|
Don't give up, I know what you're going through. There's a blog on TL where Ret talks about his view on TvZ and according to him, it's "a race to get as many units as possible". I think he's right about that. People always talk about how important micro is, but let me tell you that having good macro is so much more important.
I suggest that you mostly ignore micro for now and focus on a) executing your BO perfectly and b) macro a lot better. I recommend you don't micro at all apart from Stimpacks, sieging Siege Tanks and very crudely spreading your MnM. This can be done within 5 seconds. As soon as you've set your army up, you go back to your base and macro. On your level, this is going to work out until you get better and faster.
Hell, I've played countless games where I would suicide my first timing push out of pure stupidity but still ended up winning after a few minutes more, because of my macro.
|
Yes, TvZ is RIDICULOUSLY hard. On the flip-end I find ZvT to be extremely easy. There's absolutely no way you can lose to early aggression, just put a ling outside the terran's base and make sunkens depending on his army size. While defense against 3-hat lurker requires perfect micro all the way from the zerg's natural to your own, and if you mess up once and lose only a couple of marines, the rest of it is going to get ran over so fast.
Then again it's better than PvZ rock-paper-scissors, rather lose because even though I played better than the zerg I got overran, than losing due to sheer luck.
|
Valhalla18444 Posts
On August 29 2009 14:12 Loser777 wrote:
Thanks for all of the suggestions on cheese -that was how I got to D+ in the first place... then started only playing Zs on Iccup and forcing myself to use Han Bang 3 Vessel 1 Tank build and I'm back at D. (Why I made this thread)
TvZ is getting me addicted to this game at a time when I really can't afford to be.
LOL dude that build is 3 tanks 1 vessel not 3 vessels 1 tank
|
On August 29 2009 17:57 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2009 14:12 Loser777 wrote:
Thanks for all of the suggestions on cheese -that was how I got to D+ in the first place... then started only playing Zs on Iccup and forcing myself to use Han Bang 3 Vessel 1 Tank build and I'm back at D. (Why I made this thread)
TvZ is getting me addicted to this game at a time when I really can't afford to be. LOL dude that build is 3 tanks 1 vessel not 3 vessels 1 tank
This just might boost him above that D barrier :p
|
Personally I find TvZ (bionic) awesome -- you don't really need to think, lol. Just enjoy SC look and feel while turning your brain completely off (it's TvZ, remember?) and slowly master macro mode. It's not even about winning or losing.
|
Seriously OP you should PM me or /f add nrg.bamboo on iccup I can help you TvZ. I can rebuild you. Plus I could use the practice vs anyone at any level, just need to repeat my builds over and over until I'm good again.. just came back a few days ago.
pretty drunk k bye starcraftuuing
|
the OP's story sounds like my story :D back when i was like D D+ , TvZ was my worse MU. Losing countless games just because i didnt pay enough attention to my army, got run over and over again by a simple lurker build, shitty micro ,shitty macro, no idea about multitasking >_<...
Thx SC god i didnt give up, practiced it like mad and now it's my best MU 
Somehow i dont like mech build though -.- Probably I'm abit bias but i said so because most of my fundamental skills came from using bio in TvZ and i learnt them under intensive pressure in order to win games. TvZ is a true struggle for low-level terran. Hate it when many new terran players tend to choose mech coz it's easier, it has surprise element (not anymore yeah? :D )and so that they can get away with it.
|
On August 29 2009 17:57 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2009 14:12 Loser777 wrote:
Thanks for all of the suggestions on cheese -that was how I got to D+ in the first place... then started only playing Zs on Iccup and forcing myself to use Han Bang 3 Vessel 1 Tank build and I'm back at D. (Why I made this thread)
TvZ is getting me addicted to this game at a time when I really can't afford to be. LOL dude that build is 3 tanks 1 vessel not 3 vessels 1 tank
Unfortunately that's only a typo.
Sigh............................
not every problem has a magical fix.
|
go bbs or 10/12 and timing rush. works for me :D
abuse greedy zerg
|
200 apm is even quite low for high level TvZ for sure. There's just so much micro and actions involved in this matchup for Terran, that I would say you need at least around 250 to be good. I'm not talking about queueing 4 marines in each barrack here.
but yeah it's definately Terrans most APM-heavy matchup, because of the fact that you often use five hotkeys for your army, and your m&m are vulnerable and need microing all the time. Then BOOM back to base and click "m" for 10 barracks in 2 seconds, then "t" and "v" then back to the battle that's going on, micro etc
|
^ hahaha, 250 APM for good TvZ. I have 200-250 at the D+ level, and it's not enough AT ALL. I'd say 5-600 is a requirement to even barely match a 300 apm zerg. Impossible matchup, just play PvZ.
|
200 APM not enough? ROFLMAO, pro replays from gosugamers start with like 250 APM for terrans in TvZ. If you have 200 and stuck at d ranks you probably do tons of unnecessary spamming.
|
On August 29 2009 23:04 1984 wrote:
200 APM not enough? ROFLMAO, pro replays from gosugamers start with like 250 APM for terrans in TvZ. If you have 200 and stuck at d ranks you probably do tons of unnecessary spamming.
only the very slowest pro t's have 250 in any matchup, much less tvz
|
On August 29 2009 23:07 IdrA wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2009 23:04 1984 wrote:
200 APM not enough? ROFLMAO, pro replays from gosugamers start with like 250 APM for terrans in TvZ. If you have 200 and stuck at d ranks you probably do tons of unnecessary spamming. only the very slowest pro t's have 250 in any matchup, much less tvz
aka Tossgirl.
|
I've probably misused the word "pro" -- I don't even mean progamers with licenses, just top foreigners and mediocre koreans who from time to time appear on sites like gosugamers. The point is they are all WAY better than D ranks, the gap is tremendous. And some of them easily get away with 250 APM in TvZ. Personally I got C- as terran with completely standard play and like 130 APM.
|
man i was in the same boat a while back
i then started meching every game and got to D+ but realized that the builds weren't alltogether that solid (i would get run over by 2hatch muta into mass muta a lot and i felt like mech at very low levels is easy, but only becomes a solid viable build at much higher levels)
so i tried for a while to go the other way and not use tanks and go mnm + vessel and while its a situational strategy doing it every game for a while really improved my mnm vessel micro and my overall gamesense...then i started to work tanks back into my build.
i still have trouble executing the 3tank 1vessel timing (i always feel too weak at all the wrong times, esp right when mutas pop) so i've been going with an oov style 2rax expand (which works decently at D/D+ where i play at least, i know its not a optimized modern build) and the ability to apply early pressure (and the fact that some zergs respond with lurker builds that i think are weaker than muta) has really helped me out.
|
On August 29 2009 13:54 Kenpachi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2009 12:39 synapse wrote:
ZvT is like 50 times harder than TvZ. <300 APM means all of your attacks fail miserably -,- On D level, you 9pool terran 100% and you win.
I've never won by going 9 pool against terrans and Im a D level player :/.
|
Playing Zerg is harder in this match up. Man up.
|
United States17042 Posts
tvz is just hard all around. I think that it's probably slightly easier for T, but it's still not that easy.
And mech is the easy way out ^^
|
On August 29 2009 19:05 Loser777 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2009 17:57 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On August 29 2009 14:12 Loser777 wrote:
Thanks for all of the suggestions on cheese -that was how I got to D+ in the first place... then started only playing Zs on Iccup and forcing myself to use Han Bang 3 Vessel 1 Tank build and I'm back at D. (Why I made this thread)
TvZ is getting me addicted to this game at a time when I really can't afford to be. LOL dude that build is 3 tanks 1 vessel not 3 vessels 1 tank Unfortunately that's only a typo. Sigh............................ not every problem has a magical fix.
But how could you not see something fundamentally wrong with rushing 3 vessels and having only one tank for a han bang attack?
Improving a general understanding of the game is very important along with all the macro micro stuffs.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
