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I just wanted to give my thoughts on some recent SC2 events, including Naniwa's final game of the Blizzard Cup and the new GSL format. I'll just jump right into this since everyone should know what happened. You may have read some of this buried in the comments of a 5000 page thread, but bear with me. I'll be brief.
First of all, everyone should think about what would happen if NFL teams threw all of their games after they can no longer qualify for the playoffs. I'll use the NFL analogy because of simplicity, but the same goes for any sport. Teams play their starters every game even if they can no longer advance to the next round. I'm not going to tell you why I think they do this, but it's a fact and the fans expect it. If GOM tells you to play four games, you better be ready to play the best four games you've ever played, no matter what. It just like when the NFL tells you to play 16 games.
There have been other similar situations in the past. The groups at WCG and the consolidation rounds of MLG come to mind. I won't name names, but we all know people who forfeited their MLG consolation rounds or WCG matches if they couldn't get top two in the group.
On WCG: forfeiting matches in a WCG group of 6 can affect the placement of other players in your group. For example, Player A is playing Player B and Player C is watching. Player A has no chance of advancing to the knockout round. Player B will advance if he wins this game. Player C will advance if Player A wins. When Player A forfeits, he illegitimately gives Player B a spot that Player C could have earned. Do you think this is right?
On MLG consolation matches: imagine what would happen if one of the teams in the 3rd place match at the World Cup forfeited. You think the German and Uruguayan players were happy to play in the 3rd place match in 2010? No, they were pissed that they weren't in the final. However, they played an awesome match. If MLG tells you to play, you need to play.
To summarize the last few paragraphs, every match is important. Abiding by the rules of competition and acting fairly to both your opponents and your spectators is part of being a professional athlete. Was Naniwa fair to the spectators of his match? Was Player A of my WCG example fair to Player C? After reading Naniwa's apology, I believe he is sincere and will try to change his attitude. But if SC2 is to become a legitimate sport in the eyes of the masses, everyone involved needs to step up their level of professionalism.
I also have something to say about GomTV and the recent format changes. I don't know if anyone else feels this way, but I feel like I didn't know anything about the new format until a day or two before the November season.
After the Blizzard Cup, things got even more vague. I too expected Naniwa to retain his Code S spot due to his performance at MLG Providence. (The actions in his match against Nestea at Providence were also questionable. I could go on about why I think they were harmful, but I think everyone is over it.) However, GomTV stated that they were now granting spots on an invite basis, starting with the next GSL.
Shouldn't they have made this info public? It sounds like GomTV is just using arbitrary rules and technicalities to put whomever they want into their tournament (i.e. anyone but Naniwa).
I could go on and on on this, but here's the bottom line. We need some notice before big changes go into affect. Currently, it seems GomTV can just manipulate their tournaments by changing the format every month just to get what they want. This instability is not very helpful. We need to know the format of a tournament well in advance. We need clear cut rules on how to qualify. It's fine if they have invites, but you can't decide to invite two people to play in your tournament and then say: 'We're excited to announce that our invites for next season's GSL are IdrA and Sen! Oh, I forgot to tell you, but we're using invites next tournament.'
If we knew before MLG Providence that a Code S seed would not be one of the prizes, then it might be accepted by the community. When the community expects a Code S seed to come out of Providence and then GomTV doesn't deliver because they never publicly announced that they were changing to an invite system, it takes legitimacy away from the competition. Tournaments must also act fairly and professionally, and a big part of that is transparency. I'm not saying that an invite system wouldn't be fair. I'm not even saying I dislike GomTV. I LOVE the GSL. It's the best TV show on the planet and I want it to do well. I'm just saying that they need to clearly communicate what they expect from players and the community, as well as what players and the community can expect from GomTV. Right now, I just don't know what to expect from GomTV in terms of competition or qualification. That's just not good enough if we want SC2 to grow, now matter how awesome the matches are.
I would love to see SC2 succeed and see IdrA and MvP become household names, but we are not headed in the right direction.
That's enough for now. Thanks for reading, it kind of turned into a rant. Post a comment if you'd like. I'll try to get back to you.
I'm really not mad or anything. I just think that everyone involved needs to take professionalism to the next level if SC2 is to continue growing at such a fast pace. Now's the time to step it up.
  
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let me further summarize what the topic starter is trying to say. In order for you to be succesfull and respected in e-sports or sports, you have to have sportmanship.
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Many people fail to recognize this.
Dominance, Being the best, raping your opponent, personal record, glory, fame, etc, are not the main reason for sports.
It is sportsmanship, honoring your game, your opponent, and ultimately yourself.
Nice post OP
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I like the soccer comparison. I think 100% should be put out, even if just for a show for the fans...
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T.O.P.
Hong Kong4685 Posts
On December 15 2011 11:05 Keyboard Warrior wrote:
Many people fail to recognize this.
Dominance, Being the best, raping your opponent, personal record, glory, fame, etc, are not the main reason for sports.
It is sportsmanship, honoring your game, your opponent, and ultimately yourself.
Nice post OP
You're deluding yourself. No one watches sports for that.
On December 15 2011 11:05 Keyboard Warrior wrote:
It is sportsmanship, honoring your game, your opponent, and ultimately yourself.
This sounds boring as fuck.
On December 15 2011 11:05 Keyboard Warrior wrote:
Dominance, Being the best, raping your opponent, personal record, glory, fame, etc
Now this sounds interesting.
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On December 15 2011 11:35 T.O.P. wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 11:05 Keyboard Warrior wrote:
Many people fail to recognize this.
Dominance, Being the best, raping your opponent, personal record, glory, fame, etc, are not the main reason for sports.
It is sportsmanship, honoring your game, your opponent, and ultimately yourself.
Nice post OP You're deluding yourself. No one watches sports for that. Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 11:05 Keyboard Warrior wrote:
It is sportsmanship, honoring your game, your opponent, and ultimately yourself. This sounds boring as fuck. Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 11:05 Keyboard Warrior wrote:
Dominance, Being the best, raping your opponent, personal record, glory, fame, etc Now this sounds interesting.
I kinda have to agree with this. Sportsmanship is nice, but people being nice to each other 24/7 gets kinda boring after a little while. A little drama is good.
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Nestea vs Naniwa rivalry: good.
Naniwa calling nestea bad: also good
Nestea getting pissed after naniwa losing: good
Naniwa boxing his probes and moving: bad
Drama is great. Players obviously killing it is not.
I think Gom is actually pretty relaxed about their rules...But any Korean team would've yanked a player if they had thrown a game like that. Quantic didn't, and it's really embarrassing for gom.
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Its basically like a debate between like MMA and something like chess. Starcraft has a very wide range of personalities involved and a wide fan base. Its always disheartening for me, a logical reserved person, to see Idra, the renowned "worst mannered player" have a 1571 page fan club while MVP, a humble, nice player, who is undoubtedly the best player in the world currently has only 104 pages. It shows that at least in the western side, people are MUCH more concerned about appearances than substance. Rooting for a person because they are white is honestly pure racism. But as it stands, most people in the scene love to follow inferior players because they will dance on stage in a murloc suit when they win a best of 3 rather than top players who yawn after their 3rd major championship.
This following of personalities is good for advertising and getting crowds involved, but what makes the sport better is competition, and currently there is more motivation for getting reputation than skill. (HuK, MC, Idra vs MVP, MMA, Nestea)
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Didn't some NBA teams not play their hardest so that they could get draft picks?
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On December 15 2011 14:40 kevconsim wrote:
Didn't some NBA teams not play their hardest so that they could get draft picks?
Doubt it, since the NBA draft is done by a lottery.
Although it does remind me of a few years ago when the colts were undefeated and they pulled Peyton Manning halfway through their last game where they lost to the jets. Some saw it as an attempt to rig the playoffs to face an easier team.
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Players need to learn that tournaments aren't there for them, but for the fans/consumers. Tournaments need to know not to let 1 person shit on their organization and get away with it, that 1 player isn't the be all end all of a tournament. The game itself should come before the player.
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On December 15 2011 12:06 Luepert wrote:
Its basically like a debate between like MMA and something like chess. Starcraft has a very wide range of personalities involved and a wide fan base. Its always disheartening for me, a logical reserved person, to see Idra, the renowned "worst mannered player" have a 1571 page fan club while MVP, a humble, nice player, who is undoubtedly the best player in the world currently has only 104 pages. It shows that at least in the western side, people are MUCH more concerned about appearances than substance. Rooting for a person because they are white is honestly pure racism. But as it stands, most people in the scene love to follow inferior players because they will dance on stage in a murloc suit when they win a best of 3 rather than top players who yawn after their 3rd major championship.
This following of personalities is good for advertising and getting crowds involved, but what makes the sport better is competition, and currently there is more motivation for getting reputation than skill. (HuK, MC, Idra vs MVP, MMA, Nestea)
Length of fanclubs have more to do with controversy surrounding a person. MVP only has 104 pages because everyone has relatively the same opinion of him. People like arguing about Idra though, so that adds a lot of pages.
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Great OP.. and if the players won't do it for the love of the game and respect for the organization and other players.. then just add a little bit of $$ incentive to each group match. ESL does it during their IEM Events. It makes sense to reward players for continuing to play and respect the integrity of the event.
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EPT
