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Still upset that I am not a Diamond caliber player anymore after my 8 month deployment, I have been trying my hardest to get out of Gold these passed few days. I've been sick of playing at the lower level ladders because I can't really get back into learning "normal" play because so many of the players just like to 1 base and try for tier 3 or build a bunch of pylons after you beat them and just stay in game.
After stomping on a ton of these players, I play a competent Zerg player. After eventually losing a close game with him, I am demoted into Silver. Now I have read all the posts on MMR and how all this works, so I'm not complaining about something being broken or whatnot, I am just utterly confused how I can go on a 7 game killing spree and lose 1 close game and be demoted?
I'm just sad that now I have to get through yet another league before I stop seeing all this play that makes the game pretty boring. I can't wait until I get back to where I was but until then it is going to be a boring road :x Hopefully next time I post I won't be back in Bronze.
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On August 16 2011 05:40 Cham wrote:
I am just utterly confused how I can go on a 7 game killing spree and lose 1 close game and be demoted?
I'm just sad that now I have to get through yet another league before I stop seeing all this play that makes the game pretty boring. I can't wait until I get back to where I was but until then it is going to be a boring road :x Hopefully next time I post I won't be back in Bronze.
First, don't worry about your league-- it makes no determination in who you play against. League is meant to represent, in broad strokes, your MMR-- but it lags quite a bit due to the moving average effect.
Here's how the moving average works:
Let's say you're in gold league, and the gold league average MMR is 300. The average MMR in Silver League is 200, and there's a range from about 240-260 where you see people who have stable MMRs in both leagues.
You're a gold league player with 300 MMR. You lose 30 games and your MMR drops to 180. However, your average MMR over the course of your last 50 games is still well above 240; you had about 20 games at an MMR of 300, and then about 30 games with an MMR falling to 180.
You start winning again, since you're matched against pretty unskilled opponents. over the course of the next 30 games, your MMR gradually rises from 180 to about 250. However, the system sees your average MMR over the last 50 games is now like 210. Even though you're on a winning streak, you've spent so many of your last 50 games with a low MMR that your moving average of your most recent 50 MMR data points is well into the silver league. You are therefore demoted.
But none of this really matters; league is meaningless relative to MMR, which is what determines the caliber of your opponent. There is functionally no difference between who you were playing 2 games ago and who you're playing now, because your MMR has not drastically changed, even though your league is different.
So take heart! and keep on laddering. 5/5 for effort.
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On August 16 2011 05:53 Blazinghand wrote:
You start winning again, since you're matched against pretty unskilled opponents. over the course of the next 30 games, your MMR gradually rises from 180 to about 250. However, the system sees your average MMR over the last 50 games is now like 210. Even though you're on a winning streak, you've spent so many of your last 50 games with a low MMR that your moving average of your most recent 50 MMR data points is well into the silver league. You are therefore demoted.
So take heart! and keep on laddering. 5/5 for effort.
Ah, I guess I missed reading that part! Makes sense, for about 10 games I was trying to learn how to play Zerg and lost about 8 of them, so apparently that made my average for this season bad (Probably only about 30 games so far). Thanks!
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Hey man, if you're Terran I wouldn't mind going over some of your games with you. I'm a masters player and helped someone else out previously who had some troubles with ladder, he went from bronze to gold pretty quickly. If not, good luck!
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I say this as a BW player, so I don't know exactly how relevant it might be for you, but I was C- on ICCup for about 5-6 seasons in a row despite showing a lot of improvement both mechanically and strategically over that period of time. It was insanely frustrating, but there's a very simple mechanic at work here - EVERYONE IS GETTING BETTER. This means if you take an 8 month break, you probably got a bit rusty, nothing too serious. But, everyone who was equal skill to you back then is much farther ahead now, and due to the league structure, everyone in Diamond is much stronger than Diamonds used to be! Don't be too down on yourself! Keep practicing and worry only about improving yourself, not your rank or league!
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On August 16 2011 12:00 Fortis wrote:
I say this as a BW player, so I don't know exactly how relevant it might be for you, but I was C- on ICCup for about 5-6 seasons in a row despite showing a lot of improvement both mechanically and strategically over that period of time. It was insanely frustrating, but there's a very simple mechanic at work here - EVERYONE IS GETTING BETTER. This means if you take an 8 month break, you probably got a bit rusty, nothing too serious. But, everyone who was equal skill to you back then is much farther ahead now, and due to the league structure, everyone in Diamond is much stronger than Diamonds used to be! Don't be too down on yourself! Keep practicing and worry only about improving yourself, not your rank or league!
What I was going for though is not that I am upset I am in Silver because it is Silver, I am upset because people in Silver generally don't know basic mechanics of the game so I end up playing people who try to mass thor or cannon in like a moneymap. I just don't find games like that very entertaining because I don't feel like I am improving when I play against players like that.
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Try customs if you don't like to play in silver league against those kind of players.
Then come back to ladder after 4-6 weeks of customs and you'll stomp everyone and get promoted = win?
I personally don't do the above but I know people who did and they went fromt bronze to diamond because of this  I just hit the ladder search button and just play as much as I can on ladder.
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On August 16 2011 18:06 shannn wrote:Try customs if you don't like to play in silver league against those kind of players. Then come back to ladder after 4-6 weeks of customs and you'll stomp everyone and get promoted = win? I personally don't do the above but I know people who did and they went fromt bronze to diamond because of this I just hit the ladder search button and just play as much as I can on ladder.
Do what this man says. That and work on random opening builds in team games. I don't know why, but team games really let me focus on easy timings and such, and I like racing my allies for the first 4 gate warp-in, etc. Sometimes just playing customs isn't good because people that play customs generally want to improve, and hence never cheese you or do weird one-base all-ins, etc. So I find things like random low level 4 v 4 to be very interesting. And doing easy things like a well executed 2 base collosus will dominate most <diamond players, so it lets you get a little more reward out of it. Nothing like rolling over 4 people in a row single handedly because they all decided to go mass marine/zergling vs your 3/3 chargelot/colossus build.
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On August 16 2011 17:53 Cham wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2011 12:00 Fortis wrote:
I say this as a BW player, so I don't know exactly how relevant it might be for you, but I was C- on ICCup for about 5-6 seasons in a row despite showing a lot of improvement both mechanically and strategically over that period of time. It was insanely frustrating, but there's a very simple mechanic at work here - EVERYONE IS GETTING BETTER. This means if you take an 8 month break, you probably got a bit rusty, nothing too serious. But, everyone who was equal skill to you back then is much farther ahead now, and due to the league structure, everyone in Diamond is much stronger than Diamonds used to be! Don't be too down on yourself! Keep practicing and worry only about improving yourself, not your rank or league! What I was going for though is not that I am upset I am in Silver because it is Silver, I am upset because people in Silver generally don't know basic mechanics of the game so I end up playing people who try to mass thor or cannon in like a moneymap. I just don't find games like that very entertaining because I don't feel like I am improving when I play against players like that.
I see, I apologize for the misunderstanding. Wouldn't the logical thing to do then be noobstomp until you are clearly going to get promoted, then play custom matches vs better players, or finding practice partners on TL? Sounds like it should be fun ^^;
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