|
Few weeks ago a certain person told me that I could reach D+ in 3 months and offered me something if I reach C+ in 2 months. I am currently only ~1500 D. I would like to prove that I can reach deccent rank in only 2 months so I would like to hear tips for fast improvement and also your experience from iccup (how easy is it to go from D+ -> C- compared to C -> C+). We talked about it today and the challenge probably begins somewhere in January ( if next season ends on 1st March then I probably have to start on 1st January).
PS! I am a zerg.
EDIT: I meant 1500 D iccup rank not some sc2 diamond crap.
EDIT2: http://www.iccup.com/starcraft/gamingprofile/alkhz.html
My iccup link. Was ~1500 before I thought that I will improve faster when playing at least D+ players only. Don't have any other smurf accounts so this is my entire bw experience.
Please don't spam C+ is impossible unless x,y or z. Challenge wasn't meant to be piece of cake and it's much more interesting for me to have a really hard time achieving it. I am just looking for tips that aren't in liquipedia or useful bw zerg strategy links (again stuff that isn't in liquipedia). Would like to thank everyone who gave some advice so far!
PS! Does anyone know around what time next season will begin? I'll probably start playing iccup 2 months before the end of next season.
|
It takes most people years to even reach C-. Of course I don't know anything about your gaming/RTS background, but If you have no RTS background and you are not some underaged german kid, you will reach C+ in 2012-13.
Tips for fast improvement are clever use of the search function on this site and the ability to type in liquipedia.net in your browser.
|
Here's a tip. Don't try to go from D to C+ without first reaching C-. Your success to reaching C+ will be progressive, meaning it takes steps. You can't just go from point A to point B. Make a realistic plan to achieving your desired results. Focus right now at getting to D+, then C-, and so on.
Its a lot easier to reach C- than it is to go from C- to C+. Ranks get exponentially harder as you go.
|
On November 08 2010 03:03 Crawler wrote:
Few weeks ago a certain person told me that I could reach D+ in 3 months and offered me something if I reach C+ in 2 months. I am currently only ~1500 D. I would like to prove that I can reach deccent rank in only 2 months so I would like to hear tips for fast improvement and also your experience from iccup (how easy is it to go from D+ -> C- compared to C -> C+). We talked about it today and the challenge probably begins somewhere in January ( if next season ends on 1st March then I probably have to start on 1st January).
PS! I am a zerg.
i am only c-, but here are some tips people told me that separates c- from c/c+
-better macro - this I feel is an instinct thing, cuz it's kind of thing you have to just do without thinking.... like once you have your army fighting and set up in a battle, you should just automatically go to ur base or macro hotkeys and spam units.
-constant worker production --> not only producing them, but sending them to work immediately as they come out.... having idle workers is like having 50 minerals wasted for nothing.
-supplies -> never forget supplies. someone put it to me this way on not underestimating the effect of getting supply blocked: forgetting a supply sets you behind by however many seconds it takes to build an overlord... lets just say it's 20 seconds.... 20 fucking seconds? you can't afford to waste that kind of time.
-solidness of build orders: get really good with a couple build orders, so you can execute them without a problem almost unconsciously, and also so that you know enemy timings relative to yours. For example, as a terran, i know that if i siege expand and am not able to scout my opponent and thus have to prepare for the worst (proxy dts), i know i can get a turret up in time if i build my ebay after my first tank, before starting siege mode. know those kinds of things so you can't get ur ass cheesed cuz thats a stupid way to lose.
-which leads to my next point - know how to fight off cheese.
-better harass - this piece of advice i got from a B+ korean. this may apply more to terran, but he said c-/c barely use vulture harass in tvp, but c+/b- it becomes a lot more noticable. i guess regardless of race, this goes to the point that you have to be able to do more at the same time while keeping up macro - harass is not worth it if your macro will take a big hit for it.
|
Only D+, so I won't give overarching words of advice. I will however say this:
1500 Diamond means basically nothing in BW. The two games are pretty different with one another, and BW is much harder to manage things than in SC2.
Unlike in SC2, sticking to solid build orders and refined timings will be the key to success because these things have been solidified for years compared with SC2's gradually evolving timings and build orders.
I would recommend you to 4pool your way to C+....but meh.
|
~1500 D not 1500 diamond :D I am talking about my iccup points not sc2. Challenge is to get from D to C+ not from E to C+
|
On November 08 2010 03:29 Crawler wrote:
~1500 D not 1500 diamond :D I am talking about my iccup points not sc2. Challenge is to get from D to C+ not from E to C+
lol
Sorry that's my bad then. I'm so used to all these SC2 posts that I just sort of assumed every time I see numbers if the 1000s.
But yeah. If that's the case.....urgh....1500 to 4000 (which is C rank) is a pretty daunting task. Once again, solid build orders and timings are important. Against Terrans, it's important to get things like the 3hatch and 2hatch timings down. Against Protoss, it's that 5 hatch hydra stuff.
To get to C/C+, I'm not sure what advice to give you.
If you want, I'm a D/D+ Terran if you need a practice partner every once in a while, though I rarely ever get to follow through. >.>
|
+ Show Spoiler +On November 08 2010 03:17 OMin wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2010 03:03 Crawler wrote:
Few weeks ago a certain person told me that I could reach D+ in 3 months and offered me something if I reach C+ in 2 months. I am currently only ~1500 D. I would like to prove that I can reach deccent rank in only 2 months so I would like to hear tips for fast improvement and also your experience from iccup (how easy is it to go from D+ -> C- compared to C -> C+). We talked about it today and the challenge probably begins somewhere in January ( if next season ends on 1st March then I probably have to start on 1st January).
PS! I am a zerg. i am only c-, but here are some tips people told me that separates c- from c/c+ -better macro - this I feel is an instinct thing, cuz it's kind of thing you have to just do without thinking.... like once you have your army fighting and set up in a battle, you should just automatically go to ur base or macro hotkeys and spam units. -constant worker production --> not only producing them, but sending them to work immediately as they come out.... having idle workers is like having 50 minerals wasted for nothing. -supplies -> never forget supplies. someone put it to me this way on not underestimating the effect of getting supply blocked: forgetting a supply sets you behind by however many seconds it takes to build an overlord... lets just say it's 20 seconds.... 20 fucking seconds? you can't afford to waste that kind of time. -solidness of build orders: get really good with a couple build orders, so you can execute them without a problem almost unconsciously, and also so that you know enemy timings relative to yours. For example, as a terran, i know that if i siege expand and am not able to scout my opponent and thus have to prepare for the worst (proxy dts), i know i can get a turret up in time if i build my ebay after my first tank, before starting siege mode. know those kinds of things so you can't get ur ass cheesed cuz thats a stupid way to lose. -which leads to my next point - know how to fight off cheese. -better harass - this piece of advice i got from a B+ korean. this may apply more to terran, but he said c-/c barely use vulture harass in tvp, but c+/b- it becomes a lot more noticable. i guess regardless of race, this goes to the point that you have to be able to do more at the same time while keeping up macro - harass is not worth it if your macro will take a big hit for it.
Thanks for these tips, as a terran player how many builds do you have against each race? I know that practicing only 1 opener into same build just won't work in long run when I have to react to opponent's build. Can't really perfect 10 different builds against each race in 2 months so I probably have to improve strats with highest chance of beating cheese and common builds.
On November 08 2010 03:35 Zergneedsfood wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2010 03:29 Crawler wrote:
~1500 D not 1500 diamond :D I am talking about my iccup points not sc2. Challenge is to get from D to C+ not from E to C+ + Show Spoiler +
lol
Sorry that's my bad then. I'm so used to all these SC2 posts that I just sort of assumed every time I see numbers if the 1000s.
But yeah. If that's the case.....urgh....1500 to 4000 (which is C rank) is a pretty daunting task. Once again, solid build orders and timings are important. Against Terrans, it's important to get things like the 3hatch and 2hatch timings down. Against Protoss, it's that 5 hatch hydra stuff.
To get to C/C+, I'm not sure what advice to give you.
If you want, I'm a D/D+ Terran if you need a practice partner every once in a while, though I rarely ever get to follow through. >.>
If I accept the challenge in January then I might give you a pm! 
|
|
|
To reach C- you need A solid build order and somewhat of a decent macro.
from C- to C+ tou need solid decision making and solid macro and a lot of build and how to adapt to what you see.
Basicly this
|
Haha thanks! Although doing all this at the same time will require insane apm. Saved the link.
|
One of the most helpful things I was told a long time back (in PGT) was that D+ was the hardest rank to get. I guess that isn't quite true when you think of the leap between A and A+, but it the lower ends it really is harder to get from D to D+ than it is C- to C for example. Goodluck.
|
When you say 1500 D, do you mean that is your current true skill, or that you have just started laddering this season and have reached that point so far? If the former, I'd say there is no way you're going to make it to C+ in 2 months without doing something cheesey and maybe only playing a certain match on a certain map where your cheese is favored. I wouldn't say I'm all that good, but I went from D to C- in 2 or 3 iccup season of infrequent play, and then managed C after another season or 2. This is all without real practice (i.e. concentrating on a specific set of build orders or watching pro/my own replays to get relative timings memorized), but I still found it difficult to advance at that pace.
The biggest thing that will get you into D+ has got to be macro; just constant worker production for the first several minutes and then always keeping your production facilities active. You'll win plenty of games against people with more game knowledge by just having more units than them. Beyond that you will need some basic ideas about builds (not specific what food to build what techs, but sort of broad picture ideas) and what maps they are strong on to progress.
For zerg specifically, your apm does need to be decent. People argue about how important apm is, and certainly it doesn't make one a good player, but it does set your potential for how much you can do. Zerg play often requires you carefully micro a single group of units, but it will require massive army control just as often. In addition to solid macro, these are just skills that come with practice. A much less obvious skill is drone timing. Zerg is capable of exponential growth, but you have to know when it is safe to really power drones.
I decided to try zerg this last season and managed to scrape my way into C-, but I lost several games in which it felt like I had a significant advantage, because I just did not have the drones to remake my army once it eventually died.
|
Sorry, but unless you play like 24/7 it's near impossible to reach C+ in 2 months. C+ is definitely above average though, I wouldn't classify it as "decent". I would recommend taking a look at Day[9]s podcasts and earlier BW dailies for some really good tips and suggestions.
|
Only D+, so I won't give overarching words of advice. I will however say this:
1500 Diamond means basically nothing in BW. The two games are pretty different with one another, and BW is much harder to manage things than in SC2.
Unlike in SC2, sticking to solid build orders and refined timings will be the key to success because these things have been solidified for years compared with SC2's gradually evolving timings and build orders.
I would recommend you to 4pool your way to C+....but meh.
Have you ever played SC2? I do not think so because there is no such thing as C+ in that. What would C stand for? Chromium? Please do not denounce a game that you have never played.
|
I'm a protoss player, but I'm willing to help if you're strongly dedicated to this. I'm always willing to help players, but literally every single one of them except 1 or 2 have quit on me within one or two days. Here's my main reference account:
http://www.iccup.com/starcraft/gamingprofile/Mallow[x].html
Send me a pm if interested. I ask that you take it seriously if so.
EDIT: you'll have to copy paste the link since it won't take brackets for some reason
|
On November 08 2010 04:28 aztrorisk wrote:Show nested quote +Only D+, so I won't give overarching words of advice. I will however say this:
1500 Diamond means basically nothing in BW. The two games are pretty different with one another, and BW is much harder to manage things than in SC2.
Unlike in SC2, sticking to solid build orders and refined timings will be the key to success because these things have been solidified for years compared with SC2's gradually evolving timings and build orders.
I would recommend you to 4pool your way to C+....but meh. Have you ever played SC2? I do not think so because there is no such thing as C+ in that. What would C stand for? Chromium? Please do not denounce a game that you have never played.
You didn't read my post did you? >.>
1st. Yes. I have played SC2. 2nd. No. I wasn't referring to C+ in SC2's ladder. I was referring to reaching C+ in ICCup's ladder. I know that C+ doesn't exist in SC2.
3rd. I wasn't even denouncing the game. All I said was: SC2 and BW are different. BW is harder to manage than SC2. SC2 is still evolving so their build orders and timings don't exist. None of those even remotely touch on "denouncing" the game. >.>
*ahem* Please do not denounce a post that you have never read. 
And I agree with Grobyc. Day[9]'s podcasts and earlier dailies (emphasis on the dailies) are really good for any aspiring player.
|
Its impossible to go from D to C+ in two months. With daily practice c- is do-able
|
All I can say is good luck. I played infrequently on iccup for 3-4 seasons and everytime I managed to reach C-, I got stomped back down to D+. But maybe you can do it:D
|
Getting down 1 solid build order is the thing that will take you all the way to C+.
You can be gimmicky and reach C-, but if you want to go further learn 1 BO for every MU. Only do that BO whenever you play. When you get decent at that you will sky rocket through the ranks.
But the most important thing is to play regularly and at a daily basis. Then you wont forget the diffrent timings you can attack, but more importantly the timing\rush attacks the P and T will do to you.
3 hat muta zvt (2 hat muta also works)
3 hat - 5 hat hydra (I guess?) zvp
12 pool\9pool\12 hat zvz
|
I recommend what Neivler said. All I say though, is watch out when you use 2hatch; in fact I recommend just sticking with 3hatch.
The reason is because 2hatch is reliant on you having good muta micro against T because you sacrifice economy for faster mutas.
3hatch gives you more mutas, more economy, and a better transition into a 3rd and into hive. The only drawback is there's a timing window for a sunken break...but meh. Even though I see Koreans doing 2hatch a lot, I think 3hatch should be your standard.
|
who was this "certain" person ? and what did he offered exactly..
|
10387 Posts
It's quite possible that you could cheese your way into C+ lol
|
+ Show Spoiler +On November 08 2010 08:26 ArvickHero wrote:
It's quite possible that you could cheese your way into C+ lol
Deal was that I don't cheese
+ Show Spoiler +On November 08 2010 08:15 Mikami_ wrote:
who was this "certain" person ? and what did he offered exactly..
: ((( Might've been you
|
if you are a true D+ rank player, it's going to be near impossible getting c+. I was C+ the previous season but I'm finding it hard myself to even get C+ now. I guess it's possible if you eat sleep and dream sc, but it's going to be extremely difficult. Good luck! Take up Mallow[x]'s coaching if you want to improve. 
|
You're not going to reach C+ in 2 months. Unless you are coached by expert staff and practice with the perfect practice partners that teach you what you need to learn you're not going to come anywhere close. Fortunately, D+ is a lot more doable.
I play zerg and it took me a year to make D+. In that time I played around 500 iccup games (most of them in the summer since I have a pretty busy school schedule). There are a bunch of things you need to learn to gain competence as zerg and move up (think of it like trying to eat a whole watermelon in one sitting):
1). Understand the flow of each matchup (the general game plan seen in replays and pro casts)
2). Learn the strategy behind your build order of choice (the 'why do i build this, not the 'what do i build and when')
3). Stick to simple, very standard and safe builds (3 hatch muta zvt, 3 base spire into 5 hatch hydra zvp, and 12 pool zvz)
4). Practice a lot. A whole lot. This should go without saying. Don't worry so much about rank; the better your opponent the more you improve. The more you practice the more diverse strategies you see (the more you improve!).
5). Focus primarily on macro. Zerg is THE macro race and it's most important to get this down!
6). Practice Muta harass in a micro map (using hold position).
7). Realize that at D-level ZvZ is practically a build-order coin flip. There are advantages and disadvantages with strategic timing windows between, say, a 9pool and an overpool, but D players lack the mechanics AND understanding to pull it off.
8). Work on developing mechanics. You should be practicing so much that, over time, you get a feel for when you should do a round of unit production so you don't accumulate more than 3 larva, or knowing to build an overlord without seeing your supply count (or knowing your supply count early in the build without looking). Before long you can muta micro while setting up your third base, burrow lurkers/cast swarm/consume lings/attack a terran army while macroing, and remembering to keep up with upgrades. It's a lot to balance and you WILL mess it up on a consistent basis. This leads to...
9). Improve one aspect of your game at a time
10). Focus on one matchup at a time. I'd usually spend 3-4 weeks on one matchup and then switch, but since you only have 8 weeks make it one week/matchup with 5-10 games a day (or whatever time allows).
11). A bunch more stuff I probably forgot but others will mention.
Time is the biggest factor in measuring your improvement. I'd always get down on myself for continuously messing up my timings. Funny thing - I wouldn't play for months on end and when I came back, after about ten games of practice, I was a ton better!
Also keep in mind that since SC2 came out a lot of people loyal to BW stick with the game. This means there are a lot less lower level riff raff and a lot more talented and experienced players you will likely encounter. This is good in the grand scheme of improvement, but it sucks at the same time since the learning curve for you is a LOT steeper than for others who started a couple years ago.
|
On November 08 2010 03:38 Mortician wrote:
To reach C- you need A solid build order and somewhat of a decent macro.
from C- to C+ tou need solid decision making and solid macro and a lot of build and how to adapt to what you see.
Basicly this
You really give C ranks too much credit. Meanwhile proclamations that progamer X has poor decision making or "can't adapt" litter the live report threads.
|
On November 08 2010 16:00 Metal[x] wrote:if you are a true D+ rank player, it's going to be near impossible getting c+. I was C+ the previous season but I'm finding it hard myself to even get C+ now. I guess it's possible if you eat sleep and dream sc, but it's going to be extremely difficult. Good luck! Take up Mallow[x]'s coaching if you want to improve.
Not even true D+ rank player sadly 
|
Can't tell you how to get to C+, but I can give you advice on how to get to C- since I (almost) got there (literally 50 points away! arggggggh)
Learn ZvP well. I stopped playing bw around the time people really started leaving for sc2 beta, and the very much predominant race left was toss. I'd assume it is same, unless people have started filtering back, that the majority of the games you play will be against toss. In that sense it's a lot easier to go climb ranks as zerg than the other races. Start with 3 hatch spire into 5 hatch hydra, as it is a very good fundamental build. From there you can expand on that basis to stuff like 3 hatch muta to punish a corsair-light build, and lurker contains kill like stuff +1 speedlot timings. Also you'll get a surprising number of free wins once you learn how to play 12 hatch vs. non-proxy (10/12) 2gate.
Secondly, don't laze about getting muta micro. Download the micro maps, practice the hell out of them. At D/D+ level, all you need to know in zvz (other than lair/expansion timing, obviously) is ling positioning (get the better concave!) and muta vs. scourge micro. A lot of low level zergs hate zvz, so being confident in your ability to control your mutas (esp. against scourge) gives you a big advantage.
Lastly, once you get a bit higher up, a lot of the terrans will go standard every game, i.e. 1 rax cc, so you can try to have some fun with 3 hatch before pool. Additionally, it'll also help your bunker rush deny micro, which isn't a bad thing to have.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
