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On December 09 2008 12:31 Salv wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2008 12:29 il0seonpurpose wrote:
buy an algebra / algebra II / trig / precalc / calc book and study on your own o__O How effective is that though? Wouldn't learning this way be rather difficult without a teacher?
it is very important to have a good teacher. especially when you're in university, choosing professors is usually discouraged, but if you can sneak into a good lecture and learn a lot, your money (parent's money) is going somewhere useful.
however, in my opinion, a good textbook is often better than the average teacher/professor.
you can always count on your textbook being there (unless you lose it) and you can seek answers even if you don't exactly know what you're asking (table of contents, index, appendix, or just read the whole section) and usually you can tell right away whether your textbook has the help you're looking for or not, rather than a tutor giving you tips you already know or don't need, or even worse, faulty advice.
if your textbook doesn't have what you need, go get another one (or go to the library and search one up).
if you get pissed at your textbook not being able to help you the whole year, you can sell it to some unknowing noob out there. you can't do that with teachers 
i keep a collection of all my good textbooks. i think i have like, 16 now? they probably weigh almost as much as i do, lol
edit: btw, most high school textbooks (the ones they give to you for free use during the year) are usually not the top in quality. At the beginning of a new curriculum term, publishers race to get their books out the fastest and cheapest. Schools buy these right away for those reasons. More up to date curriculum = +1 reputation, even if your up to date isn't really up to date. Students get the short end of the stick.
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infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
Note: I'll tell you my experiences but I must tell you that it'll be skewed since I've been taking advanced calculus (but regular everything else).
I skimmed through this thread and I can tell you at least in the University of Waterloo, high school calculus courses are largely useless to the exception of data management (very useful for stats). If you know how to differentiate/integrate, that's great. If not, you can learn in a week.
If you enjoy doing math, take some courses as your elective 2nd year and consider a major switch if you really enjoy yourself. Speaking from my own experience, I didn't rely on too many concepts I learned from high school in order to do advanced level calculus (1-3). You need logic and an ability to understand abstract ideas, not some technique you learned in hs. Of course, a lot of regular calc classes will have computation elements to it but you can look up the proofs to the theorems you're applying in class in order to really get what's going on.
For my advanced calc 1 class, we started with the least upper bound property as the axiom for the course and proved the completeness theorem and the fundamental theorem of calculus without making any other assumption. Not a single thing I did in AP math in high school helped me learn these stuff.
I personally really enjoy linear algebra because everything makes sense and I can see the relationship between all these things. A lot of questions are mechanical number crunching but the theorems/proofs are quite fun and challenging at times. It requires you to know theorems, their concepts, tricks on proving little results, etc.
If you think you'll struggle, you can get a friend to help you explain the concepts. Profs are very useful in this regard as well. Professors are in general very nice people so you can ask for as much help as you want 
I say you give it a try and see if you like it. I don't think not taking academic courses in high school will hurt you that much. It just means you'll have to put in a little bit more effort but if you like it and put in a lot of effort, there's no reason to get anything below 70%.
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infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
Oh wait, I was supposed to help you tomorrow night... oh well ;;
Let me know if you have any questions regarding university math lol
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Hi, I'm going to make my first post on Team Liquid giving you advice I have a BS (soon to have a MS) in Math, so I can at least let you know what I've seen.
It seems like you've already got some good advice from other people. You seem to be interested in things that could go in many directions: math, physics, CS, etc. "Problem solving" using mathematical skills is necessary in any science. A math degree will have more rigor and proofs than a science degree, though.
However, many science related degrees will require the same lower level math courses. So, go ahead and take the calculus and linear algebra courses. Go ahead and take other general requirement science courses. Talk to professors or advisors in each department whose classes interest you. Then decide. You can always change, too.
As far as preparing for college level math classes, I can tell you what I've seen in my semesters of teaching. A strong foundation in (High School level) algebra and trigonometry will help you immensely. Believe it or not, most calculus students don't make calculus mistakes, they make algebra mistakes. So, go back and study your algebra. Remember how to factor, and how to solve different types of equations. Trig is also very useful. If you don't test into the calculus classes right away, you'll might end up taking a "precalculus" course to prepare yourself. This is not a bad thing, or a 'remedial' course. It's going over the algebra and trig in case you're one of the many students who didn't have a strong foundation in HS.
If you have any more specific questions, feel free to ask, and I'll try and help.
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On December 09 2008 22:33 ninjafetus wrote:If you have any more specific questions, feel free to ask, and I'll try and help.
Why is your name ninjafetus? :O
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I really appreciate the help; especially Infinity & Ninja.
I think I will take some algebra and calculus courses next year as my electives and see how I do and how I like it. I will probably take some science courses as well, it will most likely take some work; especially on the science end. I did a little research and there is a night course available in the summer for students who want more prep. for University. I may take this, it's not many hours a week and I can balance that and a job quite easily.
Thanks everyone for the great advice.
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On December 09 2008 12:46 Salv wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2008 12:33 motbob wrote:This is going to seem weird, but if you really enjoy solving problems, you should give physics a try. If that's not an option, you should post the course descriptions of the introductory math courses at your University. We'd be able to help you out better if you did. + Show Spoiler + Much like the first answer I gave, physics requires taking science courses like chemistry; which I haven't taken since Gr. 10 and I never payed much attention. I am really kicking myself for not preparing in high school.
That's sad since studying physics is the closest you can come to studying math problem solving, you get a whole different view on math once you start applying it to something "real" instead of just "Solve this equation system" or "Derive the rotational volume of this function around the x-axis", its "Solve this electrical circuit system" (Becomes a series of equations) or "Calculate the centre of gravity of this object" (Becomes a volume integral).
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On December 10 2008 02:27 Klockan3 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2008 12:46 Salv wrote:On December 09 2008 12:33 motbob wrote:This is going to seem weird, but if you really enjoy solving problems, you should give physics a try. If that's not an option, you should post the course descriptions of the introductory math courses at your University. We'd be able to help you out better if you did. + Show Spoiler + Much like the first answer I gave, physics requires taking science courses like chemistry; which I haven't taken since Gr. 10 and I never payed much attention. I am really kicking myself for not preparing in high school. That's sad since studying physics is the closest you can come to studying math problem solving, you get a whole different view on math once you start applying it to something "real" instead of just "Solve this equation system" or "Derive the rotational volume of this function around the x-axis", its "Solve this electrical circuit system" (Becomes a series of equations) or "Calculate the centre of gravity of this object" (Becomes a volume integral).
Maths and applied maths (aka science + engineering) are very different things thoughs. people usually like one or the other, not both.
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On December 10 2008 02:47 KlaCkoN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2008 02:27 Klockan3 wrote:On December 09 2008 12:46 Salv wrote:On December 09 2008 12:33 motbob wrote:This is going to seem weird, but if you really enjoy solving problems, you should give physics a try. If that's not an option, you should post the course descriptions of the introductory math courses at your University. We'd be able to help you out better if you did. + Show Spoiler + Much like the first answer I gave, physics requires taking science courses like chemistry; which I haven't taken since Gr. 10 and I never payed much attention. I am really kicking myself for not preparing in high school. That's sad since studying physics is the closest you can come to studying math problem solving, you get a whole different view on math once you start applying it to something "real" instead of just "Solve this equation system" or "Derive the rotational volume of this function around the x-axis", its "Solve this electrical circuit system" (Becomes a series of equations) or "Calculate the centre of gravity of this object" (Becomes a volume integral). Maths and applied maths (aka science + engineering) are very different things thoughs. people usually like one or the other, not both.
Yes, of course I know that, I even study both kinds. The thing is though that the OP said that he liked the problem solving qualities of HS math and a real math degree is not much like that, its full of stringent proofs and you can't go much by your intuition at all.
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as a math major and tutor for my university,
i took the liberty of containing all there is to know about calculus in the following picture:
when i got done with calculus i was all like "THATS IT?!? WTF SOCIETY LIED TO ME. they were all like omg calculus"
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+ Show Spoiler +On January 07 2009 14:26 wanderer wrote:as a math major and tutor for my university, i took the liberty of containing all there is to know about calculus in the following picture: when i got done with calculus i was all like "THATS IT?!? WTF SOCIETY LIED TO ME. they were all like omg calculus"
Thats a copout imo, why did you not paint the 3d one???
Or the vector one?
Or the complex one?
Or the tensor one?
Or the functional one?
But yeah, that is roughly the only things you need to know for most non-math majors. The calculus most are taking is basic math.
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apparently math majors can make over 90k depending on the field they go into -_-
i had no idea
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EPT![[image loading]](http://img162.imageshack.us/my.php?image=24712289yh6.png)
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