[Movie] Interstellar 2014 - Page 3
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Garaman
United States556 Posts
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
On November 19 2014 23:27 SKC wrote: They "lost" 70 years in the wormhole manuever and 20 years in the water planet. The timeline fits a scenario where Amelia had not arriver at the planet for long, if we consider his daughter is around 100 when she dies. I felt the scene of Amelia setting up camp was the Plan B procedure, and it wasn't a flashback, it happened while Cooper was at the station, or at least fairly close to that point in time. In my mind Cooper Station is the first vessel towards the new planet and Cooper takes the ship to arrive there a bit earlier than the rest, while Amelia is alone either still setting things up or in stasis. A lot of it is left quite open, and the fact Cooper's daughter surviving some extra time in an stasis chamber to prolong her lifespan makes it hard to nail down a timeframe, but the main point of the post was still that Amelia went with Plan B because she didn't know Plan A succeded, not because it failed. We really cant pinpoint the timeframe ye. And yes she assumed that she should proceed with Plan B after she saw cooper was gone. But the last scene of Anne felt like she later gets contacted by earth (some time prior cooper's waking up) and cooper simply just flew off (lol at the technician) to find Anne gave me the impression that she is not far from the space station. They have cooper's house etc for exhibition also made me believe that this is not the first ship they are heading to Anne's planet, or this space station now has been serving as a middle stop between earth and the planet (for some time now). | ||
nkr
Sweden5451 Posts
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Belisarius
Australia6178 Posts
If humanity has made it off earth and built a somewhat stable existence through the wormhole, it's kind of absurd that they would not have found Anne themselves. Even if they didn't know she was on Edmund's world, it seems really unlikely that nobody thought to go check out the Lazarus sites in 40+ years of being there. If Anne had been found/contacted, she would not be proceeding with plan B. There's no reason to continue a population bomb if humanity gets off earth, especially if humanity gets off earth and settles on the same planet she's pop-bombing. If they have not found/contacted her, Murphy really shouldn't have any idea that Anne is alive and alone. In particular, there's no way she could expect that Anne survived but that Doyle and Romilly did not. | ||
c0ldfusion
United States8292 Posts
On November 20 2014 06:58 Belisarius wrote: Honestly, it's hard to come up with a series of events in which the Cooper-looking-for-Anne thing works. If humanity has made it off earth and built a somewhat stable existence through the wormhole, it's kind of absurd that they would not have found Anne themselves. Even if they didn't know she was on Edmund's world, it seems really unlikely that nobody thought to go check out the Lazarus sites in 40+ years of being there. If Anne had been found/contacted, she would not be proceeding with plan B. There's no reason to continue a population bomb if humanity gets off earth, especially if humanity gets off earth and settles on the same planet she's pop-bombing. If they have not found/contacted her, Murphy really shouldn't have any idea that Anne is alive and alone. In particular, there's no way she could expect that Anne survived but that Doyle and Romilly did not. 68 years passed for everyone else. Matthew and Anne are both roughly the same age. | ||
kwizach
3658 Posts
On November 19 2014 03:50 Xiphos wrote: I think I know what direction you are getting at and I can offer a better explanation using more concrete science. The film assumes that we are bounded by the 4th dimension in time. That mankind can't control time in 4 dimensions but the 5th dimensional people can. But however on the gravity portion of the film, it was only stated that the 5D people can only communicate w/ the 4D ones w/ gravity because gravity is the constant b/w the realms, not that 5D people can manipulate it. And through the 5th dimensional ability to control time, they were somehow able to go back in time to prevent the dust problems by creating an alternative timeline. It relies on the mechanics that w/ enough time, they could've have solved the hunger problem that is they didn't just abandon Earth and transferred people elsewhere. That means that number 2 still stands. Further details here: + Show Spoiler + It also assumes that w/ Matthew's character telling her daughter the equation to render everything in 5th dimension. But the question arises is how does Matthew's character know the equation by entering into the black hole. That have never been explained. The movie could have been more consistent. In some scene, the characters gives a very grounded explanation on their decisions for the audience to digest. However on other scenes, they didn't nearly explain as much as they should have. If they added Neil Tyson's explanation on the difference b/w 4D and 5D, the movie could have flown a bit better. Or they added some explanation of how the 4D people was able construct a mechanism to arrive at 5D instead of skimming over it, the movie could've have been more believable. As SKC explained, there is only one timeline. McConaughey's character knows the data he sends Murph because his robot recorded it when it also went through the black hole. Cooper directly asks the robot if it has the data, and the robot says it does and begins transmitting it to Cooper, who then translates it into Morse code (or binary, can't remember) into his old watch (thanks to his control of gravity through the tesseract), for Murph to find. I personally don't think this needed any more explaining in the movie - it all felt pretty straightforward and every step was explained thoroughly. So, as I told you earlier, Cooper's journey was absolutely necessary to save mankind, since he transmits the black hole information to Murph, allowing her to solve the equation, allowing mankind to escape hunger/Earth. The time "paradox" in the movie was that the future humans needed Cooper to complete his journey in order to exist, but Cooper needed the future humans' help in order to complete his journey (and even to begin it). That is a paradox when we look at time the way we usually do. | ||
Belisarius
Australia6178 Posts
On November 20 2014 07:54 c0ldfusion wrote: 68 years passed for everyone else. Matthew and Anne are both roughly the same age. ...that has nothing to do with anything in my post. I know they are the same age. | ||
c0ldfusion
United States8292 Posts
On November 20 2014 08:23 Belisarius wrote: ...that has nothing to do with anything in my post. I know they are the same age. What I'm trying to say is that it could be your first scenario, except in the 68 years in between there was nothing on that planet other than Edmund's remains. Anne landed there roughly around the time that Matthew was found. Also, all things considered they probably spent all that time getting humans off earth. | ||
SKC
Brazil18828 Posts
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figq
12519 Posts
On November 20 2014 01:28 nkr wrote: hahahahaincontrol is a good actor, who knew | ||
LilClinkin
Australia667 Posts
I think the film is bloated and overly long and self-indulgent. It could have been cut down to 2 hours running time easily. A lot of the setting is poorly explained and is self-contradictory within the universe that Nolan is trying to present. He tries to build a believable world, however he broke my suspension of disbelief countless times. I don't think the way he played with time as a 4th or 5th dimensional construct was clever...countless films have done it before, they just rarely present it in such an in-your-face manner. The film is constantly trying to justify how smart it is to the audience by explaining itself through unrealistic dialogue, for instance, explaining how a wormhole works (as if a former NASA pilot doesn't already know this) or explaining the significance of the name of the Lazarus project. Having said that, there were some emotionally interesting scenes such as when MM is looking at recordings from his children, but these are ruined by emotionally flat scenes trying to tie back into science such as claiming Love is...well, I'll just avoid spoilers for those who haven't seen it. If you like LOUD NOISES and COOL VISUALS go and watch Cosmos instead. It's also scientifically accurate! | ||
Emnjay808
United States10626 Posts
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riotjune
United States3363 Posts
"No. It's necessary." About the most impactful scene in the entire movie, with some nice dramatic music to go along with it. Way to capture the survival instinct, as in if this wasn't done they will die right here and now. Other than that I took the movie for what it was: Bunch of pseudo-science mixed with nonsensical? explanations like what Inception was. Nice try Nolan, you almost had me convinced! Still, not a bad movie. | ||
rezoacken
Canada2719 Posts
It's certainly not hard sci-fi but it's not space fantasy either or action non sense. I felt the scenario still tried to give a good role to science and honestly as far as SF blockbusters are concerned I cannot help but appreciate the part that is still presented because it's just too rare. There was effort and a clear inspiration from science. The movie is visually really impressive. Nolan has a gift to make stuff look real and blend fake with real. And if you don't try too hard to link what the movie shows to real world physics (or our understanding) the plot is enjoyable even though the ending became a little bit too emotional rather than truly exciting. Maybe I would have appreciated if the plot tried to be a little more down to earth about the search of a new planet and focus on that. The score is good and oh god did it made the scene when they leave the "ice cloud" planet feel epic*. Music may become a bit repetitive though. The child actor doing his daughter I found average but Matthew McConaughey gives a strong performance (please see Dallas Buyers Club if not already). I don't know if it truly deserves a 9 on imdb but I recommend it and may make the BR purchase for that one *Edit On November 22 2014 05:43 riotjune wrote: "This is not possible." "No. It's necessary." About the most impactful scene in the entire movie, with some nice dramatic music to go along with it. Way to capture the survival instinct, as in if this wasn't done they will die right here and now. Yes that was that scene ! Guess I'm not the only one On November 21 2014 13:21 Emnjay808 wrote: Can someone enlighten me what the "equation" Murphy solved was supposed to do? If my memory is correct, being able to send into space and through the wormhole a gigantic spaceship to save currently living humans (basically plan A). | ||
Coppermantis
United States845 Posts
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imJealous
United States1382 Posts
A few lingering thoughts for discussion that I just wanted to get off my chest: - Earlier in the thread someone asked why wouldn't the humans on cooper station have found Anne Hathaway (Burk)? This is because she and Cooper are on the same timeline (the only thing that actually goes 'backwards' in time in the movie is the gravitational anomalies Cooper uses to communicate with his daughter). So in other words, she has probably only been on that planet for a few days just like Cooper was only on Cooper Station for a few days. There probably some off set due to him being in the black hole for a few hours (which takes up years for everyone else) and her flying in cryo sleep for a few years to get to the planet, but the bottom line is that if the Cooper Station humans went looking for her on that planet she wouldn't have been there yet. - People were asking where Cooper Station was. I was pretty sure when they showed Cooper floating in space after the tesserac collapsed, Saturn was in the back ground, along with the lights of the station. My understanding was that he was shot out of the wormhole. - I didn't really have an issue with all of the paradox stuff, black hole science, the tesserac, or any of the pseudo science really, but the big problems that kept annoying me were the logistics of how leaving earth was supposed to resolve a food or air shortage in any way. So say Burk and Cooper go to their new planet that has breathable air and drinkable water with their population bomb to repopulate the species. Ok. So you've solved the genetic diversity problem. How about the food problem? You are on a planet that has air and water but no plants or animals for you to eat. The only source of food you will have is your humans you are growing in those tubes! Furthermore, without those plants and animals to recycle the carbon dioxide you exhale back into oxygen, you are going to run out of air again! This new planet is going to have the exact issues you were facing on earth unless you brought a whole Noah's Ark full of population bombs to rebuild an entire biosphere. And how did humans survive on Cooper Station in any way that would be more beneficial than just staying on Earth? Ok, with Coop's transmission from the black hole, Murph is able to 'solve gravity' and the human race can now build new technologies that allow them to manipulate gravity. This was important because it allows NASA to load up humanity in this giant station and leave earth with them. Ok, so now the human race is able to get away from the blight (which kills the food and air) and we see on the station that they have fields of food growing in conditions that simulate earth. They seem to have built a self sustaining ecosystem within the enclosed environment of the space station that protects them from the dangers of space. So why didn't they just build giant bubbles on earth that shield them from the dangers of the blight and build their self sustaining ecosystem there? Out in space they have no access to new resources that they didn't bring with them. If they built the same kind of enclosed habitat on-planet they would still have access to the Earth's abundant resources. | ||
BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
On November 22 2014 20:24 imJealous wrote: Overall I enjoyed the movie, though it certainly had some silly elements, I think the strongest feature of the movie and what ultimately caused me to leave with a positive feeling despite the issues is the strength of the relationship between Murph and Cooper and how well they show the emotional journey those two characters go through given the unusual course their lives take in the film. A few lingering thoughts for discussion that I just wanted to get off my chest: - Earlier in the thread someone asked why wouldn't the humans on cooper station have found Anne Hathaway (Burk)? This is because she and Cooper are on the same timeline (the only thing that actually goes 'backwards' in time in the movie is the gravitational anomalies Cooper uses to communicate with his daughter). So in other words, she has probably only been on that planet for a few days just like Cooper was only on Cooper Station for a few days. There probably some off set due to him being in the black hole for a few hours (which takes up years for everyone else) and her flying in cryo sleep for a few years to get to the planet, but the bottom line is that if the Cooper Station humans went looking for her on that planet she wouldn't have been there yet. - People were asking where Cooper Station was. I was pretty sure when they showed Cooper floating in space after the tesserac collapsed, Saturn was in the back ground, along with the lights of the station. My understanding was that he was shot out of the wormhole. - I didn't really have an issue with all of the paradox stuff, black hole science, the tesserac, or any of the pseudo science really, but the big problems that kept annoying me were the logistics of how leaving earth was supposed to resolve a food or air shortage in any way. So say Burk and Cooper go to their new planet that has breathable air and drinkable water with their population bomb to repopulate the species. Ok. So you've solved the genetic diversity problem. How about the food problem? You are on a planet that has air and water but no plants or animals for you to eat. The only source of food you will have is your humans you are growing in those tubes! Furthermore, without those plants and animals to recycle the carbon dioxide you exhale back into oxygen, you are going to run out of air again! This new planet is going to have the exact issues you were facing on earth unless you brought a whole Noah's Ark full of population bombs to rebuild an entire biosphere. And how did humans survive on Cooper Station in any way that would be more beneficial than just staying on Earth? Ok, with Coop's transmission from the black hole, Murph is able to 'solve gravity' and the human race can now build new technologies that allow them to manipulate gravity. This was important because it allows NASA to load up humanity in this giant station and leave earth with them. Ok, so now the human race is able to get away from the blight (which kills the food and air) and we see on the station that they have fields of food growing in conditions that simulate earth. They seem to have built a self sustaining ecosystem within the enclosed environment of the space station that protects them from the dangers of space. So why didn't they just build giant bubbles on earth that shield them from the dangers of the blight and build their self sustaining ecosystem there? Out in space they have no access to new resources that they didn't bring with them. If they built the same kind of enclosed habitat on-planet they would still have access to the Earth's abundant resources. you are not calculating in The duration cooper spent in the 5th dimension giving clues on solving the formula is years for earth time, as in many many many years (because the relativity of time, the closer you are near blackhole every minute equals longer earth time), in the movie they spent like 15mins on water planet = 3hours in actual movie time = 22years for the black dude waiting, so cooper spent longer than 15mins in that and plus every minute equals longer time since he is literally in the blackhole (some argument on alot of stuffs but lets keep it simple). Simply put, we dont know how many yearsssssss passed in earth time when cooper giving clues to murph, murph could have already successed to send the space station up right when/before cooper was shoot out from the 5th dimension (again keep in mind it can be minutes = yearsss while cooper was shooting out from blackhole). Hard to type on phone but hope my points are understandable And ya there are alot of conveniences in this film(not much of plot hole just because nolan), shooting out right outside saturn and get rescued before oxygen run out, some extraordinary formula can magically be transmitted through mosse code etc. The plant field in space station/food problem is explanable simply because earth environment is beyond fucked in the film, nothing they can do to grow plants as soon as the environment is within earth atmosphere (not even with whatever bubble shield etc), imagine some super uber plague blight | ||
Belisarius
Australia6178 Posts
The only way for him to get back is to be explicitly placed in time by the 5D dudes when they collapse the tesseract. That could be any time, but it appears to be roughly back in sync with Anne (NB: the character is Dr. Brand, not Burke). Personally, I don't think the movie deserves much criticism for pseudoscience. There's only a handful of things in it which aren't plausible. Compared to any other big-budget sci-fi, it's practically the discovery channel. The ones that made me wince were the whole "solving the gravity equation" rigmarole, and the "We need the quantum data / Did you get the quantum data" thing. Even then, it's really just the phrases. We don't have a theory of quantum gravity yet, so who knows, maybe we could float space stations if we did. I'm sure some measurements close to a black hole would help. The only actual howler I remember was the thing about dropping TARS into the hole so he could see the singularity and tell them what he saw. If you're actually falling into a black hole, there's no "other side". The black bit stays ahead of you, so you should never perceive yourself to reach the horizon. | ||
SKC
Brazil18828 Posts
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NukeD
Croatia1612 Posts
On November 23 2014 23:35 SKC wrote: For me the weirdest thing was how easily they could move in and out of earth-like planets. They used a multi staged rocket to leave earth, similar to today's technology, and then a simple small ranger was enough to leave planets with atmosphere and higher gravity than earth. Yeah this also bugged me a bit. | ||
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