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i don't understand...
in this game, i just played against a typical d+ protoss user on python. if you bwchart the rep, he doesn't use any hotkeys above 4. in the entire game, he was literally 1a2a3a.
i feel like shit that this game dragged on and ended after exactly 26 minutes. this kid had 112 apm, while i was practically utilizing all my hotkeys with 222 apm.
it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game.
rep: http://repdepot.net/replay.php?id=8498
this rant is not directly against this particular player.
my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was doing as much as what i was doing.
ps: my scan timing might have been off during the 1st push, and maybe i could have ended the game then, but remember that it's not just this game as a whole. only the terran users would know 
respect to all terrans and zergs.
  
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So basically this is a "damn protoss making me play a 20 minute game with half my apm by using 3 hotkeys."
hmmm... i guess i know how you feel =/
it's the same for me but I end up losing 2/3 of the time 
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T.O.P.
Hong Kong4685 Posts
Man, I play protoss and I feel that terran is imba. Every Terran walls in these days. Protoss has no idea what the terran is doing. If I do a 1 gate build, I get owned by FD. If I do a 2 gate build, I get owned by siege expand. Terran will have finished a CC before I even start my nexus. Sometimes my 2 gate observer gets owned by 2 fact. Mines own my Dragoons. Scvs own my probes.
Siege tank +Vulture >> Zeolot +Dragoon.
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Seriously so many people on iCCup just don't know when to give up. I keep thinking to myself "jesus please leave already", and it always makes me play way worse when I'm just waiting for someone to get out and when I win it doesn't feel good at all
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why do you think terran users are angry all the time?
I started playing sc as protoss (ew) and I was happy and unstressed and everything was easy. Terran is exactly the opposite.
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Even when I offrace as terran I feel more angry than when I play protoss. I mean, I can lose a million times as protoss and not get angry but losing TvP just pisses me off sometimes.
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On March 08 2009 14:19 T.O.P. wrote:
Man, I play protoss and I feel that terran is imba. Every Terran walls in these days. Protoss has no idea what the terran is doing. If I do a 1 gate build, I get owned by FD. If I do a 2 gate build, I get owned by siege expand. Terran will have finished a CC before I even start my nexus. Sometimes my 2 gate observer gets owned by 2 fact. Mines own my Dragoons. Scvs own my probes.
Siege tank +Vulture >> Zeolot +Dragoon.
lol this sounded legit 
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On March 08 2009 14:22 Superiorwolf wrote:
Seriously so many people on iCCup just don't know when to give up. I keep thinking to myself "jesus please leave already", and it always makes me play way worse when I'm just waiting for someone to get out and when I win it doesn't feel good at all
Could not agree more.
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On March 08 2009 14:19 T.O.P. wrote:
Man, I play protoss and I feel that terran is imba. Every Terran walls in these days. Protoss has no idea what the terran is doing. If I do a 1 gate build, I get owned by FD. If I do a 2 gate build, I get owned by siege expand. Terran will have finished a CC before I even start my nexus. Sometimes my 2 gate observer gets owned by 2 fact. Mines own my Dragoons. Scvs own my probes.
Siege tank +Vulture >> Zeolot +Dragoon.
Although I too sometimes think that mines+terran ball=imba you're doing something wrong.
1 gate goons should have enough goons to repel FD; 2 gate you pressure if you scouted or make limited number of goons and be prepared to make more goons.
How are you losing to 2 fact with 2gate obs?
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Do you think Jaedong or Flash think stuff like this after losing to dragons? I wonder if July gets pissed after losing to Stork's APM that is hundreds lower...
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On March 08 2009 14:26 Ingenol wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 14:22 Superiorwolf wrote:
Seriously so many people on iCCup just don't know when to give up. I keep thinking to myself "jesus please leave already", and it always makes me play way worse when I'm just waiting for someone to get out and when I win it doesn't feel good at all Could not agree more.
Yea, but that's the basis of great comebacks. The winner gets complacent, and 1 or 2 armies later the game's evened up.
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On March 08 2009 14:04 CapO wrote:i don't understand... in this game, i just played against a typical d+ protoss user on python. if you bwchart the rep, he doesn't use any hotkeys above 4. in the entire game, he was literally 1a2a3a. i feel like shit that this game dragged on and ended after exactly 26 minutes. this kid had 112 apm, while i was practically utilizing all my hotkeys with 222 apm. it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game. rep: http://repdepot.net/replay.php?id=8498this rant is not directly against this particular player. my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was doing as much as what i was doing. ps: my scan timing might have been off during the 1st push, and maybe i could have ended the game then, but remember that it's not just this game as a whole. only the terran users would know respect to all terrans and zergs.
it sounds like you need to stop worrying about how fast you move around and focus more on what you actually do with your actions.
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United States2186 Posts
It's the reality of TvP. PvT is very very easy at low-mid levels. TvP is very very hard at all levels.
But most ICCUP Protosses are retarded and try to double expand all the time like this bum did. Once you confirm that they do with an scv you can just run them over with a 4 fact push (no armory). That should hopefully ease some of your very understandable woes.
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play as zerg. a win is always a good feeling :D
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why should people have to have "222" apm to play the game?
apm isnt everything anyways maybe you arent utilizing your apm as well as you could be and just spamming
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Everyone knows Protoss takes the least apm to play. Does this mean it's easy? Only if Starcraft were a shallow game where the only relevent factor was the speed of your hands. My apm is lowest when I play PvZ but it's by far the hardest matchup for me. My apm is low because I'm constantly thinking- about how to scout, harass, expand, react to zerg's movements. PvP is the opposite for me; I know the matchup instinctually and it's more about mechanics. I play much faster but I consider it much easier.
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On March 08 2009 14:47 Rice wrote:
why should people have to have "222" apm to play the game?
apm isnt everything anyways maybe you arent utilizing your apm as well as you could be and just spamming
no, i don't spam after the beginning.
apm is not everything, you are right. did i say that? maybe you didn't get my point.
with the low apm, he was only doing 1a2a3a (no joke, for real).
edit: it's like me doing the best i can to win, while this another guy is playing with his feet like w/e and then drag the game... sigh. i suck
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Katowice25012 Posts
I love how every terran and zerg player has a huge complex about their race :D
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And it's been said, but if you really care about winning and having it easy and you really believe that playing Protoss is the way to acheive this then you're a moron for playing Terran. But of course, you wouldn't want that feeling to be taken away from you, that you're the victim, the underdog. Any time you lose (or hell, not win quickly enough!) you can always say "well I'm playing the hardest race, noob". It's elitism and it takes away from the spirit of what is supposed to be a fun game. I play Protoss. And I lose. A lot. I don't give a shit. I'm secure in my mediocrity and just want to hang out with like minded people who enjoy playing the best rts game in the whole damn world, not people who get off on constantly complaining about how hard they have it and how much better they clearly are than everyone else.
Just had to get that off my chest.
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Sometimes brain ( i mean protoss ) > mechanics. Thanks god.
That's not because he has shitty hotkeys that he deserve to be bashed...
I hate terran whiners.
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On March 08 2009 14:36 statix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 14:04 CapO wrote:i don't understand... in this game, i just played against a typical d+ protoss user on python. if you bwchart the rep, he doesn't use any hotkeys above 4. in the entire game, he was literally 1a2a3a. i feel like shit that this game dragged on and ended after exactly 26 minutes. this kid had 112 apm, while i was practically utilizing all my hotkeys with 222 apm. it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game. rep: http://repdepot.net/replay.php?id=8498this rant is not directly against this particular player. my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was doing as much as what i was doing. ps: my scan timing might have been off during the 1st push, and maybe i could have ended the game then, but remember that it's not just this game as a whole. only the terran users would know respect to all terrans and zergs. it sounds like you need to stop worrying about how fast you move around and focus more on what you actually do with your actions.
well i think it's pretty much the consensus that terran demands a lot more apm and less adaption than protoss' low apm and high adaption (i think chill actually talked about this in liquibition)
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Protoss is so imba at mid/low leves =[
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if you think its hard killing shitty protosses in tvp you should try killing shitty terrans pvt. even the worst terran player can make me waste an extra 10 min by just sitting with their natural and turtling and not gging while i have the entire map. i mean he doesnt even need 123 apm or any hotkeys all he has to do is build tanks and fuckin siege them and you will waste a good 10 min of my life. i wouldnt even bring this up except it happens all the time and its really annoying
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On March 08 2009 15:00 3clipse wrote:
And it's been said, but if you really care about winning and having it easy and you really believe that playing Protoss is the way to acheive this then you're a moron for playing Terran. But of course, you wouldn't want that feeling to be taken away from you, that you're the victim, the underdog. Any time you lose (or hell, not win quickly enough!) you can always say "well I'm playing the hardest race, noob". It's elitism and it takes away from the spirit of what is supposed to be a fun game. I play Protoss. And I lose. A lot. I don't give a shit. I'm secure in my mediocrity and just want to hang out with like minded people who enjoy playing the best rts game in the whole damn world, not people who get off on constantly complaining about how hard they have it and how much better they clearly are than everyone else.
Just had to get that off my chest.
i don't care if i lose to a good player. i actually enjoy both winning AND losing, but maybe im not getting my point across correctly.
here's the scenario that happened after this replay,
"wow, shit 26 min long game. damn, it wasn't easy"
"i think i played someone decent"
(starts firefox for iccup website, checks the guy's record and flag)
"wtf.. barely 50% win ratio at D+, and not a korean"
"okay, let me take a look at his match list, hmm,, i admit that hes played a lotta koreans."
"let me check the rep on bwchat"
(looks at the hotkeys and apm)
"WTF... /cry"
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You are really stupid.
Why a 130 apm protoss has to be bad ?
Why ?
Do you know that gurram don't even use hotkeys ? And this guy is on Swe-A -.-
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On March 08 2009 15:12 CapO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:00 3clipse wrote:
And it's been said, but if you really care about winning and having it easy and you really believe that playing Protoss is the way to acheive this then you're a moron for playing Terran. But of course, you wouldn't want that feeling to be taken away from you, that you're the victim, the underdog. Any time you lose (or hell, not win quickly enough!) you can always say "well I'm playing the hardest race, noob". It's elitism and it takes away from the spirit of what is supposed to be a fun game. I play Protoss. And I lose. A lot. I don't give a shit. I'm secure in my mediocrity and just want to hang out with like minded people who enjoy playing the best rts game in the whole damn world, not people who get off on constantly complaining about how hard they have it and how much better they clearly are than everyone else.
Just had to get that off my chest. i don't care if i lose to a good player. i actually enjoy both winning AND losing, but maybe im not getting my point across correctly. here's the scenario that happened after this replay, "wow, shit 26 min long game. damn, it wasn't easy" "i think i played someone decent" (starts firefox for iccup website, checks the guy's record and flag) "wtf.. barely 50% win ratio at D+, and not a korean" "okay, let me take a look at his match list, hmm,, i admit that hes played a lotta koreans." "let me check the rep on bwchat" (looks at the hotkeys and apm) "WTF... /cry"
actually thats basically me. except my apm and hotkeys are pretty decent
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On March 08 2009 15:24 Boblion wrote:
You are really stupid.
Why a 130 apm protoss has to be bad ?
Why ?
Do you know that gurram don't even use hotkeys ? And this guy is on Swe-A -.-
........... please, read my post before you say something.
did i play "gurram"(whom i don't know)? was this guy just as good as the swe-A guy?
i think ur the stupid one. if u don't understand my scenario, idk what to say. i know im being whininy, but DO U NOT UNDERSTAND ME?
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why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded?
it's like, would you be happy if he played exact same skill level but have 200 apm and use all hotkeys? what? who cares?
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^ lol it's just that protoss really require less work than terran and zerg. and that's a fact. and that's what makes the race so easy to paly.
+ Show Spoiler +
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On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded?
it's like, would you be happy if he played exact same skill level but have 200 apm and use all hotkeys? what? who cares?
Exactly what i was thinking.
Jesus ... another DDR terran faping to his apm -.-
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On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded?
fuck wow, if u read my "little" scenario that i posted, i analyzed the rep after i looked at his record, flag, and match list. /sigh
idk what to say. LOL
if it was like fisheye with low apm, i wouldn't have given a fuck, since he was good back then, but is a typical D+ protoss user with 1a2a3a tactic just as good as him?
lol whats wrong with u,, please
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On March 08 2009 15:37 CapO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded? fuck wow, if u read my "little" scenario that i posted, i analyzed the rep after i looked at his record, flag, and match list. /sigh idk what to say. LOL if it was like fisheye with low apm, i wouldn't have given a fuck, since he was good back then, but is a typical D+ protoss user with 1a2a3a tactic just as good as him? lol whats wrong with u,, please
so answer my question
if he played same skill leve, but 200 apm and all hotkeys, would you be satisfied with the game?
if so, why?
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On March 08 2009 15:36 Boblion wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded?
it's like, would you be happy if he played exact same skill level but have 200 apm and use all hotkeys? what? who cares? Exactly what i was thinking. Jesus ... another DDR terran faping to his apm -.-
awesome. i try to acknowledge other ppl's perspectives as much as i can, while others blindly don't give a fuck and post. very nice.
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but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm can easily suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;;
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On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm would suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;;
where do you get off making these generalizations based off of 2 players?
it's like, for some reason a 120apm protoss with 120eapm is somehow half-assing the game as opposed to a 200apm protoss with 120eapm? really?
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On March 08 2009 15:04 daz wrote:
if you think its hard killing shitty protosses in tvp you should try killing shitty terrans pvt. even the worst terran player can make me waste an extra 10 min by just sitting with their natural and turtling and not gging while i have the entire map. i mean he doesnt even need 123 apm or any hotkeys all he has to do is build tanks and fuckin siege them and you will waste a good 10 min of my life. i wouldnt even bring this up except it happens all the time and its really annoying
you should try out arbiters or carriers some time
I hear their pretty neat
On March 08 2009 15:43 JeeJee wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm would suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;; where do you get off making these generalizations based off of 2 players? it's like, for some reason a 120apm protoss with 120eapm is somehow half-assing the game as opposed to a 200apm protoss with 120eapm? really?
thats not how it works on low levels
its 40eapm protoss vs 100eapm terran
on lower levels protoss is substantially easier than terran. We've had this discussion on TL many times, and the majority of people (even protosses) agree with it.
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On March 08 2009 15:44 fusionsdf wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:04 daz wrote:
if you think its hard killing shitty protosses in tvp you should try killing shitty terrans pvt. even the worst terran player can make me waste an extra 10 min by just sitting with their natural and turtling and not gging while i have the entire map. i mean he doesnt even need 123 apm or any hotkeys all he has to do is build tanks and fuckin siege them and you will waste a good 10 min of my life. i wouldnt even bring this up except it happens all the time and its really annoying you should try out arbiters or carriers some time I hear their pretty neat
quite fair too, sir.
as arbiters can not only cloak units, but easily stasis your army.
HOW AMAZINGLY FAIR
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On March 08 2009 15:38 JeeJee wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:37 CapO wrote:On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded? fuck wow, if u read my "little" scenario that i posted, i analyzed the rep after i looked at his record, flag, and match list. /sigh idk what to say. LOL if it was like fisheye with low apm, i wouldn't have given a fuck, since he was good back then, but is a typical D+ protoss user with 1a2a3a tactic just as good as him? lol whats wrong with u,, please so answer my question if he played same skill leve, but 200 apm and all hotkeys, would you be satisfied with the game? if so, why?
if he was my level, i would be satisfied. why? because he was my level.
if i played and lost against kwark, whos supposedly a really good player with low apm, i would not have minded. i'd understand that his mechanics are better than mine.
u still don't get that APM is not the main topic here.
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On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm can easily suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;;
yeah but your forgetting that the 120 apm protoss actually has to think and react to his opponent during the game and cant just sit in his base until he has a certain amount of units then attack
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You know it takes a lot of apm to play protoss too =/
Try reaver dropping pvt while macroing
try doing the corsair reaver harass pvz that bisu does
i have 220 apm with 150 eapm and i still feel it isn't enough as a protoss =/
edit:
"my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was doing as much as what i was doing." does" does seem like an apm topic to me ;/
when i offrace tvp also, i lose to 120 apm tosses but i just know it was my fault for positioning myself and attacking badly =/
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I am going to answer that question as well JeeJee, because I know how he feels in a way, and yes I would be more satisfied with the game.
It would make me feel like we both put in around same amount of effort doing something but I had put more thought and strategy into doing it, therefore bearly putting me ahead of him and securing the game thanks to my superiority. If he was the type of player that OP described, I would feel like he's playing with the minimum requirements just to stall the game, turtling in a way like Terrans often do by simple going 5z6z7d8d(or something) and using a terrain advantage while doing nothing else. It is like fighting a turtling terran because you have to slowly pick them apart, or expand a lot so when they starve you can fight even though they have an advantage and still be ahead after losing a fight. That makes you have to draw the game out longer, even though you can tell you will eventually win.
For Ex. I get a feeling like that in school sometimes where I am quite a hardworking student and I take pride in my work and do my very best on it. But the teacher is slack as fuck and the student who put a few things together at the last moment managed to get the same grade as I did even though mine is obviously better and I put more work into it than the other student. Although because of the slack and easy marking teacher, he just gave us both A's.
EDIT: FYI, I play TvP and PvT, I cannot TvT for shit, so this is not a biased opinion. Protoss used to be my main race for ages. I am not saying PvT is any less annoying, as I do hate it when terrrans turtle like I described, both PvT and TvP are annoying in that sense. So when the OP only describes TvP is doesn't mean one bit that he is saying that TvP is the only matchup where such and instance happens. It just happens to be the case in this thread.
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On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm can easily suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;;
Because terran mechanics isn't as mindless than protoss mechanics ?
It is even worse actually. I hate those kids who think they are smarter than the low apm protoss because they can spam. But what's the point ?
Are you using " super clever strats ?
No. You are just a dumb and dull robot who try to emulate Korean progamer playstyle then whine because he can barely win vs a D+ protoss.
Oh and btw you can still beat protoss with <150 apm even if you are a terran. Especially a D+ protoss LOLololol.
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On March 08 2009 15:04 daz wrote:
if you think its hard killing shitty protosses in tvp you should try killing shitty terrans pvt. even the worst terran player can make me waste an extra 10 min by just sitting with their natural and turtling and not gging while i have the entire map. i mean he doesnt even need 123 apm or any hotkeys all he has to do is build tanks and fuckin siege them and you will waste a good 10 min of my life. i wouldnt even bring this up except it happens all the time and its really annoying
Oh please
You're complaining about Terran turtling?
Cannons + ht + dts
As long as there is a ramp protoss can turtle like crazy
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On March 08 2009 15:45 Lurker wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:44 fusionsdf wrote:On March 08 2009 15:04 daz wrote:
if you think its hard killing shitty protosses in tvp you should try killing shitty terrans pvt. even the worst terran player can make me waste an extra 10 min by just sitting with their natural and turtling and not gging while i have the entire map. i mean he doesnt even need 123 apm or any hotkeys all he has to do is build tanks and fuckin siege them and you will waste a good 10 min of my life. i wouldnt even bring this up except it happens all the time and its really annoying you should try out arbiters or carriers some time I hear their pretty neat quite fair too, sir. as arbiters can not only cloak units, but easily stasis your army. HOW AMAZINGLY FAIR
or recall in your mineral line. Terran has to be really really gay to have a toss with the whole map have a hard time breaking him. And if he is, its just like any other form of BM which every race is capable.
So many times toss accuse a terran of turtling when hes just building up units. It's not my fault you're too stupid to tech when I have like 3 turrets in my base. And its definitely not my fault if you decide to do retarded suicide attacks into my nat
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On March 08 2009 15:49 Boblion wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm can easily suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;; Because terran mechanics isn't as mindless than protoss mechanics ? It is even worse actually. I hate those kids who think they are smarter than the low apm protoss because they can spam. But what's the point ? Are you using " super clever strats ? No. You are just a dumb and dull robot who try to emulate Korean progamer playstyle then whine because he can barely win vs a D+ protoss. Oh and btw you can still beat protoss with <150 apm even if you are a terran. Especially a D+ protoss LOLololol.
sorry that the dull dumb robot made his way through C rank where 90% of games were TvP
LOLolol
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On March 08 2009 15:44 fusionsdf wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:04 daz wrote:
if you think its hard killing shitty protosses in tvp you should try killing shitty terrans pvt. even the worst terran player can make me waste an extra 10 min by just sitting with their natural and turtling and not gging while i have the entire map. i mean he doesnt even need 123 apm or any hotkeys all he has to do is build tanks and fuckin siege them and you will waste a good 10 min of my life. i wouldnt even bring this up except it happens all the time and its really annoying you should try out arbiters or carriers some time I hear their pretty neat Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:43 JeeJee wrote:On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm would suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;; where do you get off making these generalizations based off of 2 players? it's like, for some reason a 120apm protoss with 120eapm is somehow half-assing the game as opposed to a 200apm protoss with 120eapm? really? thats not how it works on low levels its 40eapm protoss vs 100eapm terran on lower levels protoss is substantially easier than terran. We've had this discussion on TL many times, and the majority of people (even protosses) agree with it.
i dont know if you ever actually play starcraft but
1. arbiters are useless if the terran sits in his base with turrets and tanks
2. carriers take a long fucking time to make
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On March 08 2009 15:49 Boblion wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm can easily suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;; Because terran mechanics isn't as mindless than protoss mechanics ? It is even worse actually. I hate those kids who think they are smarter than the low apm protoss because they can spam. But what's the point ? Are you using " super clever strats ? No. You are just a dumb and dull robot who try to emulate Korean progamer playstyle then whine because he can barely win vs a D+ protoss. Oh and btw you can still beat protoss with <150 apm even if you are a terran. Especially a D+ protoss LOLololol.
lurker's derailing the thread, that i know.
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On March 08 2009 15:51 daz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:44 fusionsdf wrote:On March 08 2009 15:04 daz wrote:
if you think its hard killing shitty protosses in tvp you should try killing shitty terrans pvt. even the worst terran player can make me waste an extra 10 min by just sitting with their natural and turtling and not gging while i have the entire map. i mean he doesnt even need 123 apm or any hotkeys all he has to do is build tanks and fuckin siege them and you will waste a good 10 min of my life. i wouldnt even bring this up except it happens all the time and its really annoying you should try out arbiters or carriers some time I hear their pretty neat On March 08 2009 15:43 JeeJee wrote:On March 08 2009 15:41 Lurker wrote:
but the fact is that ONLY 120 apm would suffice to contend against 200+ apm terran players. 200 apm of not really spamming that is.
and that is really disappointing. how he can half-ass the game by just doing 1a2a3a and simple macro.
it happens to me to.
EDIT :capitalized only for emphasis^^;; where do you get off making these generalizations based off of 2 players? it's like, for some reason a 120apm protoss with 120eapm is somehow half-assing the game as opposed to a 200apm protoss with 120eapm? really? thats not how it works on low levels its 40eapm protoss vs 100eapm terran on lower levels protoss is substantially easier than terran. We've had this discussion on TL many times, and the majority of people (even protosses) agree with it. i dont know if you ever actually play starcraft but 1. arbiters are useless if the terran sits in his base with turrets and tanks 2. carriers take a long fucking time to make
you have the whole fucking map
make like 8 stargates
honestly
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On March 08 2009 15:46 CapO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:38 JeeJee wrote:On March 08 2009 15:37 CapO wrote:On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded? fuck wow, if u read my "little" scenario that i posted, i analyzed the rep after i looked at his record, flag, and match list. /sigh idk what to say. LOL if it was like fisheye with low apm, i wouldn't have given a fuck, since he was good back then, but is a typical D+ protoss user with 1a2a3a tactic just as good as him? lol whats wrong with u,, please so answer my question if he played same skill leve, but 200 apm and all hotkeys, would you be satisfied with the game? if so, why? if he was my level, i would be satisfied. why? because he was my level. if i played and lost against kwark, whos supposedly a really good player with low apm, i would not have minded. i'd understand that his mechanics are better than mine. u still don't get that APM is not the main topic here.
oh, APM is the main topic here. read your OP.
it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game.
my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was doing as much as what i was doing.
you're basically saying "fuck he has 50% my apm protoss is so fucking easy you can play at 50% and still put up a good fight. im so mad, why doesnt he have to play as fast as me"
yeah that has nothing to do with apm at all.
It's like, okay, your opinion (yeah how you managed to actually call it a fact is beyond me, but feel free to provide me with numerical data) is that protoss is easier to play. Why not switch to it? Obviously there's something bad about it that you wouldn't want to play it. Now that we've established protoss is not all sunshine and roses, let me bring up another point
What if i were to make a blog, saying
"what the fuck it pisses me off that a player like him with such terrible analytical ability, just emulating builds he found online, he's able to do all that gay shit without even thinking and make it into late game.
my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was thinking as much as i was"
what would you say?
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building 8 stargates takes time. then building a round of carriers in them takes time. and also, taking the whole map takes time. The point is just fucking type gg and leave when you have 0% chance of winning the game idc how imbalanced you think protoss is fuck just TYPE GG AND LEAVE
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damn i almost wish pvz was back the way it was so that the protoss were considered the whiners and not everyone else
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Yay! This thread is turning to a "Your race is imba and your race are for morons.."
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On March 08 2009 15:56 JeeJee wrote:
damn i almost wish pvz was back the way it was so that the protoss were considered the whiners and not everyone else
dont fucking say that please dont ever say that i played starcraft for the first 9 years when protoss was the worst race i dont want to go back to it again.
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Yes some people can be like that daz, but it is almost never '0%' and on iccup every last percent is a chance that their record might not get lowered. Whether it be from you getting pissed and leaving, him doing some awesome harass, waiting for a server crash, or whatever. All you can do is do what fusionsdf says. It's a fucking pain in the ass, I know, and that is exactly what CapO is getting at in his op, except it is the other way around in TvP, where he hass 6 expos and toss gets getting denied his 3rd, but turtles with arbs and storm, etc. You basically just supported the OP's opinion there.
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The ignorance in this thread is amazing.
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On March 08 2009 15:54 JeeJee wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:46 CapO wrote:On March 08 2009 15:38 JeeJee wrote:On March 08 2009 15:37 CapO wrote:On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded? fuck wow, if u read my "little" scenario that i posted, i analyzed the rep after i looked at his record, flag, and match list. /sigh idk what to say. LOL if it was like fisheye with low apm, i wouldn't have given a fuck, since he was good back then, but is a typical D+ protoss user with 1a2a3a tactic just as good as him? lol whats wrong with u,, please so answer my question if he played same skill leve, but 200 apm and all hotkeys, would you be satisfied with the game? if so, why? if he was my level, i would be satisfied. why? because he was my level. if i played and lost against kwark, whos supposedly a really good player with low apm, i would not have minded. i'd understand that his mechanics are better than mine. u still don't get that APM is not the main topic here. oh, APM is the main topic here. read your OP. Show nested quote +it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game. Show nested quote +
my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was doing as much as what i was doing.
you're basically saying "fuck he has 50% my apm protoss is so fucking easy you can play at 50% and still put up a good fight. im so mad, why doesnt he have to play as fast as me" yeah that has nothing to do with apm at all. It's like, okay, your opinion (yeah how you managed to actually call it a fact is beyond me, but feel free to provide me with numerical data) is that protoss is easier to play. Why not switch to it? Obviously there's something bad about it that you wouldn't want to play it. Now that we've established protoss is not all sunshine and roses, let me bring up another point What if i were to make a blog, saying "what the fuck it pisses me off that a player like him with such terrible analytical ability, just emulating builds he found online, he's able to do all that gay shit without even thinking and make it into late game. my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was thinking as much as i was" what would you say?
i think you're blindly posting. u don't even try to put ur position in mine. i do not believe that protoss is fucking easy. /sigh
idk if you read this, maybe u suck at browsing, or maybe u just ignore everything i say and try to rant on ur own.
here's the scenario that happened after this replay,
"wow, shit 26 min long game. damn, it wasn't easy"
"i think i played someone decent"
(starts firefox for iccup website, checks the guy's record and flag)
"wtf.. barely 50% win ratio at D+, and not a korean"
"okay, let me take a look at his match list, hmm,, i admit that hes played a lotta koreans."
"let me check the rep on bwchat"
(looks at the hotkeys and apm)
"WTF... /cry"
do u not feel the same way i did? not a tiny bit?
do u not feel my disappointment? am i the weird one here?
i understand what ur saying, but u don't seem to try to understand me at all.
you obviously have too much internet ego to not give a fuck, but only yourself. XD
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On March 08 2009 15:59 Grobyc wrote:
Yes some people can be like that daz, but it is almost never '0%' and on iccup every last percent is a chance that their record might not get lowered. Whether it be from you getting pissed and leaving, him doing some awesome harass, waiting for a server crash, or whatever. All you can do is do what fusionsdf says. It's a fucking pain in the ass, I know, and that is exactly what CapO is getting at in his op, except it is the other way around in TvP, where he hass 6 expos and toss gets getting denied his 3rd, but turtles with arbs and storm, etc. You basically just supported the OP's opinion there.
yeah i know im pretty much agreeing with him just saying hes not the only one that suffers it happens the other way around too
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Omfg, the P vs T arguments are astoundingly stupid. This blog should've been closed a long time ago.
CapO, how do you know that the person you played wasn't a lesser version of KwarK? If he stayed in the game that long, he must've known something about SC and played at the same level as you. There's no way around that. His lesser APM doesn't mean anything. For reference, see KwarK.
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On March 08 2009 16:07 Seraphim wrote:
Omfg, the P vs T arguments are astoundingly stupid. This blog should've been closed a long time ago.
CapO, how do you know that the person you played wasn't a lesser version of KwarK? If he stayed in the game that long, he must've known something about SC and played at the same level as you. There's no way around that. His lesser APM doesn't mean anything. For reference, see KwarK.
if the blog or the discussion has gone to more than one page, i think you should read the previously posted comments more carefully before you make one.
i was actually the one who mentioned kwark. i think you should read what i said.
read before you post.
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is awesome32269 Posts
Actually there are situations where stuff like this is important.
for example, everyone complains about vultures being so powerful. But vultures take loads of babysitting to be effective.
On low levels, protosses can just A move with their army (if its a decent size) and do good most of the time just with a decent flank. Terrans need to do vulture movements. Same when harrassing with them, or when defending with them against a counter.
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On March 08 2009 15:00 Boblion wrote:
Sometimes brain ( i mean protoss ) > mechanics. Thanks god.
That's not because he has shitty hotkeys that he deserve to be bashed...
I hate terran whiners.
just playing efficiently with your 118 apm's is better than just spamming up to 200+. what was tasteless apm with toss again?
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On March 08 2009 16:07 Seraphim wrote:
Omfg, the P vs T arguments are astoundingly stupid. This blog should've been closed a long time ago.
CapO, how do you know that the person you played wasn't a lesser version of KwarK? If he stayed in the game that long, he must've known something about SC and played at the same level as you. There's no way around that. His lesser APM doesn't mean anything. For reference, see KwarK.
That has already been discussed, it is not the APM that causes the anger, it's the fact that people in the game, drawing it out, when they are very likely going to lose. Yes they have a chance, whether it be 1% chance of winning or 40%, no one is denying that, but it is still nonetheless annoying. I'm sure Kwarks win rate is probably above 50% as well.
The APM is not what sparks the anger in the first place, CapO was angered at the game before he even knew of the other players APM....
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On March 08 2009 16:04 CapO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:54 JeeJee wrote:On March 08 2009 15:46 CapO wrote:On March 08 2009 15:38 JeeJee wrote:On March 08 2009 15:37 CapO wrote:On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded? fuck wow, if u read my "little" scenario that i posted, i analyzed the rep after i looked at his record, flag, and match list. /sigh idk what to say. LOL if it was like fisheye with low apm, i wouldn't have given a fuck, since he was good back then, but is a typical D+ protoss user with 1a2a3a tactic just as good as him? lol whats wrong with u,, please so answer my question if he played same skill leve, but 200 apm and all hotkeys, would you be satisfied with the game? if so, why? if he was my level, i would be satisfied. why? because he was my level. if i played and lost against kwark, whos supposedly a really good player with low apm, i would not have minded. i'd understand that his mechanics are better than mine. u still don't get that APM is not the main topic here. oh, APM is the main topic here. read your OP. it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game.
my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was doing as much as what i was doing.
you're basically saying "fuck he has 50% my apm protoss is so fucking easy you can play at 50% and still put up a good fight. im so mad, why doesnt he have to play as fast as me" yeah that has nothing to do with apm at all. It's like, okay, your opinion (yeah how you managed to actually call it a fact is beyond me, but feel free to provide me with numerical data) is that protoss is easier to play. Why not switch to it? Obviously there's something bad about it that you wouldn't want to play it. Now that we've established protoss is not all sunshine and roses, let me bring up another point What if i were to make a blog, saying "what the fuck it pisses me off that a player like him with such terrible analytical ability, just emulating builds he found online, he's able to do all that gay shit without even thinking and make it into late game. my point is that i wouldn't have minded, only if this guy was thinking as much as i was" what would you say? i think you're blindly posting. u don't even try to put ur position in mine. i do not believe that protoss is fucking easy. /sigh idk if you read this, maybe u suck at browsing, or maybe u just ignore everything i say and try to rant on ur own. here's the scenario that happened after this replay, "wow, shit 26 min long game. damn, it wasn't easy" "i think i played someone decent" (starts firefox for iccup website, checks the guy's record and flag) "wtf.. barely 50% win ratio at D+, and not a korean" "okay, let me take a look at his match list, hmm,, i admit that hes played a lotta koreans." "let me check the rep on bwchat" (looks at the hotkeys and apm) "WTF... /cry" do u not feel the same way i did? not a tiny bit? do u not feel my disappointment? am i the weird one here? i understand what ur saying, but u don't seem to try to understand me at all.
i don't judge my opponents based on their apm. i judge them based on their skill level.
Of course i read that. All it shows is that you thought you played someone decent. Then, all of a sudden, you saw that his apm number wasn't as high as you hoped, and for some reason, that player is no longer decent to you? That makes zero sense to me.
and to answer your questions, no i don't feel the same way you do. no i don't feel your disappointment. When this happens to me, i'd instead be interested as to how they can be so efficient while matching me and look to improve my game, as opposed to bash theirs.
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fuck man,,, he was from chile( no offense) and a shitty record. wow.. i don't know what else to say more. i think you have too much internet ego  so sure, i've seen ppl like you around everywhere on internet. so yeah, aite, keep it up. you can't always be with ppl u like XD
you can ignore my blog. it's turned out that it's more appropriate for ppl who are terran or zerg. didnt' mean to offend anyone.
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Yeah, I understand how you feel.. I've been beaten in PvP with a guy that has 90 apm and I have a consistent 170 to 200 apm and you'd just tell yourself.. "Man do I suck or that guy is just that could that he can read me like a book.."
Anyway, I had an opponent that has a few tricks in ZvP with a 110 apm and the game drag about to 36 minutes.. Even though I know that my opponent's apm sucked it didn't matter because he had alot of tricks and I was happy I beat a zerg player in BS.
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United States2186 Posts
Man threads like these are great for drawing out people.
Basically, it should be unanimous that PvT is simple mechanically. Stuff like 120 apm Fisheye, 100 whatever apm kwark is not unheard of. Yeah that's how it is, oh well just improve and don't worry about it. Who cares about effort so long as you win (although game length is a justifiable annoyance).
What seems to be beyond sight here is that PvT is simpler strategically too at low levels. That's just a natural consequence of the matchup. Protoss, for the most part, control the overall flow of the game by their tech choices and the timing of their expansions. Terrans are left to react to whatever the Protoss do. Thus against good Terrans who can react to everything really well it's like walking a tightrope for the Protoss. But against sub C+/B- or so Terrans, the Protoss can do anything and the Terran won't know how to react to it properly. Their side of the thinking end at low levels is simply much harder and then it flips around at decent levels and goes even or so at pro levels.
Again, that's just how it is. No use complaining about it, just improve or switch to Protoss if it bothers you. But face reality and realize that low level PvT is way easier mechanically and strategically than TvP is.
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Most of the interesting points are already being discussed.
Why are you playing against him in this ladder? Answer: he is the same level as you. So your complain about 1a2a3a is nonsense.
-it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game.
-he was from chile
-shitty record
honestly the only thing wrong here is your attitude. If i had to give you advice is that you start using your time on your own game instead of how your opponent plays. Seems to me that the guy with the internet ego here is you.
And no, im not that guy, but doest it really make a difference where he comes from?
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On March 08 2009 16:56 malongo wrote:
Most of the interesting points are already being discussed.
Why are you playing against him in this ladder? Answer: he is the same level as you. So your complain about 1a2a3a is nonsense.
-it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game.
-he was from chile
-shitty record
honestly the only thing wrong here is your attitude. If i had to give you advice is that you start using your time on your own game instead of how your opponent plays. Seems to me that the guy with the internet ego here is you.
And no, im not that guy, but doest it really make a difference where he comes from?
after reading the last sentence, i looked up and saw ur country. heh
i said no offense, and please don't be one of those ppl like not all asians can't drive. we know.... koreans are typically better. come on, korean pros vs others. practically no doubt, right?
maybe it's not just as obvious, but it seems like ur taking this pretty seriously. anyway, sry if my attitude seemed crappy to ya. don't wanna repeat things.
peace
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Hello i lose to 60 apm tosses with my 180 apm
/slit wrist
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On March 08 2009 17:06 CapO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 16:56 malongo wrote:
Most of the interesting points are already being discussed.
Why are you playing against him in this ladder? Answer: he is the same level as you. So your complain about 1a2a3a is nonsense.
-it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game.
-he was from chile
-shitty record
honestly the only thing wrong here is your attitude. If i had to give you advice is that you start using your time on your own game instead of how your opponent plays. Seems to me that the guy with the internet ego here is you.
And no, im not that guy, but doest it really make a difference where he comes from? after reading the last sentence, i looked up and saw ur country. heh i said no offense, and please don't be one of those ppl like not all asians can't drive. we know.... koreans are typically better. come on, korean pros vs others. practically no doubt, right? maybe it's not just as obvious, but it seems like ur taking this pretty seriously. anyway, sry if my attitude seemed crappy to ya. don't wanna repeat things. peace
didnt you just say earlier he was from chile and thats a reason why hes bad?
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On March 08 2009 15:34 JeeJee wrote:
why are you judging someone on their apm and hotkey usage?
isn't that a little bit retarded?
it's like, would you be happy if he played exact same skill level but have 200 apm and use all hotkeys? what? who cares?
I think the idea is that atleast he wouldn't be working so much harder to get the same results. I can see how it would be somewhat frustrating to sweat your balls off, barely scratch a win, and see the other guy with less that 150 apm.
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lol actually, all i really wanted was some other ppl's sympathy on me sweating my balls off to win heh
cant agree more with alphafuzard
and rice, lol.
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On March 08 2009 17:06 CapO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 16:56 malongo wrote:
Most of the interesting points are already being discussed.
Why are you playing against him in this ladder? Answer: he is the same level as you. So your complain about 1a2a3a is nonsense.
-it pisses me off that a player like him with such a low apm with 1a2a3a tactics, hes able to pull off some gay shit to make it into a late game.
-he was from chile
-shitty record
honestly the only thing wrong here is your attitude. If i had to give you advice is that you start using your time on your own game instead of how your opponent plays. Seems to me that the guy with the internet ego here is you.
And no, im not that guy, but doest it really make a difference where he comes from? after reading the last sentence, i looked up and saw ur country. heh i said no offense, and please don't be one of those ppl like not all asians can't drive. we know.... koreans are typically better. come on, korean pros vs others. practically no doubt, right? maybe it's not just as obvious, but it seems like ur taking this pretty seriously. anyway, sry if my attitude seemed crappy to ya. don't wanna repeat things. peace
I never felt offended, in fact he could have been a player from Mexico, Italy or wherever. I was pointing you posted and cared about where does he come from and what his record is, none of them important about the discussion, as there are hundreds of koreans at the same level that go 1a2a3a 120 apm P and can own you with a better understanding of the game. Just get over it, Protoss can use less apm and still control theyr army effectively, and shitty record players can win or put a good fight against better players. Your attitude doesnt bother me, i was posting that you can win a lot more in your game taking a different approach, as the good players care a lot more in his own game rather than the opponent. Peace.
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I use to think that playing absolutely calculated and mechanical games was the only real way to play sc, and got really fustrated by sloppy players that I won/lost against. Also I would just disregard players that played differently to the macro/100% efficient macro builds thinking they were retarded.
Realise that this is a 10 year old STRATEGY game which players can use their own minds to play however they want. Theres more to sc than winning, apm and builds. Why would mind games work if this game was TOTALLY decided by mechanics?!
Theres a reason your in Chan D and not Chan 200apm on iccup, maybe he knows his speed is slow and is compensating for it using only zlots and goons to 1a2a3a. Although on paper it may not seem like hes going as hard out as you, but maybe if you asked him/saw him play he might of been expending as much energy as you were.
Adapting your play style to a build > adapting a build to your play style
And ease up, a win is a win, and maybe try taking a good look at yourself in this replay. To be honest I reckon he was the tactically and strategically superior player, but you were the mechanically superior player which won out in the end. And when did you have the idea that you 100% had the game? He stopped your push and still had his 3rd with his econ totally unharmed and you hadnt even started your 3rd base. If he expanded again quicker than he did, he would of won. This game was a pretty good game between players of the same skill I dont know why your getting fustrated over it, i dont think he was half-assing it, and he didnt just 1a2a3a all the time, he landed some nice storms on YOUR CLUMPED TANKS when you tried attacking 6 o clock, you pressed one button to siege (assuming that cos your tanks were clumped pretty damn tightly) he pressed one button to storm, about the same effort to do each action, actually more for storm cos u have to target where you want to storm.
Also I saw only like 13 downloads +1 more for me so I dont know why ppl are just talking out of their asses when they havnt even watched the game. Tbh I thought you were lucky to have won that game because he made the wrong decision after defeating your push.
Im not arguing that PvT is not easier at low levels but to me this guy knows his strength and weaknesses and plays according to them, when I watch you play, your push seems hesitant lacking some confidence but thats just me. Theres no need to be insecure about your skill, you use to be like me afraid that if I try my best get hammered by some 100 apm sucka that I will be noob for life. Instead ask yourself, why can he compete with me although he doesnt seem to play as hard as I do. Whats he doing or what am i doing that isnt allowing apm to be the deciding factor in the game....etc
Anyways peace gg gl hf cos in the end its a game and theres nothing worse than not having fun playing a game.
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On March 08 2009 16:12 deathgodtoss wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2009 15:00 Boblion wrote:
Sometimes brain ( i mean protoss ) > mechanics. Thanks god.
That's not because he has shitty hotkeys that he deserve to be bashed...
I hate terran whiners. just playing efficiently with your 118 apm's is better than just spamming up to 200+. what was tasteless apm with toss again?
190+ now
but he had 220-230 in an old replay pack where i gather was in a time when was more active?
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CA10824 Posts
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CA10824 Posts
although the other day i beat a 170-180 apm protss with my 130 apm doing a sick 2fact push on colosseum lol.
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Mine apm: 114
His apm:256
I love bm terrans
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loooooool I know that guy as well he joins my obs games sometimes
I was a Terran player and so many ppl use to blame their loss on the race instead of being outplayed, sure it was pretty gay what the Protoss could do to you but, umm you chose terran no one told you to, learn2play it or change race like I did ^_^.
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You see it all the time in real life. Some people study really hard, spend all their free time revising for a test, then get beat by someone who spent all their time playing starcraft instead of working (yes that's me ). Hard work isn't always rewarded, in contrast to what TV tries to teach you.
It's a game, just have fun playing. Most good players have high APM, but APM is not a measure of how good you are at winning.
You could change race but probably won't since you sound like the kind of terran that's not only whiny but incredibly stubborn and love to believe that their superior mechanics makes them a better player regardless of win or loss. Oh yeah you're american too, no wonder you're into brainless key bashing (not really inferring anything, just your chile bashing is unjustified assholery).
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On March 08 2009 16:49 Ver wrote:
Man threads like these are great for drawing out people.
Basically, it should be unanimous that PvT is simple mechanically. Stuff like 120 apm Fisheye, 100 whatever apm kwark is not unheard of. Yeah that's how it is, oh well just improve and don't worry about it. Who cares about effort so long as you win (although game length is a justifiable annoyance).
What seems to be beyond sight here is that PvT is simpler strategically too at low levels. That's just a natural consequence of the matchup. Protoss, for the most part, control the overall flow of the game by their tech choices and the timing of their expansions. Terrans are left to react to whatever the Protoss do. Thus against good Terrans who can react to everything really well it's like walking a tightrope for the Protoss. But against sub C+/B- or so Terrans, the Protoss can do anything and the Terran won't know how to react to it properly. Their side of the thinking end at low levels is simply much harder and then it flips around at decent levels and goes even or so at pro levels.
Again, that's just how it is. No use complaining about it, just improve or switch to Protoss if it bothers you. But face reality and realize that low level PvT is way easier mechanically and strategically than TvP is.
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United States47024 Posts
Only a 1a2a3a blog could have grown this quickly.
Whats the point in complaining about it? Everyone's already made up their own minds about whether Protoss is imba, and a stupid anecdotal blog isn't going to change anything. All this does is incite people to troll and perpetuate a joke that's been repeated too many times for its own good.
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btw, i WIN in this game. lol
it's not like im complaining pvt imba. after 26 min, i thought i played someone my level, but no, i just sucked. my fault that i let this game drag into a late game.
also, i'm a korean.
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On March 08 2009 20:28 Nytefish wrote:You see it all the time in real life. Some people study really hard, spend all their free time revising for a test, then get beat by someone who spent all their time playing starcraft instead of working (yes that's me ). Hard work isn't always rewarded, in contrast to what TV tries to teach you. It's a game, just have fun playing. Most good players have high APM, but APM is not a measure of how good you are at winning. You could change race but probably won't since you sound like the kind of terran that's not only whiny but incredibly stubborn and love to believe that their superior mechanics makes them a better player regardless of win or loss. Oh yeah you're american too, no wonder you're into brainless key bashing (not really inferring anything, just your chile bashing is unjustified assholery).
w/e i've already mentioned kwark and fisheye. if they beat me, i wouldn't have cared, why? because they are better than me w/e micro/macro. apm was just another example to add to my statement that the opponent was not my level, but was still able to play along. like i said, i might just suck. please, analyze the rep for me, master. otherwise, idk what to say more.
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Haha, you kind of have to play Terran to know what OP is feeling. It's like "shit, how'd this newb make me break such a sweat!" Yeah your opponent wasn't very good and was on the defensive the whole time. But really, to improve as Terran I think you just have to overcome that mentality and make sure you don't make the same mistakes again. Make more science vessels and stay on top of those arbiter stasises. You could've ended the game several times earleir but you just kept getting stasised and killed. Also, your timing push wasn't really good. I think the timing was a little to late for his expo which was pretty early (don't quote me on it since I'm not a really good player). That DT really messed up your timing push so remember to get comsats earlier or put up turrets faster. Overall, if you were a better player you could've ripped that guy to shreds, so become a better player! :D
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EPT![[image loading]](http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/1101/scscrnshot030809122019.jpg)
