There are many parallels between the games of Chess and Starcraft, most notably that they are both strategy games played at a highly competitive level. Chess is a tad bit older, with the modern rules being around 600 years old. However, the evolution of chess and its championship cycle has occurred on a much slower timescale than Broodwar’s, meaning their histories can be reasonably compared. Inspired by that line of thinking, and the beautiful work of others in analyzing and visualizing player ratings for both Chess and Broodwar, I decided to write a mostly non-serious account of their respective histories and the intertwined stories of their greatest players. I know there have been many other Chess/Broodwar comparison threads, but I wanted to do something a little different.
In the distant past, Chess was a very different beast. Pieces moved differently, and the rules of the game differed. Around 1500 AD, a transformation occurred, and the game took on its modern form. Similarly, Broodwar went through a transformative change with the landmark patch 1.08 in early 2001.
As Queens and Dropships gained in movement speed, the games became more dynamic, setting the groundwork for the future evolution into popular competitive games. In this, the earliest stage of life for both games, outstanding players discovered basic principles. Maynard popularized his namesake technique of transferring workers, while Philidor emphasized the value of pawn structure in dictating the flow of the game. Basic openings were developed, although opening theory remained relatively rudimentary.
As the two games continued to evolve, so too did the level of competition. In later years, the games of Chess and Broodwar were to be dominated by their Russian and Korean contingents, respectively. However, at this stage, players from all over the world were competing on level terms.
Howard Staunton was among the first of the great talents, dominating the Chess world throughout the 1840s. Meanwhile, H.O.T.-Forever, one of the first pro players, became one of the highest rated Broodwar players from 2000-2003.
Perhaps the greatest talents of this era came from North America. The legendary Paul Morphy demonstrated his talents as a child prodigy, and went on to briefly become the strongest Chess player the World had yet to see in the late 1850s, before abruptly retiring. In the Broodwar scene, the Canadian player Grrrr... hit the top in 2000, bringing a new level of strategy and creativity to the game.
To this point, both Chess and Broodwar had been played on raw talent and imagination. Brilliant players like Joseph Blackburne in Chess and GARIMTO in Broodwar triumphed by their clever and unorthodox ideas, but had little in the way of serious preparation compared to the greats of today.
That was all to change as two highly innovative players shot to the top, revolutionizing their respective games. In Chess, Wilhelm Steinitz became the first official World Champion, and developed the first rigorous theory of the positional elements of the game. Meanwhile, BoxeR brought an unprecedented level of training in basic mechanics and micro to the game of Broodwar, dominating the game with his highly entertaining style.
Both BoxeR and Steinitz cemented their dominance by emphatically overcoming an extremely powerful and aggressive rival; for BoxeR it was YellOw, while for Steinitz it was Anderssen. Today, BoxeR and Steinitz are remembered as pioneers who laid the way for all future players.
The respective reigns of Steinitz and BoxeR were eventually eclipsed by the rise of even greater talents. In 1894, Steinitz was convincingly defeated for the World Chess Championship by a new contender, Emanuel Lasker. The rematch in 1896 was even more one-sided, beginning a 10 year period in which Lasker dominated nearly every tournament he entered. Meanwhile, BoxeR was upstaged by the young talent NaDa, who went on to become one of the greatest Broodwar players of all time, and the first golden mouse winner.
Both NaDa and Lasker displayed tremendously longevity. NaDa holds the longest Top 30 streak in the KeSPA Rankings, lasting 87 months. Lasker was World Chess Champion for 27 years, longer than any other player. Both players also made significant contributions outside of their games: Lasker to the field of pure mathematics, and NaDa to the field of bodybuilding.
BoxeR and Steinitz left significant legacies. Steinitz's theory proved highly valuable in the world of Chess, and shaped the play of the next generation of greats, including Capablanca. Similarly, BoxeR helped to train some of the greatest players of the next generation, including iloveoov.
Jose Raul Capablanca was a highly prodigious talent, who exploded onto the chess scene in 1909 when he defeated the US champion with 8 wins to 1. He was renowned for his incredibly fast and flawless play, earning him the nickname 'the chess machine'. After dominating the chess world for a decade, he faced Lasker for the World Championship in 1921, winning the match without a single loss. Capablanca's games continue to inspire today, and have even been shown to match as closely to the moves of a computer as any modern day champion's.
Iloveoov achieved a similar level of dominance in the game of Broodwar. Recruited by BoxeR, he hit the top in 2003, crushing his way to victory in 5 starleague finals over the next three years. Known as the "Cheater Terran" for his untouchable macro skills, he is considered one of the greatest Broodwar players of all time. His streak of 33-3 from 2003-2004 is the best streak of all time, and his streak of 25-0 is the longest ever winning streak in TvZ.
Capablanca was ultimately toppled by Alexander Alekhine, an extremely talented and hardworking Russian player. Alekhine had a long and impressive career, and at his height, he completely dominated the chess world. He was particularly known for his calculating skills, and his ability to turn the flow of a game to his favor, often in unexpected and imaginative fashion.
GoRush had a long and successful Broodwar history, winning the World Cyber Games in 2000, before temporarily taking a break. On his full return, GoRush climbed to the top of the Broodwar scene, taking an MSL title in 2005 on the heels of iloveoov. At his best, GoRush was particularly renowned for ability to dictate the flow of a game through his incredible game management skills.
After bearing witness to some extraordinary early talents, the games of Chess and Broodwar had evolved to a new level of competition. The talent pool for both games ran incredibly deep, and battles for the top prizes became increasingly fierce.
In this hyper-competitive era, two players managed to rise above the rest: World Champion Mikhail Botvinnik, and golden mouse winner July. Both distinguished themselves by extraordinary performances in finals matches. Botvinnik made a name for himself in 1938, with a stunning victory over Capablanca. He first won the World Chess Championship in 1948, and for a period of several years he was leagues ahead of his competitors. In 1957 he lost the championship for the first time, but went on to win it back again on two more occasions in 1958 and 1961. Throughout his career, Botvinnik made significant contributions to chess theory, raising the level of preparation required of top players.
July was a dominant force in the Broodwar scene from 2003-2005, breaking iloveoov's 25-0 winning streak against Zerg, and crushing his way through to several tournament victories, including two OSLs. Despite a subsequent slump, he recaptured his earlier form to win another starleague in 2008, thereby becoming the first Zerg to win a golden mouse. July's development of mutalisk micro remains one of the most important theoretical contributions to the game.
One of the greatest chess talents was perhaps Mikhail Tal, a player with an unrivaled intuition for attacking play. Tal experienced a meteoric rise to the top of the chess world, going from a relative unknown in 1957 to winning the World Championship from Botvinnik in 1960 with his hyper-aggressive play. Sadly, however, from here forward his career was plagued by health issues, and though he made a few promising attempts to return to the pinnacle of chess, he never recaptured his early glories.
In the world of Broodwar, GGPlay experienced a similarly rapid rise to the top, culminating in his 2007 DAUM OSL victory, highlighted by his singular defiler control. However, his play dramatically disintegrated after this, as he was crippled by carpal tunnel syndrome. Although in subsequent years he occasionally appeared to be on his way back to the top, he too never fully recovered his best form.
This was a golden era for both Chess and Broodwar, and it played host to a pantheon of great talents, many of whom went on to compete at the top level for many years.
Chess was not ready for what came next. Nor was Broodwar.
After a relatively stable period, both games were about to be rocked by perhaps their greatest talents - and certainly their greatest tragedies. Enter sAviOr. Enter Bobby Fischer.
In a climate where Zerg was considered hopelessly underpowered, sAviOr’s stupendous run of five consecutive MSL finals (3 victories) and an OSL victory was unprecedented. Winning with ridiculous ease against all races, he completely redefined the way Zerg is played.
Similarly, Fischer fought the odds to take down the Russians single-handedly. His absurd run to the world title included consecutive 6-0 victories over Taimanov and Larsen (with zero draws - remembering that more than half of all chess games at the top level are draws), followed by a 6.5-2.5 dismantling of the former World Champion Petrosian and a 12.5-8.5 victory in the final versus Spassky. In the middle of the cold war, the entire Russian chess school had united to try to stop Fischer, but he proved to be an unstoppable force.
Tragically, both players were to leave the limelight as dramatically as they had arrived, leaving their many fans aghast. After crashing to a 0-3 MSL final loss against Bisu, sAvioR entered a slump from which he never recovered. Then in 2010, tragedy turned to catastrophe when he was permanently banned for his involvement in match fixing.
After his world title victory, Fischer, growing increasingly paranoid, refused to defend his Championship title against Karpov and announced his retirement.
Both Chess and Broodwar had been advanced to completely new levels of play by sAviOr and Fischer. And both games were left badly wounded in the absence of their fallen heroes.
In this new era, Viktor Korchnoi rose to challenge for the Chess World Championship. Having enjoyed success in the 1960s, he brought his play to an entirely new level in the 1970s and 1980s. Considered by many to be greatest player never to become World Champion, he was well known for his scrappy and aggressive style.
In the post-sAviOr era, Bisu rose to become one of the strongest Protoss players of all time. From 2007-2008 he won 3 MSL titles, the most starleague titles achieved by any Protoss player. In the process, he generated a revolutionary new style of PvZ, and gained the nickname ‘Ninja Toss’ for his dark templar harassment skills.
The player to take Fischer’s throne was the new World Champion, Anatoly Karpov. Desperate to prove his worth as the new champion, he dominated the tournament scene in a way no previous champion had. After twice successfully defending his title against Korchnoi, Karpov had proved himself to be far and away the world’s best player. His incredibly solid style drew comparisons to Capablanca, and his endgame skills were unrivaled.
In the world of Broodwar, it was soon clear who the heir to sAviOr’s throne should be: Jaedong, another astonishingly talented Zerg. After announcing his presence with a 12-0 run against Terran in 2007 and his first starleague victory. He went on to prove that his ZvZ and ZvP were equally proficient, and made invaluable theoretical contributions to all three match-ups. Jaedong's mechanics were also nearly flawless, giving him a tremendous edge over his contemporaries.
Were it not for the fact that their careers happened to overlap with those of the next two great players, Karpov and Jaedong may well have been considered the greatest of all time in their respective games. Unfortunately for them, Kasparov and Flash had other plans.
Garry Kasparov ignited the Chess world when he won a Grandmaster tournament at the age of 16 despite having no rating, after being accidentally included. Within 5 years he was the number 1 ranked player, and beat Korchnoi and Smyslov to gain the right to challenge Karpov for the World Championship. Following a protracted match that was cancelled after 48 games, he won the rematch to become the youngest ever World Champion at the age of 22. Over the next 20 years, Kasparov went on to achieve a never before seen level of consistent dominance, being continually ranked world number 1 from 1985 to 2004. His play was immensely strong in every area of the game. He was especially renowned for his monstrous calculating abilities and incredible aggression. He also ushered in a new level of pre-game preparation with his extremely deep analyses.
Flash had an ignominious arrival onto the Broodwar scene, cheesing Bisu out of the Daum OSL. However, it was not long before his immense talent was recognized by all. In 2008 he became the youngest ever OSL winner at the age of 15, beating Jaedong and Bisu. His career temporarily faltered in 2009, before reaching a new level of dominance in 2010. During this time he reached the highest ever rating, scored the most ever KESPA points, and equaled NaDa's record for the most ever starleague titles (3 OSLs and 3 MSLs). Flash is known for being near flawless in every area of the game, being equally at home in aggressive and defensive positions. His innovations have led to significant advances in Terran strategies.
In the wake of Kasparov and Flash, many new and promising talents have appeared onto the Chess and Broodwar scenes. These include Kramnik, Anand, Carlsen, Aronian and Topalov in Chess, and Stats, ZeRo, Effort, Fantasy, Hydra, and JangBi in Broodwar. Whether any of these players will recapture the levels of dominance achieved by their predecessors is currently unknown.
However, it is clear that the Russian stranglehold on Chess is gradually eroding as it becomes a more international game. Currently 3 of the top 5 players in the world are non-Russians. Whether a similar shift away from Korean dominance will ever occur in the world of Starcraft is unclear, but certainly the rise of the SC2 scene is bringing a more global involvement in Starcraft. I look forward with excitement to the future growth of both Starcraft (the world's number 1 e-sport) and Chess (the world's number 1 not-really-a-sport)!
As someone who is somewhat interested in the chess world and heavily invested in bw progaming this was a very cool article to read.
Got me to wiki a lot of the older chess players I have never heard about.
Also interesting to note that even though there are many similarities it doesn't look like korean's hold on bw will ever loosen simply due to bw's popularity level. Whereas Russians hold has been slipping.
Only criticism I would have is that I'm not sure what I'm exactly supposed to take away from the graphs. That they had similar performances? Oh..and the overexaggeration of savior but pretty much everyone on TL does this.
I'm really interested not just by the relatively similarities of the players' success charts, but also by the comparisons you made to their play style.
It would make sense that the first "best" player would be whoever first actually understood what the game was about, followed by those that discoved new things, to be later eclipsed by players that took the fundamentals, the new styles, and then combined it with non-gimmicky skill.
For other people that know the history of chess and/or bw well, does the descriptions he made of those players accurately match the reality?
Great read, although I would have gone with Nada-Botvinnik for their professionalism and especially July-Tal because both used aggression a psychological weapon.
On October 01 2011 05:03 Emporio wrote: I'm really interested not just by the relatively similarities of the players' success charts, but also by the comparisons you made to their play style.
It would make sense that the first "best" player would be whoever first actually understood what the game was about, followed by those that discoved new things, to be later eclipsed by players that took the fundamentals, the new styles, and then combined it with non-gimmicky skill.
For other people that know the history of chess and/or bw well, does the descriptions he made of those players accurately match the reality?
I did my best to match up players who I felt had something important in common, in terms of career progression, history, contribution to the game, and style. July/Botvinnik is probably the biggest stretch - historically they match up very nicely, but stylistically they are very different. Of course, some will probably not agree with some of the comparisons, and in deciding to draw parallels between the histories I was forced to leave out some players who did not have a clear doppelganger.
Epic! All I can say, this has to be featured. I always found the characters behind the game a lot more interesting in chess than the game itself. And a little refresher on Broodwar history won't do any harm. Very nice.
On October 01 2011 05:03 Emporio wrote: I'm really interested not just by the relatively similarities of the players' success charts, but also by the comparisons you made to their play style.
It would make sense that the first "best" player would be whoever first actually understood what the game was about, followed by those that discoved new things, to be later eclipsed by players that took the fundamentals, the new styles, and then combined it with non-gimmicky skill.
For other people that know the history of chess and/or bw well, does the descriptions he made of those players accurately match the reality?
the comparisons were actually sound stylistically except for botvinnik and july.
botvinnik was the leader of the official soviet school/academy for chess i believe, and he played very textbook, and had a good endgame (indictative of being a bookworm/theory master)
july as you know just goes out and kills people
only similarity is that both were better in tournament settings and finals than they were normally. they brought their a game and a good competitive mentality
On October 01 2011 04:51 scDeluX wrote: Nice post, featured maybe ?
People need to see this. This should be a book. The charts convey so much information over such a long period of time, in 2 amazing mental sports. I'm in awe.
I have a lot of respect towards people who play chess or knows a lot about it. And when you "combine" broodwar and chess, it seems pretty amazing as i just noticed when i read your blog.
Amazing read and great work, one of the best blogs i have read in a long time.
this was a great read. well researched and entertaining, thank-you.
while i realize it is not as important as the information you presented, i would like to add one thing about july zerg. he succeeded at the highest level when he was at an age that is generally considered far over the hill. starcraft is a very very young mans game. and his near uniquely aggressive gameplay, even back in the BW days was amazing to watch.
this vod on the old violetak account on youtube sums up julyzerg. watch out for the ear rape at the beginning if you decide to watch it. also, i had the picture of bisu at about 4:46 as my desktop for a long time after this.
Made me nostalgic for my Chess playing days. (never too good, highest USCF rating was around 1500)
I liked the comparisons of players. And remember what a fan I was of Viktor Korchnoi as he always tried to screw withthe Soviet Union after his defection. (Yes, I am old and remember it)
I also am reminded of how fascinating a personality Mikhail Tal was... The attacker extraordinaire! Coolest nickname ever... The "Wizard of Riga".
The only thing I would want to add is that while Kasparov is statistically the best of Chess, he himself has stated that he felt that Bobby was the greatest player ever for his brilliancies and the gap that he created between himself and his "peers".
I remember reading an article from Garry in which he basically accounted for "rating inflation" and showed that at the time that Garry came closest to breaking the 3000 ELO barrier, that Bobby's demolition of his peers, had the average ratings been similar to the time of the article, would have put Bobby around 3200...
I think in the long run that Garry's prolonged dominance and ground-breaking research with Chess databases give him a very strong argument as "best ever". But I like to remind people that for the brief time that Bobby was on top, his like had never been seen before or since.
Too bad he was nuts... (or maybe the two were hand-in-hand)
Yo man this has got be one of the best post's Ive read. It's clear to see the amount of time and work you put in this. You should really be happy with yourself, because I feel like i learned a lot from this.I personally no nothing about chess, so it was cool to learn all theses champs. Amazing job, this one will be remembered!!! : )
Incredible read. Thank you! Really great to see a cool comparison of past and present greats in BW and the time periods of dominance by certain players. As soon as I saw the spiked blue line in the BW graph from 2003-2005 it couldnt be anyone else but iloveoov. Great post!
I was wondering if you were gonna draw a comparison of Magnus Carlsen with someone, but I don't think there's any new talent in BW as stupendous as him.
also, LOL @ the comparison of Flash with Deep Blue
This is SO cool. I know nothing about chess, but I love reading stuff about the competitive scene. It's really fascinating. The comparison to BW just made it that much better.
I am HIGHLY impressed. Being a chess player, I found a good foot hold in SC2 through strategics, and in ability to use imagination (positioning, mind games, logic) on the field.
I found this post highly educational for those with no knowledge in the world of chess or Broodwar. A+
That was incredibly pleasing to read. A nice history lesson for both chess and BW, though it's kind of funny how 20 years chess time is one or two years tops in BW. Definitely says something about the shifting nature of the game.
Loved this article. Playing chess for over 15 years, BW for 13, avid historian of both, it really warmed the cockles of my heart to see this comparison. Of course a few liberties were taken here and there, but the parallels drawn made up for it and more.
Being both a chess fan and a starcraft fan, I really enjoyed this read. Thanks! This actually makes me want to start playing chess again... but then I remember how stressful it is trying to decide on a move...
This was amazing and hilarious! thank you. I've always said broodwar is kind of like chess where you can move as many pieces as you want as fast as you can and the boards are all different and play a big part of the game and you have to scout what your opponent is doing.
Fantastic read. Never followed the chess scene, but drawing the similarities between BW and Chess definitely helped me get an idea of what competitive chess must've been like over the past decade+.
Really cool article--thank you for writing it. I loved all the parallels you were able to find in these two areas of competition.
It strikes me how compressed everything is in Broodwar compared to chess. You mentioned people who were the best for a period of time twice as long as Broodwar has existed. I wish that somehow BW will become truly timeless, to the point where these first 10+ years can be summed up in a brief introduction to the days of competitive broodwar.
The monumental effort this required and the amazing writeup deserve a goddamn star. You sir, are a gentleman and a scholar.
Although I do not actively play chess, I did whoop most of my peers in casual games in high school, and do passionately read bios and game recaps of greatest players.
There is a small problem because stylistically Kasparov should be analogous to Jaedong and Karpov would be Flash, but in terms of Kasparov supplanting Karpov, Flash replaced Jaedong at the top. sAviOr/Fischer is especially apt. Particularly the intrigue they still inspire even when no longer playing their games professionally.
I wonder where Petrosian and Spassky fit, as Midas and Nal_ra? (Pringles 1).
Whatthefat deserves a star. After the gift of the SQ formula to the SC world, perhaps one of the most fantastic contributions since APM, it's impossible to imagine him without one. This article clearly casts away any doubt the TL mods may have about issuing such a boon.
Maybe also include the correlation between Kasparov's preparation and Flash's preparation. Flash's analysis of players and preparation before games is unparalleled in the Starcraft scene. It's the reason he rarely gets silvers in the grand finals. Flash always brings something new (but still amazingly solid) to every grand final, that makes even the best players look terrible.
The blog layout was good, and the amount of work put into it was good as well. I think the comparisons are pretty laughable though. For example
Fischer dedicated his whole life to Chess, even after he "retired", he was still studying tournament games and trying to find improvements in people's games. He was obsessed. Bobby Fischer hated the collusion (calling it outright cheating) the Soviets were doing when they would agree to short draws with each other. Fischer was also arguably the best ever at Blitz Chess (fast chess). Savior on the other hand is a slow APM BW player, and was proven to collude with other Koreans for profit. If Fischer himself would have played BW, he would have hated Savior.
What Botvinnik brought to the table was the idea of serious game preparation before a match. Before Botvinnik, home preparation was an after-thought, post Botvinnik it was taken very seriously. I don't recall July ever being known for studying his opponents and preparing accordingly.
Karpov was a slow "constricting" positional Chess player, Jaedong is a wildly aggressive BW player. The only relation Jaedong and Flash have with their respective chess players you assigned them to is Jaedong is always #2 behind Flash, just like Karpov was always #2 behind Kasparov.
Morphy completely dominated EVERYONE during his days. He was also the most well versed in openings for his era. He literally couldn't be stopped while he played. USA couldn't stop him and when he went to Europe to challenge their best, they couldn't stop him. He was so good compared to his peers infact, that he at a certain point refused to play anyone unless he was given a handicap (usually by starting the game a pawn or knight down). Grrr.... massed carriers.
I could go on and on, but since you added this disclaimer, I guess it's alright:
I decided to write a mostly non-serious account of their respective histories and the intertwined stories of their greatest players
I think these comparisons minimize the amount of studying and preparation Chess players do. There is so much more effort involved with far less gains. In general though, good effort.
I've always compared Capablanca and Grr... The way neither of them practiced very much, but still naturally owned the game. To later be surpassed by those who spent all their time on the game.
Another article that I clicked out of boredom and thought of having a high chance of TLDR after the first paragraph, but I actually read through it word by word.
Magnificent post. Thanks for the crazy-good read. I really enjoy the comparisons between Chess and Brood War as I grew up a wannabe Chess player that turned to Brood War. Thanks for continued awesomeness.
Edit: For those interested, you should watch "Searching for Bobby Fischer" which inspired the title to this blog.
Nice article, but I disagree with some of the choices.
If you consider the analogy as an evolution of how the game works, as opposed to how long players were dominant, Boxer would be Andersson and Nada would be Morphy. These two hail back to a more romantic period of chess focusing a lot more on aggression than the current state of the game would find viable.
Oov should probably be Lasker. While his strategic contribution was as influential as Steinitz, in opening the age of macro, Oov actually won. Lasker played an extremely psychological style, and was known for making a lot of "Bad moves," which we know now to be far ahead of his time as strong examples of positional play.
Among the more "recent" chess players in OP, Bisu's counterpart is the only one I've never heard of (not being much of a follower of the game admittedly).
Wow sAviOr was (and forever will be) my favorite bw player and Bobby Fischer has always been my favorite chess icon. I never really thought about the similarities they have.
On October 01 2011 18:10 fyyer wrote: The blog layout was good, and the amount of work put into it was good as well. I think the comparisons are pretty laughable though. For example
Fischer dedicated his whole life to Chess, even after he "retired", he was still studying tournament games and trying to find improvements in people's games. He was obsessed. Bobby Fischer hated the collusion (calling it outright cheating) the Soviets were doing when they would agree to short draws with each other. Fischer was also arguably the best ever at Blitz Chess (fast chess). Savior on the other hand is a slow APM BW player, and was proven to collude with other Koreans for profit. If Fischer himself would have played BW, he would have hated Savior.
What Botvinnik brought to the table was the idea of serious game preparation before a match. Before Botvinnik, home preparation was an after-thought, post Botvinnik it was taken very seriously. I don't recall July ever being known for studying his opponents and preparing accordingly.
Karpov was a slow "constricting" positional Chess player, Jaedong is a wildly aggressive BW player. The only relation Jaedong and Flash have with their respective chess players you assigned them to is Jaedong is always #2 behind Flash, just like Karpov was always #2 behind Kasparov.
Morphy completely dominated EVERYONE during his days. He was also the most well versed in openings for his era. He literally couldn't be stopped while he played. USA couldn't stop him and when he went to Europe to challenge their best, they couldn't stop him. He was so good compared to his peers infact, that he at a certain point refused to play anyone unless he was given a handicap (usually by starting the game a pawn or knight down). Grrr.... massed carriers.
I could go on and on, but since you added this disclaimer, I guess it's alright:
I decided to write a mostly non-serious account of their respective histories and the intertwined stories of their greatest players
I think these comparisons minimize the amount of studying and preparation Chess players do. There is so much more effort involved with far less gains. In general though, good effort.
Jaedong isn't that aggressive when you compare him to players like Shine, Eff0rt or Kwanro. He is more I should say, opportunistic and spontaneous.
Flash is one of the Terrans that does not play a slow constricting style, he is actually extremely aggressive and will always try to end games whenever the opportunity arises. Compare this to Fantasy who constricts the player through-out the whole game setting up early contains and dropping like crazy until the player has no economy left, that's a constrictive style. Flash almost never does contains, he just moves out and obliterates everything as fast as he can.
If Flash isn't cheesing, he is making extremely aggressive expansions (14cc) and teching extremely hard (valkonic/double armory), as soon as he scans carriers, he will and send out his entire army at once and take out all 6 bases at the same time. If he scouts a 12 nexus, he will bunker rush, if he plays on Heartbreak ridge and scouts a 12 hatch, he will bunker rush.
Flash probably has the highest number of bunker rushes against both Zerg and Protoss in the past few years, and he often does them in finals. Flash is one of the most aggressive players in this era of BroodWar.
Flash is just known for being a very uninteresting un-dynamic player, his attacks are so powerful often he just ends the game as soon as he moves out, or he will just sit on 3 bases which he managed to obtain with 1 factory, and wait until the Protoss makes an expansion too early or switches to carriers, in which case Flash will end the game within the next 10 seconds.
You also forget that Flash was known for his cheese back in his early days. It annoyed a lot of people, a notable person (can't remember who it was) mentioned in a interview (or twitter maybe?) that Flash's play reeked of boxer-esque cheese.
Great post and nice to read if you have a chess background, but comparing starcraft to chess is just wrong ....
No need to elaborate this further because this has been discussed a million times, so just let me say that this article was a very entertaining read and you did a great job.
Great blog. 5/5, although a few of the earlier comparisons struck me as a stretch, but that might be because I'm not familiar with the very old-school BW players and scene :p
Nice, but I think July matches Alekhine a little more, particularly because he dethroned Capablanca whilst july dethroned OOV. It just would work so well. another quick sidenote on the chess history botvinniks beating capa in 1938 was a great game but not particularly relevant capa was past his prime by then. Great post though good to know there are fellow SC/Chess fans out there
Dude this is a sick analogy, never thought of chess and bw this way before in my entire life. Great write-up! I'm kind of feeling baffled right now lol.
Love the BW/chess analogies. Yeah, yeah, chess and starcraft are worlds apart, but the similarities that do exist are striking (e.g. early/mid/endgame classifications).
I was told Kasparov retired from playing chess, but still teaches it.
Theres a very strong American named Gata Kamsky that could become the best however.
Great article though. Amazed by how well OP related the history of BW to chess, even though the former has been around for a VERY short amount of time compared to chess.
On October 01 2011 06:47 Gruesome wrote: The only thing I would want to add is that while Kasparov is statistically the best of Chess, he himself has stated that he felt that Bobby was the greatest player ever for his brilliancies and the gap that he created between himself and his "peers".
I remember reading an article from Garry in which he basically accounted for "rating inflation" and showed that at the time that Garry came closest to breaking the 3000 ELO barrier, that Bobby's demolition of his peers, had the average ratings been similar to the time of the article, would have put Bobby around 3200...
I think in the long run that Garry's prolonged dominance and ground-breaking research with Chess databases give him a very strong argument as "best ever". But I like to remind people that for the brief time that Bobby was on top, his like had never been seen before or since.
Too bad he was nuts... (or maybe the two were hand-in-hand)
Basically he thought Fischer did not accept a match with Karpov because he was afraid to lose -- he hadn't played chess in three years.
Anyway, all those comparisons between players of different eras are completely bogus and useless. Still, Fischer was such a hard worker, it took the coming of the computer era to produce another Fischer-like player -- Carlsen.. which comes back to the OP's point
I'm someone interested in chess who didn't play Brood war, but I've been trying to get into watching it and learning the history of it, so this is pretty awesome.
On October 01 2011 02:59 Ack1027 wrote: As someone who is somewhat interested in the chess world and heavily invested in bw progaming this was a very cool article to read.
Got me to wiki a lot of the older chess players I have never heard about.
Also interesting to note that even though there are many similarities it doesn't look like korean's hold on bw will ever loosen simply due to bw's popularity level. Whereas Russians hold has been slipping.
Only criticism I would have is that I'm not sure what I'm exactly supposed to take away from the graphs. That they had similar performances? Oh..and the overexaggeration of savior but pretty much everyone on TL does this.
I think the OP meant that at the time sAviOr started to dominate, the TvZ matchup heavily favored Terran, due to the maps etc. From what I understand at the time Bobby Fischer was around, chess was dominated by the russians, and he was the first american world champion in chess.
On October 01 2011 02:59 Ack1027 wrote: As someone who is somewhat interested in the chess world and heavily invested in bw progaming this was a very cool article to read.
Got me to wiki a lot of the older chess players I have never heard about.
Also interesting to note that even though there are many similarities it doesn't look like korean's hold on bw will ever loosen simply due to bw's popularity level. Whereas Russians hold has been slipping.
Only criticism I would have is that I'm not sure what I'm exactly supposed to take away from the graphs. That they had similar performances? Oh..and the overexaggeration of savior but pretty much everyone on TL does this.
Heh... You must have missed the fact that he was the only zerg player winning 'anything' for 20 months or so...
Amazing article. Chess is of course a much more advanced game strategically, but paradoxically it's hard to program the Starcraft equivalent of Deep Blue: an AI that can beat progamers. Maybe there could be one if professional programmers did it?
On October 01 2011 06:47 Gruesome wrote: The only thing I would want to add is that while Kasparov is statistically the best of Chess, he himself has stated that he felt that Bobby was the greatest player ever for his brilliancies and the gap that he created between himself and his "peers".
I remember reading an article from Garry in which he basically accounted for "rating inflation" and showed that at the time that Garry came closest to breaking the 3000 ELO barrier, that Bobby's demolition of his peers, had the average ratings been similar to the time of the article, would have put Bobby around 3200...
I think in the long run that Garry's prolonged dominance and ground-breaking research with Chess databases give him a very strong argument as "best ever". But I like to remind people that for the brief time that Bobby was on top, his like had never been seen before or since.
Too bad he was nuts... (or maybe the two were hand-in-hand)
The thing that I disagree with the most is well put by the comment below.
On October 01 2011 16:39 oBlade wrote: There is a small problem because stylistically Kasparov should be analogous to Jaedong and Karpov would be Flash, but in terms of Kasparov supplanting Karpov, Flash replaced Jaedong at the top. sAviOr/Fischer is especially apt. Particularly the intrigue they still inspire even when no longer playing their games professionally.
I wonder where Petrosian and Spassky fit, as Midas and Nal_ra? (Pringles 1).
This is really killer man. haha I love it! I can't believe how many times I thought, Yes perfect! Boxer /steinitz, oov/capa, flash/kasparov! and of course the crown jewel savior/fischer. Thank you!!!
So great! I have always wanted to make something like that but you did it perfectly. Where did you think that Nakamura would be? I mean, he's kind of like a "foreigner" in chess because hes from the United States.
Im rebumping this because it has sparked me into playing more competitively. Also its an amazing read that both teaches you chess and brood war history in relatively good detail. Please make this featured.
On December 13 2011 12:24 theslayer922 wrote: Im rebumping this because it has sparked me into playing more competitively. Also its an amazing read that both teaches you chess and brood war history in relatively good detail. Please make this featured.
It was spotlighted in early October, if I'm not mistaken.
I think this post deserves more views, it is very well written and definitely an interesting read. Loved the parallels between bw/chess with the dropship and comparison of ELOs.
having started to play chess recently this post resonates with me even more than when i last read it.
edit: probably more people would see it in sc2 general
Where's GG99Slayer, the norwegian who won the first KBK, and got people like Slayer's Boxer to copy his name!!
Blasphemy!! Holes in your story, hurry and fix, right this instant!! He beat up that Hot guy too in the finals i think. And first player in the world to have 300 apm hands!!
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