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So as a man approaching the end of his twenties D: It is in my experience that most people in their early to mid twenties treat each other like shit. Maybe they don't necessarily mean to do so, they just do so subconsciously, or due to hormones or whatever. That's another discussion though.
Back to the point of this thread. People in their late teens and twenties tend to have shitty relationships. That's kind of the point. You date around. You see what you like, and what you don't like. Sometimes you find out things about yourself that you never would have thought. Or sometimes you change your whole outlook on what kind of woman you are looking for and can't believe what you used to desire. Whatever the case is, we all; metaphorically or literally, end up going through a relationship eventually where cheating is involved. Maybe you did the cheating. Maybe your SO did. Maybe you both did. Either way it usually ends the relationship, and it's usually for the best. This is actually better than if it had happened once you were married, or had kids, a career- or whatever else would be disastrous to the situation.
With all that taken into consideration; assuming someone has to cheat eventually.
Is it better to be cheated on or cheating with?
 
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Well if I was cheated on I would most likely have the moral high ground and therefore be seen less as a douche bag than I would if I had cheated with; on the other hand, If i cheated with my self confidence would go up and (depending on the context) I would be glad since I now knoew I would not cheat later on in life.
Or maybe people would know that I am a cheater and that they should stay away from me or at least be careful.
Def cheated on, you'd get hurt and you would be angry but in the long run you saved someone else misery.
Maybe not cheated on...
Ill have to get my ol think tank back together.
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I've never been in a relationship with cheating, although I'm also in the minority of young adults who have actually had a long, successful relationship... I've been with my girlfriend for about 7-8 years now, I'm 25, and we were high school sweethearts (and made it through long distance relationships in college and graduate school).
But I'd rather be cheated on than be the cheater, as (like KK said above) I'd have the moral highground, and also it wouldn't tarnish my reputation. If you're cheating in one relationship, I would think it'd be hard for any new person to want to date you exclusively as well (because you may very well cheat on this new person too).
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Although the easy answer morally, is the cheated on. I wonder how many people actually have been through one or both. And I wonder how many people have since changed their outlook.
Being someone who actually fits into both categories. I can say it's much easier emotionally to cheat with than be cheated on. And I if one were to happen to me again, I would rather it be me in the control seat.
Before you all get white knight on me, know that I have grown from the experience and changed my ways. So the whole once a cheater, always a cheater thing is bullshit. It's more akin to an addiction, I've kicked it and I'm technically a lifelong predisposed individual but I will do my best never to relapse. + Show Spoiler [backstory] +The girl I cheated on (only in the early month or so of the relationship) who I was with for 4 years, was really a shitty relationship. She was/is a damaged person and I was an uncaring abusive (not physically) asshole because she would go party and abuse me verbally, or randomly throw me under the bus. Never could really trust her fully. After we broke up, I got people coming out of the woodworks telling me she was cheating left and right, including right from the horses mouth from at least 2 guys. And recalling now, at least 1 time where she mentioned something that I thought was a joke and didn't believe at the time.
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Yeah MC I'm not going to white knight on you, but my girlfriend and I have both (always) agreed on cheating being a dealbreaker in terms of our relationship (just like how a dealbreaker for some is whether or not their significant other wants kids). And we have our reasons, and you and others have your own reasons (good or bad) for cheating.
And even if you've learned from cheating that you'll never do it again (which is the silverest lining there is, from my perspective), I would be afraid it would eventually come up in the future (that you've cheated in the past), and then you would be judged by your new/ potential significant other. ::shrugs::
Personally, I'd hate to feel betrayed, but I'd hate even more to betray someone who put all their trust and love in me. I don't like to fuck up ^^
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On October 31 2013 08:36 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
I've never been in a relationship with cheating, although I'm also in the minority of young adults who have actually had a long, successful relationship... I've been with my girlfriend for about 7-8 years now, I'm 25, and we were high school sweethearts (and made it through long distance relationships in college and graduate school).
But I'd rather be cheated on than be the cheater, as (like KK said above) I'd have the moral highground, and also it wouldn't tarnish my reputation. If you're cheating in one relationship, I would think it'd be hard for any new person to want to date you exclusively as well (because you may very well cheat on this new person too).
haha that gives me hope. sounds like im in the exact situation now that you were in ~4 years ago lol
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On October 31 2013 08:53 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2013 08:36 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
I've never been in a relationship with cheating, although I'm also in the minority of young adults who have actually had a long, successful relationship... I've been with my girlfriend for about 7-8 years now, I'm 25, and we were high school sweethearts (and made it through long distance relationships in college and graduate school).
But I'd rather be cheated on than be the cheater, as (like KK said above) I'd have the moral highground, and also it wouldn't tarnish my reputation. If you're cheating in one relationship, I would think it'd be hard for any new person to want to date you exclusively as well (because you may very well cheat on this new person too). haha that gives me hope. sounds like im in the exact situation now that you were in ~4 years ago lol
How old are both of you guys? I am actually interested in the context of it all and future. for science.
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DPB said he was 25. im 21, in college with a gf of 4-5 years
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On October 31 2013 09:07 PassiveAce wrote:
DPB said he was 25. im 21, in college with a gf of 4-5 years
Didn't see that he said that, but I actually meant the girls too. Are they the same age or thereabouts? All in college?
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my gf is 24, she finished college just as I was starting lol
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Kinda comparing apples to oranges. One is an emotional kick in the balls, the other takes away your ability to say that you aren't a colossal bag of shit.
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On October 31 2013 09:21 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote:
Kinda comparing apples to oranges. One is a kick in the balls, the other takes away your ability to say that you aren't a colossal bag of shit.
Objectively speaking, why do you think there is such animosity toward people who cheat in our society and culture? I think this holds true in non western cultures as well. Like what do you think, if any, is the biological/evolutionary reasoning to hate cheating and cheaters?
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I think its because its painful to the other person in the relationship, and partly because the act of cheating is often tied in with deceitfulness.
I think its ok if you want to fuck other people when your in a relationship with someone but if your gonna do it then you should let the person your in a relationship know that you want to fuck other people. I mean, its really only fair to the person your "dating" that you let them know if you arnt interested in them anymore.
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On October 31 2013 09:25 MarlieChurphy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2013 09:21 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote:
Kinda comparing apples to oranges. One is a kick in the balls, the other takes away your ability to say that you aren't a colossal bag of shit. Objectively speaking, why do you think there is such animosity to people who cheat in our society and culture. I think this holds true in non western cultures as well. Like what do you think, if any, is the biological/evolutionary reasoning to hate cheating and cheaters?
Well, how it works is extremely obvious, but why it exists? Fairly easy to deduce as well. Keep in mind this is a logical deduction from facts I've learned, not something I've read from a scientific study. Evolution has thrown scientists a curve-ball many times so far. The below is presented as a walkthrough of my thought process on this matter. All facts are facts I have confirmed, all conclusions are conclusions I have made from those facts.
Sex, and what it means for each gender, is a very important factor in evolution. Men spit out some expendable liquids and then they're done. They can do this at any time and be pretty much just as fertile every time they do this. It's a very simple, low-investment process that encourages spamming. It's like a 50 caliber machine gun pretty much. If you shoot enough, you'll manage to hit something eventually. Since it encourages spamming, men evolved a nearly-uncontrollable urge to stick their dick in anything it'll fit into (I'm a guy, btw, so no feminazi here). This urge was probably a lot less controlled back in the day, due to lack of laws, consequences, morals encouraging restraint, complicated social game, yada yada yada.
Anyways, eventually we got a bit smarter and realized that, in order to help propagate our genes, it would be helpful to ensure that our genetic legacy actually survived to adulthood. So, we started getting attached to our spouse and our children. Unfortunately, that didn't get rid of the uncontrollable meat-seeking missile between our legs, so there was definitely a large risk of some random male coming along and sexing up your valuable genetic investment. So, men evolved to get pissed when other men tried to damage or even subvert their investments.
That should explain how men get angry when cheated on, but as for women? They were probably always prone to being attached. They're weaker than men by a good margin and pregnancy + raising a child is downright debilitating. Men evolved to be attracted to looks, since it was a quick way to judge the only important thing for them: fertility. Women, on the other hand, evolved a much more nuanced system to judge a potential mate's ability and willingness to care for their bloated, pregnant ass. If men were on a Humvee, driving around as fast as they could while spamming their mounted 50 cal at anything with a pulse, women were laying prone on the ground with a sniper rifle, patiently scoping out every target before firing a single, well-placed shot. Naturally, such a person would be particularly averse to loosing their mate. Back in the day, that would probably kill you if you were pregnant. Heck the best case scenario is you've already given birth and can just leave your kid to starve. You can't care for him, you need to eat.
So yeah, that's my theory. If we were pack animals back in the day, things would probably be less extreme. Our children might get adopted, we'd help each other when bad things happened, we'd have more potential mates. You'd basically be less screwed in general should anything happen. You'd still be at a disadvantage if a relationship were to go awry though, which means evolution would still take place, but things wouldn't be as harsh for our evolutionary ancestors.
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It's better to be cheated on. I've been cheated on by a girl before and I ended up feeling like a big bag of recycled toilet paper that got accidentally flushed with the neighbors dog's sock vomit. But it does make you end up getting over that person a lot faster. They're garbage and you want nothing to do with them. It was good you found out now rather than finding out much later.
If I cheated with, I don't know how I could live with myself after. It's like the lowest thing you can do in a relationship. That or tape over your last copy of Rocko's Modern Life. Seriously, how good was that show?
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On October 31 2013 09:21 PassiveAce wrote:
my gf is 24, she finished college just as I was starting lol
My girlfriend is 24 as well. She'll finish vet school around the same time as I finish my PhD program.
She did undergrad in Connecticut and I stayed in New Jersey... it was pretty hard, but it became a lot easier when she got into vet school at UPenn <3
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sometimes I don't get people. Then again I've never really understood monogamy. My girlfriend(s- on occassion) can jump whosoever's bones they wish, and I can do likewise. I only expect them not to lie about it, nor put my sexual health at risk.
Especially before the age of 30 no single person is capable of sustaining the need for intimacy of any other for any meaningful length of time. People who try tend to end up emotionally scarred or stunted, either from grinding their face against an awkward relationship they feel ethically compelled into remaining in or from massive guilt when they naturally fail at that expectation.
The only truly healthy and confident woman I know is getting married to her partner of like five years soon, in which time she's slept with a dozen or more other guys, including me. I am overjoyed for them, as they are a beautiful couple, and her partner is completely happy for her to spread her attentions around, even after the ceremony. This, more than anything else, has taught me that 'cheating' is in the same category of social ills as 'cooties'. It's an excuse for people to feel angry and betrayed, to ostracise and isolate rather than discuss and accept.
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On October 31 2013 12:30 Thereisnosaurus wrote:
sometimes I don't get people. Then again I've never really understood monogamy. My girlfriend(s- on occassion) can jump whosoever's bones they wish, and I can do likewise. I only expect them not to lie about it, nor put my sexual health at risk.
That makes sense, especially for younger people. As people get older or start to plan out the rest of their lives, however, a little more stability in relationships may be preferred (especially if you plan on having children).
Especially before the age of 30 no single person is capable of sustaining the need for intimacy of any other for any meaningful length of time. People who try tend to end up emotionally scarred or stunted, either from grinding their face against an awkward relationship they feel ethically compelled into remaining in or from massive guilt when they naturally fail at that expectation.
Uh, well I'm just fine with my monogamous, exclusive relationship. So is my girlfriend. So are a few dozen of my friends (age 21-28) who are already married or engaged. Just because you aren't capable of sustaining one doesn't mean others can't handle it, if they prefer it over staying in open relationships.
The only truly healthy and confident woman I know is getting married to her partner of like five years soon, in which time she's slept with a dozen or more other guys, including me. I am overjoyed for them, as they are a beautiful couple, and her partner is completely happy for her to spread her attentions around, even after the ceremony. This, more than anything else, has taught me that 'cheating' is in the same category of social ills as 'cooties'. It's an excuse for people to feel angry and betrayed, to ostracise and isolate rather than discuss and accept.
Cheating in a relationship is a real thing, if there is a pre-established agreement regarding fidelity and trust. It's far more analogous to lying or stealing, than it is to something non-existent. Cheating is less of an issue in a polyamorous relationship (because you're allowing your partner- and you- to fool around with others), but fidelity and trust are justifiable concerns when practicing an exclusive relationship (especially if you have a family and fooling around with other people starts to jeopardize the time and money you should be spending on your kids). If you don't want to worry about cheating, date someone else who doesn't care either (or don't date anyone at all). And you may be very happy with that, but just because you "never really understood monogamy" doesn't mean it shouldn't exist or won't be preferred by some people for legitimate reasons.
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On October 31 2013 12:30 Thereisnosaurus wrote:
sometimes I don't get people. Then again I've never really understood monogamy. My girlfriend(s- on occassion) can jump whosoever's bones they wish, and I can do likewise. I only expect them not to lie about it, nor put my sexual health at risk.
Especially before the age of 30 no single person is capable of sustaining the need for intimacy of any other for any meaningful length of time. People who try tend to end up emotionally scarred or stunted, either from grinding their face against an awkward relationship they feel ethically compelled into remaining in or from massive guilt when they naturally fail at that expectation.
The only truly healthy and confident woman I know is getting married to her partner of like five years soon, in which time she's slept with a dozen or more other guys, including me. I am overjoyed for them, as they are a beautiful couple, and her partner is completely happy for her to spread her attentions around, even after the ceremony. This, more than anything else, has taught me that 'cheating' is in the same category of social ills as 'cooties'. It's an excuse for people to feel angry and betrayed, to ostracise and isolate rather than discuss and accept.
He says while roughly half of the countries in the world have an average marriage age in the late twenties, which means a stable relationship that started months, if not years before that point. I guess that means most people are emotional cripples who suffered severe psychological damage as a result of falling in love.
Don't reflect your own feelings onto everybody else. Just because you and your friends are fine with cheating doesn't mean everybody else is. Similar things can be said about your beliefs towards monogamy and the nature of attraction.
Also, your assertion that the cheating is an "excuse" is ridiculous in the extreme. Do you know how much people react to being cheated on? They get fucking destroyed. Wrecked. Reactions on such an enormous scale can't be conditioned in so easily. Conditioned emotional reactions aren't bad in and of themselves, they hurt because they activate natural negative reactions, like a string tied to a gun trigger. For example, a person who is happy alone may feel sad about not having any friends. Not having any friends is not inherently painful for the individual, he is happy alone, but it is abnormal, which means he is abnormal in some way, perhaps because he has no social skills. So, having no friends triggers the negative emotions associated with his failures in the social arena, thus completing the system.
So, what would you say is the "root pain" in cheating? The most obvious one seems to be the other person rejecting your feelings towards her, or at the minimum, she doesn't care about you as much as you do about her. She doesn't reciprocate your feelings. If that is the root pain, then it also refutes your assertion that people are inherently polygamous. If we can care that much, then we can be monogamous.
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I haven't read all the new posts here yet but I just thought about this (ill do that in the morning), and I wanted to clarify (not sure if it makes much of a difference). By 'cheating with', I meant you and your SO, and you stepped outside the relationship. Not a person(friend?) and their SO, and you being single and knowing about their relationship and partaking in their cheating. Which is worse? or is it?
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EPT
