EPTUS Politics Feedback Thread - Page 272
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Sermokala
United States13956 Posts
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28674 Posts
On January 03 2020 21:46 Sermokala wrote: Thats not the issue. The drone strike thing is literally a strawman as I don't know anyone who was saying how great drone strikes were. Xxio is literally talking about multiple types of violence (as you can see the commas if nothing else) and even if it is about a particular type of people that still is consistent about it being people. It's not a strawman, GH asked Xxio how he felt about the following statements: 1. "I think it's justified to bomb X (country) even if that means some innocent children will die" 2. "I think it's justified if Andy Ngo got beat up" Xxio said that he felt #1 was acceptable and that #2 was not (and gave some context for why). My personal opinion is that support of #1 is several magnitudes worse than support of #2 (I'm not a fan of either). Stuff like this is why 'catchphrase moderation' (political equivalent of 'no balance whining') doesn't work for this thread, the issues we debate are more complex and nuanced and thus require a contextual (and thus arbitrary) way of dealing with it. Saying 'support of violence gets you banned' either bans virtually every poster from the thread, or requires adherence to a personal definition of violence that excludes a lot of violence (state sanctioned, for one) from the equation. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
On January 03 2020 08:27 Xxio wrote:Threatening civil war is also bad. People who support Trump no matter what are like zombies. I don't think many are white nationalists. I take physical action more seriously, like the Charlottesville attack and this list of radical left activities. I'm sure there are many on the right too. I made this list because for some reason people here like to pretend antifa and the radical left is good. The link to authoritarianism is obvious. I'm not going to write an essay.
This is deeply inappropriate. It is announced in a smug way ("at your peril"). Whether you acknowledge it or not, being a moderator gives you special status, witness Seeker and the John McCain discussion, where it was not clear whether it was his personal opinion or moderator opinion. However, this is a clear threat to use mod powers personally to ban and stifle the opinions of people that mod disagrees with. I disagree with Drone all the time, however not once has he directly threatened to use his mod powers to push the discussion of the politics threads in the direction he wants it to, and so I feel safe to argue against him. With xxio that is not the case. | ||
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12204 Posts
On January 03 2020 22:07 Liquid`Drone wrote: It's not a strawman, GH asked Xxio how he felt about the following statements: 1. "I think it's justified to bomb X (country) even if that means some innocent children will die" 2. "I think it's justified if Andy Ngo got beat up" Xxio said that he felt #1 was acceptable and that #2 was not (and gave some context for why). My personal opinion is that support of #1 is several magnitudes worse than support of #2 (I'm not a fan of either). Stuff like this is why 'catchphrase moderation' (political equivalent of 'no balance whining') doesn't work for this thread, the issues we debate are more complex and nuanced and thus require a contextual (and thus arbitrary) way of dealing with it. Saying 'support of violence gets you banned' either bans virtually every poster from the thread, or requires adherence to a personal definition of violence that excludes a lot of violence (state sanctioned, for one) from the equation. Olly Thorn from PhilosophyTube argues in his series on liberalism that one of the main purposes of political ideology is to define the acceptable targets of violence. I like this take a lot. To my knowledge there is no political ideology that doesn't include support for a form of violence, it's just that once you have accepted it as part of your ideology, it doesn't register as violence anymore. Violence is what other people do in support of other goals. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23250 Posts
On January 18 2020 02:15 Wombat_NI wrote: People interject to head off the tiresome GH vs the same couple of posters shade-throwing sessions that derail this thread with regularity. Well, can’t speak for anyone other than myself, as well as GH (because the left posters are his fan club obviously). Do people want to discuss politics or not? For fuck’s sake. I think I've been doing better at ignoring the nonsense and not getting sucked into endless back and forths with JimmiC in particular but constantly seeing "GH thinks.. GH says... GH ____" get's a little old after a while. Especially when it's not even what I actually think, like "capitalist class are evil bogeyman" or whatever. I know Seeker thinks this is because I'm a bad person and JimmiC is good, but I'd hope there's others among us that see it differently. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37025 Posts
On January 18 2020 02:30 GreenHorizons wrote: Figure I'd put this response where it belongs. I think I've been doing better at ignoring the nonsense and not getting sucked into endless back and forths with JimmiC in particular but constantly seeing "GH thinks.. GH says... GH ____" get's a little old after a while. Especially when it's not even what I actually think, like "capitalist class are evil bogeyman" or whatever. I know Seeker thinks this is because I'm a bad person and JimmiC is good, but I'd hope there's others among us that see it differently. Yay! Childish victim mentality strikes again! Never change, GH. | ||
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12204 Posts
On January 18 2020 04:20 Seeker wrote: Yay! Childish victim mentality strikes again! Never change, GH. GH: "Yup, but on the scale, with the carelessness, and single-minded focus on profit you'd expect from the US as opposed to smaller social democratic nations." JimmiC describing this post: "It is simply not true that everyone who runs a business or a farm, or works at them, or manages them has a single-minded focus on profit in the US. Almost everyone has multiple focuses." Me: "I don't see the connexion between the content of the sentence quoted and the accusation made toward it. So I was hoping that I could be shown where the propaganda is, since I don't see it in the quote." DMCD, having decided that this makes me mini-GH: "Part and parcel. Not mutually exclusive. Nobody answers for me. I don't see why you would doggedly answer for GH. Let GH answer for himself. And you don't need to talk like him either. This capitalism is the root of all evil schtick is getting old. Develop your own way of speech." Love to be a good person. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12204 Posts
Cause I'm not seeing 15 users purposely misrepresenting everything GH says every time he posts so that you can shit on him and encourage the forum to side against him, consciously trying to gaud him into breaking his rule of not answering you and making the thread significantly worse. It's only you doing that. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23250 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12204 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12204 Posts
But you know, whatever. If you were far right or far left you would have been banned eons ago. You can lie about our interactions if that's your kink, it fascinates me that you think any of what you're doing here is worthwhile. I suspect most people don't read your posts when they're adressed at me or GH and that's why you get away with so much shit. I have as little interest in talking to you now as I had recently, but if we're going to talk about people shitting up the forum I must add my voice in there. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12204 Posts
"Yes you and GH hate me and pm about it, very cool and mature." ...you really think the forum revolves around you don't you. That's incredible. I guess we're doing this now: https://ibb.co/BGdGGkD We talked about you once in the "does it feel like progress" part, where I said just about the same thing about your posting that I've told you in our PMs. From what I gather from what I saw here, it looks like you're having a ton of conversations about GH in your PMs though, where your 15 friends tell you that they feel the same you do about him? Could it perhaps be some sort of projection on display here? Why do you keep telling me that I can not engage you if I want to? That's what I've been doing, and that's what I'll continue to do after this. And you know that. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
On January 19 2020 00:37 GreenHorizons wrote: I appreciate Neb speaking up and just hope others express their observations. Sure, why not, since this group generally seems interested in that: 1. GH posts as he usually does - in my eyes, generally outspoken but also quite a frequent poster, who occasionally gets into those less-than-cordial debates with others. Not always a perfect poster, but no one else is, either. Not bad overall. 2. Neb is... kinda sorta in the same boat? I hear him talk about others being generally hostile to him for his outspoken opinions, but I do have a hard time actually seeing it play out that way. 3. "Good person" JimmiC isn't that much different from either of the two above, but clearly has an addiction to baiting GH. He's not bad outside of that, and generally a pretty constructive poster, but it's a pretty annoying habit. 4. Seeker is acting in a way that isn't really very becoming of a moderator. Choosing obvious a priori favorites and consistently making rather petty remarks, such as the one above about GH being childish. It feels like that approach to moderation does breed the same childish attitude in the thread itself, because the way the moderators moderate does define the mood of the rest of the posters. 5. He didn't come in here, but DMCD does do a lot of really questionable characterizations of the positions of others, so I'm mildly confused why those characterizations are taking center stage in this little meta-discussion. | ||
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