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On June 27 2011 16:00 Endymion wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 15:55 flowSthead wrote:On June 27 2011 15:13 Endymion wrote:
I can't respect ugly girls, just like I can't respect ugly guys. It's not even a sexual thing, I just don't like ugly people because 99.99% of the time their appearance reflects their personality. That said, I don't respect every attractive person I know, but physical appearances are an initial cut off for me. Thank you for, I presume, not reading it fully. Or if you did, then you absolutely missed the point. Personally, I don't care that you are "shallow" as the word means very little to me, but I just find your conclusion difficult to fathom. How is it the case that 99% of the time a person's appearance reflects their personality? I just have never had that experience, so good for you, I guess? ?? I read the post, I just don't believe it or connect to it so I stated my opinion to prompt discussion, sorry for sullying your holy blog.
I don't mind you stating your opinion. It just feels like after I spent 3 or 4 paragraphs talking about how if one takes a moment to think about, sometimes they are affected by personality to the point that people that would not otherwise be physically attractive become so anyway, you responded with something like the lines of "Lol, nope, ugly girls suck".
I mean let me ask you this. I take it as a given that no one person can ever truly know another human being fully, no matter how long they spend time together. You can make a good approximation over time, but never fully. If you only choose to hang out with attractive people, how the hell do you know that all ugly people have poor personalities? It is kind of an irrational conclusion, and I happen to not appreciate irrational conclusions.
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On June 27 2011 15:55 flowSthead wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 15:31 Torte de Lini wrote:
The reality of it all is that a person will find many women "attractive", good-looking and quite enticingly gorgeous.
However, in the end, most people will go for women they are about the same "level" of beauty, inside and outside (and I wish I could reference the source, it's been a few years about this phenomenon or test).
To be bold, I would say you find the "hurt" part of a person not because they are more "real" in general, but rather because it is something you can relate to or recognize easily and thus match yourself with.
But that's me assuming, which I generally try not to.
Try watching "Blue Valentine" for a "real" love.
I personally think you'd love it and I'd love to hear your thoughts. I would say that your first point is most likely correct. As I often might feel a certain fragility in myself, perhaps that attracts me as well. I cannot be completely sure about this though, since I tend to not want to show that fragility in a relationship, and regret doing so when I inevitably do so. I can't honestly say whether or not your assumption is correct, but it very well might be. As for "Blue Valentine", I saw it, and to be honest was not particularly impressed. I didn't find the characters particularly attractive to be honest. Sure they felt real, and the movie was interesting enough, but there was just a lot missing for me. It is beautifully shot and acted though, just felt sort of plotless. I wonder if you have seen "Before Sunrise" and "Before Sunset". I consider that set to be the most "real" movies involving a relationship I have ever seen. Both characters have slight moments where they let their guard down in both movies that represent fragility that I find lacking in "Blue Valentine". It often felt in the latter as if only the guy showed those moments, and poorly worded, whereas the girl often did not. The "Before" movies had both of them expose themselves emotionally. I don't know, in the end it may just be that one appeals to me more than the other, but I'd love to hear your thoughts about either as well ^^.
Focus more on the pace and direction of the film. How it is cut and edited, because the timings are key here. I don't want to spoil for those interested but: + Show Spoiler +I'm sure you noticed it, but I was blown away to see them get divorced during the ignition of a love we were being introduced to as well. The fireworks was really the icing on the key and truly symbolic
The acting, as you said, was superb.
Nope, haven't seen them. Will truly consider since you saw my film already :B
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On June 27 2011 15:55 frodoguy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 15:32 Torte de Lini wrote:On June 27 2011 15:13 Endymion wrote:
I can't respect ugly girls, just like I can't respect ugly guys. It's not even a sexual thing, I just don't like ugly people because 99.99% of the time their appearance reflects their personality. That said, I don't respect every attractive person I know, but physical appearances are an initial cut off for me. And vice-versa apparently. Those who are strong in their skewed views of people are generally unattractive themselves and know this. They put out this high standard to compensate or excuse themselves for their inability to achieve much of a social level. I hope this isn't you and I also hope you don't live by these absolutes you callously talk so openly about. But i and a whole lot of other people really love kpop (its all about looks, incase you didnt know), does that mean i fall under this category? Because that just sounds a bit silly to me
Reread it again.
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On June 27 2011 16:04 flowSthead wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 16:00 Endymion wrote:On June 27 2011 15:55 flowSthead wrote:On June 27 2011 15:13 Endymion wrote:
I can't respect ugly girls, just like I can't respect ugly guys. It's not even a sexual thing, I just don't like ugly people because 99.99% of the time their appearance reflects their personality. That said, I don't respect every attractive person I know, but physical appearances are an initial cut off for me. Thank you for, I presume, not reading it fully. Or if you did, then you absolutely missed the point. Personally, I don't care that you are "shallow" as the word means very little to me, but I just find your conclusion difficult to fathom. How is it the case that 99% of the time a person's appearance reflects their personality? I just have never had that experience, so good for you, I guess? ?? I read the post, I just don't believe it or connect to it so I stated my opinion to prompt discussion, sorry for sullying your holy blog. I don't mind you stating your opinion. It just feels like after I spent 3 or 4 paragraphs talking about how if one takes a moment to think about, sometimes they are affected by personality to the point that people that would not otherwise be physically attractive become so anyway, you responded with something like the lines of "Lol, nope, ugly girls suck". I mean let me ask you this. I take it as a given that no one person can ever truly know another human being fully, no matter how long they spend time together. You can make a good approximation over time, but never fully. If you only choose to hang out with attractive people, how the hell do you know that all ugly people have poor personalities? It is kind of an irrational conclusion, and I happen to not appreciate irrational conclusions.
It's not irrational at all, I edited my first post explaining why I don't think it is. I know a lot more "fake" people than I know shapeshifters, and most people who are attractive have the drive to do something (maintain their physical beauty), where as ugly people obviously don't have the drive so I can't say anything for their personality..
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NeverGG
United Kingdom5399 Posts
I often feel like I'm dismissed immediately by men (especially if I'm in the company of women who are attractive.) and it's hard to get out of the mind-set of 'I'm ugly so there's no point in trying.' Infact at the moment this is my entire mindset. Even if I had the best personality in the world since I'm ugly it doesn't really seem to matter.
I definitely feel as though I'd be treated better (by almost everyone) if I was considered attractive. As it is I have zero redeeming physical qualities, and have been mistaken for a man in the past more than once (which was during my years in university.) It hit my self-confidence so badly that I basically never recovered, and often find it hard to even look at myself in a mirror.
The upside of this is that I can easily have friendships with men without them becoming complicated by relationship issues. Also I'm never subject to sexual harassment problems either. Freed from the potential for romance I have plenty of time to pursue my hobbies, but I'm going to need to plan for my future with the idea of none of the additional benefits of having a partner ^^; (Well except my cat....)
P.S. Not everyone has the money or confidence to 'maintain their physical beauty.' I'd need thousands of dollars worth of surgery to make myself into something considered attractive. I don't even know where to begin - even the most basic things like clothes shopping are a self-conscious nightmare for me. I hate even going into shops, and trying things on is even worse.
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On June 27 2011 15:08 flowSthead wrote:
We like what we like, whether that be socially instilled in us, or genetically through particular pheromones, it doesn't really matter.
Oh god I hope you don't actually believe that. There's enough crap going around without the implication that men like what they like about women because we've been culturally conditioned (nicer word for brainwashed, really) to like it. It's absolute BS. You may logically engage yourself in liking something (oh she'd make a good mother/wife) but in the end the reaction in your pants is only caused by what you feel, not by what you think.
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Well there are two possibilities here: either Endymion is just more idiotic trash trying to use the internet as a crutch for his pathetic social life, or we could all be getting trolled pretty hard. Someone should look at his previous posts to see if he is actually this stupid.
User was warned for this post
Edit: Seriously mods?
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On June 27 2011 15:13 Endymion wrote:
I can't respect ugly girls, just like I can't respect ugly guys. It's not even a sexual thing, I just don't like ugly people because 99.99% of the time their appearance reflects their personality. That said, I don't respect every attractive person I know, but physical appearances are an initial cut off for me.
Ok after I've been burned at the stake I may as well edit my post. I used to live in a really hostile middle school/high school environment that only cared about physical appearance, not personality or merit. So I was weened on this mindset, and being a fat kid had its definite downs. But now through all the pain I've learned to place fitness above eating, and I'm happily fit and anorexic now. Thus, I find people who call themselves "big-boned" a bit abrasive, especially when they look down on eating disorders or fitness. Also, I don't really like people who think plastic surgery is messing up a girls "natural" beauty when it's the girl's choice to correct her imperfections.
For the people who think I'm shallow, you're just as shallow as me if you care about a personality as much as I value physical beauty, in fact more so because it's easier to shed who you are rather than what you are. I can go to a sports game and be super social, then have dinner with my parents, then be an introvert and play Starcraft for 12 hours, all in one day. Which aspect do you prefer, because I can fake any of them for you, where as I can't really fake what I am unless I commit to surgery or serious physical activity. This makes working out a sort of "achievement," showing that you've committed to something, opposed to money or friends which I could just deceive you about. Judging by a personality is like judging a book by its cover, you need all aspects of the person, not just one.
Maybe I'm just jaded, but don't demean me by labeling me "shallow".....
Reading this, I can't respect you.
First of all, their is a large difference between appearances and personality. The reason why people respect others for their personality rather than their appearances is because their personality is what defines someone. The ability to naturally mold your personality rather than your appearance is on factor in why that person merits respect.
For example, would you respect a lazy person or a hard working person?
However, using your logic, the lazy person could always become a hard working person. Yes, the transition into becoming a hard working person makes them more respectable. Their decision to forsake their laziness and work hard is admirable and deserves respect.
Scenario two: Would you rather respect a ugly person or a pretty person?
Your answer would be probably be the pretty person if you had to pick between the two. Now, what if the ugly person got plastic surgery and now looks very pretty. Even if she still has her ugly personality, you would be more inclined to respect her.
This is why personality determines whether a person merits respect and not appearances.
Yes, I know that you mentioned that the reason you don't respect ugly people is because 99.9% of the time, they have ugly personalities.
First of all, this is extremely stereotypical. Secondly, your logic is extremely fallible. Using this logic, you would not respect elders because they lose their attractiveness to time despite what they have done with their lives.
It is time for you to wake up from your bubble and start thinking for yourself. If you continue your narrow, ignorant ways, don't expect to establish a stable family because 50% of marriages ends in a divorce. I wonder what will happened to your relationship with your wife (under the low circumstances that you'll be able to find one) when she gets old and loses her attractiveness. Then you'll stop respecting her and a relationship without mutual respect cannot last.
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On June 27 2011 16:09 Endymion wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 16:04 flowSthead wrote:On June 27 2011 16:00 Endymion wrote:On June 27 2011 15:55 flowSthead wrote:On June 27 2011 15:13 Endymion wrote:
I can't respect ugly girls, just like I can't respect ugly guys. It's not even a sexual thing, I just don't like ugly people because 99.99% of the time their appearance reflects their personality. That said, I don't respect every attractive person I know, but physical appearances are an initial cut off for me. Thank you for, I presume, not reading it fully. Or if you did, then you absolutely missed the point. Personally, I don't care that you are "shallow" as the word means very little to me, but I just find your conclusion difficult to fathom. How is it the case that 99% of the time a person's appearance reflects their personality? I just have never had that experience, so good for you, I guess? ?? I read the post, I just don't believe it or connect to it so I stated my opinion to prompt discussion, sorry for sullying your holy blog. I don't mind you stating your opinion. It just feels like after I spent 3 or 4 paragraphs talking about how if one takes a moment to think about, sometimes they are affected by personality to the point that people that would not otherwise be physically attractive become so anyway, you responded with something like the lines of "Lol, nope, ugly girls suck". I mean let me ask you this. I take it as a given that no one person can ever truly know another human being fully, no matter how long they spend time together. You can make a good approximation over time, but never fully. If you only choose to hang out with attractive people, how the hell do you know that all ugly people have poor personalities? It is kind of an irrational conclusion, and I happen to not appreciate irrational conclusions. It's not irrational at all, I edited my first post explaining why I don't think it is. I know a lot more "fake" people than I know shapeshifters, and most people who are attractive have the drive to do something (maintain their physical beauty), where as ugly people obviously don't have the drive so I can't say anything for their personality..
Sorry, I didn't see the edit. Perhaps it is not irrational, but at the very last there is a huge gulf in values between you and I. You say that you see drive and the ability to maintain fitness, whereas I largely see a waste of time. I mean I agree with you that being overweight is more often than not a test of will rather than genetics, but I was more speaking to the idea of accomplishment and the ability to converse.
For example, between two people one of which spent most of their time working out being fit, going to a tanning salon, etc. and a person who read a lot of books and watched a lot of TV, I would probably hang out with the latter. If they could do both, then cool, but I am more interested in a person's opinions rather than physical appearance.
It may in fact be easier to fake a personality than change your appearance, I agree with that. But faking opinions consistently is a somewhat difficult task the longer a conversation goes on. It's not like you can fake having an experience.
Anyways, sorry for the harsh initial response, but this is kind of what I meant. Whereas your initial judgement might be towards physical appearance, mine will be from what a person says. Your first post had little explanation, and thus came off as poorly thought out. The edit is better, and convincingly display a difference in values that I can assess.
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On June 27 2011 15:13 Endymion wrote:
I can't respect ugly girls, just like I can't respect ugly guys. It's not even a sexual thing, I just don't like ugly people because 99.99% of the time their appearance reflects their personality. That said, I don't respect every attractive person I know, but physical appearances are an initial cut off for me.
Ok after I've been burned at the stake I may as well edit my post. I used to live in a really hostile middle school/high school environment that only cared about physical appearance, not personality or merit. So I was weened on this mindset, and being a fat kid had its definite downs. But now through all the pain I've learned to place fitness above eating, and I'm happily fit and anorexic now. Thus, I find people who call themselves "big-boned" a bit abrasive, especially when they look down on eating disorders or fitness. Also, I don't really like people who think plastic surgery is messing up a girls "natural" beauty when it's the girl's choice to correct her imperfections.
For the people who think I'm shallow, you're just as shallow as me if you care about a personality as much as I value physical beauty, in fact more so because it's easier to shed who you are rather than what you are. I can go to a sports game and be super social, then have dinner with my parents, then be an introvert and play Starcraft for 12 hours, all in one day. Which aspect do you prefer, because I can fake any of them for you, where as I can't really fake what I am unless I commit to surgery or serious physical activity. This makes working out a sort of "achievement," showing that you've committed to something, opposed to money or friends which I could just deceive you about. Judging by a personality is like judging a book by its cover, you need all aspects of the person, not just one.
Maybe I'm just jaded, but don't demean me by labeling me "shallow".....
Oy, difficult where to begin. A lot of what you're saying is very narrow-minded and just furthering the justified views of shallowness. To callously call others shallow because we take into account more than what's physically valued is the cherry on this sundae of melting pettiness and superficiality on your part.
I'm going to ignore your anecdotes and blast from the past because it's just nonsense that reinforced your stereotypical view and sense of "understanding" of people in general, despite how limited and poor it is in the grand scheme of things/society.
But let's halt and read this beauty: Also, I don't really like people who think plastic surgery is messing up a girls "natural" beauty when it's the girl's choice to correct her imperfections.
This poor statement further concludes that you do have a narrow-minded understanding of people. Plastic surgery has legitimate uses, we both know that. What you don't seem to account for is that plastic surgery isn't something people "think is messing up a girl's natural beauty", it just places an importance on a part of them that shouldn't have priority, financial support or be a form of getting over one's insecurities. We all have imperfections, that is what allows one to see a person's perfections. To repair these would be to emphasize these imperfections as something to be insecure about rather than accept that there are key components of you that don't deserve more and better attention (than say the traits and qualities you can improve on).
The true irony here is that you naturally got into shape after being overweight, but then entirely support those who want the easy way into changing themselves without effort. This I find baffling and furthering my conclusions about you
Onward we go: It's faster to judge someone physically and assume their personality than to fake a personality. If I judged you physically before you can come up to me and fake all your traits, guess what's more shallow and easier to perform?
Good try though, that was really cute. I really enjoyed that last throw of the spear. You didn't even justify why ugly people have ugly personalities, you dodged that completely. Did you take note at how, no matter what shape or form you are, your true personality shines in the end.
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On June 27 2011 16:07 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 15:55 flowSthead wrote:On June 27 2011 15:31 Torte de Lini wrote:
The reality of it all is that a person will find many women "attractive", good-looking and quite enticingly gorgeous.
However, in the end, most people will go for women they are about the same "level" of beauty, inside and outside (and I wish I could reference the source, it's been a few years about this phenomenon or test).
To be bold, I would say you find the "hurt" part of a person not because they are more "real" in general, but rather because it is something you can relate to or recognize easily and thus match yourself with.
But that's me assuming, which I generally try not to.
Try watching "Blue Valentine" for a "real" love.
I personally think you'd love it and I'd love to hear your thoughts. I would say that your first point is most likely correct. As I often might feel a certain fragility in myself, perhaps that attracts me as well. I cannot be completely sure about this though, since I tend to not want to show that fragility in a relationship, and regret doing so when I inevitably do so. I can't honestly say whether or not your assumption is correct, but it very well might be. As for "Blue Valentine", I saw it, and to be honest was not particularly impressed. I didn't find the characters particularly attractive to be honest. Sure they felt real, and the movie was interesting enough, but there was just a lot missing for me. It is beautifully shot and acted though, just felt sort of plotless. I wonder if you have seen "Before Sunrise" and "Before Sunset". I consider that set to be the most "real" movies involving a relationship I have ever seen. Both characters have slight moments where they let their guard down in both movies that represent fragility that I find lacking in "Blue Valentine". It often felt in the latter as if only the guy showed those moments, and poorly worded, whereas the girl often did not. The "Before" movies had both of them expose themselves emotionally. I don't know, in the end it may just be that one appeals to me more than the other, but I'd love to hear your thoughts about either as well ^^. Focus more on the pace and direction of the film. How it is cut and edited, because the timings are key here. I don't want to spoil for those interested but: + Show Spoiler +I'm sure you noticed it, but I was blown away to see them get divorced during the ignition of a love we were being introduced to as well. The fireworks was really the icing on the key and truly symbolic The acting, as you said, was superb. Nope, haven't seen them. Will truly consider since you saw my film already :B
Oh I'm not saying the movie lacked emotional punch, and I completely agree with your interpretation. The only problem I had was that because it felt off, I never got quite as invested in the characters. So by the end of the movie, even though I could fully appreciate the great editing and pace of the film, I just wasn't invested and I couldn't feel the impact.
On June 27 2011 16:14 Weasel- wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 15:08 flowSthead wrote:
We like what we like, whether that be socially instilled in us, or genetically through particular pheromones, it doesn't really matter. Oh god I hope you don't actually believe that. There's enough crap going around without the implication that men like what they like about women because we've been culturally conditioned (nicer word for brainwashed, really) to like it. It's absolute BS. You may logically engage yourself in liking something (oh she'd make a good mother/wife) but in the end the reaction in your pants is only caused by what you feel, not by what you think.
Thousands of years of arranged marriages would beg to differ :-). Whether or not you are physically attracted to 14 year old girls, I am sure most people today above the age of 18 would feel uncomfortable hitting on a 14 year old girl. That is not genetics, that is purely cultural.
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On June 27 2011 16:26 flowSthead wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 16:07 Torte de Lini wrote:On June 27 2011 15:55 flowSthead wrote:On June 27 2011 15:31 Torte de Lini wrote:
The reality of it all is that a person will find many women "attractive", good-looking and quite enticingly gorgeous.
However, in the end, most people will go for women they are about the same "level" of beauty, inside and outside (and I wish I could reference the source, it's been a few years about this phenomenon or test).
To be bold, I would say you find the "hurt" part of a person not because they are more "real" in general, but rather because it is something you can relate to or recognize easily and thus match yourself with.
But that's me assuming, which I generally try not to.
Try watching "Blue Valentine" for a "real" love.
I personally think you'd love it and I'd love to hear your thoughts. I would say that your first point is most likely correct. As I often might feel a certain fragility in myself, perhaps that attracts me as well. I cannot be completely sure about this though, since I tend to not want to show that fragility in a relationship, and regret doing so when I inevitably do so. I can't honestly say whether or not your assumption is correct, but it very well might be. As for "Blue Valentine", I saw it, and to be honest was not particularly impressed. I didn't find the characters particularly attractive to be honest. Sure they felt real, and the movie was interesting enough, but there was just a lot missing for me. It is beautifully shot and acted though, just felt sort of plotless. I wonder if you have seen "Before Sunrise" and "Before Sunset". I consider that set to be the most "real" movies involving a relationship I have ever seen. Both characters have slight moments where they let their guard down in both movies that represent fragility that I find lacking in "Blue Valentine". It often felt in the latter as if only the guy showed those moments, and poorly worded, whereas the girl often did not. The "Before" movies had both of them expose themselves emotionally. I don't know, in the end it may just be that one appeals to me more than the other, but I'd love to hear your thoughts about either as well ^^. Focus more on the pace and direction of the film. How it is cut and edited, because the timings are key here. I don't want to spoil for those interested but: + Show Spoiler +I'm sure you noticed it, but I was blown away to see them get divorced during the ignition of a love we were being introduced to as well. The fireworks was really the icing on the key and truly symbolic The acting, as you said, was superb. Nope, haven't seen them. Will truly consider since you saw my film already :B Oh I'm not saying the movie lacked emotional punch, and I completely agree with your interpretation. The only problem I had was that because it felt off, I never got quite as invested in the characters. So by the end of the movie, even though I could fully appreciate the great editing and pace of the film, I just wasn't invested and I couldn't feel the impact. Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 16:14 Weasel- wrote:On June 27 2011 15:08 flowSthead wrote:
We like what we like, whether that be socially instilled in us, or genetically through particular pheromones, it doesn't really matter. Oh god I hope you don't actually believe that. There's enough crap going around without the implication that men like what they like about women because we've been culturally conditioned (nicer word for brainwashed, really) to like it. It's absolute BS. You may logically engage yourself in liking something (oh she'd make a good mother/wife) but in the end the reaction in your pants is only caused by what you feel, not by what you think. Thousands of years of arranged marriages would beg to differ :-). Whether or not you are physically attracted to 14 year old girls, I am sure most people today above the age of 18 would feel uncomfortable hitting on a 14 year old girl. That is not genetics, that is purely cultural.
Hm... fair enough. I could agree actually, we were spectators of a rising and falling of a relationship, but not of the people invested.
Agreed :3
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Even though I completely disagree with Endymion about not respecting unattractive people, there is some truth in his statement. You can usually tell a lot about a person's personality just by taking one look at him/her. Also, a hardworking person is way more likely to care of him/herself than a lazy person. Obviously this doesn't mean that handsome people have better personalities, but I'm pretty sure there will be an small statistical correlation between the two.
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On June 27 2011 16:28 bartus88 wrote:
Even though I completely disagree with Endymion about not respecting unattractive people, there is some truth in his statement. You can usually tell a lot about a person's personality just by taking one look at him/her. Also, a hardworking person is way more likely to care of him/herself than a lazy person. Obviously this doesn't mean that handsome people have better personalities, but I'm pretty sure there will be an small statistical correlation between the two.
No, that's called the Halo-Effect and anecdotes.
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On June 27 2011 16:14 NeverGG wrote:
I often feel like I'm dismissed immediately by men (especially if I'm in the company of women who are attractive.) and it's hard to get out of the mind-set of 'I'm ugly so there's no point in trying.' Infact at the moment this is my entire mindset. Even if I had the best personality in the world since I'm ugly it doesn't really seem to matter.
I definitely feel as though I'd be treated better (by almost everyone) if I was considered attractive. As it is I have zero redeeming physical qualities, and have been mistaken for a man in the past more than once (which was during my years in university.) It hit my self-confidence so badly that I basically never recovered, and often find it hard to even look at myself in a mirror.
The upside of this is that I can easily have friendships with men without them becoming complicated by relationship issues. Also I'm never subject to sexual harassment problems either. Freed from the potential for romance I have plenty of time to pursue my hobbies, but I'm going to need to plan for my future with the idea of none of the additional benefits of having a partner ^^; (Well except my cat....)
P.S. Not everyone has the money or confidence to 'maintain their physical beauty.' I'd need thousands of dollars worth of surgery to make myself into something considered attractive. I don't even know where to begin - even the most basic things like clothes shopping are a self-conscious nightmare for me. I hate even going into shops, and trying things on is even worse.
This is honestly kind of depressing. I wish I could say something to cheer you up, but I cannot pretend that physical attractiveness doesn't do anything for me. I mean, I do not consider myself very attractive at all, but I feel as though I am at least average. Thinking you are ugly must be rough.
I will say that confidence is attractive, and that is probably kind of a lame thing to say since I am sure you have heard it before. I don't know, I feel for you though. It is definitely a lot harder to be unattractive as a girl then it is as a guy, but I wouldn't say it is insurmountable. I obviously don't know your situation, but don't give up! Confidence breeds success. You just have to get a little bit of it to get you on a roll.
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On June 27 2011 16:22 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 15:13 Endymion wrote:
I can't respect ugly girls, just like I can't respect ugly guys. It's not even a sexual thing, I just don't like ugly people because 99.99% of the time their appearance reflects their personality. That said, I don't respect every attractive person I know, but physical appearances are an initial cut off for me.
Ok after I've been burned at the stake I may as well edit my post. I used to live in a really hostile middle school/high school environment that only cared about physical appearance, not personality or merit. So I was weened on this mindset, and being a fat kid had its definite downs. But now through all the pain I've learned to place fitness above eating, and I'm happily fit and anorexic now. Thus, I find people who call themselves "big-boned" a bit abrasive, especially when they look down on eating disorders or fitness. Also, I don't really like people who think plastic surgery is messing up a girls "natural" beauty when it's the girl's choice to correct her imperfections.
For the people who think I'm shallow, you're just as shallow as me if you care about a personality as much as I value physical beauty, in fact more so because it's easier to shed who you are rather than what you are. I can go to a sports game and be super social, then have dinner with my parents, then be an introvert and play Starcraft for 12 hours, all in one day. Which aspect do you prefer, because I can fake any of them for you, where as I can't really fake what I am unless I commit to surgery or serious physical activity. This makes working out a sort of "achievement," showing that you've committed to something, opposed to money or friends which I could just deceive you about. Judging by a personality is like judging a book by its cover, you need all aspects of the person, not just one.
Maybe I'm just jaded, but don't demean me by labeling me "shallow"..... But let's halt and read this beauty: Also, I don't really like people who think plastic surgery is messing up a girls "natural" beauty when it's the girl's choice to correct her imperfections. This poor statement further concludes that you do have a narrow-minded understanding of people. Plastic surgery has legitimate uses, we both know that. What you don't seem to account for is that plastic surgery isn't something people "think is messing up a girl's natural beauty", it just places an importance on a part of them that shouldn't have priority, financial support or be a form of getting over one's insecurities. We all have imperfections, that is what allows one to see a person's perfections. To repair these would be to emphasize these imperfections as something to be insecure about rather than accept that there are key components of you that don't deserve more and better attention (than say the traits and qualities you can improve on).
You make it sound like plastic surgery is a bad thing (from a psychological point of view), which it is not. According to research, most women have gain many benefits, including higher self-esteem. So i dont agree when u say that it shouldnt have priority, financial support or a form of getting over one's imperfection.
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Give me a study that compares the long-term overall self-esteem levels of people who have plastic surgery and those who rely on other methods to cope with imperfections that aren't or should not be a hindrance on their life (or in the main aspects of their life, since insecurities will always play a part or role).
Then give me the financial difference between the two.
Then maybe what you're saying won't sound like half a story. To reiterate, what you're saying is that someone who invested time, money, thought and interest into a procedure came out feeling better about who they are and how they look (than before). By golly! That's astounding!
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I don't have a problem with unattractive people.
I DO have a problem with people who are not unattractive naturally, but who cause themselves to be so by not taking proper care of themselves, such as being overweight, having unkempt or greasy hair, or not being properly groomed.
I don't care what natural gifts you were or were not given when it comes to physical appearance, but at least make the most of what you've got. Especially when it comes to weight.
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Too often I've felt really guilty and have been proven wrong again and again when I judge someone based on their looks. Quite a few people that I somewhat didn't pay attention to (because they looked bad - this 1 guy had some hormone problems and had spots all over his body and he's overweight and keeps his fingernails bloody long) turned out to be really good friends and really nice and interesting , even helpful people.
To make a general baseless statement that isn't true in all cases: Since confidence and arrogance are related in my opinion, people who look worse tend to be more humble or have low self esteem, depending on how they take it, and vice versa.
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Torte de Lini , really good music at your sig! And flowSthead, the music you posted sounds as twisted as what you wrote in the OP hahaha really good stuff :D
I would really appreciate it if you would PM me more good stuff!
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i know a girl. i met her in grade 8. she wasnt the most attractive person. in fact you could consider her on the lower end of the "hot" scale. Despite her looks she had a wonderful heart, wrote perhaps the best poetry i had ever read. But not any of the guys in school cared a single bit about her
however i went out of my way to make sure she always had someone to talk to. always had someone to ask for help in class. always had a friend.
During the break of grade 10 to grade 11. she became the most beautiful person in the school. she started doing modelling for hairdressers. and as soon as she became gourgeous all the guys all of a sudden wanted her. but guess what, whenever they'd try to hit on her, she would always remind them they didnt want her then, she didnt want them now.
All the guys that were calling me an idiot for hanging out with her before. now all hated my guts. because i was always there. where they wanted to be
we were best friends for 6 years. still are.
never judge a book by its cover. you may miss out on a story that might change your life
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EPT
