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[MSL] Nate MSL Grand Finals - Flash vs Jaedong - Page 207

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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StylishVODs
Profile Joined December 2005
Sweden5331 Posts
January 23 2010 14:10 GMT
#4121
On January 23 2010 23:07 boredcouch wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2010 23:04 StylishVODs wrote:
There was still some minerals at flashes natural + he could have lifted his main cc to grab another expo and poof we got 2base again.
Its not like jaedong was very heavy on drones.

Jaedong had the advantage but the game wasn't over.


Really? Do you know how long it would take for a CC to get to another expansion? Be real.


Maybe long enough for his natural to mine out?

+jaedongs main/natural was out or almost out, cant really see...
it would have been 2base vs 2base with advantage to jaedong if he had some ultras making.
According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was.
Bisu-Fan
Profile Joined January 2010
Russian Federation3329 Posts
January 23 2010 14:10 GMT
#4122
YAY JD!!!!
The Revolutionist Shall Rise Again! No. 1 Kim Taek Yong Fan 어헣↗ GO JAEDONG!!!!!!! GO ACE!!! 태연 <3 윤아 <3 승연 <3
KameZerg
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1761 Posts
January 23 2010 14:10 GMT
#4123
On January 23 2010 23:09 Holgerius wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2010 23:08 ICanFlyLow wrote:
I miss the time when the finals games werent staged and fake.

Last week?


I ment that the one who lost, lost on purpose.
asdasdasdasdasd123123123
Kyo Yuy
Profile Joined January 2009
United States1286 Posts
January 23 2010 14:12 GMT
#4124
On January 23 2010 23:09 Holgerius wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2010 23:08 ICanFlyLow wrote:
I miss the time when the finals games werent staged and fake.

Last week?

More like last MSL. XD

I didn't really like the reseeding based on KeSPA rank idea, to be honest. It gives the really good players some easier opponents by default, and that applies to both Jaedong and Flash really.

I know they didn't want a Calm vs. Kwanro finals again, but forcing lesser players to play the cream of the crop earlier just due to ranking seems a bit unfair to me.
#1 KawaiiRice fan :D
zeo
Profile Joined October 2009
Serbia6282 Posts
January 23 2010 14:12 GMT
#4125
The DONG had TWO defilers about five seconds before the blackout,
how are sooo many people missing this? One plagu and swarmu and its GG.
Nuf said
"If only Kircheis were here" - Everyone
annYeong(o11)
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Canada784 Posts
January 23 2010 14:12 GMT
#4126
What do Flash and IdrA have in common?

+ Show Spoiler +
They both lose without typing gg
Founder of the KiWiKaKi Fanclub: teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=188537 my keyboard is like half broken. like terran. please ignore typos, thanks
D00dles
Profile Joined June 2008
Cambodia217 Posts
January 23 2010 14:13 GMT
#4127
Yes, Big JD ftw.
"This. How people cant see it is beyond me... how making a copy of something is stealing is also beyond me. Is it stealing to make a photo copy of a book?" - HuskyTheHusky
endGame
Profile Joined June 2009
United States394 Posts
January 23 2010 14:13 GMT
#4128
On January 23 2010 23:12 annYeong(o11) wrote:
What do Flash and IdrA have in common?

+ Show Spoiler +
They both lose without typing gg


Haha. That's too funny.
"...As the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must." -Thucydides
annYeong(o11)
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Canada784 Posts
January 23 2010 14:13 GMT
#4129
On January 23 2010 23:12 fox[tail] wrote:
The DONG had TWO defilers about five seconds before the blackout,
how are sooo many people missing this? One plagu and swarmu and its GG.
Nuf said



because NO terran can EVER win against defilers, it's kinda like how defilers are AUTOMATIC WIN for the zerg, forget CCGG it's HIVEGG.
Founder of the KiWiKaKi Fanclub: teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=188537 my keyboard is like half broken. like terran. please ignore typos, thanks
Invictus
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Singapore2697 Posts
January 23 2010 14:13 GMT
#4130
I dont get all the numbers of units talk. I still feel the best solution would be to change the last 3 maps and let the 2 players meet again next week. A regame would be so unfair to jaedong since his build revolved around getting early ultras(correct me if im wrong) and awarding the game to jaedong would be also be so unfair to flash because nobody would know who would be the winner until someone ggs.

Imo lets just wait for the interviews to come out and see what they have to say about this ridiculous incident
Lee Jaedong Fighting!
StylishVODs
Profile Joined December 2005
Sweden5331 Posts
January 23 2010 14:15 GMT
#4131
Anyway...

Flash had:
Still minerals at his natural.
1 mineral only exp running.
Opportunity to lift main CC to closeby expansion. (when natural is out, he can transfer those scvs).
units left out on the map + 2-3 sciencevessels (probably 2 more coming).

Jaedong had:
2 bases almost mined out or mined out, 1 base fully going and 1 with 6 drones.
2-3 ultras and some lings.

Sure jaedong had the advantage, but when you look at what they had its way too early to call it a win for jaedong in a final like this.
According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was.
annYeong(o11)
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Canada784 Posts
January 23 2010 14:17 GMT
#4132
On January 23 2010 23:15 StylishVODs wrote:
Anyway...

Flash had:
Still minerals at his natural.
1 mineral only exp running.
Opportunity to lift main CC to closeby expansion. (when natural is out, he can transfer those scvs).
units left out on the map + 2-3 sciencevessels (probably 2 more coming).

Jaedong had:
2 bases almost mined out or mined out, 1 base fully going and 1 with 6 drones.
2-3 ultras and some lings.

Sure jaedong had the advantage, but when you look at what they had its way too early to call it a win for jaedong in a final like this.



it's not even about that, it's the fact that judges who weren't progamers deciding a pro-game.

like a kindergarten class making supreme court decisions
Founder of the KiWiKaKi Fanclub: teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=188537 my keyboard is like half broken. like terran. please ignore typos, thanks
SuperArc
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Austria7781 Posts
January 23 2010 14:17 GMT
#4133
The problem with lifting main cc is that it will lower Flash's gas income.

His SVs were the only thing that kept him in the game, he needed all the gas he could get.
Snow - future of protoss! :) Nada = baller
BloodDrunK
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Bangladesh2767 Posts
January 23 2010 14:18 GMT
#4134
LOL (Z)Power Outage is already pretty high up the rankings just after a single win vs FLASH.it deserves a pic.
+ Show Spoiler +
maybe a pic of MBC kissing KESPA's ass!!!
You have the power to create your own destiny.
moopie
Profile Joined July 2009
12605 Posts
January 23 2010 14:18 GMT
#4135
On January 23 2010 23:06 Boonbag wrote:
I hope MBC doesn't get too much shit from all that, cuz failing that hard one of your three main year event, can pretty much fuck them up big time.


And why shouldn't it? how are these finals not their fault?

1) smaller venue (this I can excuse due to lower attendance previous years and thus a low expected outcome, though potentially they could have looked into another venue once the final ticket was cleared up a bit, like ro4 showing at the very least 'interesting' potential matches).
2) shutting out the public from the potential seating which went only to fanclubs.
3) 'virtual studio' seating the players away from the fans.

and lets not forget...
4) not having the 2 most important computers in the room on a UPS.

Toss into that the fact that a lot of netizens were already mad at them for the flash overlay during the kal/jd series (which I actually didn't think was a big deal, but apparently in korea it was), and you have a lot of people mad at MBC.

I expect that if things really do heat up and it looks like they are having a hard time finding a sponsor, it will give GOM more of a drive to re-establish its league.
I'm going to sleep, let me get some of that carpet.
Heimatloser
Profile Joined March 2009
Germany1494 Posts
January 23 2010 14:20 GMT
#4136
i always used to compare sc with chess.
i know in chess things like positioning and materials matter.
but if kasparov vs deep blue would have ended with a power blackout, would have anybody thought of giving the game to the one with better positions?
would anybody give an online-chessgame to the ones with more material if the server crashes?

you will never know whats in the heads of the players, we will never know if flash had a master plan, or if jaedong could have pulled through.
all that i know is that this was a clear remis, and that nobody ever should judge what a professional is doing, and if he is doing it good.

"hey flash, we know that you didnt gg yet, but you already lost this match at this point!"
bullshit, why am i watching games when ppl can tell at any time who would have won?

No other sport would be this much of a joke.
All what KT currently needs is a Zerg and a second Terran
Holgerius
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden16951 Posts
January 23 2010 14:20 GMT
#4137
On January 23 2010 23:17 annYeong(o11) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2010 23:15 StylishVODs wrote:
Anyway...

Flash had:
Still minerals at his natural.
1 mineral only exp running.
Opportunity to lift main CC to closeby expansion. (when natural is out, he can transfer those scvs).
units left out on the map + 2-3 sciencevessels (probably 2 more coming).

Jaedong had:
2 bases almost mined out or mined out, 1 base fully going and 1 with 6 drones.
2-3 ultras and some lings.

Sure jaedong had the advantage, but when you look at what they had its way too early to call it a win for jaedong in a final like this.



it's not even about that, it's the fact that judges who weren't progamers deciding a pro-game.

like a kindergarten class making supreme court decisions

And they also made the decision quite fast, which obviously means no high level analysis was possible. It's just so unfair and dumb to do what they did in a situation as important as a Starleague final.
I believe in the almighty Grötslev! -- I am never serious and you should never believe a thing I say. Including the previous sentence.
StylishVODs
Profile Joined December 2005
Sweden5331 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-23 14:21:37
January 23 2010 14:21 GMT
#4138
On January 23 2010 23:17 SuperArc wrote:
The problem with lifting main cc is that it will lower Flash's gas income.

His SVs were the only thing that kept him in the game, he needed all the gas he could get.


Science vessels or more marines + new gas. He might have had 2 more SV qeued up. The point is, it was not completely over.
If anyone could make a comeback its flash or jaedong. Even when playing against eachothers.

They didn't even have the damn replay.
According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was.
mark718
Profile Joined February 2008
United States73 Posts
January 23 2010 14:21 GMT
#4139
On January 23 2010 23:15 StylishVODs wrote:
Jaedong had:
2 bases almost mined out or mined out, 1 base fully going and 1 with 6 drones.
2-3 ultras and some lings.


He also had a 5th morphing at top right. Even if Flash could lift out of his main, JD's exp would have been up first.

zeo
Profile Joined October 2009
Serbia6282 Posts
January 23 2010 14:22 GMT
#4140
On January 23 2010 23:13 annYeong(o11) wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2010 23:12 fox[tail] wrote:
The DONG had TWO defilers about five seconds before the blackout,
how are sooo many people missing this? One plagu and swarmu and its GG.
Nuf said



because NO terran can EVER win against defilers, it's kinda like how defilers are AUTOMATIC WIN for the zerg, forget CCGG it's HIVEGG.


JD defiler play was awesome in the battle for 7 o'clock. If they were full energy there is no way flash could break 7 o'clock with the kind of reinforcements coming in for JD
"If only Kircheis were here" - Everyone
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