On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
Wc3 has the same built in delay. We're waiting on the day it gets fixed, too.
Well, with SC2 they kept the WC3 delay. Dota2 kept the Dota delay from WC3, to be more authentic. LoL has the same delay.
So most people got used to SC2 build-in delay, which would be completely unacceptable post-lan latency in SC BW. People got used to it. SC2 players stop caring. They either came from WC3, LoL, Dota2, and are used to it. When they came from LAN lat SC, they either quiit or stopped caring.
People used to build-in delay of SC2, WC3, Dota2, LoL, they say they don't feel it. They don't feel something is wrong.
But when you play HoN or SC, it is obvious something is wrong and it is unplayable 'until you get used to it'. Blizzard in beta even reduced the build-in delay for a while during SC2. Then they came out and said 'no one noticed it, as no one talked about it', and they promptly turned it back on.
There is 10,000 pages on balance talk on the SC2 page, but almost none on the build-in delay.
For me, there is no reason to 'get used to' a huge build-in delay. But I guess I am weird.
SC2 does not have a WC3-style delay. WC3 delay its literally 250ms when you're playing on Battle.net versus other forms of the game. Hence why even though WC3 has a built in ladder as opposed to BW, Battle.net is still unplayable with the delay and most serious people play on 3rd party platforms.
On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
400ms delay? I have a ping of ~30ms on LoL, if I had a ping of 400 I would go insane.
I don't think he plays league so he probably doesn't know. The game would be unplayable at that ping.
I don't think anybody in the US gets 400ms. Before the server switch I was at a steady 40ms, now I'm at a stable 75ish
On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
Wc3 has the same built in delay. We're waiting on the day it gets fixed, too.
Well, with SC2 they kept the WC3 delay. Dota2 kept the Dota delay from WC3, to be more authentic. LoL has the same delay.
So most people got used to SC2 build-in delay, which would be completely unacceptable post-lan latency in SC BW. People got used to it. SC2 players stop caring. They either came from WC3, LoL, Dota2, and are used to it. When they came from LAN lat SC, they either quiit or stopped caring.
People used to build-in delay of SC2, WC3, Dota2, LoL, they say they don't feel it. They don't feel something is wrong.
But when you play HoN or SC, it is obvious something is wrong and it is unplayable 'until you get used to it'. Blizzard in beta even reduced the build-in delay for a while during SC2. Then they came out and said 'no one noticed it, as no one talked about it', and they promptly turned it back on.
There is 10,000 pages on balance talk on the SC2 page, but almost none on the build-in delay.
For me, there is no reason to 'get used to' a huge build-in delay. But I guess I am weird.
SC2 does not have a WC3-style delay. WC3 delay its literally 250ms when you're playing on Battle.net versus other forms of the game. Hence why even though WC3 has a built in ladder as opposed to BW, Battle.net is still unplayable with the delay and most serious people play on 3rd party platforms.
I don't play sc2 but how is the ping there? Anybody can tell me for comparison's sake?
On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
Wc3 has the same built in delay. We're waiting on the day it gets fixed, too.
Well, with SC2 they kept the WC3 delay. Dota2 kept the Dota delay from WC3, to be more authentic. LoL has the same delay.
So most people got used to SC2 build-in delay, which would be completely unacceptable post-lan latency in SC BW. People got used to it. SC2 players stop caring. They either came from WC3, LoL, Dota2, and are used to it. When they came from LAN lat SC, they either quiit or stopped caring.
People used to build-in delay of SC2, WC3, Dota2, LoL, they say they don't feel it. They don't feel something is wrong.
But when you play HoN or SC, it is obvious something is wrong and it is unplayable 'until you get used to it'. Blizzard in beta even reduced the build-in delay for a while during SC2. Then they came out and said 'no one noticed it, as no one talked about it', and they promptly turned it back on.
There is 10,000 pages on balance talk on the SC2 page, but almost none on the build-in delay.
For me, there is no reason to 'get used to' a huge build-in delay. But I guess I am weird.
SC2 does not have a WC3-style delay. WC3 delay its literally 250ms when you're playing on Battle.net versus other forms of the game. Hence why even though WC3 has a built in ladder as opposed to BW, Battle.net is still unplayable with the delay and most serious people play on 3rd party platforms.
I don't play sc2 but how is the ping there? Anybody can tell me for comparison's sake?
Your ms is your ms, it's not a built in ms delay like Star1 and War3 battle.net games.
On March 28 2017 08:28 ted. wrote: Anyone know if UPnP automatically opens ports? Or does it just not rely on that anymore?
The reason I ask is that I work at a boarding school so I am on their network. Through my router I am not able to open my ports. I think the only way I could open ports would be contacting the school's IT and having them do it. I am hoping this UPnP will just not require these ports to be open. I can play xbox live and other online games fine, bw just lags to hell.
Sup Ted, long time no see!
UPnP can automatically open ports (or the equivalent of that), but the router you're using needs to support it and it needs to be turned on in the router. Which I doubt is true in a place like school, but you never know. You should still be able host/play on ShieldBattery without any problems .
I wish Blizzard would implement Shield Battery and if two players can't active UPnP, it will switch automatically to Shield Battery.
I don't wish Shield Battery becoming a separate server, but rather integrated to system.
On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
Wc3 has the same built in delay. We're waiting on the day it gets fixed, too.
Well, with SC2 they kept the WC3 delay. Dota2 kept the Dota delay from WC3, to be more authentic. LoL has the same delay.
So most people got used to SC2 build-in delay, which would be completely unacceptable post-lan latency in SC BW. People got used to it. SC2 players stop caring. They either came from WC3, LoL, Dota2, and are used to it. When they came from LAN lat SC, they either quiit or stopped caring.
People used to build-in delay of SC2, WC3, Dota2, LoL, they say they don't feel it. They don't feel something is wrong.
But when you play HoN or SC, it is obvious something is wrong and it is unplayable 'until you get used to it'. Blizzard in beta even reduced the build-in delay for a while during SC2. Then they came out and said 'no one noticed it, as no one talked about it', and they promptly turned it back on.
There is 10,000 pages on balance talk on the SC2 page, but almost none on the build-in delay.
For me, there is no reason to 'get used to' a huge build-in delay. But I guess I am weird.
SC2 does not have a WC3-style delay. WC3 delay its literally 250ms when you're playing on Battle.net versus other forms of the game. Hence why even though WC3 has a built in ladder as opposed to BW, Battle.net is still unplayable with the delay and most serious people play on 3rd party platforms.
SC2 definitely does have a forced delay of about 200ms. Dota2 does too. HotS doesn't.
On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
Wc3 has the same built in delay. We're waiting on the day it gets fixed, too.
Well, with SC2 they kept the WC3 delay. Dota2 kept the Dota delay from WC3, to be more authentic. LoL has the same delay.
So most people got used to SC2 build-in delay, which would be completely unacceptable post-lan latency in SC BW. People got used to it. SC2 players stop caring. They either came from WC3, LoL, Dota2, and are used to it. When they came from LAN lat SC, they either quiit or stopped caring.
People used to build-in delay of SC2, WC3, Dota2, LoL, they say they don't feel it. They don't feel something is wrong.
But when you play HoN or SC, it is obvious something is wrong and it is unplayable 'until you get used to it'. Blizzard in beta even reduced the build-in delay for a while during SC2. Then they came out and said 'no one noticed it, as no one talked about it', and they promptly turned it back on.
There is 10,000 pages on balance talk on the SC2 page, but almost none on the build-in delay.
For me, there is no reason to 'get used to' a huge build-in delay. But I guess I am weird.
SC2 does not have a WC3-style delay. WC3 delay its literally 250ms when you're playing on Battle.net versus other forms of the game. Hence why even though WC3 has a built in ladder as opposed to BW, Battle.net is still unplayable with the delay and most serious people play on 3rd party platforms.
SC2 definitely does have a forced delay of about 200ms. Dota2 does too. HotS doesn't.
SC2 doesn't have a forced delay. You can check it yourself by going to custom games, right clicking on a map and creating an offline game. You'll get a game with 0 ping. Compare that to ladder, and it's similar (depending on your ping).
250ms is what I get to brazil and it's almost unplayable. It's definitely not forced to 250 all the time lol
On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
Wc3 has the same built in delay. We're waiting on the day it gets fixed, too.
Well, with SC2 they kept the WC3 delay. Dota2 kept the Dota delay from WC3, to be more authentic. LoL has the same delay.
So most people got used to SC2 build-in delay, which would be completely unacceptable post-lan latency in SC BW. People got used to it. SC2 players stop caring. They either came from WC3, LoL, Dota2, and are used to it. When they came from LAN lat SC, they either quiit or stopped caring.
People used to build-in delay of SC2, WC3, Dota2, LoL, they say they don't feel it. They don't feel something is wrong.
But when you play HoN or SC, it is obvious something is wrong and it is unplayable 'until you get used to it'. Blizzard in beta even reduced the build-in delay for a while during SC2. Then they came out and said 'no one noticed it, as no one talked about it', and they promptly turned it back on.
There is 10,000 pages on balance talk on the SC2 page, but almost none on the build-in delay.
For me, there is no reason to 'get used to' a huge build-in delay. But I guess I am weird.
SC2 does not have a WC3-style delay. WC3 delay its literally 250ms when you're playing on Battle.net versus other forms of the game. Hence why even though WC3 has a built in ladder as opposed to BW, Battle.net is still unplayable with the delay and most serious people play on 3rd party platforms.
SC2 definitely does have a forced delay of about 200ms. Dota2 does too. HotS doesn't.
What? It absolutely does not. 200ms would be unplayable in today's modern environment. Dota 2 doesn't have any such delay either. What we're talking about is the built in delay Blizzard added for Battle.net before broadband was a thing so ping wouldnt be a HUGE advantage.They stopped doing it for SC2 but WC3 and BW suffer from such a delay.
On March 28 2017 06:27 Spec1aLisT wrote: Can someone explain to me, if they will change the Latency completely and make it mandatory to everyone to play at Lan speeds? I Love the latency now(low latency). Because I play a game called Snipers and it needs it to be that way, otherwise the game mechanics are ruined.
There is no reason to think it won't have the same latency as WC3 and SC2; battle.net latency.
Blizzard has never patched LAN latency into SC with any of their patches, nor acknowledged it's importance for SC2. I get shivers about how everyone in 2017 playing DOTA2, LoL and SC2 is used to playing with 400ms delay.
Wc3 has the same built in delay. We're waiting on the day it gets fixed, too.
Well, with SC2 they kept the WC3 delay. Dota2 kept the Dota delay from WC3, to be more authentic. LoL has the same delay.
So most people got used to SC2 build-in delay, which would be completely unacceptable post-lan latency in SC BW. People got used to it. SC2 players stop caring. They either came from WC3, LoL, Dota2, and are used to it. When they came from LAN lat SC, they either quiit or stopped caring.
People used to build-in delay of SC2, WC3, Dota2, LoL, they say they don't feel it. They don't feel something is wrong.
But when you play HoN or SC, it is obvious something is wrong and it is unplayable 'until you get used to it'. Blizzard in beta even reduced the build-in delay for a while during SC2. Then they came out and said 'no one noticed it, as no one talked about it', and they promptly turned it back on.
There is 10,000 pages on balance talk on the SC2 page, but almost none on the build-in delay.
For me, there is no reason to 'get used to' a huge build-in delay. But I guess I am weird.
SC2 does not have a WC3-style delay. WC3 delay its literally 250ms when you're playing on Battle.net versus other forms of the game. Hence why even though WC3 has a built in ladder as opposed to BW, Battle.net is still unplayable with the delay and most serious people play on 3rd party platforms.
SC2 definitely does have a forced delay of about 200ms. Dota2 does too. HotS doesn't.
What? It absolutely does not. 200ms would be unplayable in today's modern environment. Dota 2 doesn't have any such delay either. What we're talking about is the built in delay Blizzard added for Battle.net before broadband was a thing so ping wouldnt be a HUGE advantage.They stopped doing it for SC2 but WC3 and BW suffer from such a delay.
Yes, it does have delay. Are you playing Dota2 regularly? Then you probably got used to the delay. Try playing HotS for a few weeks and then go back to Dota2. You will become aware of the forced delay
I tried dota 2 and i thought it felt "sluggish". I know when i played hon that i noticed that the response was fast. For sc2 i wasnt aware of it, but still feels really bad if blizzard said that they reverted it back to the long delay since people didnt talk about it.
Could it be because people accept what they are dealt? Why think about something that you think cant be changed.
I don't notice any delay in Dota2 when I'm playing with low ping. Do you have any recent source about the input delay that you mentioned? The link you gave is 5 years old.
On March 29 2017 01:40 Sr18 wrote: I don't notice any delay in Dota2 when I'm playing with low ping. Do you have any recent source about the input delay that you mentioned? The link you gave is 5 years old.
I think 5 years ago, there was "some" delay, but a good chunk of the whining was from kids from HoN and LoL that really disliked the cast and turn speeds of Dota 2.
So, judging by what I've read here and elsewhere, I don't need to get signed up on iccup / use mca64 launcher, as people will be using bnet servers. What about maps though? Should I download iccup map packs or anything like that? Playing around on BW doing some vs AI games it seems like these maps are pretty outdated.
On March 29 2017 01:40 Sr18 wrote: I don't notice any delay in Dota2 when I'm playing with low ping. Do you have any recent source about the input delay that you mentioned? The link you gave is 5 years old.
I only have my personal experience. I tried Dota2 after playing HotS (Heroes of the Storm) for a while, and the delay felt horrible, despite 30ms ping. This was after the Source2 engine update, if I remember correctly.
I'm considering installing Dota2 again, to see it with my own eyes again.
If anyone wants to do some experiments, HotS is a great baseline for a game without forced delay. LoL is without forced delay too, I believe.
On March 29 2017 01:40 Sr18 wrote: I don't notice any delay in Dota2 when I'm playing with low ping. Do you have any recent source about the input delay that you mentioned? The link you gave is 5 years old.
I think 5 years ago, there was "some" delay, but a good chunk of the whining was from kids from HoN and LoL that really disliked the cast and turn speeds of Dota 2.
Either that, or you're wrong and there really is a forced delay, but you got used to it.
On March 29 2017 01:40 Sr18 wrote: I don't notice any delay in Dota2 when I'm playing with low ping. Do you have any recent source about the input delay that you mentioned? The link you gave is 5 years old.
I think 5 years ago, there was "some" delay, but a good chunk of the whining was from kids from HoN and LoL that really disliked the cast and turn speeds of Dota 2.
LoL players cried about the cast and turn speed in Dota 2? I haven't played Dota 2 myself but the turn speed/casting animation canceling in LoL was abysmal...
i really think there is confusion between people feeling "forced delay" and a game that has actually turn rates/auto atk animations
LoL to Dota feels awful to people because every LoL hero has instant turn rates. I doubt anyone can distinguish the "feel" between the either this "forced delay" or whether its just getting used to turn rates.
On March 29 2017 02:06 mOnion wrote: i really think there is confusion between people feeling "forced delay" and a game that has actually turn rates/auto atk animations
LoL to Dota feels awful to people because every LoL hero has instant turn rates. I doubt anyone can distinguish the "feel" between the either this "forced delay" or whether its just getting used to turn rates.
if dota had forced lag, pros would notice by now
What's so absurd about thinking that Dota2 still has forced delay? Especially considering that other games like SC2 also have forced delay. The pros obviously got used to it, like they did in Dota1 and SC2.
Anyway, I'm downloading Dota2 to test it... 3 hours download though. No one will remember this discussion by the time my download has finished. Feels bad.
EPT
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