[D] TvZ Bio --> mech - Page 2

On August 06 2010 06:00 DJONES wrote:


If you outplay your opponent, you win. If your opponent outplays you, they win. Seems perfectly fair to me.

On August 06 2010 09:39 Mystlord wrote:
And fantasy making a big splash in BW again... This isn't impossible to beat, it's just that Zergs have to adapt their Mech strategy a bit to play against this properly. Against normal Mech, Zerg has the advantage of a much better economy, but against a bio -> Mech, Zerg has the advantage of higher tech. Defiler + Lurker is actually a very effective defensive combination against Mech, and more so because the Terran's Vessel count is limited.

Another thing, Vessel count doesn't limit the Zerg's ability to go mass Mutalisks at all, especially on Polaris Rhapsody (the supposedly "imba" map of last night), because of the double gas expansion. Terran will have to get some Goliaths then to counter the Mutalisk threat, and that will pull the Terran's gas in three directions: Tank, Vessel, and Goliath, not to mention the decreased Vulture count.

If there's one other disadvantage that Zerg has in this style of play, it's that their upgrades are completely messed up. Carapace upgrades are essentially useless, and they aren't getting the Missile attack nor Air Carapace upgrades they'll need to push back Mech.

This isn't really "unbeatable", it's just another strategy experiencing a peak in usage, like 3 Hatch Muta -> Quick Hive or Corsair/Reaver. Zergs will soon find a way around it.

That being said, the performance of Jaedong and Effort (especially Effort) last night wasn't too hot. Not really the best decision making I've seen by either player in recent times. I mean Effort sending streams of units in against Mech or Jaedong attacking an established Terran position without Swarm is just ugh.

On August 06 2010 09:12 krndandaman wrote:


what do you and others think about this game? not gonna say this revolutionizes zvt, but i think this was a great approach by by.hero to fool with the terran's head. (the head that's so used to standard zvt builds)



the early burrow to delay nat (while making forgg think he was going speedlings), and then faking mutas while instead going lurkers.
while forgg is preparing the wrong units to combat units that aren't even made, forgg is safely taking his expansions getting his 3rd/4th gas easily.
he then just presses his advantage with an amazing econ advantage while climbing the tech ladder quickly as well as getting his upgrades.

On August 06 2010 13:34 TriniMasta wrote:
lol using fantasy and Leta as examples, nice
main mech users in BW scene, mainly fantasy as Leta was known more for Wraith usage (that fails as well), imo fantasy is the only terran that can open mechanic against zerg properly, Midas and FlaSh are just copiers •_•

On August 06 2010 09:39 Mystlord wrote:

Another thing, Vessel count doesn't limit the Zerg's ability to go mass Mutalisks at all, especially on Polaris Rhapsody (the supposedly "imba" map of last night), because of the double gas expansion. Terran will have to get some Goliaths then to counter the Mutalisk threat, and that will pull the Terran's gas in three directions: Tank, Vessel, and Goliath, not to mention the decreased Vulture count.

On August 06 2010 17:06 hypercube wrote:
I feel silly posting in BW strategy because I don't actually play but felt this game should be mentionned too, since it was played before Fantasy vs Zero:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jJKo8KFTjo

On August 06 2010 17:12 hitthat wrote:

So we also should mention famous game Fantasy vs Jeadong in SPL great final, when the mech transition (tank banking) was critical factor that won a game. But yeah, while the Fantasy invented that style of play (tell what you want, he is true revolutionist!), that is Flash, who is making this standard. I think that Flash's perfect mechanic is the deciding factor that makes the stuff like that popular. Fantasy himself , while one of the top players, cannot be match in mechanic factor for Flash.

On August 06 2010 18:37 Navane wrote:
Isn't there an obvious way to spot the transition? We could suicide an overlord once in a while to see for instance an armory or extra factories being added on. That way we can choose to step in or over the window. T will be weak during his transition; we could expand extra or try to kill him there.

On August 06 2010 01:19 Harem wrote:
@OP: You're missing

This game shows how obnoxious Terran tech switches are nowadays.

Also, that taking a terran's potential 4th-5th gas really limits their options and potential in the later game. However, on 2p maps, it can be a lot harder to achieve this.