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On March 02 2010 04:28 Liquid`NonY wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 04:17 Biff The Understudy wrote:
I do think that they exagerate, and I don't believe that most progamers practice 12 hours a day.
I am a musician, and I can tell you that practicing 10 hours in one day is basically spending all your time on it. Not going outside, not meeting friends. Practice, eat, take a shower, make one or two breaks not to become a zombi every two/three hours, and your day is over.
I know it is not the same, because playing a music instrument (except maybe piano, where at least you sit) is wayyyy more tiring and physical than playing starcraft, and you need much more breaks. Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day.
Now theses people play tournaments, they have to go there, to wait, they watch games, they chat on the internet and with friends at least a little bit, they do some gym, even a minimum, and sometimes they give interview. That makes a 12 hours on a daily basis straight impossible.
So I guess a good guess would be an average of 8 - 10 hours for the most crazy ones of actually playing the game. estro had 11 hours mandatory. b-team would get half a day off about once a week. a-team would sometimes get full days off and they'd also all travel to proleague matches. some people like nsp_action and say[join] would play during their break times so they'd play 12+ hours in a day it's my opinion that training that many hours isn't optimal. but it is the standard method in korea and it gets results
What I was questionning is if theses people actually play 11 hours, or is that the time they are supposed to be there, also doing stuff like watching rep, discussing strategies, or taking breaks from time to time.
My point was that if you put 11 hours practice in your schedule, you probably end up doing 8-9 hours, because you are a human and not a machine.
Congratulation for your match, it was very entertaining and amazingly high level 
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On March 02 2010 04:07 buickskylark wrote:
9-10 hours? That is utterly insane. Most athletes don't train that much.
Try playing a video game for 10 hours then try playing football, soccer, basketball or any other physical sport and see the difference. It takes a lot more to keep the body running during exercise then it does to think like in SC.
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If you read/ watch interviews of progamers, for example Artosis' interview of Moon, they block quite a bit of time for practice. 11-3, 4-9:30, 10:30 to 1:30. During that time, you are playing. If you are not playing, you are discussing strategy, of you are doing neither, you are watching reps/vods and thinking about your play from an objective standpoint. Nothing more.
From what i have seen and heard, it seems like they managers of pro teams aren't insanely strict, meaning they won't beat you or chastise you if you aren't practicing during those times, but if it reflects negatively in your play, there are about a thousand other amateurs/ semi-pros who a willing and capable of practicing and playing at or close to your level, unless you are FlaSh or Jaedong.
If top-level players are preparing for a tournament, they will practice upwards to 18 hours in a day, and some times pull marathons of 20-30 hours straight with little or no breaks.
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On March 02 2010 05:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 04:28 Liquid`NonY wrote:On March 02 2010 04:17 Biff The Understudy wrote:
I do think that they exagerate, and I don't believe that most progamers practice 12 hours a day.
I am a musician, and I can tell you that practicing 10 hours in one day is basically spending all your time on it. Not going outside, not meeting friends. Practice, eat, take a shower, make one or two breaks not to become a zombi every two/three hours, and your day is over.
I know it is not the same, because playing a music instrument (except maybe piano, where at least you sit) is wayyyy more tiring and physical than playing starcraft, and you need much more breaks. Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day.
Now theses people play tournaments, they have to go there, to wait, they watch games, they chat on the internet and with friends at least a little bit, they do some gym, even a minimum, and sometimes they give interview. That makes a 12 hours on a daily basis straight impossible.
So I guess a good guess would be an average of 8 - 10 hours for the most crazy ones of actually playing the game. estro had 11 hours mandatory. b-team would get half a day off about once a week. a-team would sometimes get full days off and they'd also all travel to proleague matches. some people like nsp_action and say[join] would play during their break times so they'd play 12+ hours in a day it's my opinion that training that many hours isn't optimal. but it is the standard method in korea and it gets results What I was questionning is if theses people actually play 11 hours, or is that the time they are supposed to be there, also doing stuff like watching rep, discussing strategies, or taking breaks from time to time. My point was that if you put 11 hours practice in your schedule, you probably end up doing 8-9 hours, because you are a human and not a machine. Congratulation for your match, it was very entertaining and amazingly high level
lick lick, how does it taste
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NonY, would you comment on what you consider other effective, yet less time consuming ways to practice (Or direct me to previous posts if you'd discussed this before).
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On March 02 2010 05:01 Biff The Understudy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 04:26 WheelOfTime wrote:On March 02 2010 04:17 Biff The Understudy wrote:
I do think that they exagerate, and I don't believe that most progamers practice 12 hours a day.
I am a musician, and I can tell you that practicing 10 hours in one day is basically spending all your time on it.
Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day.
You fail quite hard. Clearly, you're not a very good musician, and you're pretty narrow-sighted for thinking "Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day". 24 hrs in a day, with 7 hrs going to sleep and 3 hrs for food/breaks/washroom, that's still 14 hours of practice everyday. Hell, I know music majors who practice their instruments 12 hrs and study for 4 hrs a day consistently. Just because you don't have enough willpower and are narrow-sighted, doesn't mean everyone else is. Sigh. If you don't know what you are talking about, don't make dumb judgements. I am not narrow sighted, and I am training in one of the best music school in Europe. So maybe I know better than you what I talk about. And I have been playing in top orchestras, with top players. Have you played, let say, viola, once in your life? No. So let me tell you, most musicians arounds me don't have the muscles and the physical endurance to practice more than 5-6 hours regularly. If not they just break their back. Because when you are a 1 metre 60 japanese lady, you have limits, physical limits. You can play in orchestra 9 hours a day, because in orchestra you don't actually play all the time and you are sit down. Personnal practice means playing often very intensely most of the time. I can practice uo to eught hours, and I am healthy. More than that, I fall apart. And someone like Auer, I know you have never heard about him was saying his students, like Heifetz or Milstein, not more than 5 hours violin a day, because more is destructive. If you have the muscles to practice a violin Brahms concerto or something like that 11 hours a day, that's good for you. I tell you that most people can't. Now my point that to practice 8 hours, you need to block 10 or 11 hours of youur time. Because you need breaks, even if you are superman, both for your body and your mind. And in a life, you need to do some other stuff. Like Shopping to eat, make your fucking lundery, go to college, and do administrrative stuff. And meet friends from time to time, take lessons in college, walk from one place to another, relax a little bit, cook, etc etc etc etc etc etc So unless you sleep 3 hours a day, practicing 12 hours on a regular basis is plain impossible. So please, just shut up instead of saying stupid thinks.
You're just being deliberately ignorant now.
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10-12 hours... reminds me of my wow playing days haha
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On March 02 2010 05:01 Biff The Understudy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 04:26 WheelOfTime wrote:On March 02 2010 04:17 Biff The Understudy wrote:
I do think that they exagerate, and I don't believe that most progamers practice 12 hours a day.
I am a musician, and I can tell you that practicing 10 hours in one day is basically spending all your time on it.
Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day.
You fail quite hard. Clearly, you're not a very good musician, and you're pretty narrow-sighted for thinking "Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day". 24 hrs in a day, with 7 hrs going to sleep and 3 hrs for food/breaks/washroom, that's still 14 hours of practice everyday. Hell, I know music majors who practice their instruments 12 hrs and study for 4 hrs a day consistently. Just because you don't have enough willpower and are narrow-sighted, doesn't mean everyone else is. Sigh. If you don't know what you are talking about, don't make dumb judgements. I am not narrow sighted, and I am training in one of the best music school in Europe. So maybe I know better than you what I talk about. And I have been playing in top orchestras, with top players.
Do you go to CNSMDP (aka Paris Conservatoire)?
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On March 02 2010 05:48 Culture wrote:
NonY, would you comment on what you consider other effective, yet less time consuming ways to practice (Or direct me to previous posts if you'd discussed this before).
i would love to hear about this as well. I think 10 hours is excessive. After about 4-5 hours of playing you're just going in auto mode and probably aren't learning anything new, just playing.
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With such violent and brutal training regimens imagine how strong their hands must be.
does anyone have tossgirls number ? 
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On March 02 2010 06:03 StayFrosty wrote:
10-12 hours... reminds me of my wow playing days haha
Except SC is a lot more demanding then MMORPGs xD
I played MMORPGs for 6 hours straight before, but I highly doubt I can do that with SC
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On March 02 2010 06:24 StarN wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 05:01 Biff The Understudy wrote:On March 02 2010 04:26 WheelOfTime wrote:On March 02 2010 04:17 Biff The Understudy wrote:
I do think that they exagerate, and I don't believe that most progamers practice 12 hours a day.
I am a musician, and I can tell you that practicing 10 hours in one day is basically spending all your time on it.
Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day.
You fail quite hard. Clearly, you're not a very good musician, and you're pretty narrow-sighted for thinking "Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day". 24 hrs in a day, with 7 hrs going to sleep and 3 hrs for food/breaks/washroom, that's still 14 hours of practice everyday. Hell, I know music majors who practice their instruments 12 hrs and study for 4 hrs a day consistently. Just because you don't have enough willpower and are narrow-sighted, doesn't mean everyone else is. Sigh. If you don't know what you are talking about, don't make dumb judgements. I am not narrow sighted, and I am training in one of the best music school in Europe. So maybe I know better than you what I talk about. And I have been playing in top orchestras, with top players. Do you go to CNSMDP (aka Paris Conservatoire)?
I have like 30 friends from there. Thanks.
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well i think if u play that much u often forget about time. which means u dont think that ur just playing 8hours straight up.
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On March 02 2010 04:28 Liquid`NonY wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 04:17 Biff The Understudy wrote:
I do think that they exagerate, and I don't believe that most progamers practice 12 hours a day.
I am a musician, and I can tell you that practicing 10 hours in one day is basically spending all your time on it. Not going outside, not meeting friends. Practice, eat, take a shower, make one or two breaks not to become a zombi every two/three hours, and your day is over.
I know it is not the same, because playing a music instrument (except maybe piano, where at least you sit) is wayyyy more tiring and physical than playing starcraft, and you need much more breaks. Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day.
Now theses people play tournaments, they have to go there, to wait, they watch games, they chat on the internet and with friends at least a little bit, they do some gym, even a minimum, and sometimes they give interview. That makes a 12 hours on a daily basis straight impossible.
So I guess a good guess would be an average of 8 - 10 hours for the most crazy ones of actually playing the game. estro had 11 hours mandatory. b-team would get half a day off about once a week. a-team would sometimes get full days off and they'd also all travel to proleague matches. some people like nsp_action and say[join] would play during their break times so they'd play 12+ hours in a day it's my opinion that training that many hours isn't optimal. but it is the standard method in korea and it gets results
Just wondering what your opinion would be on an optimal practice schedule?
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On March 02 2010 06:03 Piy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 05:01 Biff The Understudy wrote:On March 02 2010 04:26 WheelOfTime wrote:On March 02 2010 04:17 Biff The Understudy wrote:
I do think that they exagerate, and I don't believe that most progamers practice 12 hours a day.
I am a musician, and I can tell you that practicing 10 hours in one day is basically spending all your time on it.
Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day.
You fail quite hard. Clearly, you're not a very good musician, and you're pretty narrow-sighted for thinking "Most people can't practice more than 5-6 hours in one day". 24 hrs in a day, with 7 hrs going to sleep and 3 hrs for food/breaks/washroom, that's still 14 hours of practice everyday. Hell, I know music majors who practice their instruments 12 hrs and study for 4 hrs a day consistently. Just because you don't have enough willpower and are narrow-sighted, doesn't mean everyone else is. Sigh. If you don't know what you are talking about, don't make dumb judgements. I am not narrow sighted, and I am training in one of the best music school in Europe. So maybe I know better than you what I talk about. And I have been playing in top orchestras, with top players. Have you played, let say, viola, once in your life? No. So let me tell you, most musicians arounds me don't have the muscles and the physical endurance to practice more than 5-6 hours regularly. If not they just break their back. Because when you are a 1 metre 60 japanese lady, you have limits, physical limits. You can play in orchestra 9 hours a day, because in orchestra you don't actually play all the time and you are sit down. Personnal practice means playing often very intensely most of the time. I can practice uo to eught hours, and I am healthy. More than that, I fall apart. And someone like Auer, I know you have never heard about him was saying his students, like Heifetz or Milstein, not more than 5 hours violin a day, because more is destructive. If you have the muscles to practice a violin Brahms concerto or something like that 11 hours a day, that's good for you. I tell you that most people can't. Now my point that to practice 8 hours, you need to block 10 or 11 hours of youur time. Because you need breaks, even if you are superman, both for your body and your mind. And in a life, you need to do some other stuff. Like Shopping to eat, make your fucking lundery, go to college, and do administrrative stuff. And meet friends from time to time, take lessons in college, walk from one place to another, relax a little bit, cook, etc etc etc etc etc etc So unless you sleep 3 hours a day, practicing 12 hours on a regular basis is plain impossible. So please, just shut up instead of saying stupid thinks. You're just being deliberately ignorant now.
Actually, he's absolutely 100% completely correct. I'm a professional musician, studying classical cello at the university of North Texas. I can't practice more than 4 hours a day and I've been doing it for 12 years.
If you know a music major who says they practice 12 hours a day, they are lying out of their asses. It's a fact. Sorry, but you are wrong.
Coltrane and Heifetz may be able to practice 10-12 hours a day, but ask them what university they attended.
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Playing musical instruments though is more physically demanding than playing StarCraft. Maintaining posture takes a ton of effort. With StarCraft, you just do whatever you feel comfortable with.
Also, I don't imagine you do much daily stuff as a progamer. You live in a progaming house where probably the B-teamers do it for you XD. That or you take turns.
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why do u guys compare playing a music instrument to playing a computer game? TT
even i could play 10h+ wc3 or sc or whatever if i want 2~
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On March 02 2010 08:17 rasers wrote:
why do u guys compare playing a music instrument to playing a computer game? TT
even i could play 10h+ wc3 or sc or whatever if i want 2~
For every day of your life?
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why do u guys compare playing a music instrument to playing a computer game? TT
even i could play 10h+ wc3 or sc or whatever if i want 2~
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On March 02 2010 08:21 neobowman wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 08:17 rasers wrote:
why do u guys compare playing a music instrument to playing a computer game? TT
even i could play 10h+ wc3 or sc or whatever if i want 2~ For every day of your life?
I work 10-12 hours a day in construction, 6 or sometimes 7 days a week. What the big deal? Many people do 1 thing for 10 hours a day.
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EPT
