• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:19
CEST 14:19
KST 21:19
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double2Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple3BSL Season 2313Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon111
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double Recent Patches and the Future Stellar Fest 1 Replay Pack Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16)
Tourneys
Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) 2026 GSTL Grand Finals SC2 INu's Battles#21 [ 3-Days tournament ] ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder Where can I find Flash replays that work? a Announcement on the JEDI Ringing Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon? BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro8 Day 3 [ASL22] Ro8 Day 4 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 2
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Zero Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine All you football fans (soccer)! Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Violent-Cooperative Play and…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 9418 users

Thinking about birds and squirrels

Blogs > batsnacks
Post a Reply
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-20 22:32:12
April 20 2014 05:59 GMT
#1
This is just sort of a test. I can't promise any of this will make sense.

The squirrels behind my house are the most spoiled animals in existence. This all began when I was shopping around at the hardware store and a 90 dollar bird feeder caught my eye; I decided I needed it. 90 dollars is pretty expensive for an impulse buy for me but I'm frequently out on my back porch and I like seeing the occasional bird when I'm out there. I hoped this would draw more of them to the area.

It caught the birds' attention at first. I assume this isn't the first bird feeder they had seen, some of my neighbors in the area probably have them too, but they seemed to have a hard time getting at the food inside. Some of the anti-squirrel technology implemented into the bird feeder was making the means to food more complicated than the birds felt was worth their while. In the end, the birds gave up on the device and I still had two giant bags of bird seed left over.

Rather than let the bird seed go to waste, I decided to see if I could at least attract their attention by putting small piles of it on easy to reach posts in my back yard. They loved this. In two days my back yard was full of several species of birds; cardinals, woodpeckers, blue jays, doves, and finches. After watching them for a while I started to notice that each species of bird seemed to have it's own personality.

Bright red male cardinals would fight and chase each other if there was a female around. Woodpeckers were independent and were the only species other birds wouldn't mess with; would you mess with someone who could smack their face into a tree a hundred times a minute? Blue jays and doves were the bullies, they would chase smaller birds out of the yard. The doves were particularly aggressive and would gang up in groups of 4-5 to chase away the others. Finches are cute and fast. They would choose a safe spot somewhere far enough off, swoop in, grab 1 seed, retreat back to safety to eat, and repeat.

Anyway, having abandoned my 90 dollar bird feeder entirely in lieu of setting free food for all out in the open I was starting to attract more than just birds. The squirrels were especially enthusiastic about the hand outs. It started with just one, then two, then in a few days there were six regulars that I could count. Most people do not like squirrels in their yard. They steal birdseed, they will eat all the food in your garden if you have one, and they will throw their nuts and seeds in your air conditioning unit in some misguided attempt to store food. After watching the squirrels carefully however, I was starting to really like them. They didn't scare away any birds and their behaviors were surprisingly complex and fun to watch.

I noticed very quickly that, unlike the birds, the squirrels would not just eat their fill and then leave. The squirrels would eat their fill, then start stuffing their cheeks with seeds, then when their cheeks were full they would run to some seemingly random location, bury the seeds, and return to my yard for more. Repeat until birdseed is gone. I followed several squirrels many times on their journeys to stash their seeds and noticed that they rarely put food in the same stash spot. This struck me as curious: How does a squirrel keep track of all their stashes? What is the method? Do they use trail marks? It didn't seem the case. Rote memorization? I doubt it, they had a lot of spots, more than I could easily keep track of. Or is it an algorithm? More on this later.

Another curious behavior emerged: After only a few days of leaving the birdseed out in the open, I was noticing squirrels that would look through the windows of my house and keep track of my location at all times. I'd just be sitting in my office, look outside, and there's a squirrel on the fence glaring at me. I'd move to the kitchen, and the same squirrel would have moved to a tree outside the kitchen window, again, staring at me.

The squirrels were getting attached to me, as evidenced by them following my movements around the house, and I was getting attached to them. I decided I wanted to buy them a special treat. I went to the grocery store looking for squirrel food and decided on a giant bag of unsalted, roasted, peanuts. These will be great I thought. Much larger than the sunflower seeds I had been giving them and perfect for stashing. Plus, I figured, maybe if the squirrels like these more they will stop eating the birdseed all together and leave it for the birds. I woke up the morning after, walked to the kitchen (as usual squirrels staring at me through the window), walked outside to put out the usual bird seed, went inside, then took out the peanuts I bought and scattered them on the ground. I made it my mission this morning to gain more insight into how a squirrel chooses and finds it's stashes.

I am not a biologist. Everything I say is pure, casual, speculation. In all likely hood, nothing I say is true.

Squirrels use a simple algorithm for locating and deciding on stash locations.

It is a system I am going to describe as: Spot Points, Trails, Wall Points, and Jumps.

A Spot Point is a precise location where food can be found easily (I.E. my back yard).

A Trail is a path that leads between Spot Points and/or Wall Points. A Trail will either begin at a Spot Point and end at a Wall Point, or begin at a Wall Point and end at another Wall Point. A trail contains the variables Stealth and Energy Expenditure.

Stealth refers to how stealthy a squirrel can be while traveling along a Trail. This variable is desired to be as high as possible in order to avoid predators.

Energy Expenditure refers to how much energy must be expended in order to travel along a Trail. This variable is desired to be as low as possible in order to conserve valuable energy.

A Trail starts at a Spot Point or Wall Point and continues along the precise path where Stealth is highest and Energy Expenditure is lowest. A mathematical balance between the two variables must be reached.

If when following a Trail the Stealth and Energy Expenditure variables fall below a certain threshold, I.E. there is too little Stealth and/or too much Energy Expenditure, a Wall Point is encountered.

When a Wall Point is encountered, the surroundings are briefly surveyed to obtain a heuristic estimate of where the next best Trail will start. The Jump is then executed and the squirrel begins on the new Trail, again abiding by highest Stealth and lowest Energy Expenditure.

Squirrels ALWAYS stash their food at a Wall Point, I.E. in between two Trails.

It is desirable for the squirrel to limit the amount of Jumps performed, as a Jump requires significant Energy Expenditure.

A crude diagram:
[image loading]

This system is useful because by simply keeping track of locations where food is easily located (Spot Points), all food stashes can easily be found by following the rules for Trails, since Trails abide by where Stealth is the highest and Energy Expenditure is the lowest every time.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If this theory is correct, then by modifying a Trail a squirrel is using between Wall Points, I should be able to throw them off their stashes. I will be testing this theory in some indeterminate period of time to come.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Questions for TL:

Does the "squirrel search algorithm" make sense?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

edit: Now with video!



Squirrel starts checking out the camera about 1:30

*****
JohnChoi
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
1773 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-20 10:36:23
April 20 2014 10:35 GMT
#2
This was the most interesting read I've had in a while. Behaviors of squirrels this is some animal behavior Ph.D shit!!
and to answer the question at the end, yes it totally makes sense. the squirrel is being as efficient as possible by finding a stealthy yet convenient location to store their food lol
Saechiis
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Netherlands4989 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-20 10:49:21
April 20 2014 10:49 GMT
#3
This is nuts! And who dislikes squirrels? They're so cute.
I think esports is pretty nice.
Pangpootata
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
1838 Posts
April 20 2014 13:13 GMT
#4
Something to consider: When a squirrel chooses a wallpoint which is not a permanent fixture, try to remove it and see what the squirrel does. Will the squirrel get puzzled and lose track of everything? or will it just forgo that one point and proceed as usual. I know it's quite mean to the squirrel, but it's for the sake of science!
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
April 20 2014 13:55 GMT
#5
On April 20 2014 22:13 Pangpootata wrote:
Something to consider: When a squirrel chooses a wallpoint which is not a permanent fixture, try to remove it and see what the squirrel does. Will the squirrel get puzzled and lose track of everything? or will it just forgo that one point and proceed as usual. I know it's quite mean to the squirrel, but it's for the sake of science!


They won't starve. Trust me. Worst case scenario is I'll start seeing more sunflowers in my back yard.
pebble444
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Italy2503 Posts
April 20 2014 16:48 GMT
#6
loved this blog made me laugh and cheerful. i think do that those squirrels are acting like bullies. You gave them a finger and there taking the whole hand. You should impose a limit and hold your space, its not fair to the birds and to you
"Awaken my Child, and embrace the Glory that is your Birthright"
Omnishroud
Profile Blog Joined November 2013
1073 Posts
April 20 2014 18:02 GMT
#7
On April 20 2014 19:49 Saechiis wrote:
This is nuts!


Did you really expect to get away with that ? D:
Omni = Capped (RIP TL Account) - LoL EUW: Capped92 - EU Bnet: Capped#1137 - Steam: Capped92
Mafe
Profile Joined February 2011
Germany5966 Posts
April 20 2014 19:40 GMT
#8
We need pictures of said squirrels.
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-20 22:18:22
April 20 2014 22:03 GMT
#9
On April 21 2014 04:40 Mafe wrote:
We need pictures of said squirrels.


Uploading a nice video now. Should be done within the hour.

http://youtu.be/6qfasCg4Pas?t=25s

Going to add it to my original post too. Thanks for the idea.
Mothra
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States1448 Posts
April 20 2014 22:31 GMT
#10
Love the video. What a pig that squirrel is lol.
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-20 23:03:54
April 20 2014 22:58 GMT
#11
On April 21 2014 07:31 Mothra wrote:
Love the video. What a pig that squirrel is lol.


Yeah he was kind of being a bastard today and scaring the birds. They're not usually like that. Maybe the cold weather has him feeling grumpy. You can see in the video that he's hungry because he is actually eating the seeds instead saving them for later, so that could also be why.
JohnChoi
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
1773 Posts
April 20 2014 23:15 GMT
#12
Maybe he hid a bunch of seeds for reserve then he was like "oh shit i forgot where i hid them" and he is hungry now
flamewheel
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
April 20 2014 23:50 GMT
#13
This is awesome. Great read!
Writerdamn, i was two days from retirement
hp.Shell
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2527 Posts
April 21 2014 20:26 GMT
#14
I think it's also easier for cardinals and finches to eat seeds because of their shorter beaks. The blue jays have to peck them open so they can grab the food inside, but the cardinals can just crack them open, almost like how we do with molars.

You should totally use this as a Ph.D. dissertation study, or publish your findings in a scientific journal. Really interesting stuff, maybe you could also video the squirrels following those path algorithms and stashing the food, and then have another video where you've modified the environment and then we can all see what they do!
Please PM me with any songs you like that you think I haven't heard before!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Kung Fu Cup
11:00
2026 Week 25
Rex100
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko362
ProTech130
Rex 100
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 40894
Jaedong 1155
Hyuk 894
Soma 529
actioN 496
Horang2 384
Soulkey 360
EffOrt 343
BeSt 332
Mini 309
[ Show more ]
Light 252
Zeus 241
Larva 229
Stork 209
Last 207
910 189
Snow 135
ggaemo 122
Rush 119
Pusan 87
ZerO 71
Mind 54
Creator 49
Mong 43
Killer 38
hero 37
Sharp 36
Shinee 33
Yoon 31
Free 30
Bale 26
Shine 20
HiyA 19
yabsab 13
Noble 13
sorry 13
Sacsri 9
Icarus 5
Terrorterran 3
Dota 2
Gorgc6906
Dendi692
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1656
markeloff114
kRYSTAL_30
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor1366
Other Games
gofns40222
singsing1759
B2W.Neo504
XBOCT319
Pyrionflax294
DeMusliM224
byalli187
hiko127
ArmadaUGS64
Mew2King61
ZerO(Twitch)13
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 1016
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream208
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH325
• StrangeGG 33
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 9
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1488
Other Games
• WagamamaTV173
Upcoming Events
Stellar Fest
42m
The PondCast
21h 42m
OSC
1d
Stellar Fest
1d
OSC
1d 11h
Stellar Fest
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
Online Event
2 days
FEL
3 days
AI Arena Tournament
3 days
[ Show More ]
BSL: Ladder Tournament
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
INu's Battles
3 days
herO vs Classic
Percival vs Rogue
BSL Open Qualifier
4 days
BSL Open Qualifier
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
INu's Battles
5 days
SHIN vs Cure
ByuN vs Zoun
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-27
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Calamity Invitational

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.