EPTHoly shit please read [ Edit ] - Page 6
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hunterAS
United States408 Posts
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Milzo
France656 Posts
On June 21 2004 18:55 Abyss_Bahamut wrote: Also a HUGE SHUT THE FUCK UP goes to the people who say he was using the goons to kill the turret because of scouts or dts. First of all, when the four goons were UNDER the barracks, Kingdom didn't even HAVE scouts, hell he probably didn't even warp his Stargate halfway by then. Hum, no. Just after the "battle of the four goons", focus changes to Kingdom's base, and we can see a fully completed Stargate with a Scout on top of it, + another one being researched (8'30" in the VOD). I think that Kingdom had a quick decision to make, it's that simple. Maybe he could have entered Control's base but he backed off seeing a dozen SCVs ready to pwn the four goons' asses with the support of a fresh tank just popping out of the factory closest to the wall-in. I don't think that Kingdom would have dealt much damage with these four goons, and an additionnal force of five goons was indeed "on the way" but still far from Control's base. Kingdom's decision seems all the more reasonable since he had invested a lot of money in Stargate+Scouts, so he needed to keep his units alive, in order to keep delaying Control's expansion and macro (he's late on his expanding and knows he has to warp in two expansions and make a lot of probes in the next few minutes). Kingdom lost because he didn't research speed for his zealots / didn't have enough zealots when Control pushed, not because he didn't try to push his advantage with those four goons. I rest my case. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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Milzo
France656 Posts
So it's not that surprising to see P>T on Requiem and Nostalgia, and Z>T on Namja Iyagi (Kingdom vs Control discussed above ^^). | ||
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Mora
Canada5235 Posts
u people are stupid. | ||
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Milzo
France656 Posts
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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DoubleStormIII
Korea (South)2610 Posts
And obviously OGN doesn't have that much money, so over. OVER with this stupid conspiracy theory or whatever.  If Kingdom or Control somehow gets to read these threads, they will not throw the game, but will throw up About that Kingdom game, he got harassed a lot by 2-Tank drops on his expansion (killing 7~8 Probes) and 4-Vulture drops on his main (killing another 7~8 Probes). That makes only one multi get going. And he decides to control the Scouts just in order to stop those Dropship harassments and couldn't macro well. While that was going on, Control was getting a lot of Factories, even bypassing Academy. See that he didn't have scans? He just didn't go Academy. He didn't want to waste resources on that. Kingdom also was going fast DT while fast multi, which of course will not give him enough time to speedup his Zealots. He simply didn't have that timing. And Control comes out with a group or more of Tanks, while he didn't have enough Zealots to face them. No Shuttles either becuase he didn't go Robotics. He couldn't get back either, because if he gets back, his natural and 3rd multi will get raped by Tanks on natural and Vultures on 3rd multi. (He did't have enough minerals to build Cannons) And that ends the game. Control made such a perfect timing to attack, and he attacked. Kingdom had been always wasting units on the opponent if he thinks that is needed. That's how he lost to Sunny on MTL, where he moves like 2 groups of Zealots to Sunny's Vultures and all of them gets killed, doing nothing. Kingdom's PvT superiority comes from Carriers, and he didn't go Carriers. And that was end of the story. | ||
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Ack1027
United States7873 Posts
On June 21 2004 20:33 Milzo wrote: Hum, no. Just after the "battle of the four goons", focus changes to Kingdom's base, and we can see a fully completed Stargate with a Scout on top of it, + another one being researched (8'30" in the VOD). I think that Kingdom had a quick decision to make, it's that simple. Maybe he could have entered Control's base but he backed off seeing a dozen SCVs ready to pwn the four goons' asses with the support of a fresh tank just popping out of the factory closest to the wall-in. I don't think that Kingdom would have dealt much damage with these four goons, and an additionnal force of five goons was indeed "on the way" but still far from Control's base. Kingdom's decision seems all the more reasonable since he had invested a lot of money in Stargate+Scouts, so he needed to keep his units alive, in order to keep delaying Control's expansion and macro (he's late on his expanding and knows he has to warp in two expansions and make a lot of probes in the next few minutes). Kingdom lost because he didn't research speed for his zealots / didn't have enough zealots when Control pushed, not because he didn't try to push his advantage with those four goons. I rest my case. It's funny how you know what he was thinking. There is no excuse that you can come up with that will make me change my thoughts on the 4 goon situation. As you said, the first scout was finished, I admit that. But what you failed to see was that with 4 goons under a barracks vs a tank with only 4 scvs CLOSE enough to start repairing it [ The other 6-8 scvs being a little behind, still well in Control's base ] If he really needed to kill the turret, because of his coming ' Scout ' the 5 dragoons that you say you saw COMING were way ahead of the scout, and as well all know dragoons are much faster than scouts. Kingdom easily could have destroyed the turret in time for the scout to come and ' Harass '. The four goons under the barrack by then would've targted the tank only, killing it, losing a maximum of 2-3 goons, still leaving AT LEAST one under the barrack, then soon after the 5 goons destroy the turret, they would come and relieve any more opposition at Controls entrance, The scout[s], then without any turret problems could go freely. That is what I would have done, and I gurantee you it would've worked. I'm not going to sit here and type like you and 4 others who think you know how Kingdom thought/played. | ||
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chobopeon
United States7342 Posts
On June 21 2004 18:55 Abyss_Bahamut wrote: First of all, sorry to Chobopeon, I wasn't really informed previously on Mensrea identification attempts. Second of all, wow I just want to say stfu plz to all the people who were talking about those other games. Those were definitely not * helped * [ I'm going to avoid using the word rigged here ] I've watched those games and they were all reasonable mistakes. Also a HUGE SHUT THE FUCK UP goes to the people who say he was using the goons to kill the turret because of scouts or dts. First of all, when the four goons were UNDER the barracks, Kingdom didn't even HAVE scouts, hell he probably didn't even warp his Stargate halfway by then. I'm telling you if you fucking watch it and have a open mind you will see that it's FUCKING suspicious for him to move 4 goons away from victory. The SCOUTS if you were fucking watching and not saying, omfg bullshit no rigging, came AFTER the initial block harass. They heleped prevent Control from expanding to his nat. Rebanned, your post was so fucking stupid, here it is. Alright, He goes Scouts and Dts... So everyone is freaking out over him killing a TURRET? Hmm it would seem to me that turrets are a pain in the ass against both of those things. Woot Um, wtf you moron. Did you even watch the VOD? The dts came during the last 2-3 minutes of the game in a desparate attempt by Kingdom to save himself. Control was halfway up the fucking map. The turret that I was talking about before was the one Control built at his BLOCK I.E. ENTRANCE when the only attacking units on the map were tanks and goons. i love the love at the start  anyway, im about to watch the vod. | ||
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Dick
United States717 Posts
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STIMEY d okgm fish
Canada6140 Posts
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ZyPhReX
1192 Posts
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Arbiter[frolix]
United Kingdom2674 Posts
On June 21 2004 05:12 hasuwar wrote: What do you guys think, Kingdom is going to be laughing or something at the end, if they rigged the game? What do you think? That OGN really rigged the game? Kingdom should give up being a pro-gamer and go to Hollywood, considering what a superb actor he must be to so realistically fake that reaction at the loss. It is all nonsense. | ||
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STIMEY d okgm fish
Canada6140 Posts
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TanGo
Sweden1019 Posts
And about the Nada vs Yellow, by the coments of mensrea I guess it was fairly rigged, or Nada wanted a loss ^_^ And this game, dunno since I didn't watch the vod -.- | ||
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STIMEY d okgm fish
Canada6140 Posts
again, because this post is to help those of u without comprehension skills already.. ill repeat myself. i dont think this happened, i dont care, im just saying.. its ridiculous to say "wow theres a prize and prestige, no one wuld ever rig! why woudl they?' | ||
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Milzo
France656 Posts
On June 21 2004 21:35 Abyss_Bahamut wrote: It's funny how you know what he was thinking. There is no excuse that you can come up with that will make me change my thoughts on the 4 goon situation. As you said, the first scout was finished, I admit that. But what you failed to see was that with 4 goons under a barracks vs a tank with only 4 scvs CLOSE enough to start repairing it [ The other 6-8 scvs being a little behind, still well in Control's base ] If he really needed to kill the turret, because of his coming ' Scout ' the 5 dragoons that you say you saw COMING were way ahead of the scout, and as well all know dragoons are much faster than scouts. Kingdom easily could have destroyed the turret in time for the scout to come and ' Harass '. The four goons under the barrack by then would've targted the tank only, killing it, losing a maximum of 2-3 goons, still leaving AT LEAST one under the barrack, then soon after the 5 goons destroy the turret, they would come and relieve any more opposition at Controls entrance, The scout[s], then without any turret problems could go freely. That is what I would have done, and I gurantee you it would've worked. I'm not going to sit here and type like you and 4 others who think you know how Kingdom thought/played. I'm just GUESSING what he could have thought at that moment. You fail to realize that 4 goons cannot do significant damage in a terran base when factories are still pumping units and goons are harassed by SCVs. As I said, Kingdom was late on his macro and needed to keep his goons alive in order to maintain the containment that much longer/ be able to spend a lot of minerals on two expos and many probes. I think that he was very right to do so, in the long run. | ||
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Ack1027
United States7873 Posts
You just proved to everyone that you are a newb. | ||
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STIMEY d okgm fish
Canada6140 Posts
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