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OK here's the deal (it's a rant).
I TA for a course in a university which I am required to host office hours so the students can come and ask me questions about the course. There is this one girl who comes often for help, but she is an awfully rude person - unbearably rude (she calls me names, asks private questions, interrupts my conversation with other students needing my help, and she is inconsiderate of others overall.).
While I didn't show any explicit words about it, I certainly didn't like her (I assure you I am not the only one). Sometimes, when there are students other than her asking questions, I often take longer time to explain others' questions so I didn't have to talk to her. I was pretty cold to her, basically.
But she isn't dumb. She knew I was being cold to her and a few days ago she asked me to "talk in private". I did, which turned into a painful, two hours long conversation.
I won't state everything in the conversation, but you can see the most important part in the spoiler:
+ Show Spoiler +
Basically, she told me:
1. She has some psychological disorder (she is on medication);
2. Her parents are really demanding on her;
3. She has no friends;
4. She often thinks of suicide.
5. She knows she says offending things to others (got into trouble many times)
The conversation became two hours because of the fourth part - I was pretty worried of what she was going to do once she leaves my office because she was crying in front of me. I had to keep her for an extensive amount of time, trying to convince her that everyone has difficulty fitting in university at the beginning with real and made-up details about my own experience. After two hours I think I finally calmed her down and convinced her to go home (her mom called her like 10 times in 2 hours asking her to go home) after I accepted her request to hug her.
I am a bit worried at this point. I am worried that she might be attached to me, which I don't want. I am just doing a job and I don't want any odd relationship with a student - especially not with one that is suicidal. I know for a fact that I am not a smooth talker and occasionally I offend other people - but it's far more hurtful if the person is attached to me for whatever reasons - not to mention the tendencies she claimed.
You may argue that I was cold to her and I was at least partially at fault here; but you haven't met her so you don't know how much of a pain it is to talk to her, let alone teaching her.
Anyways, I am debating what I should do at this point. Tomorrow is Monday; I may go out and seek counseling for this.
Sigh...
+ Show Spoiler +Thanks for reading the whole thing. Here's an electronic cookie for you ^^ ![[image loading]](http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_53oMB4-fxXM/SVZZdJntnPI/AAAAAAAAAAM/vXEtrdBFtqI/s1600-R/cookie.gif)
 
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Have you recommended that she seek counseling at school? There's surely a place at the university where she can go get help. Props for being a good listener, but you shouldn't have to go through that; it's not your job, nor your responsibility. It can pretty much only end badly for you.
+ Show Spoiler +Thanks for the cookie 
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Braavos36390 Posts
If you work for the school surely they have some official way to deal with students who talk about suicide. I'd just follow their procedures and try to make it as open and official as possible.
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Does your university offer psychiatric counselling/services?
If she knows that she needs help, then maybe that's the logical next step. You should try to convince her that you won't be able to help her out as much, and that she needs professional counselling.
Tough spot, yeah..
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i was thinking same thing as darkplasmaball - you should definitely refer her to the school's counseling, and talk to the counselors about her. if she is attached to you and making a play on you, you'll know after doing that. it really ISNT your responsibility, and worst-case scenario it could be dangerous to make it so
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Ehh, you might want to report this incident to someone higher up in the university ranks. She obviously needs some help. As far as the conversation I guesse you did the right thing. There was no way you could have send her away immediatly. Good luck
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Ahh man tough situation. I hope everything turns out for the best, good luck :D
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On November 29 2010 07:56 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Have you recommended that she seek counseling at school? There's surely a place at the university where she can go get help. Props for being a good listener, but you shouldn't have to go through that; it's not your job, nor your responsibility. It can pretty much only end badly for you. + Show Spoiler +Thanks for the cookie
I asked if she seeks counseling in school; she does seek help - apparently it didn't help much.
Typically I wouldn't give my own opinion nor say too much, but she was crying and refused to leave (I can't kick her out of my office when she just told me 5 minutes ago she wanted to KILL HERSELF), so I had to fill the awkward silence. But you are right: I think she might be attached to me now and it's already going badly.
Maybe I will resign my position. I need more time to focus on my courses anyways.
The other thing I need to consider is whether or not I should tell the school about her claimed suicidal tendencies. If she asked me to "talk to me in private", I am not sure if I can give away these details to any third parties, such as the school.
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On November 29 2010 08:06 sob3k wrote:
What disorder?
I intentionally left many details vague just in case someone who attends my university can somehow guess who I am referring to by reading this text (there are only so many universities in Canada and she is pretty conspicuous). But I can tell you it's a serious one and she requires medication for it.
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On November 29 2010 08:06 Sufficiency wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 07:56 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Have you recommended that she seek counseling at school? There's surely a place at the university where she can go get help. Props for being a good listener, but you shouldn't have to go through that; it's not your job, nor your responsibility. It can pretty much only end badly for you. + Show Spoiler +Thanks for the cookie I asked if she seeks counseling in school; she does seek help - apparently it didn't help much. Typically I wouldn't give my own opinion nor say too much, but she was crying and refused to leave (I can't kick her out of my office when she just told me 5 minutes ago she wanted to KILL HERSELF), so I had to fill the awkward silence. But you are right: I think she might be attached to me now and it's already going badly. Maybe I will resign my position. I need more time to focus on my courses anyways. The other thing I need to consider is whether or not I should tell the school about her claimed suicidal tendencies. If she asked me to "talk to me in private", I am not sure if I can give away these details to any third parties, such as the school.
Well, good luck 
Hopefully, things work out for you and her.
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Osaka27158 Posts
You really need to contact your supervisor at school and get the girl into the official channels. This will give her better help than you can give her, and also absolve you of responsibility.
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On November 29 2010 08:10 Manifesto7 wrote:
You really need to contact your supervisor at school and get the girl into the official channels. This will give her better help than you can give her, and also absolve you of responsibility.
Yes you are right... I'll see what I can do tomorrow...
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Manifesto7 is exactly right.
Don't let her drag you into some psycho drama.
Be sure to cover your ass, you don't want to get blamed if shit hits the fan.
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United States24753 Posts
Exactly as Manifesto7 said: talk to your direct superior in your position. You should not have to deal with this or bear the responsibility on your shoulders... you are not (I assume, don't mean to sound negative) qualified to deal with this. Do not let her be the reason why you resign your position.
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Damn, you got caught in a bad position... plenty of good advices above, so I don't think I need to repeat. Hope everything works out ok.
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Dude just thinking about this pickle you are in got me hot under the collar. Good luck resolving it, definitely follow Mani's and Micro's lead, they are both teachers I believe?
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Manifesto7 nailed it.
And don't you worry too much, as long as she can cry she'll probably be alright.
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Korea (South)1897 Posts
Agreed on Mani's point as well. But you've done a great job handling her thus far, good job, but only a trained professional should be dealing with someone like that as it is way out of anyone's normal expertise. but the fact she does express this to you, show she is aware, if you continue with your TA job, I'd say, simply try not to be cold rather just smile, but be firm and just let her know to wait for moment etc, but again, in this kind of situation, its hard to simply not give her some special consideration at this point.
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On November 29 2010 10:17 HwangjaeTerran wrote:
Manifesto7 nailed it.
And don't you worry too much, as long as she can cry she'll probably be alright.
First part of your post is fine...
The second part... I've never heard of that saying at all.
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Cookie!
You should definitely talk to supervisor. Also TA = student?
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On November 29 2010 12:03 ReketSomething wrote:
Cookie!
You should definitely talk to supervisor. Also TA = student?
TA = Teaching Assistant (usually a graduate or undergrad student)
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On November 29 2010 12:07 AppleTart wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 12:03 ReketSomething wrote:
Cookie!
You should definitely talk to supervisor. Also TA = student? TA = Teaching Assistant (usually a graduate or undergrad student)
Is TA + another student relationship really bad?
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On November 29 2010 12:17 ReketSomething wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 12:07 AppleTart wrote:On November 29 2010 12:03 ReketSomething wrote:
Cookie!
You should definitely talk to supervisor. Also TA = student? TA = Teaching Assistant (usually a graduate or undergrad student) Is TA + another student relationship really bad?
Usually they don't like it if you are teaching the same class your partner is in because of obvious bias that could arise. Other than that its fine...
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You don't want your ass trapped in a bear trap so inform ppl above you to spread responsibility for what occurs with this girl as you don't want something to happen and you get told you could have done xyz which would have helped.
Things like this is more common then you think and universities have dealt with it countless times i'm sure so they will be able to help quickly.
You don't have to be cold to someone just cos they rub you the wrong way; sure you don't have to go out of your way but at the end of the day you can sit back and know you didn't increase any problems by being curt.
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Counselling services.
This is not your responsibility, and you are absolutely correct in that you do not want to start something with your student (conflict of interest, btw), especially with one who is suicidal.
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On November 29 2010 12:17 ReketSomething wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 12:07 AppleTart wrote:On November 29 2010 12:03 ReketSomething wrote:
Cookie!
You should definitely talk to supervisor. Also TA = student? TA = Teaching Assistant (usually a graduate or undergrad student) Is TA + another student relationship really bad?
It's a conflict of interest. Most professors allow it if you let them know ahead of time, so that, if they feel necessary, they can schedule a substitute TA to grade the student who is involved.
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On November 29 2010 12:17 ReketSomething wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 12:07 AppleTart wrote:On November 29 2010 12:03 ReketSomething wrote:
Cookie!
You should definitely talk to supervisor. Also TA = student? TA = Teaching Assistant (usually a graduate or undergrad student) Is TA + another student relationship really bad?
I don't think it's as loathed upon as a teacher + student relationship in highschool, but it's still conflict of interests.
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On the absolving of your responsibility... really do convey everything you've written so far to your instructor/supervisor and I'd also call someone at the counseling center to let them know your student discussed committing suicide. They should have a file on her and the incident needs to be documented in detail. In cases, compulsory counseling can also be ordered if she is a danger to herself/others. My girlfriend's roommate has some issues, and mentioned suicide in Facebook posts. The suitemates got together and went to the school counselors, who setup weekly meetings with the girl who has since improved.
Thanks for the cookie.
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Definitely not a good idea to get involved. You could get into more trouble than it's worth. You may have gone too far already. If she has some mental instability, she could turn the physical contact into more than it was, or worse, accuse you of something more later if she is not pleased with how you treat her... It all sounds like attempts to gain sympathy and attention... not to be cold myself... but if I were you I would not see her alone any longer and if she comes to you for more attention, send her to her advisor or the school's health center. Gotta protect yourself bro.
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On November 29 2010 13:49 blamous wrote:
Definitely not a good idea to get involved. You could get into more trouble than it's worth. You may have gone too far already. If she has some mental instability, she could turn the physical contact into more than it was, or worse, accuse you of something more later if she is not pleased with how you treat her... It all sounds like attempts to gain sympathy and attention... not to be cold myself... but if I were you I would not see her alone any longer and if she comes to you for more attention, send her to her advisor or the school's health center. Gotta protect yourself bro.
Yea, that's one of my worries.
It happened on Friday late afternoon, though. So there is really nothing I can do right now until Mnoday...
I wouldn't be worried about her accusing me of anything. Given her conditions, my words will always win against hers. But it is still desirable for me to lay it on the table before anything bad happens.
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Don't worry too much about this. Some girls tend to throw around the word 'suicide' like it's nothing, I've personally heard it at least a dozen times and nothing ever happens. I'm not gonna lie first time I encountered this dumbass behavior I got really worried and reacted like you did, but after a few times (different girls) I became completely desensitized. Most important thing is KEEP IT PROFESSIONAL! No more two hour talks. Seriously. I would refuse any private time. Always keep a chaperone in the room or keep the door wide open etc.
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On November 29 2010 17:57 Zim23 wrote:
Don't worry too much about this. Some girls tend to throw around the word 'suicide' like it's nothing, I've personally heard it at least a dozen times and nothing ever happens. I'm not gonna lie first time I encountered this dumbass behavior I got really worried and reacted like you did, but after a few times (different girls) I became completely desensitized. Most important thing is KEEP IT PROFESSIONAL! No more two hour talks. Seriously. I would refuse any private time. Always keep a chaperone in the room or keep the door wide open etc.
Yes, I think from now on all conversations will be made with open door.
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Well, I talked to some relevant individuals. It seemed to me that they dealt with her many times on this issue already. They gave me some suggestions, took a log of what happened based on my description, told me they'd follow up on her, and gave me a bunch of numbers to call in case something like that happens again.
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I am bumping this.
Today she asked me if we could talk. I told her I was busy, then she told me she wanted to kill herself again.
Luckily, this time I came prepared! It was about 6pm, so I took her to the campus police. An officer took her in, and took my statement (for like 5 minutes).
Maybe she was just trying to get my attention (in a disturbing way)... sigh. On the other hand I have no choice but to take her seriously. O well....
At least she didn't ask me to hug her again.
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EPT
