Time to Wake Up
Blogs > Barrin |
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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iTzSnypah
United States1738 Posts
So which fruit are you referring to? | ||
Birdie
New Zealand4438 Posts
Also related: I don't think it's true anymore that the USA government answers to You the people. Certainly it could again return to answering to the people (if it ever did), but it won't as long as people allow the government to grow so large. And I don't think anything will change in a good way until the USA collapses in some way, whether through war or economic collapse or financial collapse or religious upheavel, any one of which could be coming soon and could be far away. I certainly wish your country the best of luck in sorting itself out but I don't see it changing just because of good words written by well-meaning people. It's very rare to have that happen if you look at history, and I don't see any way that the USA will be the exception. | ||
Elegy
United States1629 Posts
Yet issue is taken already: "I am purposely not backing up my claims with evidence because I want you to research and find out for yourself - honestly you are the problem if you haven't and don't." The "compelling evidence" you speak of regarding 9/11 for example, is hardly compelling, and based largely on often questionable partial analysis of the official story, or are attempts to prove a political agenda based on a need to prove something that isn't there. You then move on to claim the Federal Reserve is controlled by private banks with no government oversight, an obviously untrue statement. More to the point, it's a partial truth taken to an extreme and thus couched in the logic of using only a fragment of the truth to attempt to explain the whole. Your point about the CIA is, again, similar to your incorrect view of the Reserve, not an unsurprising occurrence. All in all, while I understand and appreciate your points (some of which are valid, to be sure), you are exhibiting a very common trait among primarily young "internet warrior" types where your views and beliefs are often decided before looking at the actual facts, or your view of the facts is often a perversion of the truth. It makes it very difficult to dissuade of your extremist ideology with regards to some of your points (9/11, the Fed, false flags being common, science in the classroom etc etc) because the partial nuggets of truth are so well embedded in what you choose to believe. Lastly, your points in your first paragraph about the Constitution are very likely simply wrong, as its highly unlikely you could construct a solid, defensible legal case about exactly why and how (based on both precedence, logic, and a firm understanding of constitutional history and law) the government is somehow illegally selling parts of itself to large organizations in an unconstitutional manner. More likely than not, the actions of the government somehow conflict with how YOUR perception of constitutionality. Whether in reality they do or not is a subject for debate, of course, and would naturally require far more specific details. Now, I will say this: The US is a country with great problems. The war on drugs. The education system. Student debt. Social welfare programs. Questionable military intervention. Shady intelligence gathering techniques. The list goes on. But assuming the government is out to "get us" or keep us down is silly. It's nonsense. The "government" is widely inefficient and insanely slow and bogged down in miles of red tape that it boggles the mind as to how anyone could think the CIA, for example, has the means, time, resources, and willpower to sift through all of your emails for...what purpose, exactly? If the government was capable of even a fraction of the conspiracy theories that exist, or more accurately the perversions of reality that concerned individuals occasionally have, you'd be talking about a quite literally omniscient entity that transcends all known parameters regarding limitations. The government, to a conspiracy nut, is a God. The truth is obviously far from that. If you say it's time to wake up, I'd say it's time to simply step back and face reality. The government never "answered to the people" in the sense I believe you think it did. The Newsroom rant linked above is quite telling- it's perfect until he starts waxing philosophically on what we lost as a country. It makes for good drama...but it's mostly rose tinted glasses. | ||
farvacola
United States18768 Posts
On December 21 2012 12:07 Elegy wrote: + Show Spoiler + Good read. Yet issue is taken already: "I am purposely not backing up my claims with evidence because I want you to research and find out for yourself - honestly you are the problem if you haven't and don't." The "compelling evidence" you speak of regarding 9/11 for example, is hardly compelling, and based largely on often questionable partial analysis of the official story, or are attempts to prove a political agenda based on a need to prove something that isn't there. You then move on to claim the Federal Reserve is controlled by private banks with no government oversight, an obviously untrue statement. More to the point, it's a partial truth taken to an extreme and thus couched in the logic of using only a fragment of the truth to attempt to explain the whole. Your point about the CIA is, again, similar to your incorrect view of the Reserve, not an unsurprising occurrence. All in all, while I understand and appreciate your points (some of which are valid, to be sure), you are exhibiting a very common trait among primarily young "internet warrior" types where your views and beliefs are often decided before looking at the actual facts, or your view of the facts is often a perversion of the truth. It makes it very difficult to dissuade of your extremist ideology with regards to some of your points (9/11, the Fed, false flags being common, science in the classroom etc etc) because the partial nuggets of truth are so well embedded in what you choose to believe. Lastly, your points in your first paragraph about the Constitution are very likely simply wrong, as its highly unlikely you could construct a solid, defensible legal case about exactly why and how (based on both precedence, logic, and a firm understanding of constitutional history and law) the government is somehow illegally selling parts of itself to large organizations in an unconstitutional manner. More likely than not, the actions of the government somehow conflict with how YOUR perception of constitutionality. Whether in reality they do or not is a subject for debate, of course, and would naturally require far more specific details. Now, I will say this: The US is a country with great problems. The war on drugs. The education system. Student debt. Social welfare programs. Questionable military intervention. Shady intelligence gathering techniques. The list goes on. But assuming the government is out to "get us" or keep us down is silly. It's nonsense. The "government" is widely inefficient and insanely slow and bogged down in miles of red tape that it boggles the mind as to how anyone could think the CIA, for example, has the means, time, resources, and willpower to sift through all of your emails for...what purpose, exactly? If the government was capable of even a fraction of the conspiracy theories that exist, or more accurately the perversions of reality that concerned individuals occasionally have, you'd be talking about a quite literally omniscient entity that transcends all known parameters regarding limitations. The government, to a conspiracy nut, is a God. The truth is obviously far from that. If you say it's time to wake up, I'd say it's time to simply step back and face reality. The government never "answered to the people" in the sense I believe you think it did. The Newsroom rant linked above is quite telling- it's perfect until he starts waxing philosophically on what we lost as a country. It makes for good drama...but it's mostly rose tinted glasses. Holy shit. Took the words right off of my fingertips. I'll simply add a meaningless quip I've just made up. "The Monolith and the Inefficient Machine can oftentimes frighten us one and the same, that needn't mean we confuse the two." | ||
MountainDewJunkie
United States10340 Posts
And no, combined with the Introvert thread, I am certainly not taking issue with you. You are obviously educated and a man of passion. But I feel it is you who does not see the big picture. Caring, feelings, organic home gardens, amount to nothing. Massive forceful change is required and even if we all feel guilt for our abundance compared to the rest of the world, who among us has actually done something remotely meaningful to quell both the nation's and the world's problems? | ||
HardlyNever
United States1258 Posts
I am purposely not backing up my claims with evidence because I want you to research and find out for yourself - honestly you are the problem if you haven't and don't. I skimmed over the rest, and I probably don't 100% disagree with everything you say, but that is never a good way to start writing when you are trying to convince someone of something. I'm envisioned a tin foil hat of some size; if you want to come back at this with credible (i.e. academic) sources I'd be more than happy to give it a read. | ||
blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On December 21 2012 12:07 Elegy wrote: Good read. Yet issue is taken already: "I am purposely not backing up my claims with evidence because I want you to research and find out for yourself - honestly you are the problem if you haven't and don't." The "compelling evidence" you speak of regarding 9/11 for example, is hardly compelling, and based largely on often questionable partial analysis of the official story, or are attempts to prove a political agenda based on a need to prove something that isn't there. You then move on to claim the Federal Reserve is controlled by private banks with no government oversight, an obviously untrue statement. More to the point, it's a partial truth taken to an extreme and thus couched in the logic of using only a fragment of the truth to attempt to explain the whole. Your point about the CIA is, again, similar to your incorrect view of the Reserve, not an unsurprising occurrence. All in all, while I understand and appreciate your points (some of which are valid, to be sure), you are exhibiting a very common trait among primarily young "internet warrior" types where your views and beliefs are often decided before looking at the actual facts, or your view of the facts is often a perversion of the truth. It makes it very difficult to dissuade of your extremist ideology with regards to some of your points (9/11, the Fed, false flags being common, science in the classroom etc etc) because the partial nuggets of truth are so well embedded in what you choose to believe. Lastly, your points in your first paragraph about the Constitution are very likely simply wrong, as its highly unlikely you could construct a solid, defensible legal case about exactly why and how (based on both precedence, logic, and a firm understanding of constitutional history and law) the government is somehow illegally selling parts of itself to large organizations in an unconstitutional manner. More likely than not, the actions of the government somehow conflict with how YOUR perception of constitutionality. Whether in reality they do or not is a subject for debate, of course, and would naturally require far more specific details. Now, I will say this: The US is a country with great problems. The war on drugs. The education system. Student debt. Social welfare programs. Questionable military intervention. Shady intelligence gathering techniques. The list goes on. But assuming the government is out to "get us" or keep us down is silly. It's nonsense. The "government" is widely inefficient and insanely slow and bogged down in miles of red tape that it boggles the mind as to how anyone could think the CIA, for example, has the means, time, resources, and willpower to sift through all of your emails for...what purpose, exactly? If the government was capable of even a fraction of the conspiracy theories that exist, or more accurately the perversions of reality that concerned individuals occasionally have, you'd be talking about a quite literally omniscient entity that transcends all known parameters regarding limitations. The government, to a conspiracy nut, is a God. The truth is obviously far from that. If you say it's time to wake up, I'd say it's time to simply step back and face reality. The government never "answered to the people" in the sense I believe you think it did. The Newsroom rant linked above is quite telling- it's perfect until he starts waxing philosophically on what we lost as a country. It makes for good drama...but it's mostly rose tinted glasses. I pretty much agree with you on everything you just said. Honestly OP I kind of face palmed reading what you just wrote and then saying why you aren't giving evidence. | ||
SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
On December 21 2012 12:07 Elegy wrote: Good read. Yet issue is taken already: "I am purposely not backing up my claims with evidence because I want you to research and find out for yourself - honestly you are the problem if you haven't and don't." The "compelling evidence" you speak of regarding 9/11 for example, is hardly compelling, and based largely on often questionable partial analysis of the official story, or are attempts to prove a political agenda based on a need to prove something that isn't there. Pretty much all of them are half baked theories that conveniently ignore certain facts of what happened that day, and none of them ever answer the counter arguments that are presented? Building 7, for instance, has been explained a zillion times (it wasn't structurally sound), and when this is brought to one of these conspiracy theorist nutjobs, all they say is "LOL! CONSIDER YOUR SOURCE! THEY'RE RUN BY THE GOVERNMENT!" The reason that they believe and support the conspiracy is not because of anything they see, but rather because the conspiracy upholds their preconceived world view. Observing anything objectively would require them to question the very foundations on which they have constructed their lives, and that is far too difficult and painful a task to follow through with... the idea that we could be wrong is horrifying to most. And here is a study backing up what I just wrote. [Interesting read, by the way.] | ||
hoby2000
United States918 Posts
Most of the replies to this blog are ironic because you guys are exemplifying EXACTLY what Barrin is talking about. I'm more than positive he knew you would respond like that too because i have been tempted to write this EXACT post so many damn times, but I always remember that most people just don't get it. This world is a mess. | ||
MountainDewJunkie
United States10340 Posts
Tell us then, hoby2000, with your enlightened awareness and mastery of irony, have you done for our nation and our earth? | ||
hoby2000
United States918 Posts
On December 21 2012 12:42 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Not one person here believes the world ISN'T a mess. And we surrender more freedoms on an annual basis. Tell us then, hoby2000, with your enlightened awareness and mastery of irony, have you done for our nation and our earth? My supposed "enlightened awareness" and "mastery of irony" are from doing this thing called thinking. I do it in my spare time so I can move my life forward. | ||
ParkwayDrive
United States328 Posts
ive always tried to have hope with america because freedom is all that matters and as fucked up as america is we still alot of freedom compared to most places. the problem is we have a lot less freedom than people are led to believe in this country and that is what is really sad. i for one have given up hope in america, the thing that really sealed the deal for me is these school shootings. no one wants to get the the root of the problem which the the psychotropic drugs that many of our kids are put on since being a toddler because teachers and parents want a quick fix and/or they just dont do the research and they believe whatever big pharma will tell them. but no one is even asking what drugs this kid was on, they would rather blame starcraft and try and take away our guns. we have always had guns, other countries have guns. yet school shootings only happen here. no one ever asks because they are afraid of big pharma. our diets and our medications are killing us and no one seems to care enough to even ask the questions. makes me sick and i for one cant wait to get out of this country in a few months. | ||
iamho
3344 Posts
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MountainDewJunkie
United States10340 Posts
On December 21 2012 12:51 ParkwayDrive wrote: lol gotta love people who wont do the work themselves. you tried bro but sheep will be sheep. i get what youre saying but in the end we can only take care of ourselves and try with those we care about. ive always tried to have hope with america because freedom is all that matters and as fucked up as america is we still alot of freedom compared to most places. the problem is we have a lot less freedom than people are led to believe in this country and that is what is really sad. i for one have given up hope in america, the thing that really sealed the deal for me is these school shootings. no one wants to get the the root of the problem which the the psychotropic drugs that many of our kids are put on since being a toddler because teachers and parents want a quick fix and/or they just dont do the research and they believe whatever big pharma will tell them. but no one is even asking what drugs this kid was on, they would rather blame starcraft and try and take away our guns. we have always had guns, other countries have guns. yet school shootings only happen here. no one ever asks because they are afraid of big pharma. our diets and our medications are killing us and no one seems to care enough to even ask the questions. makes me sick and i for one cant wait to get out of this country in a few months. Dude, you are ahead of the game. I salute you | ||
SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
On December 21 2012 12:39 hoby2000 wrote: How can you guys say that our government is not out to get us? We have trillions of dollars in debt, and it's only increasing because of an economic idea that has proven to fail in Europe. We consistently have our army all over the world in countries where we're not wanted, there are a handful of bills they've tried to pass in the past couple of years limiting people's ability to speak their minds (NDAA, SOPA, PIPA, Patriot Act), AND we are STILL in the middle of a failed War on Drugs because they believe that when you make a law, people should just follow it. Most of the replies to this blog are ironic because you guys are exemplifying EXACTLY what Barrin is talking about. I'm more than positive he knew you would respond like that too because i have been tempted to write this EXACT post so many damn times, but I always remember that most people just don't get it. This world is a mess. I don't think they're out to get us. I think that people in general are inconceivably stupid and incompetent, and they're just naturally running things into the ground. I think it makes some people feel better to think that there are some groups of masterminds orchestrating all of this, and that if we could bring awareness we could fight against these powers. But realistically, I think this is the natural progression that we will take until we actually realize that a Utopian existence is not possible. The belief in a potential utopia is, in my opinion, the reason behind what we're seeing today, not that some crazy group of people wants to rule the world. And all you have to do is listen to people to realize that they honestly believe humanity is capable of removing all the bad things in life. So no, they aren't out to get us: they're just dumb. | ||
farvacola
United States18768 Posts
On December 21 2012 12:56 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Dude, you are ahead of the game. I salute you Dudes from Cleveland iirc, so I can kind of understand why he wants to leave lol | ||
AnachronisticAnarchy
United States2957 Posts
I am purposely not backing up my claims with evidence because I want you to research and find out for yourself - honestly you are the problem if you haven't and don't. People are far too lazy these days and are in the habit of believing whatever bullshit they're fed. If you just read something and take it for fact, that can very often end up being a major mistake. | ||
MountainDewJunkie
United States10340 Posts
On December 21 2012 13:06 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote: I really hate how a lot of people are bashing on this line: People are far too lazy these days and are in the habit of believing whatever bullshit they're fed. If you just read something and take it for fact, that can very often end up being a major mistake. I don't have a problem with that line myself, because I believe it. But it is admittedly dismissive. If you want to be taken seriously, one must cover all bases. | ||
SweeTLemonS[TPR]
11739 Posts
On December 21 2012 13:17 MountainDewJunkie wrote: I don't have a problem with that line myself, because I believe it. But it is admittedly dismissive. If you want to be taken seriously, one must cover all bases. If nothing else, it'd be nice to know what he is basing his opinions on. Having that information can then lead to other sources, and so on. Like weed being an excellent medicine. I'm aware of its application in a handful of circumstances, but not aware of it being a cure for anything; I'd like to see where he's getting that information, and if it's even worth looking into, because if his source is High Times, then it's not worth my time to research. | ||
Ghin
United States2391 Posts
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HardlyNever
United States1258 Posts
On December 21 2012 13:06 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote: I really hate how a lot of people are bashing on this line: People are far too lazy these days and are in the habit of believing whatever bullshit they're fed. If you just read something and take it for fact, that can very often end up being a major mistake. It has nothing to do with lazy. It is a stupid line. If you read a scientific paper that started with "we have evidence for what we are about to tell you about, but go do the research/experimentation for yourself or you are part of the problem" you would (hopefully) rightly dismiss it. I imagine he isn't posting his "sources" from some combination of: 1)They are scattered and this is an amalgamation of stuff he has read/heard over the course of time. 2)They would be ridiculed as unreliable, biased or outright crack-potish. That isn't how you present an argument if you want to be taken seriously. Given some of these claims, I'm not sure he does... Also, as an aside, do you not grasp the irony of your statement? You say we shouldn't believe everything we read without evidence, but then you want us to believe what we are reading here... without... evidence? Are you trolling? | ||
Treehead
999 Posts
I do, however, have a couple nitpicks on points you make. On December 21 2012 11:19 Barrin wrote: ... The federal reserve (controlled by private bankers unchecked by other branches of government) is constantly making money out of thin air which continuously devalues each of your dollars. ... Our public school systems are terrible at teaching critical thinking to children; so many people believe so much crazy shit and yet a lot of them can't even accept global warming. Science classrooms are under attack by religious fanatics who really dislike the fact of evolution. ... The most vigilant of those remaining are the people's militias (who somehow have a negative stigma) that the constitution literally tells us to create & maintain... but they can't be a militia if they're unarmed. ... 1. Most people don't have real dollars anymore. Most people have almost all of their value in their home - and many owe nearly as much as that. Homes will grow in value with inflation - what will not grow with inflation is the debt that they take on in order to acquire said homes. People are getting poorer, no doubt, but it has absolutely nothing to do with quantitative easing and the Federal Reserve. 2. Our public schools also aren't really trying that hard to teach children critical thinking. They're emphasizing confidence, and hoping they figure out critical thinking themselves. Children do naturally lack confidence - so this may not be a bad thing, but my personal belief is that the reason critical thinking hasn't become more prominent in school is because so many parents are not pushing it. Consider most school subjects - which ones most emphasize critical thinking? Math and science primarily. And while no one is trying to push these out of our schools, neither is anyone preaching that we should teach more math in schools. If anything, parents these days (not teachers) are trying to "protect" their children from the "useless" math that they wish they never had to learn. I've worked at a mathematics department in a university, and seen the parents. 3. The will of the people is not enforced by the right to bear arms anymore - this is the reason militias get a bad rap. Real armies have tanks, missiles, aircraft carriers and fighter jets. And even beyond that, the U.S. now has drones. How many armed militiamen do you think it'd really take to fight those (hint: it's a lot)? The "power" that the U.S. civilian has is (as your youtube link references) in the social and political realms. It's that if enough people hate what the government is doing, they have the political and social (not military) power to make things different. The only reason this would ever not be the case is if a lot of heads are conspiring against the U.S. citizen, which seems highly unlikely given how much the heads of commerce, politics, finance, and military seem to get along with each other - let alone between factions. | ||
BirdKiller
United States428 Posts
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ParkwayDrive
United States328 Posts
On December 21 2012 13:58 Treehead wrote: Great blog. You have an opinion, and you voice it. You ask people to be more involved in their government and what their society is doing. I do, however, have a couple nitpicks on points you make. 1. Most people don't have real dollars anymore. Most people have almost all of their value in their home - and many owe nearly as much as that. Homes will grow in value with inflation - what will not grow with inflation is the debt that they take on in order to acquire said homes. People are getting poorer, no doubt, but it has absolutely nothing to do with quantitative easing and the Federal Reserve. except it has almost everything to do with the federal reserve because they are manipulating interest rates away from what the market would dictate which causes consumers and investors alike to make poor decisions with their money because they are being fed bad information. it gives people the idea that they have the room to borrow money now instead of saving like they should be or vice versa depending on how they want to fudge the rate. | ||
AnachronisticAnarchy
United States2957 Posts
On December 21 2012 13:41 HardlyNever wrote: It has nothing to do with lazy. It is a stupid line. If you read a scientific paper that started with "we have evidence for what we are about to tell you about, but go do the research/experimentation for yourself or you are part of the problem" you would (hopefully) rightly dismiss it. I imagine he isn't posting his "sources" from some combination of: 1)They are scattered and this is an amalgamation of stuff he has read/heard over the course of time. 2)They would be ridiculed as unreliable, biased or outright crack-potish. That isn't how you present an argument if you want to be taken seriously. Given some of these claims, I'm not sure he does... Also, as an aside, do you not grasp the irony of your statement? You say we shouldn't believe everything we read without evidence, but then you want us to believe what we are reading here... without... evidence? Are you trolling? You need to work on your reading comprehension a bit. I never said that you should believe what you are reading here without evidence. I just don't like how people are bashing the fuck out of that line when there's a lot of truth in that particular line. People who want to incite change for the better often run into an absolutely massive obstacle: the stupidity and laziness of the masses. It's the main reason people like politicians can operate the way they do. No one can be fucked to prove that 90% of what comes out of their mouth is bullshit, they just swallow idiotic soundbites until their beliefs about both of the candidates are largely false. Presenting a well-informed opinion piece changes nothing in the long term if people just swallow it like they do everything else. The most important part is making people think and work for once. (Please note that none of this is in support of the rest of his article. I am merely discussing the part that I drew attention to) | ||
Treehead
999 Posts
On December 21 2012 14:17 ParkwayDrive wrote: except it has almost everything to do with the federal reserve because they are manipulating interest rates away from what the market would dictate which causes consumers and investors alike to make poor decisions with their money because they are being fed bad information. it gives people the idea that they have the room to borrow money now instead of saving like they should be or vice versa depending on how they want to fudge the rate. Lower interest rates these days just mean people will actually lend money. In case you didn't notice, there was a while there when nobody wanted to lend. Some amount of encouragement between lenders and borrowers is probably a good thing until the economy stabilizes. Feel free to disagree, but I'd prefer if you do so without sticking to "the market does everything right", because not everyone believes that (I, for one, believe that the market did an awful job reacting to the gulf oil spill or hurricane sandy, for instance). | ||
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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Roe
Canada6002 Posts
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farvacola
United States18768 Posts
On December 21 2012 16:20 Roe wrote: Everyone would rather go to the mall and by sneakers with lights in them....with lights in them.... Dontchoo be talkin shit bout mah L.A. Gear brah. | ||
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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surfinbird1
Germany999 Posts
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Treehead
999 Posts
On December 21 2012 17:36 Barrin wrote: Does this really only get 1/5 stars? George was right. Your message is that most american citizens are being lazy and the country is suffering for it (which is true), and you ask a lot of people to stop being lazy and start doing the real, hard work of democracy - where most people have been told that this work starts and ends in the voting booth. Are you surprised most people didn't like hearing that? | ||
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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ParkwayDrive
United States328 Posts
On December 21 2012 15:01 Treehead wrote: Lower interest rates these days just mean people will actually lend money. In case you didn't notice, there was a while there when nobody wanted to lend. Some amount of encouragement between lenders and borrowers is probably a good thing until the economy stabilizes. Feel free to disagree, but I'd prefer if you do so without sticking to "the market does everything right", because not everyone believes that (I, for one, believe that the market did an awful job reacting to the gulf oil spill or hurricane sandy, for instance). lol so you invite me to disagree, but i have to make my point without using a vital piece of information that you personally dont believe in? just wow. u dont have to believe in markets for them to be the most efficient way, so frankly it doesnt bother me. however i will still take the bait somewhat. i am not a free market purist. i believe there are circumstances where the makret must be adjusted or fixed by the government. mostly due to cases of corrupt capitalists and people who dont play the game fairly. but thats another thread. the free market only works when everything is transparent and people have access to right information so they can make correct decisions. what the fed does (the fed is independent of govt btw, so that is a whole nother issue) when they change rates is to increase the amount of uncertainty and give people bad information. it then becomes very hard to make good decisions with your money. lending and borrowing is not inherently good or bad so we shouldnt pretend like it is by encouraging one way or the other. we should be encouraging transparent and correct information to allow people to make the choice themselves. if for example the rate set by the fed is lower than we the market would dictate then those who are blind to the fed will make bad decisions with their money, thinking that it is the right decision. those who know what the fed is up to will simply be flooded with uncertainty as to what the real market rate is, which only acts to cloud the market even further. | ||
EtherealDeath
United States8366 Posts
Edit - Correction, it is technically possible, and one has to wonder what the specialized equipment there would be used for if not that. So it's quite plausible, and I would say very probable. Edit 2 - Somehow despite my media whoring I missed the fact that in October this year, the Supreme Court heard a case on the constitutionality of the FISA extensions. Thanks mainstream media for making that a big issue. I'm glad to know that the normal "swing issues" like gay marriage get endless coverage when they end up in the Supreme Court (although it deserves coverage for sure) but shit like the sweeping coverage of FISA is pretty much ignored - and is NOT a swing issue, since both sides of aisle jump for it. Good thing NPR is great. Hope funding for it doesn't ever go to hell like was suggested in the recent Presidential election by Romney. | ||
HardlyNever
United States1258 Posts
On December 21 2012 14:36 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote: You need to work on your reading comprehension a bit. I never said that you should believe what you are reading here without evidence. I just don't like how people are bashing the fuck out of that line when there's a lot of truth in that particular line. People who want to incite change for the better often run into an absolutely massive obstacle: the stupidity and laziness of the masses. It's the main reason people like politicians can operate the way they do. No one can be fucked to prove that 90% of what comes out of their mouth is bullshit, they just swallow idiotic soundbites until their beliefs about both of the candidates are largely false. Presenting a well-informed opinion piece changes nothing in the long term if people just swallow it like they do everything else. The most important part is making people think and work for once. (Please note that none of this is in support of the rest of his article. I am merely discussing the part that I drew attention to) I don't even... know how to respond to the sequence of logic fails here... How is there a "lot of truth" in the statement "I'm not backing up my claims with evidence because you need to find them. You are part of the problem if you don't." That isn't a true/false style statement (except the last bit). I think it's you that needs to up their reading comprehension. Are you saying anyone who doesn't research crack-pot conspiracy theory ideas is "part of the problem?" Again, if you saw that statement in any serious paper, you would immediately stop reading. I'm not sure how this is different other than it is the internet, and therefore I'm not supposed to take it seriously. | ||
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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tehemperorer
United States2183 Posts
Phrases like "lazy sheeple" and "George was right" would hint at you being the possessor of some hidden knowledge, but only to those without any. Believe it or not, there are people who have already been over the material you presented, read the same books, and come to the same conclusions. However, they are at a point where further research/investigation has rendered those early conclusions invalid, and to some extent, foolish. I think that's the next step you have to get to. Things you suggest have been too generalized and in that process a lot of truth has been lost. For example, the selling of the US government to private interests is a legitimate problem not just in the US but all over the world. However, that statement is a lot more succinct than it should be. While it's true the interests of certain companies oftentimes factor into political agendas, the power of these companies to push their interests is not that great, and certainly not so great as the level you present. General Note: It so happens that media outlets frequently use oversimplification and "stretching the truth" to get subscribers to believe the message they are presenting (Fox, NBC, etc.). People who know better, like yourself, get upset and worry that other, less conscious people might be swayed into believing the message. To counteract this, these people express dissenting opinion through whatever channels available to them, trying to publicize what they believe to be the truth in hopes to dilute the original message. In doing so, they oftentimes commit the same wrongs that were done by the original media source: they oversimplify or push to hyperbole a message in hopes of swaying opinion through emotion rather than logic. Don't be guilty of that; people are smarter than you think. I do agree with your choice to not post evidence. Posting evidence makes crazy claims seem credible, and that is a dangerous thing. Smartly you have left readers of your post two choices: either dismiss it as a collection of improbable conspiracy theories, or to go actually look for the truth. | ||
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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tehemperorer
United States2183 Posts
On December 22 2012 03:41 Barrin wrote: Can you elaborate on what conspiracy theories you think I'm buying into? Sure. An example I would point to is "The federal reserve (controlled by private bankers unchecked by other branches of government) is constantly making money out of thin air which continuously devalues each of your dollars." That's only slightly true, but there's a lot more to that concept as well as the real reasons why the US dollar can lose or gain value, but to someone who doesn't know any better that statement is a lot more powerful than it should be. Perhaps how you present your ideas caused me to react the way I did? People who don't do research for themselves aren't smarter than I think. Sorry. Too nebulous a statement to have any real bearing. In the context of your original post, you may be right, but it depends on the actual people you are judging and your own personal evaluation of intelligence, which isn't likely to be relevant in any serious attempt to measure intelligence. I think what's more important here is the attitude in which you approach people in general. It seems that if I haven't read what you have read I am somehow not as smart or not as informed, which can't be true. I think you're misunderstanding my intention. My intention isn't to get everyone to believe even most of what I'm saying (you could go for half of it though)... my intention is to encourage people to do the research for themselves. I understood your intention; it should have been easy for most people to see that by what's in your very first paragraph. Things are not as bad as conspiracy theorists would have you believe, but they're not going as good as people who just say "oh yeah its just a few problems". When you fail to do actively and continuously do the research yourself you are 'disenfranchising yourself from the democratic process', as they say. Totally agree. My two cents is as follows. What's really damaging to our democracy is that it is probably easier to be misinformed than it is to be informed. Being misinformed is fundamentally more dangerous than being uninformed, because while both states of being are states of ignorance, one is the state of ignorance under the guise of knowledge. In the US there is a strengthening climate of activism, particularly in our youth, and while this is certainly a good thing, it happens to take place in an age of misinformation. These are young people whose adult opinions are beginning to take shape, and informed or misinformed, they are taking those views to the polls.[/QUOTE] | ||
theMTC
United States4 Posts
On December 22 2012 03:32 tehemperorer wrote: Hmmm... where to begin... Things you suggest have been too generalized and in that process a lot of truth has been lost. For example, the selling of the US government to private interests is a legitimate problem not just in the US but all over the world. However, that statement is a lot more succinct than it should be. While it's true the interests of certain companies oftentimes factor into political agendas, the power of these companies to push their interests is not that great, and certainly not so great as the level you present. well this statement can be debunked with just one word......MONSANTO | ||
tehemperorer
United States2183 Posts
On December 22 2012 04:44 theMTC wrote: well this statement can be debunked with just one word......MONSANTO Haha thankfully nothing can be debunked with just a single word! | ||
HardlyNever
United States1258 Posts
On December 22 2012 03:10 Barrin wrote: Serious paper. Blog. Serious paper. Blog. Serious paper... hmm........ That's why I put this part in I'm not sure how this is different other than it is the internet, and therefore I'm not supposed to take it seriously. So we can both agree this isn't supposed to be taken seriously. | ||
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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r_con
United States824 Posts
We have 1/20th of the world's population, yet we consume 1/4th of the world's oil. We cut down trees at an astonishing rate. Our government is all over the world and yet we still have plenty of people in poverty and homeless in our own backyard. We need a lot more clean water. Our fruit is imported and often underripe, our livestock is often treated like dirt, and most of the rest is processed and full of preservatives. We have plenty of disease and illness right here at home... we have the world's biggest military but one of the worst health care systems? Even if you can get health care our many of our doctors love prescribing all sorts of stuff you don't really need (and they're not even required to learn nutrition). im just gonna talk about this paragraph and want you to think about what you wrote. We have 1/20th of the world's population, yet we consume 1/4th of the world's oil. DUH! the united states has money and in addition is extremely spread out, of course this is gonna fucking happen. how much of the worlds oil do we use in comparison to developed nations would be a more relevant statistic first off, and you also have to consider how our country is laid out, we have a very spread out population so its just common sense. We cut down trees at an astonishing rate. we also, at least in my state plant 3 trees for everyone we cut down, also trees getting cut down is not a big deal, most of the co2 emissions on planet earth are done by plants and vegetation and sea algae if your worried about that whole debate. Do i know if our co2 emissions are making our temp rise? no. From what Ive read probably yes, but it will still probably be safe because of how overall small are emissions are compared to whole system. Temperature changes are also pretty common and guess what? there is possible evidence of temperatures shooting up 7 degrees globally in a couple hundred years, they didn't last long, but the life on planet earth still seemed to be kicken during those times. Though there is evidence of extreme global warming worldwide disaster, but not in the way your probably imagined it. and it was due to volcanic ash and a huge amount of algae that could survive in the environment and spitted out so much toxic fumes that it killed 90 percent of life on earth. But i believe the amount of co2 was far more than what people could reasonably do. Our government is all over the world and yet we still have plenty of people in poverty and homeless in our own backyard. It's a matter of a different philosophy, many people in our country are ok with people being homeless, some people don't want to take the increased taxes of making these people not homeless. Oh yeah, poverty in this country is a fucking cakewalk. We need a lot more clean water. Our fruit is imported and often underripe, our livestock is often treated like dirt, and most of the rest is processed and full of preservatives. We have the most clean drinking water of any country on earth, also our clean water standards i believe are some of the best in the world, in addition to also being cheaper. Our fruit is imported and often under-ripe(so what?) you know that lots of fruit don't ripen until after they are pulled off the tree? Our livestock are treated overall pretty good(since the book by upton sinclair's "the jungle" in the early 19th century) and consumers have options(kosher for example), we also go through tons of safety measures to make sure the meat is safe, go read some usda stuff. Processed food is not evil, unhealthy when consumed in large amounts, of course, but so is bacon, go read http://modernistcuisine.com/ about more food safety and microbiology and preservatives. I have the book, I'm sure you can find it somewhere. We have plenty of disease and illness right here at home... we have the world's biggest military but one of the worst health care systems? and so does every other country, it's what happens when your taxes are fucking low and you don't have completely institutionalized healthcare. Biggest military is also a question of nations priorities, i do think military has a place a place in modern society as pushing for better and better technology. Again it comes down to priorities, and hopefully you undestand the US government has done some would consider great things being in countries we don't belong in as you would probably put it. You mainly hear about the failures. Here's one, removed Saddam Hussein from Kuwait. Even if you can get health care our many of our doctors love prescribing all sorts of stuff you don't really need (and they're not even required to learn nutrition). then blame the colleges that teach them, though i doubt your qualified to even say what you need and don't need(I'm certainly not). Our understanding of medicine and the human body is still pretty primitive. many drugs can't compete with placebos, neuroscience is still finding tons of discoveries, and overall we just don't know a lot, Doctors are just doing what they are told, and understand. I guess you could blame the human race for our lack of understanding about the human body and medicine, or you could understand that we are learning all the time and trying to improve and find the best way to do medicine as possible. Yes, there is some stuff i disagree with in America and i am playing devils advocate here. But you probably need to do some more research before saying everything is fucking horrible and often understand that some people are literally OK with the shit you consider awful. A lot of people in America are OK with homelessness(i personally don't care, oh yeah, and i have been homeless before and i have lived in a homeless shelter, only a week though). A lot of people are ok with limited healthcare by the government I don't know what one is better for me because i pay for my health insurance. What one is better for America, I don't know, not enough data and i don't like to make claims i can't back up or doesn't have "right way to do it" Again, sorry i can't cite a lot of these, i do read a lot of science but am not a scientist myself. There is just too much complex information for a person to reasonably be expected to understand it all. That is why we listen to experts, and wait for data to come. And some of the stuff i said could not be true, the thing is that it would take me a very very very long time to cite and find and read and understand. Do i believe you did adequate research, no, but neither did I because the amount of time that would go into these blocks of text would be insane. So yeah... that's all. And i pointed out one paragraph, if i was to criticize your entire post id be fucking typing and researching for months. | ||
Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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r_con
United States824 Posts
On December 23 2012 01:28 Barrin wrote: Right. I even said that myself in a previous post. So what we should just accept it and keep spreading out? Maybe we could start condensing a little... I care more about the beautiful ecosystems that the forests create tbh. I care about the creatures themselves and the opportunity to appreciate them. That's true. But it's OUR country. I live in Jupiter Florida with consistently some of the best drinking water in the country. But I don't take it for granted... I care very much about clean water and I hope EVERYONE can have access to it. And then we'll have peace? No dude, we're always looking for wars for some reason. Even in peacetime we declare war on shit, the war on drugs for example. I am blaming the people for not enacting legislation requiring doctors to learn nutrition (and thus requiring/encouraging the schools to teach it). Doctors prescribe all sorts of shit THEY KNOW YOU DON'T NEED. They have a vested interest in keeping you sick, because sick people keep coming back to them. Please wake up. provide evidence for any of your claims, otherwise your spouting shit. I admit I'm spouting shit i don't understand, perhaps you should too. Your asking me to do research, but my research has obviously lead me to a far different conclusion. Your asking me to wake up but I've provided you with reasonable solutions. There is a great joke told be Neil Degrasse Tyson of believers and miracles. A religious man is told he is going to die from cancer in 6 months, by his doctor. He goes to another doctor to get a second opinion he says 7 months, and then another says 5 months. 2 years go by, hes fine, the cancer goes dormant and he is gonna live longer. So they thank god for their miracle, but it never occurred to them that perhaps that all three doctors were fucking wrong? to them its more reasonable that a godly being cured them than the doctors were wrong. I mean these doctors all had the same training and education it makes sense that they would come to the same conclusions. which one is more reasonable? Clean water is not a problem in the modern world because we have safe reliable and cheap solutions for it. The rest of the world will hopefully get these one day. doctors are truly trying to help people, i know doctors, dentists, etc. etc. Yes i suppose you could say that they are in the interest of keeping people sick, i guess, most well educated people i know generally wouldn't want to keep people sick because that is fucked up. I'm sure it happens, but i doubt that they go through 8 years of education to do a shitty job. Provide large scale evidence of it happening nationwide(not just one corrupt hospital or doctor) then ill give a shit. You also misunderstand the U.S. role in the world, or the role that they would like to take. The US would like to be a white knight, fight back against communism(continually done over the last 50 years) help in UN related stuff. A large portion of america is very against recreational drug use, and many people in political office are older, so they are also against it. And Ill bet you would find very few people want meth to be legalized(personally i don't give a shit). And A lot of people dont want weed to be legalized or harder drugs, there are still people who want cigs banned. Stop thinking this is government keeping you down, its your goddamn neighbors demanding this of government, maybe not your friends though . idk, it just feels like your spouting nonsense to me without providing hard evidence | ||
FryBender
United States290 Posts
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Roe
Canada6002 Posts
most of the co2 emissions on planet earth are done by plants and vegetation and sea algae if your worried about that whole debate huh? when did this happen? When did plants start emitting CO2 instead of oxygen? | ||
aZealot
New Zealand5447 Posts
Wow. Even as blog rants go, this is a poor one. Better luck with the next one, Barrin. You need to work more and think more. Edit/ Kudos for your obvious passion though. Apathy is clearly not one of your faults. | ||
Roe
Canada6002 Posts
On December 23 2012 04:10 aZealot wrote: I thought Barrin's OP was a satire, a bad satire. But I see that he is actually defending it in the thread. So, it was serious. Wow. Even as blog rants go, this is a poor one. Better luck with the next one, Barrin. You need to work more and think more. Edit/ Kudos for your obvious passion though. Apathy is clearly not one of your faults. where was the satire? | ||
tehemperorer
United States2183 Posts
On December 23 2012 03:32 Roe wrote: huh? when did this happen? When did plants start emitting CO2 instead of oxygen? Whoa I can't believe someone said that, that is extremely scary that some moron out there doesn't know this fundamentally basic fact. | ||
Boblion
France8043 Posts
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bonifaceviii
Canada2890 Posts
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r_con
United States824 Posts
On December 23 2012 10:49 tehemperorer wrote: Whoa I can't believe someone said that, that is extremely scary that some moron out there doesn't know this fundamentally basic fact. I never said they gave it off when they were living, they off c02 when plants animals(mostly bugs cause they are 80-90 percent of animal biomass) and algae die. (what the fuck do you think fossil fuels are made out of?) When plants die they give off co2 into the atmosphere, and i'm pretty sure its more than what we give out in factories. http://water.me.vccs.edu/exam_prep/carbondioxide.html the more you know : ) | ||
dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
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