EPTArtosis talks about this here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1249297340?t=1h10m55s
BW General Discussion - Page 402
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Puosu
7101 Posts
Artosis talks about this here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1249297340?t=1h10m55s | ||
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sntct
100 Posts
On January 02 2022 07:35 Puosu wrote: Apparently Artosis had done casts for the new ASTL season, but they were blocked from releasing the casts. Artosis talks about this here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1249297340?t=1h10m55s Who blocked it? | ||
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TornadoSteve
1144 Posts
I feel pretty safe to answer it without any further informations : nope, he is far from being ok. User was warned for this post. | ||
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ggsimida
1156 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
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Timebon3s
Norway772 Posts
On January 02 2022 07:35 Puosu wrote: Apparently Artosis had done casts for the new ASTL season, but they were blocked from releasing the casts. Artosis talks about this here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1249297340?t=1h10m55s This is so fucking lame. Why on earth do the Koreans want to limit bws exposure outside of Korea? The same thing happened to Sayle when he tried streaming their stuff. This legit pisses me off | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8939 Posts
you cant have a twitch/youtube streamer casting afreeca content and have none of the money he receives going to afreeca. its a fairly no brainer commercial decision. you want artosis to cast astl, tell him to get become a streamer on afreeca, instead of jumping on some dumb "koreans dont want sc outside of korea!! herp" nonsense | ||
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Puosu
7101 Posts
I guess we'll see if they've just now decided to quit youtube, or if this is something else. And iirc. Artosis can't stream on afreeca because of his twitch contract. It certainly sucks if these kinds of business decisions on part of Afreeca/Twitch make it harder for BW to survive outside of Korea. edit: Actually I can't find any Korean ASL vods on youtube. So maybe I remember wrong or they have removed the uploads. The old English ASL casts are still there tho. | ||
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Lorch
Germany3711 Posts
Really unfortunate about ASTL. Given that Tastosis dont cast live anymore, I guess the only way would be for them to stream the vods on Afreeca or something? It does seem very odd though. Afreeca gives them commentary free vods for ASL, so I'd imagine the same happened for ASTL. I don't see why else Tastosis would start casting before being allowed to release. Blocking it after the fact is quite odd. I hope Afreeca and Tastosis can find some kind of agreement for future ASTL seasons  | ||
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Timebon3s
Norway772 Posts
This is the same as sharing music. If u want people to notice u, you gotta get your product out there. Doesn’t seem like there’s much creativity on their part to make something happen or get some kind of profit out of their product | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On January 04 2022 04:18 Timebon3s wrote: I understand that they don’t want to support the English scene if there’s not enough money to gain from it, but actively working against it is fucking retarded. They should be stoked people actually care about Starcraft. This is the same as sharing music. If u want people to notice u, you gotta get your product out there. Doesn’t seem like there’s much creativity on their part to make something happen or get some kind of profit out of their product The Tastosis/ASL compromise with later VoDs after the live broadcasts seemed pretty reasonable. It’s a goodwill thing if nothing else, I can’t see there being much people sitting in the category of foreign BW fans who don’t know Korean to milk revenue from. Do Afreeca ads even pay out outside the Korean market? I’ve watched Nyoken/Scan as much as Tastosis in the past so hopefully that’s still an option moving on. | ||
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M3t4PhYzX
Poland4300 Posts
On January 02 2022 07:35 Puosu wrote: Apparently Artosis had done casts for the new ASTL season, but they were blocked from releasing the casts. Artosis talks about this here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1249297340?t=1h10m55s well this fucking sucks a big one.. T_T whoever did that, stink makes no sense | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8939 Posts
On January 04 2022 03:08 Lorch wrote: Every single big BW streamer has a youtube channel though, I dont see Afreeca having a problem with that. Really unfortunate about ASTL. Given that Tastosis dont cast live anymore, I guess the only way would be for them to stream the vods on Afreeca or something? It does seem very odd though. Afreeca gives them commentary free vods for ASL, so I'd imagine the same happened for ASTL. I don't see why else Tastosis would start casting before being allowed to release. Blocking it after the fact is quite odd. I hope Afreeca and Tastosis can find some kind of agreement for future ASTL seasons every single big bw streamer has a youtube channel that posts clips or vids of their afreeca stream. afreeca has already taken their cut so it doesnt matter what the streamers do with their content as long as its within their partnership agreements. if artosis was to cast astl theres no way afreeca gets any money outside of artosis literally paying for the broadcasting rights. seriously its not rocket science. i mean maybe artosis actually did pay to cast astl, but i highly doubt it and theres no evidence of that happening. why should afreeca do it for charity though? perhaps you should propose to artosis that he does pay for the cast and you can send your donations to him instead, although i doubt even artosis would be interested in such a deal | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On January 04 2022 08:42 evilfatsh1t wrote: every single big bw streamer has a youtube channel that posts clips or vids of their afreeca stream. afreeca has already taken their cut so it doesnt matter what the streamers do with their content as long as its within their partnership agreements. if artosis was to cast astl theres no way afreeca gets any money outside of artosis literally paying for the broadcasting rights. seriously its not rocket science. i mean maybe artosis actually did pay to cast astl, but i highly doubt it and theres no evidence of that happening. why should afreeca do it for charity though? perhaps you should propose to artosis that he does pay for the cast and you can send your donations to him instead, although i doubt even artosis would be interested in such a deal Wasn’t a stretch goal on the initial Gofundme/Patreon (or whatever platform) for ASL that they’d do ASTL? Which I believe they more than hit, and they basically did pay to cast that way for the ASL right? Was my understanding of how things went down, it’s a while ago now so this may not be correct. If I’m completely talking out my arse, I’m happy to be corrected folks, just my recollections of the rather tortuous process last time. If they didn’t pay Afreeca, and Afreeca just let them do it on the proviso that it wasn’t live and came out later as a VoD on YouTube, what’s different this time around? | ||
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Lorch
Germany3711 Posts
On January 04 2022 08:42 evilfatsh1t wrote: every single big bw streamer has a youtube channel that posts clips or vids of their afreeca stream. afreeca has already taken their cut so it doesnt matter what the streamers do with their content as long as its within their partnership agreements. if artosis was to cast astl theres no way afreeca gets any money outside of artosis literally paying for the broadcasting rights. seriously its not rocket science. i mean maybe artosis actually did pay to cast astl, but i highly doubt it and theres no evidence of that happening. why should afreeca do it for charity though? perhaps you should propose to artosis that he does pay for the cast and you can send your donations to him instead, although i doubt even artosis would be interested in such a deal I am paying for a Patreon that pays for ASL casts and I was under the impression that given that they far surpased their initial goals, it was also gonna go towards ASTL rights. I mean they kept talking about negotiating rights, so I'd imagine some of the Patreon cash did go towards that. I also fail to see why they would first cast it and then ask ASTL for rights/vods. So to me this seems like Afreeca ditched out of the deal last second just as they were ready to release their stuff. Also it would have gone on the same Afreeca Youtube channel that they also post their ASL vods on. While it may get demonitized due to conflicting music copyright laws between the US and Korea, it gives exposure to Afreeca as a plattform at the very least. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8939 Posts
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Jealous
10407 Posts
On January 04 2022 09:57 Lorch wrote: I am paying for a Patreon that pays for ASL casts and I was under the impression that given that they far surpased their initial goals, it was also gonna go towards ASTL rights. I mean they kept talking about negotiating rights, so I'd imagine some of the Patreon cash did go towards that. I also fail to see why they would first cast it and then ask ASTL for rights/vods. So to me this seems like Afreeca ditched out of the deal last second just as they were ready to release their stuff. Also it would have gone on the same Afreeca Youtube channel that they also post their ASL vods on. While it may get demonitized due to conflicting music copyright laws between the US and Korea, it gives exposure to Afreeca as a plattform at the very least. On January 04 2022 10:14 evilfatsh1t wrote: i cant comment on what happened with patreon and all that so no idea. just saying the only logical conclusion right now is that afreeca obviously feels they arent getting something out of the astl casts. like posters have already brought up, there isnt much reason otherwise to forbid the casts from happening Although Artosis said that he has already spent money on this, I find it hard to believe that Afreeca would take his money and then say "nah tough luck we changed our minds." I think that he spent the money and invested the effort much like the people who supported the Patreon in the hopes of getting ASTL casted: on spec. Certainly does suck that it went down this way, but that is the risk associated with doing business that way IMO. I believe that it was GTR who many years ago confirmed that advertising to foreign viewers grants no income to tournament organizers in Korea. For example, even if it was called Gillette OSL, it was sponsored by Gillette Korea which is functionally a separate entity from Gillette elsewhere. Views from foreign IPs are of no interest to them because even if foreigners buy a thousand Gillette razors, Gillette Korea doesn't see a dime. Furthermore, the fact that Artosis signed a contract with Twitch is not something that helps the situation, nor is it Afreeca's fault. With that in mind, it makes complete sense for them to not invest any effort into collaborating with foreigner casters and audiences, because in effect it potentially* loses them money to do so in the form of hours spent negotiating, sharing files, oversight and maintenance, accounting, etc. I get that people are upset, but saying "it makes no sense" just demonstrates a lack of thought and understanding. Being upset with Afreeca is what doesn't make sense in this situation IMO. It will be interesting to see how the Patreon supporters and Artosis handle this situation going forward; obviously, not every person who donates does so specifically for ongoing ASTL/ASL coverage, but the fact that Artosis (and Tasteless, right?) are now receiving a hefty sum of cash every month with no project in the works and no deliverables on the horizon does seem like a potential problem that needs solving. *Edit: Even of Tastosis paid out of pocket in order to get the rights to do so, I believe that it wouldn't be an amount that Afreeca would consider worthwhile for their investment of labor and oversight, but I do agree with someone who above said that maybe they weren't creative enough with how they could make it profitable. Perhaps holding an English-targetted donation drive for Afreeca themselves instead of Tastosis' Patreon in order to gauge interest could have been an idea? However, that also requires some time, effort, advertising, etc... | ||
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Ivory Coast859 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
It seems, odd. I’m presuming Artosis desired/had a clean feed to cast over. Unless he records separate audio over the live feed and syncs it over a clean feed provided later. If the former then why provide a clean feed if it’s not going to be authorised to be released. If the latter it’s plausible that Artosis just went and recorded a cast, assuming but not confirming it would be a-OK and that’s what’s happened. If they can’t monetise their content outside of Korea though, while there’s little incentive to assist in an English broadcast/VoDs, there’s little incentive to stop the production of content of that kind too right? And is Nyoscan off the table for this? | ||
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moktira
Ireland1548 Posts
On January 04 2022 21:18 WombaT wrote: And is Nyoscan off the table for this? Scan said here that StarcastTV didn't get permission to do an English cast, he didn't know the reason but said you could ask Cruiser who runs the channel. | ||
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