags?
yeah what the hell its a clearly marked spoiler hahaha
On December 20 2008 15:55 sung_moon wrote: i cant believe im putting my faith in FBH
FBH TvZ/T is godlike. It is only his TvP where he is somewhat lacking.
i dont mean it as skill-wise which TvT/Z FBH has lots of, i mean it as a savior fan.....
You claim to be a savior fan but you are rooting for KHAN? POSER. you are simply somebody who thinks savior is a decent guy. True fanboys only watch Khan games to have them stomped.
On December 20 2008 16:01 abakben wrote: Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
are u fucking kidding me there are spoiler tags?
yeah what the hell its a clearly marked spoiler hahaha
just don't click on it
yeah but it doesn't even have any body and when you click a spoiler it doesn't mean it's something that is about to happen which will spoil the entire flow of the match it could have been from game 1 or 2 or 3.
On December 20 2008 16:01 abakben wrote: Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
are u fucking kidding me there are spoiler tags?
yeah what the hell its a clearly marked spoiler hahaha
just don't click on it
I think point was that people are lazy to click another thread.
On December 20 2008 16:01 abakben wrote: Why are you guys spoiling the results for the other match up? There is already another thread. If I wanna know the results I can always check the other thread.
are u fucking kidding me there are spoiler tags?
yeah what the hell its a clearly marked spoiler hahaha
just don't click on it
yeah but it doesn't even have any body and when you click a spoiler it doesn't mean it's something that is about to happen which will spoil the entire flow of the match it could have been from game 1 or 2 or 3.
if you don't want to spoil anything, don't click the spoiler
your defense seems to be 'i'm too fucking stupid to comprehend the mechanic of a spoiler tag' and quite frankly that's not a very good defense
i think there would have been a timing with fbh's mnm vs bests 3 goons? fbh could have faked a defensive play with bunker then rushed, best countered the bunk with nexus thinking defensive play by fbh?
bisu/best/fantasy combo is so effective even if one of them drops a game, they can send any to ace, and have a good chance of cleaning up the match. if only they played like this at the beginning of the season....
That was a really bad rape. I don't know what FBH was thinking and why he didn't all in with scv/medic and kill Best's Nexus. If he wanted to go for a macro game then he should have at least took his nat before he made his factory.
On December 20 2008 16:25 Yaqoob wrote: That was a really bad rape. I don't know what FBH was thinking and why he didn't all in with scv/medic and kill Best's Nexus. If he wanted to go for a macro game then he should have at least took his nat before he made his factory.
i think FBh may of had a window if he kept pumping MnM and went all-in scv's while best was awrping his 3rd in... i dunno, but sounds better than switching to mech and trying to play like that...
If T1 zergs aren't autolosses it'd have a much better standing in proleague for sure. best/bisu/fantasy combo is really just good as stork/jangbi/fbh, if not better.
On December 20 2008 16:28 zhaoli86 wrote: If T1 zergs aren't autolosses it'd have a much better standing in proleague for sure. best/bisu/fantasy combo is really just good as stork/jangbi/fbh, if not better.
On December 20 2008 16:28 zhaoli86 wrote: If T1 zergs aren't autolosses it'd have a much better standing in proleague for sure. best/bisu/fantasy combo is really just good as stork/jangbi/fbh, if not better.
I'm pretty sure they proved they are far superior tonight.
On December 20 2008 16:28 zhaoli86 wrote: If T1 zergs aren't autolosses it'd have a much better standing in proleague for sure. best/bisu/fantasy combo is really just good as stork/jangbi/fbh, if not better.
Yes but they insist on sending Midas out instead of Fantasy every other match it seems like when he really needs to go back on B-team for some practice =/
With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
Wait, isn't this season twice as long though (44 games)?
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
SKT1 FIGHTING!!!!!!
They lost a game last week in an ace match. But ya, before that, they were I think on a 5 game winning streak.
OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
Wait, isn't this season twice as long though (44 games)?
Hm, actually I don't know, you might be right. Thought each team played every other one twice and that was it, but that may have changed. Gotta read the R&S thread someday. :p
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
They're playing Lecaf next, which means their play-off hopes just died. + Show Spoiler +
But thanks for knocking KHAN off of #1 PL ranking.
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
I'm a bit worried about that match, unless ForGG wins against hyuk we probably won't be seeing Jaedong at all. AND WHERE IS BACKHO???
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
I'm a bit worried about that match, unless ForGG wins against hyuk we probably won't be seeing Jaedong at all. AND WHERE IS BACKHO???
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
I'm a bit worried about that match, unless ForGG wins against hyuk we probably won't be seeing Jaedong at all. AND WHERE IS BACKHO???
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
I'm a bit worried about that match, unless ForGG wins against hyuk we probably won't be seeing Jaedong at all. AND WHERE IS BACKHO???
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
They're playing Lecaf next, which means their play-off hopes just died. + Show Spoiler +
But thanks for knocking KHAN off of #1 PL ranking.
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
I'm a bit worried about that match, unless ForGG wins against hyuk we probably won't be seeing Jaedong at all. AND WHERE IS BACKHO???
Unless...? :\
because 1st and 3rd one T1 should win. forgg is on 2nd match, and if he doesn't win Jaedong won't have a chance to show up.
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
They're playing Lecaf next, which means their play-off hopes just died. + Show Spoiler +
But thanks for knocking KHAN off of #1 PL ranking.
I think SKT1 still has a chance...
At best, Jaedong doesn't get to play. At worst, Bisu takes it in the ace match.
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
I'm a bit worried about that match, unless ForGG wins against hyuk we probably won't be seeing Jaedong at all. AND WHERE IS BACKHO???
Unless...? :\
because 1st and 3rd one T1 should win. forgg is on 2nd match, and if he doesn't win Jaedong won't have a chance to show up.
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
They're playing Lecaf next, which means their play-off hopes just died. + Show Spoiler +
But thanks for knocking KHAN off of #1 PL ranking.
I think SKT1 still has a chance...
At best, Jaedong doesn't get to play. At worst, Bisu takes it in the ace match.
if it goes to ace match, bisu won`t take it, coz it will be: JD > s2
On December 20 2008 16:32 alphafuzard wrote: With thezerg in the ranks to bolster their pitiful z lineup (as demonstrated once again by hyuk), skt should be the team to beat. I believe they are on a 7 win streak now? We could see an epic comeback by the end of the season. If they can get thezerg on par with best/bisu/fantasy, then they will be unstoppable.
They actually lost last week (s2 threw his game and Fantasy lost twice), ending their streak. But they can probably still reach the playoffs if they win every single remaining match (probably just one week left though I guess).
They're playing Lecaf next, which means their play-off hopes just died. + Show Spoiler +
But thanks for knocking KHAN off of #1 PL ranking.
I think SKT1 still has a chance...
At best, Jaedong doesn't get to play. At worst, Bisu takes it in the ace match.
if it goes to ace match, bisu won`t take it, coz it will be: JD > s2
That makes zero sense. Bisu is the zerg specialist of STK. If anyone had a shot at taking a game from JD in an ace it is Bisu.
On December 20 2008 17:57 RaiSad wrote: wow Jangbi, Stork and FBH all lost
Bisu > Stork.70 v 50% PvP respectively in their last 10, lol. Or something like that. TvP is FBHs worst matchup, and Best isn't really a bitch P, either.
On December 20 2008 16:08 doubleupgradeobbies! wrote: gah best failing a cheese is like the only way fbh could have won this without cheesing himself why best why?
Also your doing it wrong, bisu also had manner pylons! Stick to the correct build
i just thought this post was funny, it was the exact opposite of what i was thinking, because when best stole FBH's gas and forced a 2nd rax, the game was effectively over. i don't think best expected to kill FBH with the units from that forward gate.
i don't think a single proxy gate is really very all-in or cheese, if you build a building where someone can see it when they scout with their first scout, it's more just a very aggressive standard build. the single proxy gate is really popular on some maps.
On December 20 2008 16:08 doubleupgradeobbies! wrote: gah best failing a cheese is like the only way fbh could have won this without cheesing himself why best why?
Also your doing it wrong, bisu also had manner pylons! Stick to the correct build
i just thought this post was funny, it was the exact opposite of what i was thinking, because when best stole FBH's gas and forced a 2nd rax, the game was effectively over. i don't think best expected to kill FBH with the units from that forward gate.
i don't think a single proxy gate is really very all-in or cheese, if you build a building where someone can see it when they scout with their first scout, it's more just a very aggressive standard build. the single proxy gate is really popular on some maps.
Exactly. Forward 1-gate with gas steal is not an all-in cheese, it's an alternate, very agressive build *hides from the cloud of noobs screaming BOO, BOO, IT'S CHEESE LOL WAATTTTTT*
On another note, I pretty much expected this result (I thought Jangbi would win though, and SKT1 would win the ZvZ, but meh. Last 2 games, expected. Bisu was barely edged out [mostly thanks to his own mistakes, even] in Stork's brilliant [yes!] OSL run, but ever since he's shown fading play while Bisu's been stronger than ever. And obviously FBH is still a chump compared to BeSt , at least in that matchup).
actually stork played really rubbish today, I dont know what his strategy was, but even he had pulled out his expo, I dont see how he was going to win his ramp. Great mapcontrol by Bisu btw
On December 20 2008 16:08 doubleupgradeobbies! wrote: gah best failing a cheese is like the only way fbh could have won this without cheesing himself why best why?
Also your doing it wrong, bisu also had manner pylons! Stick to the correct build
i just thought this post was funny, it was the exact opposite of what i was thinking, because when best stole FBH's gas and forced a 2nd rax, the game was effectively over. i don't think best expected to kill FBH with the units from that forward gate.
i don't think a single proxy gate is really very all-in or cheese, if you build a building where someone can see it when they scout with their first scout, it's more just a very aggressive standard build. the single proxy gate is really popular on some maps.
1 proxy gate and dt drop and whatnot are what are called 'protoss cheeses' they have the killing power of an allin, but even if they fail they dont leave you in very bad shape.
On December 20 2008 16:08 doubleupgradeobbies! wrote: gah best failing a cheese is like the only way fbh could have won this without cheesing himself why best why?
Also your doing it wrong, bisu also had manner pylons! Stick to the correct build
i just thought this post was funny, it was the exact opposite of what i was thinking, because when best stole FBH's gas and forced a 2nd rax, the game was effectively over. i don't think best expected to kill FBH with the units from that forward gate.
i don't think a single proxy gate is really very all-in or cheese, if you build a building where someone can see it when they scout with their first scout, it's more just a very aggressive standard build. the single proxy gate is really popular on some maps.
1 proxy gate and dt drop and whatnot are what are called 'protoss cheeses' they have the killing power of an allin, but even if they fail they dont leave you in very bad shape.
On December 20 2008 16:41 disciple wrote: OZ next... damn fantasy, you killed the streak on a side note, BeSt is an absolute beast, there is no finesse,nothing cute and funny in his style, only brute, pure force...scary
I'm a bit worried about that match, unless ForGG wins against hyuk we probably won't be seeing Jaedong at all. AND WHERE IS BACKHO???
On December 21 2008 02:13 Emptyness wrote: All games were great .
It's so nice that the best from SKT1 beat down the best of Khan . It feels so good .
SKT1 ftw .
Even as an Anti-non-Boxer-SKT, I agree that all the games were great. Though, to me Bisu didn't so much win as Stork did lose, and I think Best is a massive pussy for not playing out a straight PvT against someone known for the abysmal match-up (or was he fucking around because FBH is that bad?), but after that.... yeah. --
Anyone else see Best lose 10 dragoons or so to FBH's setup of MnM/Tank defense?? That's what a straight game woulda looked like.
On December 21 2008 02:13 Emptyness wrote: All games were great .
It's so nice that the best from SKT1 beat down the best of Khan . It feels so good .
SKT1 ftw .
Even as an Anti-non-Boxer-SKT, I agree that all the games were great. Though, to me Bisu didn't so much win as Stork did lose, and I think Best is a massive pussy for not playing out a straight PvT against someone known for the abysmal match-up (or was he fucking around because FBH is that bad?), but after that.... yeah. --
Anyone else see Best lose 10 dragoons or so to FBH's setup of MnM/Tank defense?? That's what a straight game woulda looked like.
On December 21 2008 02:13 Emptyness wrote: All games were great .
It's so nice that the best from SKT1 beat down the best of Khan . It feels so good .
SKT1 ftw .
Even as an Anti-non-Boxer-SKT, I agree that all the games were great. Though, to me Bisu didn't so much win as Stork did lose, and I think Best is a massive pussy for not playing out a straight PvT against someone known for the abysmal match-up (or was he fucking around because FBH is that bad?), but after that.... yeah. --
Anyone else see Best lose 10 dragoons or so to FBH's setup of MnM/Tank defense?? That's what a straight game woulda looked like.
Anyone else see Best not microing that game.....
best doesn't know micro.
I always see him do something stupid (especially in PvZ losing lots of corsairs haha), but then he says fuck it and just macros his way to wins. pretty amusing really.
On December 20 2008 18:05 Proposal wrote: Jangbi was the only favorite to win his set out of the three
Yeah he should have won . His PvT is so good .What happent in the game ??
I dont want to spoil it, it was the best game in the set with some PP by both
Whaaaaaaat? I thought it was kinda boring.. It played out like how TvP on Luna used to back in like 2005~ when everyone was compensating for their inability to beat toss straight up by just taking half the map and turtling for 3-3.
Bisu vs Stork and Great vs Hyuk were both better imo ;o
Game wasn't bad, just was a bit.. slow - Fantasy never ventured past the middle (seriously, he never went above his half of the map with anything but vultures or dropships).
On December 20 2008 18:05 Proposal wrote: Jangbi was the only favorite to win his set out of the three
Yeah he should have won . His PvT is so good .What happent in the game ??
I dont want to spoil it, it was the best game in the set with some PP by both
Whaaaaaaat? I thought it was kinda boring.. It played out like how TvP on Luna used to back in like 2005~ when everyone was compensating for their inability to beat toss straight up by just taking half the map and turtling for 3-3.
Bisu vs Stork and Great vs Hyuk were both better imo ;o
Game wasn't bad, just was a bit.. slow - Fantasy never ventured past the middle (seriously, he never went above his half of the map with anything but vultures or dropships).
well theres not a whole lot of choice if you dont completely stop their dts (you already have a turret on the low ground when they get there) with that build. having to turret push out to your natural while they expand off 2 goons and a dt really narrows the timing window and any kind of 2 base push is gonna be essentially allin since you're down in both econ and tech. he played gay and turtly but jangbi forced him into it by playing even gayer.
On December 20 2008 18:05 Proposal wrote: Jangbi was the only favorite to win his set out of the three
Yeah he should have won . His PvT is so good .What happent in the game ??
I dont want to spoil it, it was the best game in the set with some PP by both
Whaaaaaaat? I thought it was kinda boring.. It played out like how TvP on Luna used to back in like 2005~ when everyone was compensating for their inability to beat toss straight up by just taking half the map and turtling for 3-3.
Bisu vs Stork and Great vs Hyuk were both better imo ;o
Game wasn't bad, just was a bit.. slow - Fantasy never ventured past the middle (seriously, he never went above his half of the map with anything but vultures or dropships).
I dont think Flash leaved his half of the map against JangBi or Bisu on Blue Storm but the games were great nevertheless
On December 20 2008 18:05 Proposal wrote: Jangbi was the only favorite to win his set out of the three
Yeah he should have won . His PvT is so good .What happent in the game ??
I dont want to spoil it, it was the best game in the set with some PP by both
Whaaaaaaat? I thought it was kinda boring.. It played out like how TvP on Luna used to back in like 2005~ when everyone was compensating for their inability to beat toss straight up by just taking half the map and turtling for 3-3.
Bisu vs Stork and Great vs Hyuk were both better imo ;o
Game wasn't bad, just was a bit.. slow - Fantasy never ventured past the middle (seriously, he never went above his half of the map with anything but vultures or dropships).
well theres not a whole lot of choice if you dont completely stop their dts (you already have a turret on the low ground when they get there) with that build. having to turret push out to your natural while they expand off 2 goons and a dt really narrows the timing window and any kind of 2 base push is gonna be essentially allin since you're down in both econ and tech. he played gay and turtly but jangbi forced him into it by playing even gayer.
Yeah, nothing wrong with the way Fantasy played at all - the game was just pretty gay. Fully supportive of doing what you need to win tho!
man, so happy skt won this! they risked everything with this lineup. they risked having fbh thrust his crotch at them again, their msl champion being defeated by samsung's osl chamption, and fantasy fucking up YET ANOTHER FUCKING MATCH FOR HIS TEAM.
Some people will bash BeSt's proxy gate considering FBH's already less than stellar TvP, but IMO it was basically BeSt doing a game-long ceremony. He knew he had the game pretty much in the bag once he forced FBH to go 2rax, and he proceeded to roll him over with pure macro. Seriously, did he micro at all in that game?
IMO attack moving an endless stream of units into your opponents base with little to no regard of micro is just as much of a mindfuck as scouts would be.
Finishing the game with less than 100 minerals off of like 7 bases isn't too shabby either. Cheater Protoss?
On December 21 2008 07:11 erin[go]bragh wrote: Some people will bash BeSt's proxy gate considering FBH's already less than stellar TvP, but IMO it was basically BeSt doing a game-long ceremony. He knew he had the game pretty much in the bag once he forced FBH to go 2rax, and he proceeded to roll him over with pure macro. Seriously, did he micro at all in that game?
IMO attack moving an endless stream of units into your opponents base with little to no regard of micro is just as much of a mindfuck as scouts would be.
Finishing the game with less than 100 minerals off of like 7 bases isn't too shabby either. Cheater Protoss?
But like, Oov's thing wasn't keeping his minerals under 100. His thing was having a crapton of minerals because he always found the best times to get as many and as early expansions as possible.
FBH already had nerves to deal with considering he was up against BeSt at 2-1 in favor of SKT1. The early aggression imo was the right thing to do in order to prevent FBH from getting a good pace and overcoming his doubts.
The game with Bisu saw him play defensively (instead of creatively) when he gets attacked early on by a competent protoss so this was part of the overall SKT strategy to get the win. No need to micro at all by midgame cause FBH pretty much broke down after the first 5minutes...
On December 21 2008 07:11 erin[go]bragh wrote: Some people will bash BeSt's proxy gate considering FBH's already less than stellar TvP, but IMO it was basically BeSt doing a game-long ceremony. He knew he had the game pretty much in the bag once he forced FBH to go 2rax, and he proceeded to roll him over with pure macro. Seriously, did he micro at all in that game?
IMO attack moving an endless stream of units into your opponents base with little to no regard of micro is just as much of a mindfuck as scouts would be.
Finishing the game with less than 100 minerals off of like 7 bases isn't too shabby either. Cheater Protoss?
But like, Oov's thing wasn't keeping his minerals under 100. His thing was having a crapton of minerals because he always found the best times to get as many and as early expansions as possible.
Yeah, thats how oov had huge armies, but oov was called cheater terran cause of the huge armies. The process in reaching/maintaining a ridiculous army size, to the point to where it looks like you might be cheating [ala oov] is not relevant.
On December 23 2008 06:09 monstar123 wrote: Yeah, Mind killed Bisu in his prime. Jaedong killed when he was in a slump. And today Bisu will rape JD in ACE match!
I'm sorry, I fail to see how getting third in the OSL and runner up in the MSL makes him go into a slump.
He loses to mind. The next month he loses to Stork 0-3 , the player whom he beat 3-2 in the previous MSL finals and barely beats Upmagic! (horrible tvp) 3-2 in the qualifers. How does that not constitute as a mental wreck? Yes he may have lost to Jaedong in Gom MSL 4 in that classic game, but he also lost to YELLOW ARNC, whose career 47% ZvP makes even his also horrible brother Luxury seem like a strong ZvPer.
Then loses to an off form Iris 0-2 in GSI. His play in Bacchus wasn't *bad* per say (game vs Flash on Katrina was pretty nice) but it was hardly great either.
I think his performance in this period is underrated, but there is absolutely no question that Bonjwa Bisu died the moment he lost to Mind. You don't just get raped 0-3 to a player whom you beat six months earlier. Bisu in his prime would never be eliminated by Yellow[arnc]; that evidence along is enough to discount any rubbish of Jaedong beating him in his prime.
stork was definitely better in that series, probably because of the effect of the mind series, but builds and bad luck had a lot to do with the score being 3-0
He loses to mind. The next month he loses to Stork 0-3 , the player whom he beat 3-2 in the previous MSL finals and barely beats Upmagic! (horrible tvp) 3-2 in the qualifers. How does that not constitute as a mental wreck? Yes he may have lost to Jaedong in Gom MSL 4 in that classic game, but he also lost to YELLOW ARNC, whose career 47% ZvP makes even his also horrible brother Luxury seem like a strong ZvPer.
Then loses to an off form Iris 0-2 in GSI. His play in Bacchus wasn't *bad* per say (game vs Flash on Katrina was pretty nice) but it was hardly great either.
I think his performance in this period is underrated, but there is absolutely no question that Bonjwa Bisu died the moment he lost to Mind. You don't just get raped 0-3 to a player whom you beat six months earlier. Bisu in his prime would never be eliminated by Yellow[arnc]; that evidence along is enough to discount any rubbish of Jaedong beating him in his prime.
Because Stork is the known king of PvP back then and he choked in the finals? (goon range).
Well, look at his games, especially the one vs Jaedong, I would not call his performance there a slump. Bisu really wasn't a bonjwa back then. Though I may be wrong on this. He's definitely stronger now, by far.
Quote me where I said Jaedong beat Bisu in his prime, 'cause I never did.