EPTI feel like players are focused more on macro and build order side of the game and we dont see the amazing battles and tactical maneuvers like we was used to see in the official BW, also they are sticking to the same old standart formula and bring nothing new. Sorry, but despite of how good hero is for me his style of play is simply boring. BW is not a game only for the mind to make calculations, for the vewer this is really not enough to get interested. I want to see passion and spirit, new strategies and amazing battle tactics.
[SSL] Grand Finals - Page 67
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_Animus_
Bulgaria1064 Posts
I feel like players are focused more on macro and build order side of the game and we dont see the amazing battles and tactical maneuvers like we was used to see in the official BW, also they are sticking to the same old standart formula and bring nothing new. Sorry, but despite of how good hero is for me his style of play is simply boring. BW is not a game only for the mind to make calculations, for the vewer this is really not enough to get interested. I want to see passion and spirit, new strategies and amazing battle tactics. | ||
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Essbee
Canada2371 Posts
On March 17 2014 17:55 _Animus_ wrote: I dont know about you, but i didnt get to see very interesting games for the whole tournament and feel exited like i was used to be when BW was official, exept jangbi vs lazy with his outstanding army controll and the epic storms against piano (maybe if he start to practice it will be more than that). I feel like players are focused more on macro and build order side of the game and we dont see the amazing battles and tactical maneuvers like we was used to see in the official BW, also they are sticking to the same old standart formula and bring nothing new. Sorry, but despite of how good hero is for me his style of play is simply boring. BW is not a game only for the mind to make calculations, for the vewer this is really not enough to get interested. I want to see passion and spirit, new strategies and amazing battle tactics. I've always thought the maps were the cause of this. We need more maps like Pathfinder and stuff. These kind of maps force them to create new strategies and then gives us amazing game. I'm really tired of all the similar macro maps ala FS. I like them but just once in a bo5 for example not like 4 different variants in a single bo5, that's ridiculously repetitive. With that said, I disagree a bit with what you said because I think the players are still very entertaining. We had the chance to see really great games during this SSL. Still, I want to see new maps, strategies and builds so badly. Edit: Also, what's with Sonic ALWAYS using yellow vs red? Would be cool to see all the colors, no? Tho, I do appreciate the fact that he's using a resolution changer, I think it's really neat. | ||
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Archers_bane
United States1338 Posts
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AppleSauce123
Denmark148 Posts
On March 17 2014 17:55 _Animus_ wrote: I dont know about you, but i didnt get to see very interesting games for the whole tournament and feel exited like i was used to be when BW was official, exept jangbi vs lazy with his outstanding army controll and the epic storms against piano (maybe if he start to practice it will be more than that). I feel like players are focused more on macro and build order side of the game and we dont see the amazing battles and tactical maneuvers like we was used to see in the official BW, also they are sticking to the same old standart formula and bring nothing new. Sorry, but despite of how good hero is for me his style of play is simply boring. BW is not a game only for the mind to make calculations, for the vewer this is really not enough to get interested. I want to see passion and spirit, new strategies and amazing battle tactics. I think you're asking for too much, especially considering players are competing for a decent amount of prize money in starleagues. It was reasonable to expect players to try out different 'battle tactics' and strategies in an environment like Proleague, where there were a ton of games and coaches/b-teamers to help you out in preparation. We don't have that anymore, so the most effective way to ensure you win is to simply have solid game-play. It's not worth it to be clever because that's not the point. The point is to win. Also, Hero's PvZ is anything but boring... | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12071 Posts
On March 17 2014 19:37 Archers_bane wrote: Glad to see Bisu is doing well in BW again. I hope this inspires other ex-BW players to return and spice up the competition! I think they'd be more happy to see how much money he makes from streaming first since arguably for a lot of ex-BW people who are still on good salaries (Flash and Fantasy I would imagine) it might sadly not be worth it ffor them to switch back. | ||
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_Animus_
Bulgaria1064 Posts
On March 17 2014 19:38 AppleSauce123 wrote: I think you're asking for too much, especially considering players are competing for a decent amount of prize money in starleagues. It was reasonable to expect players to try out different 'battle tactics' and strategies in an environment like Proleague, where there were a ton of games and coaches/b-teamers to help you out in preparation. We don't have that anymore, so the most effective way to ensure you win is to simply have solid game-play. It's not worth it to be clever because that's not the point. The point is to win. Also, Hero's PvZ is anything but boring... Then that will make me and more spectators walk away from it as an entertainment and then guess what? These tournaments are not made for the players, as much as for the fans. If the game becomes less entertaining it will impact pretty badly on the scene, its simple. | ||
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
On March 18 2014 03:08 _Animus_ wrote: Then that will make me and more spectators walk away from it as an entertainment and then guess what? These tournaments are not made for the players, as much as for the fans. If the game becomes less entertaining it will impact pretty badly on the scene, its simple. Many people showed up for this tournament. If this tournament had bad games up to the finals, fans will dissipate. So we don't need you and your negativity around here. The level of the games have improved drastically since the last SSL. We are seeing crisper and sharper timings after each rounds. No not even rounds, groups. | ||
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_Animus_
Bulgaria1064 Posts
On March 18 2014 03:58 Xiphos wrote: Many people showed up for this tournament. If this tournament had bad games up to the finals, fans will dissipate. So we don't need you and your negativity around here. The level of the games have improved drastically since the last SSL. We are seeing crisper and sharper timings after each rounds. No not even rounds, groups. As much as you want to defend BW image i think there are some things to be desired and its foolish just to tell people to go away when they give a critic to something BW related. You can watch timings and be entertained, if thats what makes the game great for you. I need more than this, maybe i want too much but thats what i want as a fan(remember Jin Air OSL finals?). The crowd was big and this is a good thing, as Sonic did upgrade his level of organisation by huge margin. With so many new ex-progamers, it sure attracts much more people including me, following the whole tournament as i wasnt following previous seasons as much. I was just expecting games to get closer to the quallity of the pro bw era. I hope they will become even better, its all in the hands of the players. | ||
CaucasianAsian
Korea (South)11603 Posts
On March 18 2014 05:25 _Animus_ wrote: As much as you want to defend BW image i think there are some things to be desired and its foolish just to tell people to go away when they give a critic to something BW related. You can watch timings and be entertained, if thats what makes the game great for you. I need more than this, maybe i want too much but thats what i want as a fan(remember Jin Air OSL finals?). The crowd was big and this is a good thing, as Sonic did upgrade his level of organisation by huge margin. With so many new ex-progamers, it sure attracts much more people including me, following the whole tournament as i wasnt following previous seasons as much. I was just expecting games to get closer to the quallity of the pro bw era. I hope they will become even better, its all in the hands of the players. practicing in team houses with coaches, and 20 other players to go over strategy with had its advantages.. | ||
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AppleSauce123
Denmark148 Posts
On March 18 2014 05:25 _Animus_ wrote: As much as you want to defend BW image i think there are some things to be desired and its foolish just to tell people to go away when they give a critic to something BW related. You can watch timings and be entertained, if thats what makes the game great for you. I need more than this, maybe i want too much but thats what i want as a fan(remember Jin Air OSL finals?). The crowd was big and this is a good thing, as Sonic did upgrade his level of organisation by huge margin. With so many new ex-progamers, it sure attracts much more people including me, following the whole tournament as i wasnt following previous seasons as much. I was just expecting games to get closer to the quallity of the pro bw era. I hope they will become even better, its all in the hands of the players. You basically wrote 8 lines of text to say pretty much nothing. | ||
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_whiteness_
Brazil106 Posts
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Ciryandor
United States3735 Posts
On March 17 2014 18:07 Essbee wrote: I've always thought the maps were the cause of this. We need more maps like Pathfinder and stuff. These kind of maps force them to create new strategies and then gives us amazing game. I'm really tired of all the similar macro maps ala FS. I like them but just once in a bo5 for example not like 4 different variants in a single bo5, that's ridiculously repetitive. With that said, I disagree a bit with what you said because I think the players are still very entertaining. We had the chance to see really great games during this SSL. Still, I want to see new maps, strategies and builds so badly. Edit: Also, what's with Sonic ALWAYS using yellow vs red? Would be cool to see all the colors, no? Tho, I do appreciate the fact that he's using a resolution changer, I think it's really neat. Mist was a good attempt, but we need to start walking away from that and pay Rose.of.Dream to do some really ridiculous BW SPL-level maps. | ||
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Ilikestarcraft
Korea (South)17743 Posts
On March 17 2014 18:07 Essbee wrote: Edit: Also, what's with Sonic ALWAYS using yellow vs red? Would be cool to see all the colors, no? Tho, I do appreciate the fact that he's using a resolution changer, I think it's really neat. It helps the obs and viewers notice things easier on the minimap so they don't miss a drop/fight. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8971 Posts
On March 18 2014 11:40 Ilikestarcraft wrote: It helps the obs and viewers notice things easier on the minimap so they don't miss a drop/fight. This is true most of the time; but there's a shitton of Kakaru's on Sniper Ridge, and those are yellow on the minimap! Easy to confuse them with drops! I agree I wouldn't mind seeing more colors, I miss the imba purple protoss: | ||
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fabiano
Brazil4644 Posts
Brown is invisible. | ||
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
On March 18 2014 05:25 _Animus_ wrote: As much as you want to defend BW image i think there are some things to be desired and its foolish just to tell people to go away when they give a critic to something BW related. You can watch timings and be entertained, if thats what makes the game great for you. I need more than this, maybe i want too much but thats what i want as a fan(remember Jin Air OSL finals?). The crowd was big and this is a good thing, as Sonic did upgrade his level of organisation by huge margin. With so many new ex-progamers, it sure attracts much more people including me, following the whole tournament as i wasnt following previous seasons as much. I was just expecting games to get closer to the quallity of the pro bw era. I hope they will become even better, its all in the hands of the players. That's good and all but in comparison to the OTHER esport titles out there, the average BW as of now STILL overceed them by a HUGE margin. I personally can't get into FPS and as of now its basically CS:GO, Crossfire, and Quake the level of skills they showcase are more or less focused toward reaction time (Modern military simulations). Quake is sort of the game that I could only understand the more I play it as the action are very hard to follow. Again not saying they are bad games but they are one of those games that are fun to play but not to watch. Now let's get into DotA2 + LoL, both of those games takes WAY too long to finish (an average game is about 30 to 40 minutes long) which requires A LOT of commitment which I currently don't have so I pretty much just watch YouTube's game recap + highlight. I respect DotA2's skill HUGELY due to characters' decision making skills rivals just as much as RTS game. Think that farming = macroing by LH/Deny/Jungle and that each units have more micro potentials due to having a load of choices w/ items + abilities. Finally it reminds me of the way how RTS work that you can get the necessary skill and/or item (or in the case of RTS games, the units combination) but you still gotta to use them as efficiently as possible. And don't even get me started on SC2. On average, there are just more tense moments RIGHT now in BW than SC2 games have. I don't think I've missed any other big esport titles. If you think about it, BW is still the BEST professional game (yeah Afreecan streamers are doing this for a LIVING so they are still considered as professionals). People should stop bitching about it and enjoy this right. Like dude what other game industry have survived a matchfixing scandal, getting sued by its own fucking MOTHER company, having a brand new game to compete with it, AND having 1/2 of its players leaving for that game. I can't even believe that I'm still watching this game playing at this level. Many time we as a community thought that it would be nail in the coffin for our beloved scene but the corpse ALWAYS managed to kick the cover open and have another laugh. Don't hate, appreciate. | ||
BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES51717 Posts
On March 18 2014 12:10 fabiano wrote: Better yellow and red than brown. Brown is invisible. purple vs orange/blue vs orange/green vs orange are probably best for viewing. | ||
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oDieN[Siege]
United States2905 Posts
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Essbee
Canada2371 Posts
On March 18 2014 10:13 Ciryandor wrote: Mist was a good attempt, but we need to start walking away from that and pay Rose.of.Dream to do some really ridiculous BW SPL-level maps. I agree that Mist was a good attempt but I feel it wasn't enough. I mean, look at the rest of the map pool, there's still so many macro 4-corners maps in every damn boX. And okay, I see the reason for yellow/red but I'm still disappointed. It was not like this before with Kespa and I don't remember it being a big issue, no? | ||
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Birdie
New Zealand4438 Posts
On March 18 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote: purple vs orange/blue vs orange/green vs orange are probably best for viewing. Red Zerg vs white Terran is always the best colour/race combo. @Xiphos Quake is all about map control and timing (and probably other FPS, I don't play FPS much though), although of course the mechanics of shooting other players is important. | ||
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