EPTI notice that when you have mass mnm vs ultras and you irradiate the ultras, it kills your mnms faster than the ultras. So if you were to d matrix in this situation, would you be better off?
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extracheez
Australia151 Posts
I notice that when you have mass mnm vs ultras and you irradiate the ultras, it kills your mnms faster than the ultras. So if you were to d matrix in this situation, would you be better off? | ||
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Zoler
Sweden6339 Posts
On May 07 2009 01:02 extracheez wrote: What do you guys think about using D matrix on marines when zerg gets ultras? I notice that when you have mass mnm vs ultras and you irradiate the ultras, it kills your mnms faster than the ultras. So if you were to d matrix in this situation, would you be better off? Yes, if you have energy when a battle occurs, use dmatrix, almost never irradiate. Sometimes you can irradiate an ultra which you see will splash a lot of lings, otherwise no. | ||
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merach
United States182 Posts
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FreshNoThyme
United States356 Posts
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Bebop Berserker
United States246 Posts
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StylishVODs
Sweden5331 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=86770¤tpage=53 Muff2n: If protoss steals gas there is a high possibility he will produce some zealots before his first dragon and also proxying gateways. You should be careful with your simcity build (the way you place your buildings to gain advantage over your attacker). I explain some of the buildingplacements in the tvp general tips vod. From there you should either kill the refinary and carry on as usual. Use 4-5 scvs and be sure not to kill it when his probe is close because he might try to rebuild it. This will give you a slight disadvantage in the early game since pulling that many scvs cost slightly more than pulling an early probe and make an assimilator. But its very doable, specially on lower ranks. Or, you could use your scouting scv to make a second barrack (at 11 food) in a proxylocation and make about 6-8 rines before you attack. Use the mineraltrick to pull about 12 scvs along with your attack. This will leave 3-4 scvs in main and you can continue to produce marines and make a bunker. Or, you can make a bunker in your natural and expand faster. Reason is that the protoss will have spend early minerals on an assimilator rather than on gateways and his goonrange wll be greatly delayed. Extracheez: Generally, only irradiate ultralisks if they are far from your units. Sometimes its useful to sacrifice a few vessels in order to fly around the map and irradiate ultralisks. If they are about to attack you or you're about to attack them, always d-matrix your front marines. Bebop Bereserker: I dont reccomend getting mines if you face a zerg with fast gas. Its better to upgrade vulturespeed. If you do the 8raxmech you will usually go 2fac and therefor getting 6 vults before speed kicks in. Its much easier to sneak into his main if you have speed and you can snipe alot of drones since the mutas will not be able to kill the vultures if you run the around the mutalisks. He might also get a few hydras before mutalisks and it will be almost impossible to sneak through with slow vults. If you can get 3 or more vultures in his base and you notice his spire is almost finnished, you can go for his larvas with the attack. They will die really fast if they are not eggs morphing already. Usually, if he goes straight for 2hatchmuta, 8rax mech with speedvults is a freewin. Only get mines if he's doing some sort of hydra attack. Otherwise, go directly from speed into goliathrange or expansion. | ||
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JaMsLeGs
United States3 Posts
I Start off with Your Drop ship Build. I drop 1 tank 2 vults During This Time I'll have made 1+ factory (total 2 facts) reload ship with 3 vults if protoss made an expo and drop there.. During the drop I'll start my push.. While pushing i'll create an expo then try and create around 2-3 facts (5Facts) 1 with shop and 4 without.. and keep up pressure while i expand again.. then i'll drop 1 more time.. Questions During This Build: When Do I get Academy? What Happens if my drop ship is discovered and Drop was prevented? how Should I react? During Push Should I worry about getting Science Vessel? If my push is broken should I Wait until I'm Maxed? or when Toss attacks? If you have answered any of these questions can You tell me which page lol... And I cant find your Pack 2 Of Vods of games.. lol can you guide me Thx TvZ I like to use your 9minPush, Ay yu Mui or something, and EE timing builds.. and I always Have a Problem with Mutas.. Once I have everything Should I just leave My base For the Muta's To mess around with? cause normally The Muta's attack turrets and supplies and stuff. Or should I keep a few marines inside the base and defend then Leave? | ||
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StylishVODs
Sweden5331 Posts
TvP With the dropstrat I usually just drop once and then do the fakedrop and attack frontqal with 3tanks, 4marines and rallied vultures. Attacking early will help you since he's getting an expansion and you're not, so as long as the game goes on the protoss is likely to catch up unless you do megadamage with your drops. You don't need academy for this first push usually unless you've spotted a templar archives, but its good if ebay is finnished when your tanks arrives so you can make some turrets if needed, also a bunker is good. When attacking you can make a CC and go from there for 5fact push if your first one wasn't successful. If you do this, make a few turrets to defend your base while you get the 5fact and be sure to have academy ready when you move out. DUring this time you can use the dropship you have to do constant harass and try to keep some mapcontrol with vultures. If the drop is prevented its an uphill battle. Then I guess a good thing might be to go back with the drop, go for a frontal attack and fake the drop in the first try and go for a fast win or to make an expansion as soon as possible and keep him afraid of the drop. You don't have to worry about sciencevessel for the first or second push here. THe last question is to hard to answer generally. It depends. If you're behind, harass while macring to max is always an option, If you do this, harass with some vultures on the map and a few dropships at the same time and macro like crasy and also get upgrades. Atleast 2-1 is what you need with a maxed army. TvZ With the A-Yu-Mi build you should have this problem. Marines should start attacking the sunkens before his mutalisks are finnished. With the EE timing you wil have many barracks and many marines. Defending vs mutalisks before you move out shouldn't be a problem. Make the turrets as I explain in the 9minpush build vod and keep about 7-10 marines and 2 medics in your main at some turrets so your units are split up. When you must move out, when the upgrade is on the "ng" in upgrading. Move out unless he keeps making mutalisks. If he continues to make mutalisks this means his lurkertiming will be delayed and you can delay your timingpush and need to defend the base alittle more. If he makes only 9 or 11 you can defend until you should move out and then just move out. Your 5rax will be able to produce enough units do defend pretty fast again, or he will fly over your barracks and kill the marines being made. But if he does not retreat with the mutalisks when you attack he will die, so he's not going to stay in your base that long. When doing the 9minpush you're not moving out before 9minutes usually. This will mean that he will have tried to mutaliskharass you for 3 minutes. Usually he would have died a few mutas by now and will be less of a threat. If he still have all muta left, you could add 1 additional turret at the locations you feel are unsafe at the moment you're moving out. If his mutaliskharass is really great you can wait in base with the units and move out alittle later. WIth the 9minpush you will usually have quite some time before defilers are out and if you wait for the second vessel or the dropship before you attack its not always that big of a deal. I think you just have to work on your turretplacement and your defense vs mutalisk harass in general before you move out, but its hard to tell unless ive seen you play. Anyway good luck! | ||
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Bebop Berserker
United States246 Posts
On May 08 2009 10:10 StylishVODs wrote: Bebop Bereserker: I dont reccomend getting mines if you face a zerg with fast gas. Its better to upgrade vulturespeed. If you do the 8raxmech you will usually go 2fac and therefor getting 6 vults before speed kicks in. Its much easier to sneak into his main if you have speed and you can snipe alot of drones since the mutas will not be able to kill the vultures if you run the around the mutalisks. He might also get a few hydras before mutalisks and it will be almost impossible to sneak through with slow vults. If you can get 3 or more vultures in his base and you notice his spire is almost finnished, you can go for his larvas with the attack. They will die really fast if they are not eggs morphing already. Usually, if he goes straight for 2hatchmuta, 8rax mech with speedvults is a freewin. Only get mines if he's doing some sort of hydra attack. Otherwise, go directly from speed into goliathrange or expansion. I meant I got mines after speed. But now ive played 2 games where my opponent got mutas when mines was 3/4 done. I think 2 hatch is slightly faster. | ||
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JaMsLeGs
United States3 Posts
PS. LOVE YOU StyLish. No Homo. lol | ||
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StylishVODs
Sweden5331 Posts
Ok, thats better, but I still would advice you to go for range directly after speed. If he does a 3hatch build you can go for cc before range. | ||
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Vaeshir
United States5 Posts
a) The Protoss building a pylon in my wall and subsequently drowning me with zealots. I've been told that this means I just shouldn't wall in, but surely that isn't the only answer. b) The scouting probe attacking (and often killing) my builder SCVs, even if I send a SCV to attack the scouting probe. Thanks! | ||
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JaMsLeGs
United States3 Posts
What is a Good Push Formation? with tanks: ll = tanks together lllllllllllllllllll lllllllllllllllllll or ll ll ll ll ll ll ll ll ll ll ll ll or lllll lllll lllll lllll or llllll llllll llllll llllll llllll lllllll or llll llll llll llll And against Someone (most C + and up) goes quick Arbs.. which I'm having trouble with.. Normally they would 2gate->expo->drop DT->expo->Arb While slowing push with DT,goons, and Zealots. What would be a counter for this build.. ARB comes out around 11 - 12 mins. In TvZ Tell Me if I'm Right If I use A-yu-mi.. The attack should be Before Muta's come out.. In EE timing. the attack should be before Lurkers.. | ||
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Sublimis
Sweden70 Posts
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ZzZzAnG
United States109 Posts
for tvp on destination ive lost a game because i didnt know how to proper respond: my quistion: what do you do after you spot and kill proxy gates in your main or just outside your natura?my response was to do 2 fac but it totally failed .Do you think its better to maintain your advantage if you can say that and just continue with normal build order because you killed opponents base which cost him minerals and i just lost mining time. Is it pretty even from there? | ||
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Muff2n
United Kingdom249 Posts
I have tried to move down before but with say 4 rines, 1 tank, 1 vulture I struggle, especially if they camp the bottom of the ramp just out of range. | ||
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Muff2n
United Kingdom249 Posts
In TvZ Tell Me if I'm Right If I use A-yu-mi.. The attack should be Before Muta's come out.. In the vod Stylish says you should be attacking the sunkens about 10seconds before the first mutas hatch. | ||
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MoeMoeKyun
United States215 Posts
I played a guy on Bluestorm who did this and I and I tried to just get some goliath+turrets off 2 base but his harassment and constant use of them when I tried pushing when he got his third killed me. Is there no other choice? Also in TvZ with your first vessel do you have to save energy so that when his first patch of defilers pop you can irradiate them immediately? Or is it just preference? Thanks! | ||
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StylishVODs
Sweden5331 Posts
Making a walling is sometimes risky. There is a chance that the probe will build a pylon and send 1-3 zealots straight to your base. The best way to handle it is probably to bring scvs to the ramp and have some marines behind. Protoss making a pylon and a couple of zealots will usually cost him more than it costs you to bring 2-3 scvs to block. If a probe is attacking your buildingscv you need to pull a mining scv right away and attack it. The usual problem is that you just click attack and press on the probe, this is not the most efficient way. What you need to do is spam leftclick on the probe and it will die alot faster and the scv will follow the probe faster aswell. Whenever your building scv starts getting low helth, click on it and press cancel, then use the attacking scv to continue building the structure, move the low health scv to mine minerals again and bring a new scv to attack the probe. You do the same vs drones that are microed to kill single scvs, you just spam leftclick on it and he won't be able to do the normal back and forth trick that sometimes can be annoying when you have 1 scv vs 1 drone. I will add this question into the faq, its good to know this. JaMsLeGs: It varies alot. When using the flashstrategy you have to harass him in the midgame with vultures and drops. While harassing with vultures you lay mines across the map and this way you can get information of where his units are. When you push out in the lategame you will have 3 scans. Use them to determine where his units are and always put mines where his units will run when he attacks you. Mines need to be placed before the actual encounter. If he attacks and you haven't laid mines yet, you are better of not laying any mines and just have the vults with your tanks. Positioning of tanks isn't that important when moving out with such a large army. The most important thing is that you get them up in siege mode as fast as possible if he decides to attack. If you have time for it, you can try not to have every tank clutched together, but dont waste too much time on it unless he has alot of arbiters. If he has many arbiters you want to spread out your tanks alot more. I don't really think I can generalize better then this and tell you what position is best for tanks since it differs so much. But usually when not having too much tanks its good to position them 3 and 3 or 2 and 2 or something like that. Always try to place mines so that he cannot attack your tanks with goons without drawing the mines but far away enough so that zealots won't drag mines into the tanks. My best advice is that you watch how progamers use their mines, specially fantasy. Also read the [G]Terran FAQ. I think there are alot of answers there to your questions, including play vs arbiters and such. Yes you are correct about the TvZ. EE timing is made so that the attack will occur when he is morphing his lurkers. A-yu-mi will occur when the mutas are morphing aswell. When the units are ready it will be too late. ZzZzAnG: Proxy gates is tough to deal with sometimes. How you follow up is mostly based on how much damage you took. I usually stay on 1 fact 1 rax, kill the gateway and then expand for myself, depending on what he does ofcourse. If you want you can send me a replay of a proxygame and I can try to figure out what you did wrong. Its really hard to generalize when faceing a proxy since the damage taken really decides what you can do to follow up. Continuing with the initial strat after succesfully defending a proxyrush is definately viable. Muff2n: Are you talking about siege expand or FD expand? If you do the FD expand your mine upgrade will be finnished alot sooner than your CC. This way you can plant mines outside your natural before he attack you with more than 3 goons. If you think he will attack you with a 2gate rush just make another vult after the first one and sometimes even make a bunker. You will have 6 mines 1 tank and a bunker before CC is finnished. If he's doing a really strong preassurebuild I suggest that you switch to the Strong FD instead of normal FD. The idea with the FD opening is that you move out with 4-5 marines 1 vult and 1 tank as soon as the vult is finnished, place mines outside your natural and make the CC on the expansion location. He will have 3 goons max at this point unless he's doing 10/15 gate in which case you have to do the strong FD if you dont want to wall in. If you're talking about siege expand, if following the build your siegemode will be upgraded when the CC is finnished and you will have 2 tanks. Siege them on the cliff and he cannot attack you. SCC-AlwaysGG: I dont really understand the question. I think you should read through the Terran FAQ, i think there are some information on how you play vs fast carriers there(under TvP 5Factpush). Remeber that a protoss who's rushing for carriers wont have enough groundunits to stop an early rush, so the answer isnt always to start producing goliath emidiately when you see his stargates. First he has to make the carriers, then the interceptors and then he has to kill all your ground forces before he's safe. During this time you can do alot of damage with purely tanks and vultures. I usually always add armory and atleast start upgrading range though when I see multiple stargates, but i dont always switch to goliaths directly. TvZ question. If your talking about a standard push at 9-10 minutes with m&m tanks and 1 vessel, the answer is no. I suggest that you practice the 9min push. Dont even use the first vessel for irradiating, there is no way he will have defilers up at 9-10 minutes anyway. You're better of using defensematrix with your first vessel. When I'm doing the 9min push I actaully dont even start upgrading irradiate after my first vessel. I usually make a dropship after my first vessel and then another vessel before upgrading irradiate. Since his defilers won't be up yet, using irradiate with 1 vessel on 1 lurker isnt as good as to use the defensematrix on strategic units. The whole point of these timed attacks, wether its 9minpush or late-hive counterpush (as i call it, its in my vodsection), is to attack him before his defilers are out and ready to cast swarm. When he has swarm you should already have mutliple vessels out with irradiate. I'm very tired right now and I think I could have answered all your questions maybe abit simpler, im sorry for that I need to go to bed^^ Feel free to say if you aren't satisfied with the answer and I'll try to elaborate tomorrow when my mind is fresh. | ||
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dhe95
United States1213 Posts
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