Exactly 25 years ago today, on May 18, 2001, the final balance patch for StarCraft: Brood War — Patch 1.08 — was released. To this day, it remains the definitive ruleset the game is still played on.
Some of the key changes introduced in Patch 1.08:
* Dragoon build time increased from 40 to 50 seconds. * Psi Storm damage reduced from 128 to 112. Before this change, a single Storm could instantly kill a Lurker. * Supply cost for Battlecruisers and Carriers reduced from 8 to 6, while the Ultralisk's supply cost was reduced from 6 to 4. * Missile Turret cost reduced from 100 to 75 minerals. * Spawning Pool cost increased from 150 to 200 minerals to nerf 4-Pool and 5-Pool builds.
Overall, the patch significantly buffed Terran while heavily nerfing Protoss. And now, a quarter of a century later, we're still living with the consequences.
When Patch 1.08 was released, modern standard maps didn’t exist yet, the meta was completely different, and many mechanics and tricks (such as muta stacking or stacking burrowed Lurkers) had not yet been discovered.
The patch itself wasn’t a mistake — the real mistake was that no further balance patches were ever released afterward.
On May 18 2026 21:34 Ryzel wrote: Okay, what changes would you recommend for a hypothetical new balance patch?
Are bug fixes considered balance patching in BW? In that case i'd suggest they fix the issue where ranged units occasionally freeze in place when you move and attack
* Psi Storm damage reduced from 128 to 112. Before this change, a single Storm could instantly kill a Lurker. * Missile Turret cost reduced from 100 to 75 minerals.
Keep the old cost would be really balance more so much.
Psi Storm is high risk high reward. Less Turret more Marine.
Zealot 100 mineral > 75 mineral Arbiter Recall 150 energy > 100 energy Reaver 15 mineral > 0 mineral Dark Archon Maelstrom 100 energy > 10 energy
Remove Forge, upgrade acttack and armor for all units is only from Cybernetics Core Photon Cannon build time 38 seconds > 15 seconds Nexus 400 mineral > 500 mineral
Terran
Vulture 3 Spider Mines > 1 Spider Mine Tank remove Siege Mode, range and dmg is always in Siege Mode Wraith Cloak all time
On May 18 2026 21:34 Ryzel wrote: Okay, what changes would you recommend for a hypothetical new balance patch?
I probably wouldn’t change the balance now. That should have happened much earlier — around 2005–2007 — once it became clear that there were structural issues with ZvP and TvZ.
That said, if Blizzard suddenly decided to make balance changes today, I wouldn’t be opposed to it either.
What I’d rather see instead is moving away from standard Fighting Spirit-style maps that reinforce or even exaggerate the current status quo. Instead of having 5 or 6 maps like that in a 7-map pool, there should maybe be only one.
The rest of the map pool should consist of maps more like Roaring Currents, Death Valley, Troy SE, Plasma, Inner Coven, Sparkle, Gold Rush and similar experimental or asymmetric maps.
And only if that approach failed would I seriously return to the idea of balance patches.
On May 18 2026 21:56 SCRVN wrote: I think we need a new patch:
Protoss
Zealot 100 mineral > 75 mineral Arbiter Recall 150 energy > 100 energy Reaver 15 mineral > 0 mineral Dark Archon Maelstrom 100 energy > 10 energy
Remove Forge, upgrade acttack and armor for all units is only from Cybernetics Core Photon Cannon build time 38 seconds > 15 seconds Nexus 400 mineral > 500 mineral
Why don't you just remove zerg entirely at this point lmao
One thing that I see every time this discussion comes up is that people suggest changes that are so big that they would make the game instantly unplayable at the highest level.
It's true that on most maps that are actually used on the ladder / ASL, protoss is unfavoured against Zerg. But doing things like reducing Zealot cost from 100 to 75 would swing it very far in the opposite direction. Imagine a two-gate opener - right now it puts Zerg under a lot of pressure, but it Zerg defends correctly, they can have an advantage, because of how much the Protoss build was slowed down. Now, at the reduced cost, by the time you've made 6 Zealots, you've saved up enough minerals for a "free" forge. In essence, 2-gate in main would become much less risky for Protoss. Also, keep in mind that this stays for the whole game.
The interesting thing about BW is that instead of directly balance patching the base game, balance decisions are generally made through the map pool (take a look at this most recent ASL regarding the insanely Terran-favored maps). Certain map features tend to tilt in favor of certain races in match-ups, for instance things like ability to wall at natural choke points or having buildable terrain in the middle of the map or behind minerals, etc. This approach seems to have worked well enough through the intervening 25 years.
Unrelatedly, Maelstrom being 10 energy would be a complete joke rofl
what about an evolution chamber upgrade that gave spore colonies explosive splash damage to add some variety to ZvZ? it would be explosive so it mostly impacts mutalisks and scourge without hard countering corsairs in PvZ, but even at 50% splash damage that might be too good against sairs...but maybe if you made it expensive it could work. it's never going to happen, but it can be fun to think about.
On May 19 2026 11:56 StaticNine wrote: what about an evolution chamber upgrade that gave spore colonies explosive splash damage to add some variety to ZvZ? it would be explosive so it mostly impacts mutalisks and scourge without hard countering corsairs in PvZ, but even at 50% splash damage that might be too good against sairs...but maybe if you made it expensive it could work. it's never going to happen, but it can be fun to think about.
Just make it work Vs bio units only, like irradiate.
StarCraft will be better if it has 3 Terran, 3 Protoss, and 3 Zerg.
TerranZ in TvZ: Turret 50 Mineral, Vulture 5 Mines TerranT in TvT: Remove Tank TerranP in TvP: Vulture 1 Mine, Remove Siege Tank mode but all nomal Tanks get range and dmg like Siege Tank
ProtossZ in PvZ: Zealot 75 Mineral, Stormru one hit Lurker, Maelstrom 10 energy, Photon Cannon build time 15 seconds ProtossT in PvT: Recall 250 Energy, Nexus 500 Mineral, Zealot 125 Mineral ProtossP in PvP: Remove Reaver
ZergZ in ZvZ: Remove Lings ZergT in ZvT: Pool 300 Mineral, Ultralisk 20 Supply, Dark Swarm: Duration 3 seconds ZergP in ZvP: Remove Hydralisk, Ultralisk 1 Supply, Dark Swarm: Duration 200 seconds
On May 18 2026 21:23 Maks wrote: Overall, the patch significantly buffed Terran while heavily nerfing Protoss. And now, a quarter of a century later, we're still living with the consequences.
When Patch 1.08 was released, modern standard maps didn’t exist yet, the meta was completely different, and many mechanics and tricks (such as muta stacking or stacking burrowed Lurkers) had not yet been discovered.
The patch itself wasn’t a mistake — the real mistake was that no further balance patches were ever released afterward.
25 years of good games. this is just literal pointless balance whine.
players had to spend 25 years exploring playing and fully utilizing concepts. and without progaming and esports with millions of US dollars at stake we would have never known the answers.
bw has become one of the most greatest games ever because there was no patch. the players and the mapmakers took a beautifully designed game from blizzard and made it an extremely deep game that is still entertaining and fresh.
also consider that remastered was its own balance patch:
valkyries became more stable/usable protoss could remap probe and pylon off ‘p’ mutalisks benefitted heavily from TR-24 mapmakers received new tools / quality of life changes. the map pool before and after remastered is night and day with new concepts like butter and refined standard maps
the quality of life changes as well it was as perfect as could be helping give SC1 new life. compare with warcraft 3 remaster
On May 19 2026 15:56 rotta wrote: I just want to see the rarely/never used units and spells buffed somehow
Devourers are absolute shit, countered by scourge, BCs (yamato LUL), and only really useful on island maps, which Zerg often loses even getting a third gas via bug.
That's why even with three gas on Sparkle, Zerg doesn't actually instant win. If that was a feature on a ground map, Zerg would ez clap Terrans
The game is balanced around being a ground map because Zerg air sucks too much in Brood War
If devourers had a bazillion HP it would solve a lot on island maps. They cost 250/150! A 150/100 corsair has a combined total of 180 and a speed of 6.67 and are not affected by stuff like irradiate
i saw soO or someone in k-league use devourers vs SK terran+BC late game, so smart for countering BCs because they cost very little gas, and Z late game is generally mineral rich but gas starved
On May 19 2026 17:00 Crimson)S(hadow wrote: i saw soO or someone in k-league use devourers vs SK terran+BC late game, so smart for countering BCs because they cost very little gas, and Z late game is generally mineral rich but gas starved
Only 50 gas per devourer, way cheaper than making 8-10 scourges per BC to kill them. which often doesn't even work... I wonder how many devourers to kill 2 bc's are needed
I am always wondering if there would be a way to "unlock" the whole Ghosts portion of Terran without necessarily making them stronger in the process. But it's not just a unit that is useless but it comes with multiple buildings (attachment), mechanics (nukes) and several upgrades which are all useless (read: not cost-effective or attention-economy-effective). It's just too obvious that all of this was designed for single player missions where you pilot a single Ghost. And, sure, once in a blue moon someone does something cool with Ghosts, but the fact that this stands out so much and everyone remembers it just underscores how useless they are so that anyone making use of them instantly stands out. But to be fair, I fail to see a version of the Ghost that does not make Terran stronger, so probably not possible.
But I like to dream up a world in which Ghosts are a viable or even core late game component in both TvZ and TvP. So here are some ideas for changes that I do not consider "balance" but just wild ideas:
- Merge Wraith and Ghost cloak into a single upgrade (you can research it at any one of the addon buildings) [so you can already have this once we get to the late game] - Increase the effect of damage & armor upgrades on Ghosts to +3 damage +2 armor [relevant for..] - The Ghosts vision upgrade allows them to hit units under dark swarm [..killing lurkers under dark swarm] - Lockdown works on all flying units (instead of all mechanical) - Medic's Restauration spell is changed from single unit to small AOE, cost is increased [so there is at least a theoretical counter to red or green goo, but it's costly and micro intense]
- Scout supply reduced to 2, costs reduced to 200/100 - Scout ground attack damage increased from 8 to 12 and ground cooldown reduced from 1.26 to 0.92 (same as air) [so two scouts can two shot a drone/probe] - Scout ground & air attack upgrade scaling increased to +3 per upgrade - Scout movement speed upgrade cost reduced to 100/100 and time reduced from 105 to 80 - Scout vision upgrade now grants them detection but only right under them (very small area), cost is up to 200/200 [so you can kill burrowed units or even DTs or Wraith if you micro well]
- Devourer .. I have no idea.. anyone?
[Edit, probably a good idea to explain the rationale of those changes. Also, changing up things (in a sensible way) is a good thing for any game, League is a good example]
On May 19 2026 17:00 Crimson)S(hadow wrote: i saw soO or someone in k-league use devourers vs SK terran+BC late game, so smart for countering BCs because they cost very little gas, and Z late game is generally mineral rich but gas starved
Only 50 gas per devourer, way cheaper than making 8-10 scourges per BC to kill them. which often doesn't even work... I wonder how many devourers to kill 2 bc's are needed
just tested, assuming 0/0 upgs for both, 3 devourers is not enough for 2 BCs, but 4 devourers beats 2 BCs very comfortably
On May 19 2026 15:56 rotta wrote: I just want to see the rarely/never used units and spells buffed somehow
Devourers are absolute shit, countered by scourge, BCs (yamato LUL), and only really useful on island maps, which Zerg often loses even getting a third gas via bug.
That's why even with three gas on Sparkle, Zerg doesn't actually instant win. If that was a feature on a ground map, Zerg would ez clap Terrans
The game is balanced around being a ground map because Zerg air sucks too much in Brood War
If devourers had a bazillion HP it would solve a lot on island maps. They cost 250/150! A 150/100 corsair has a combined total of 180 and a speed of 6.67 and are not affected by stuff like irradiate
Change it so irridate is affected by armour on biological units, this way devourer does not die in one irridate cast.Alternatively increase Devourer HP by 10.
Otherwise i would be looking at improving protoss against hydra bust, probably just decrease cost of cannon to 125, increase speed of HT warp and decrease storm research cost to 150/150.Everyone agrees PvZ is imbalanced at highest levels, but better to start with very minor changes and see how it affects it, seen so many games where a tiny handful of seconds against a hydra bust would continue the game.
I can't do yet another patch discussion, but... the comsat as an addon sucks ass. That said and keeping balance whine as of last 3-4 years in mind, maybe Terran deserves that added inconvenience for being the statiscally better race.
The in game timer was both the best and worst feature to be added ever. Real old graphics are still superior to the redumbed one. I miss playing 1.16.1
Scout is expensive as fuck and could use a tiny tiny upgrade, but the reality is that Protoss doesn't need that, in the same way ghost and devourer don't need a buff.
EPT
