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[QUOTE]On February 01 2008 20:23 Live2Win wrote:
[QUOTE]On February 01 2008 20:07 diehilde wrote:
[QUOTE]On February 01 2008 20:04 Live2Win wrote:
[QUOTE]On February 01 2008 20:00 GeLaar wrote:
also, i'm smiling as i read that xellos cheesed. that's just wonderful. bisu got screwed by cheese two days ago, and it was cheese that saved him. nice![/QUOTE]
irony at it's best[/QUOTE]
omg the beesuit fanboys! it didnt "save" him. it just prolonged his stay in bacchus osl. even if he makes it out of the tiebreaker, it will just be for his fanboys to see him get slaughtered in the ro8. At least us savior fanboys accepted the fact that savior is dead atm, funny that most bisu fanboys havent quite gotten that bisu is dead too. with his current form, he wont go anywhere near finals.[/QUOTE]
One good cheese deserves another.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On February 01 2008 20:32 mdb wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2008 20:28 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 20:26 Live2Win wrote:On February 01 2008 20:25 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 20:00 Live2Win wrote:On February 01 2008 19:58 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 19:56 Hittegods wrote:On February 01 2008 19:54 Barbarne wrote:On February 01 2008 19:51 kramus wrote:
july taking the pro out of "progamer" When was it required to have a sixth sense for when your opponent is cheesing to be called pro? It's not like there was any skill in that game whatsoever. Yeah, obviously no skill whatsoever. You proxy some rax, a-move and wait for your win. Gtfo. uh against a 12hatch 11pool thats exactly what it is if the zerg misses it Did you go blind during that drone vs marine/scv battle right before the lings came? That was the decisive battle right there. If July got his drones to surround the marines like he use to do a long time ago that game would have been over. Definately an intense micro skirmish, much more than a simple a-move. what? who the hell do you think you're talking to? its just drones, any idiot can run from drones long enough to let an unmolested bunker complete but it wasn't a-move. IMO july was an idiot to not cancel his hatch as soon as he saw the first marine arrive. it might as well have been, the point isnt the specific commands issued its how completely over the game was when july's drone missed the barracks and he's not an idiot not to cancel the hatchery. what are you talking about? an extra hatchery means more larva and the ability to make sunken colonies. cancelling the hatchery doesn't do anything, there's no way you can get sunkens up in time in your main if there's no longer a fat target at your nat He would have ~300 extra minerals. And with proper drone micro he could have delayed the marines till sunks are up.
that wouldn't really change the final outcome. two proxied barracks get marines to a zerg base really, really fast.
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So who has impressed the most of the group 3-0 winners?
I think Stork is looking as strong as ever, winning against all three races.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On February 01 2008 20:35 Adamthegreat wrote:
So who has impressed the most of the group 3-0 winners?
I think Stork is looking as strong as ever, winning against all three races.
in my opinion the most impressive 3-0 was by luxury, really kind of surprising. stork had two losers and his kicktoy flash in his group, much had two losers and yarnc
luxury had two legends who are playing like losers and bisu, but luxury is more of a loser than stork and much in OSL
i said 'loser' five times in this post
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I don't know if canceling the hatch would have been better but he would have had to make a sunken and lings that would be useless once the geysers go down, playing 1 base island. And that's assuming he manages to hold the 2 rax constant rine pump.
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Live2Win
United States6657 Posts
On February 01 2008 20:32 mdb wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2008 20:28 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 20:26 Live2Win wrote:On February 01 2008 20:25 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 20:00 Live2Win wrote:On February 01 2008 19:58 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 19:56 Hittegods wrote:On February 01 2008 19:54 Barbarne wrote:On February 01 2008 19:51 kramus wrote:
july taking the pro out of "progamer" When was it required to have a sixth sense for when your opponent is cheesing to be called pro? It's not like there was any skill in that game whatsoever. Yeah, obviously no skill whatsoever. You proxy some rax, a-move and wait for your win. Gtfo. uh against a 12hatch 11pool thats exactly what it is if the zerg misses it Did you go blind during that drone vs marine/scv battle right before the lings came? That was the decisive battle right there. If July got his drones to surround the marines like he use to do a long time ago that game would have been over. Definately an intense micro skirmish, much more than a simple a-move. what? who the hell do you think you're talking to? its just drones, any idiot can run from drones long enough to let an unmolested bunker complete but it wasn't a-move. IMO july was an idiot to not cancel his hatch as soon as he saw the first marine arrive. it might as well have been, the point isnt the specific commands issued its how completely over the game was when july's drone missed the barracks and he's not an idiot not to cancel the hatchery. what are you talking about? an extra hatchery means more larva and the ability to make sunken colonies. cancelling the hatchery doesn't do anything, there's no way you can get sunkens up in time in your main if there's no longer a fat target at your nat He would have ~300 extra minerals. And with proper drone micro he could have delayed the marines till sunks are up.
Agreed. If July started building a creep right as soon as he saw the marines, waited to cancel his hatch until the last minute to buy time for the creep to finish, then morphed the sunken and lings with the extra ~275 minerals he would get as he cancels his hatch, he would have had the time to block the rush (he could use drones to buy more time too).
Of course the problem still remains that Xellos would just back off and kill the assimilators and trap July in, which is probably why he chose to use that strat on this map specifically.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On February 01 2008 20:39 Live2Win wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2008 20:32 mdb wrote:On February 01 2008 20:28 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 20:26 Live2Win wrote:On February 01 2008 20:25 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 20:00 Live2Win wrote:On February 01 2008 19:58 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On February 01 2008 19:56 Hittegods wrote:On February 01 2008 19:54 Barbarne wrote:On February 01 2008 19:51 kramus wrote:
july taking the pro out of "progamer" When was it required to have a sixth sense for when your opponent is cheesing to be called pro? It's not like there was any skill in that game whatsoever. Yeah, obviously no skill whatsoever. You proxy some rax, a-move and wait for your win. Gtfo. uh against a 12hatch 11pool thats exactly what it is if the zerg misses it Did you go blind during that drone vs marine/scv battle right before the lings came? That was the decisive battle right there. If July got his drones to surround the marines like he use to do a long time ago that game would have been over. Definately an intense micro skirmish, much more than a simple a-move. what? who the hell do you think you're talking to? its just drones, any idiot can run from drones long enough to let an unmolested bunker complete but it wasn't a-move. IMO july was an idiot to not cancel his hatch as soon as he saw the first marine arrive. it might as well have been, the point isnt the specific commands issued its how completely over the game was when july's drone missed the barracks and he's not an idiot not to cancel the hatchery. what are you talking about? an extra hatchery means more larva and the ability to make sunken colonies. cancelling the hatchery doesn't do anything, there's no way you can get sunkens up in time in your main if there's no longer a fat target at your nat He would have ~300 extra minerals. And with proper drone micro he could have delayed the marines till sunks are up. Agreed. If July started building a creep right as soon as he saw the marines, waited to cancel his hatch until the last minute to buy time for the creep to finish, then morphed the sunken and lings with the extra ~275 minerals he would get as he cancels his hatch, he would have had the time to block the rush (he could use drones to buy more time too). Of course the problem still remains that Xellos would just back off and kill the assimilators and trap July in, which is probably why he chose to use that strat on this map specifically.
xellos stalled his marines, he didnt rally directly to july's nat
there was less time to cancel and make a creep colony in his main than you think there was
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Hungary11305 Posts
On February 01 2008 20:35 Adamthegreat wrote:
So who has impressed the most of the group 3-0 winners?
I think Stork is looking as strong as ever, winning against all three races.
I would say that Stork and Much did what there was to do, without too much fanciness. Ok, Stork's display against Flash was marvellous, but apart from that he did his job, which is dominate until quarters / semis and then forget goon range. That is the Stork we know.
Much on the other hand had arguably a rather weak group (thanks to seniority bonus) and performed as he was supposed to - which should not serve to lower the respect, playing as good as you are expected to still takes some effort (hello Bisu).
Luxury on the other hand was far from the clear favourite in his group, which was probably the toughest one apart from group 1 (which, after Savior's abysmal performance, appears less group-of-deathly now). Against July, Bisu, and Xellos he was never the clear favourite. If you check Liquibet, Luxury was 293 - 418 against July, 438 - 298 against Xellos and 156 - 611 against Bisu. While you can question the expertise of Liquibetters, this clearly shows that Luxury performed alot better than expected and thus also as the most impressive of the 3-0 guys.
edit: Besides, all the group winners beat all three races. Fascinating that an allocation of 2 x A, B, C always yields a group winner of race A. Quite imbalanced.
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On February 01 2008 20:31 Aesop wrote:Anyway, we have in Ro8: Group winners: Stork, Much, Luxury, [JD / Sea / Best] Group 2nds: Frozean, [Bisu / Xellos / July], [JD / Sea / Best], [Rock / Flash / Rumble]The rest is undecided, wow  . All the tiebreakers have three races represented and so far we have 2 x P, 1 x Z and 1 x T in Ro8.
Sounds more like a description than the names of progamers.
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On February 01 2008 20:37 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2008 20:35 Adamthegreat wrote:
So who has impressed the most of the group 3-0 winners?
I think Stork is looking as strong as ever, winning against all three races. in my opinion the most impressive 3-0 was by luxury, really kind of surprising. stork had two losers and his kicktoy flash in his group, much had two losers and yarnc luxury had two legends who are playing like losers and bisu, but luxury is more of a loser than stork and much in OSL i said 'loser' five times in this post
yea... a lot of losers in starleague 
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While theorycrafting about how July could've defended Xellos's attack, you guys are forgetting something. You need a hatchery, to have creep, to build creep/sunken colonies. If the hatchery is canceled, there will be no sunkens and you're gonna be stuck inside your base.
Although July couldn't pull off some insane comeback today, it was probably not possible since he failed to scout the proxy.
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Funny how Frozean and Luxury are both in the quarters now. I wrote those guys off 1~1.5 years ago after numerous failed attempts to qualify.
Good to see them finally living up to their potential, allthough I see way more potential in Luxury if he can clean up his ZvP(which he seems to be on the way of doing).
I always had the impression Frozean had a stellar TvZ from replays a couple of years ago, however as of late, its his TvP games that have been convincing, while his TvZ seems sloppy but with macro to maintain a decent level.
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On February 01 2008 21:17 vnlegend wrote:
While theorycrafting about how July could've defended Xellos's attack, you guys are forgetting something. You need a hatchery, to have creep, to build creep/sunken colonies. If the hatchery is canceled, there will be no sunkens and you're gonna be stuck inside your base.
Although July couldn't pull off some insane comeback today, it was probably not possible since he failed to scout the proxy.
Um, thats what theyre talking about. Sunkens in the main.
Regardless, it is possible to defend a proxy BB bunker rush even with 12 hatch poor scouting, but its really really really hard. Especially on Troy where early aggression can trap your opponent in his base for a long time. So basically, 12 hatch is a pretty dumb idea on Troy, and July should have been extra wary of early rush cheese, and he was just kinda oblivious.
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9070 Posts
its now clear to me, savior switched to terran... i was just hoping for xellos to win and he did it, what a great day for starcraft! bisu should take his chance or go drinking a beer with savior and watch the games on the TV
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savior stop making me so emo
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savior, you fucking suck.
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On February 01 2008 15:14 RowdierBob wrote:
Sea
Stork
Xellos
Much
Easy game.
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4/4! yay
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EPT
