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i highly doubt anyone besides MAYBE gom would buy the ip rights to SC1 at higher than mbc/ogn would be willing to offer it because there aren't any players besides in KESPA
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If the Proleague never comes
Will she know how much I loved her
Did I try in every way to show her every season
That she's my only one
And if my ip rights on earth were through
And she must face Blizard without me
Is the love I gave her in the past
Gonna be enough to last
If the Proleague never comes...
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If they don't have this all sorted out now, there just going to run into the same problems when they want to broadcast a Starcraft 2 via MBC or OGN to a mainstream Korean audience. It's best that they are doing this now and taking the risk of taking competition in Brood War, a game they don't really care about from a financial standpoint, rather than waiting and screwing it up with Starcraft 2. Furthermore, if this forces Brood War to die, then that will hasten the transfer of progamers to Star 2. IMO, it's a win win situation for Blizzard. MBC should have negotiated, and hopefully OGN will get their shit together before the same happens to them.
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On October 23 2010 15:12 PalaceAthene wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2010 14:48 cocoa_sg wrote:On October 23 2010 14:06 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 14:03 StatiC)Ex( wrote:
Does no one here agree with the saying "Out with the old, in with the new?"
It's only right to move on.
Conservatives. -_- I agree. Tex-Mex for everyone! So you both would rather see BW die than support the co-existence of both BW and SC2 as two viable and distinct e-sports? Great... you are not helping our cause here. We want to see e-sports survive, but if BW dies, e-sports will have gone backwards by several years. As much as I want to swear at you both, I will not say anything more here. -_- Again, BW and SC2 aren't sports, they are used for e-sports. Just like Halo 3 is used for e-sports, and isn't a sport itself. Fine line in semantics here. E-sports will be around as long as people play their Team Fortress 2 and counter-strike or whatever. SC2 and SC will still be used in E-sports, regardless of what happens in this situation. Someone else will license the permissions if MBC/OGN falls, after all when Gom licensed permissions to broadcast games, Blizzard gave them the contract at the price of $1. ...And then KeSPA threatened them and pretty much shut them down by witholding their own players. That's when Blizzard started seeing KeSPA as a threat, but now I'm just running off on a tangent.
Am I reading this right?
You AGREED with StatiC)Ex that "out with the OLD, in with the NEW".
That implies you are supporting the notion that BW has to cease existing, and that SC2 has to take its place.
I then argued with this perspective in mind. You are only contradicting yourself when you say afterwards, "SC2 AND SC will still be used in E-sports...".
Oh, the irony.
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I thought Ongamenet had a deal with GomTV?
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On October 23 2010 09:36 Shiragaku wrote:
...For some reason, I am supporting MBC over Blizzard. Is that normal?
I don`t support anybody... they both are acting like children. Blizzardhasnt given a shit till SC2 is out and MBC is trying to pull a fast one by not paying it. There`s no way they can win.
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On October 23 2010 14:37 Antiochus wrote:
Sigh and just when I thought they might finally make some progress =\
This is actually the definition of progress.
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On October 23 2010 09:39 syllogism wrote:
They should have done this years ago
dont you get that this was all planned?
from blizzards perspective:
BW pro-league was free advertising and passive hype-building for SC2. Now, the latter is out so it's time to kick BW to the curb. R>I>P
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KOTIIIIIIIK!!!
User was warned for this post
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On October 23 2010 15:08 Enderbantoo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2010 14:01 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 13:55 ghrur wrote:On October 23 2010 13:39 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 13:30 ghrur wrote:On October 23 2010 13:25 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 13:19 zenMaster wrote:On October 23 2010 13:13 deafhobbit wrote:On October 23 2010 13:06 Hikko wrote:On October 23 2010 13:00 deafhobbit wrote:
[quote]
Any yet Blizzard ISN'T holding back esports by trying to ban anyone from participating in any further OSL's, MSL's, Courage Tournaments, or Proleague matches?
Currently, they aren't. The only thing they're pissed about is the fact that the broadcasting organizations did not pay their dues in order to broadcast Starcraft games even though they were explicitly told so or risk legal consequences. Notice MBC and OGN are being sued. Not KeSPA. They're submitting for an injunction to stop proleague. The specter of this is why OGN and MBC are hesitant to start up new starleagues right now. Yeah, they're trying to fuck over esports. Yes, we love E-Sports but we will stop proleague if we don't get control over everything. I'm so mad I will punch a kitten. They only want to control their product. *IB4 people argue soccer balls or whatever stupid analogies they bring up* And no, pro sports are not owned by anybody but Starcraft isn't a sport. Starcraft is a product that is used to play a sport ("e-sports"). OGN and MBC, and in turn KeSPA has never had the right to use Starcraft for their business. Pro sports ARE owned by people, especially the broadcasting of sports. Examples include the NBA, the NFL, and the MLB. All of them have a "do not broadcast without the permission of _______" before their games. In this case, Basketball:NBA, Starcraft:Kespa. Wrong, it's been stated that KeSPA had bought the rights from HanBitSoft. They also had the right when they themselves bought the game... unless you're saying we can't put up our starcraft matches on youtube now without paying Blizzard royalties. Finally, their business is based around the matches. Starcraft matches are their product, which are a combination of many things, just like NBA matches are a product of many people's hard work. Funny thing, uploading videos on certain sites restrict content from games. The thing is, Gaming law is sketchy in the sense that it hasn't been explored as much as Movies, TVs, and sports even. And while it's been stated KeSPA bought rights from HanBitSoft, they were just the distributor. Like how Capcom distributes GTA games in Japan, they have no right to do with whatever they want concerning the IP itself, they're just the ones that translate it, and sale to the stores to retail. Comparing games to sports or anything is a fallacy, because game laws aren't as cut clear as sport fair use is. Take Blip TV: http://blip.tv/faq/content/From the content restrictions: It is also our policy not to accept videogame screen recordings. So as it stands it's sketchy when it comes to broadcasting copyright content from videogames. Maybe commentators can throw their 2 cents into the ring, seeing as they freely upload casts, they know more than us. I don't understand, if gaming law hasn't been explored as you stated, how can you then make the second statement about HanBitSoft and being "just the distributor?" Also, yes, games haven't been explored as much, but we're no discussing strictly games here, we're discussing e-SPORTS as they're called. Anyway, my original point stands in that most sports HAVE companies which control the distribution of the products their organization made. Also, I'd think the Blip TV supports KeSPA if anything because it doesn't accept screen recordings, but it accepts videos with commentators. KeSPA hires the commentators in this case; they also hire the players, the observers, etc. Because Distributor, in any sense of the word, is just the company that localizes and 'distributes' the product. They have no control over the IP itself, they just have permission to distribute it.(Key work, distribute(. Again, Starcraft isn't a sport, it's a product used to play e-Sports. A product that very well has a copyright owner, and protection from that. It is not a real 'sport' in the sense that not everyone can play it;IE schools can play Basketball, but they don't have to pay the NBA or anyone license fees, but if they wanted to use Starcraft for their class or anything, they'd have to ask permission from the license holder in order to do so. That's why you can't compare Starcraft to real sports. Blip.Tv was just an example of their terms of service directly stating limitations of using gameplay content in videos. Whether they support kespa indirectly because so is irrelevant. Berkeley had a Starcraft class.... they didnt or need to get rights from Blizzard.... so that point is invalid.
Not rights, but permission.
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On October 23 2010 15:17 cocoa_sg wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2010 15:12 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 14:48 cocoa_sg wrote:On October 23 2010 14:06 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 14:03 StatiC)Ex( wrote:
Does no one here agree with the saying "Out with the old, in with the new?"
It's only right to move on.
Conservatives. -_- I agree. Tex-Mex for everyone! So you both would rather see BW die than support the co-existence of both BW and SC2 as two viable and distinct e-sports? Great... you are not helping our cause here. We want to see e-sports survive, but if BW dies, e-sports will have gone backwards by several years. As much as I want to swear at you both, I will not say anything more here. -_- Again, BW and SC2 aren't sports, they are used for e-sports. Just like Halo 3 is used for e-sports, and isn't a sport itself. Fine line in semantics here. E-sports will be around as long as people play their Team Fortress 2 and counter-strike or whatever. SC2 and SC will still be used in E-sports, regardless of what happens in this situation. Someone else will license the permissions if MBC/OGN falls, after all when Gom licensed permissions to broadcast games, Blizzard gave them the contract at the price of $1. ...And then KeSPA threatened them and pretty much shut them down by witholding their own players. That's when Blizzard started seeing KeSPA as a threat, but now I'm just running off on a tangent. Am I reading this right? You AGREED with StatiC)Ex that "out with the OLD, in with the NEW". That implies you are supporting the notion that BW has to cease existing, and that SC2 has to take its place. I then argued with this perspective in mind. You are only contradicting yourself when you say afterwards, "SC2 AND SC will still be used in E-sports...". Oh, the irony.
I thought the tex mex part gave away the sarcasm in that reply.
God, you just take this too seriously, don't you?
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On October 23 2010 15:45 PalaceAthene wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2010 15:17 cocoa_sg wrote:On October 23 2010 15:12 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 14:48 cocoa_sg wrote:On October 23 2010 14:06 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 14:03 StatiC)Ex( wrote:
Does no one here agree with the saying "Out with the old, in with the new?"
It's only right to move on.
Conservatives. -_- I agree. Tex-Mex for everyone! So you both would rather see BW die than support the co-existence of both BW and SC2 as two viable and distinct e-sports? Great... you are not helping our cause here. We want to see e-sports survive, but if BW dies, e-sports will have gone backwards by several years. As much as I want to swear at you both, I will not say anything more here. -_- Again, BW and SC2 aren't sports, they are used for e-sports. Just like Halo 3 is used for e-sports, and isn't a sport itself. Fine line in semantics here. E-sports will be around as long as people play their Team Fortress 2 and counter-strike or whatever. SC2 and SC will still be used in E-sports, regardless of what happens in this situation. Someone else will license the permissions if MBC/OGN falls, after all when Gom licensed permissions to broadcast games, Blizzard gave them the contract at the price of $1. ...And then KeSPA threatened them and pretty much shut them down by witholding their own players. That's when Blizzard started seeing KeSPA as a threat, but now I'm just running off on a tangent. Am I reading this right? You AGREED with StatiC)Ex that "out with the OLD, in with the NEW". That implies you are supporting the notion that BW has to cease existing, and that SC2 has to take its place. I then argued with this perspective in mind. You are only contradicting yourself when you say afterwards, "SC2 AND SC will still be used in E-sports...". Oh, the irony. I thought the tex mex part gave away the sarcasm in that reply. God, you just take this too seriously, don't you?
And if I failed to detect your 'sarcasm'? Whatever.
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On October 23 2010 15:20 us.insurgency wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2010 09:36 Shiragaku wrote:
...For some reason, I am supporting MBC over Blizzard. Is that normal? I don`t support anybody... they both are acting like children. Blizzardhasnt given a shit till SC2 is out and MBC is trying to pull a fast one by not paying it. There`s no way they can win.
Can't really see why it would be "pulling a fast one" when Blizzard asking for money was pretty recent. I mean MBC made it pretty clear they did not want to agree to blizzards terms. (negotiations childish sure, but neither party was willing to come to middle grounds, blizzard more so in my eyes.) If MBC wins, i suppose that will mean OGN doesn't need to pay blizzard anything as well. (though im not to sure about this)
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I would like to wish everybody in here good luck. No matter if you're hardcore SC2 or BW - You can't be rooting for Activision Blizzard on this one.
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On October 23 2010 15:49 cocoa_sg wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2010 15:45 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 15:17 cocoa_sg wrote:On October 23 2010 15:12 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 14:48 cocoa_sg wrote:On October 23 2010 14:06 PalaceAthene wrote:On October 23 2010 14:03 StatiC)Ex( wrote:
Does no one here agree with the saying "Out with the old, in with the new?"
It's only right to move on.
Conservatives. -_- I agree. Tex-Mex for everyone! So you both would rather see BW die than support the co-existence of both BW and SC2 as two viable and distinct e-sports? Great... you are not helping our cause here. We want to see e-sports survive, but if BW dies, e-sports will have gone backwards by several years. As much as I want to swear at you both, I will not say anything more here. -_- Again, BW and SC2 aren't sports, they are used for e-sports. Just like Halo 3 is used for e-sports, and isn't a sport itself. Fine line in semantics here. E-sports will be around as long as people play their Team Fortress 2 and counter-strike or whatever. SC2 and SC will still be used in E-sports, regardless of what happens in this situation. Someone else will license the permissions if MBC/OGN falls, after all when Gom licensed permissions to broadcast games, Blizzard gave them the contract at the price of $1. ...And then KeSPA threatened them and pretty much shut them down by witholding their own players. That's when Blizzard started seeing KeSPA as a threat, but now I'm just running off on a tangent. Am I reading this right? You AGREED with StatiC)Ex that "out with the OLD, in with the NEW". That implies you are supporting the notion that BW has to cease existing, and that SC2 has to take its place. I then argued with this perspective in mind. You are only contradicting yourself when you say afterwards, "SC2 AND SC will still be used in E-sports...". Oh, the irony. I thought the tex mex part gave away the sarcasm in that reply. God, you just take this too seriously, don't you? And if I failed to detect your 'sarcasm'? Whatever.
Then it's not my problem.
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5003 Posts
On October 23 2010 10:17 Wonders wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2010 10:05 infinitestory wrote:On October 23 2010 10:04 Wonders wrote:On October 23 2010 09:53 BigBadSkathe wrote:
If this lawsuit leads to the downfall of KeSPA I'm all for it. BW can and will survive without them. Every time a new detail comes out about KeSPA's actions it just makes them look less and less professional, and more and more like slime ball capitalists who could care less about the hard work that was put into making the game they make their living off of. Sure they did a lot for esports at a time when Korea needed a distraction, but a little humility would go a long way. Without Blizzard, BW wouldn't exist, and somehow they want to pretend they don't owe their livelihoods to that company. Someone more knowledgeable please correct me if I'm mistaken, but does KeSPA not consist precisely of the companies that are sponsoring the pros teams? The companies definitely have representatives in kespa, but kespa is actually a distinct entity iirc Yes I know that, but my understanding was that there's nothing apart from those companies. I remember reading in a Milkis thread somewhere that their board of directors consisted entirely of those representatives.
yeah there's a board of directors and an executive office.
kespa is a distinct entity but the companies have quite a bit of say in them. Just because kespa says something does not necessarily mean all the teams hold that position.
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Could this mean all the matches on youtube on jon747 and VioleTAK could get taken down?
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On October 23 2010 12:57 PalaceAthene wrote:
It's pointless trying to argue to them. They don't understand how at this point in time, Kespa is hurting the pro scene more than helping them by forbidding any of their players from playing in the GSL.
Shut up you fucking idiotic troll.
All you've done in the 19 posts you've been on this forum is troll and make serious errors of fact arguing against Kespa.
How about you go build Esports for 10 years, totally untouched, and have the game maker make more than ridiculous demands.
Its not about money, its about control, Blizzard even went as far as to say they have the right to the progamer contracts... how the fuck is that possible.
Negotiations broke down because blizzard asked for more than licensing money, which is all they really had the right to.
kespa was willing to pay quite early, it aint about the money, get it through your thick skulls that blizzard DEMANDED control of everything, and that is clearly arguable.
The way I see it:
Blizz asking for money is not arguable
The rest of their freakish demands are clearly arguable. They don't own the pro league, they dont own the teams, they dont have a right to audit every single fkn company.
Sick of these fanboys
User was temp banned for this post.
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Next in line would be Iccup server. Kill all the BW so the sc2 could become big.
*Yeah I reaaaaly love how Blizz is doing their business these days. Here's for Blizz 
*sarcasm 
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On October 23 2010 09:38 mustaju wrote:
I don't know what is worse. That this actually is happening or that we are bound to get a massive amount of people here saying that this is a good thing.
funny thing is, every single one who thnks and says it's "good" doesn'T have any SC:BW icon in their sigs, and are registered sth. like september 2010
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/sad/sad0123.gif)
