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On November 27 2013 20:24 A_Scarecrow wrote: should you build roach warren earlier if terran goes for fast helions/blueflame all in? If it is on 2 bases I seriously doubt that. I might be wrong though.
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On November 27 2013 20:24 A_Scarecrow wrote: should you build roach warren earlier if terran goes for fast helions/blueflame all in?
No unless they are doing a 1 base all in by the time it hits it will have been after you get the normal roach warren anyway.
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hmm ok I suppose. as of late ive been struggling against early helions from kr diamond players. try and get surrounds and ect but their control is always good enough to get the better engagement. maybe just work on my micro again.
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do you still get a roach warren defensivly ? To be honest i only make it reactionary when spotting hellbats/blueflame or when i want to do a roach bane all in. I feel like a baneling nest can deal with the rest of the agression terran put up with. It's only hard to deal with banshee hellion marine agression. But some extra queens fill the gap untill mutas come out and chase it away.
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On November 27 2013 23:15 THAmarx wrote: do you still get a roach warren defensivly ? To be honest i only make it reactionary when spotting hellbats/blueflame or when i want to do a roach bane all in. I feel like a baneling nest can deal with the rest of the agression terran put up with. It's only hard to deal with banshee hellion marine agression. But some extra queens fill the gap untill mutas come out and chase it away.
Yeah I do get it defensively. Is it a must? No, it all goes down to preference and I just prefer it unless I see my opponent is not doing hellions or something.
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Blade can you pls addj to this guide OL PLACEMENT for this sesons maps? Some photo with marks on them for Ol
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On November 30 2013 05:04 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2013 23:15 THAmarx wrote:+ Show Spoiler + do you still get a roach warren defensivly ? To be honest i only make it reactionary when spotting hellbats/blueflame or when i want to do a roach bane all in. I feel like a baneling nest can deal with the rest of the agression terran put up with. It's only hard to deal with banshee hellion marine agression. But some extra queens fill the gap untill mutas come out and chase it away. Yeah I do get it defensively. Is it a must? No, it all goes down to preference and I just prefer it unless I see my opponent is not doing hellions or something.
me with my big mouth... after i posted this i got hellbat pushed 3 times in a row. Roach warren would been helpfull ^^
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On December 04 2013 19:58 Solanek wrote: Blade can you pls addj to this guide OL PLACEMENT for this sesons maps? Some photo with marks on them for Ol I like this diea. Also, when each OL should be there for 2 player maps
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It does depend a lot on variables.... Do you drone scout? How afraid are you of vikings/phoenix, what do you want the overlord to do, what is the general playstyle of your opponent, locations on the map, opponents opening, opportunity costs of having overlords in scouting position as opposed to defensive, etc.
Furthermore, any kind of dead space on the map OR unaccessible/hard to get vision of high-ground is a suitable location.
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Hey Blade, great guide there. I am a bit lost in ZvZ now (EU mid master) and the match up is holding me back a lot. Which of the styles you mentioned do you think will work out the most in ladder? I just need a style to focus on in order to improve with that and general ZvZ mechanics.
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On December 05 2013 03:12 Karpfen wrote: Hey Blade, great guide there. I am a bit lost in ZvZ now (EU mid master) and the match up is holding me back a lot. Which of the styles you mentioned do you think will work out the most in ladder? I just need a style to focus on in order to improve with that and general ZvZ mechanics.
Right now mutalisks are the most common on the ladder for sure. Most of my zvz's are muta wars.
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hey blade, I am watching a lot of gm streams. I noticed a lot of gm open muta in tvz. They go instead of fast upgrades for a spire and make around 10 mutas. Getting map control over the hellion reaper / sometimes banshee. And then getting upgrades more bases and stuff. Is this a style you would recommend?
edit: when i asked the gm when he would do this he replied, only if they opened reaper.
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On December 11 2013 21:49 THAmarx wrote: hey blade, I am watching a lot of gm streams. I noticed a lot of gm open muta in tvz. They go instead of fast upgrades for a spire and make around 10 mutas. Getting map control over the hellion reaper / sometimes banshee. And then getting upgrades more bases and stuff. Is this a style you would recommend?
edit: when i asked the gm when he would do this he replied, only if they opened reaper.
Um like fast 2 base muta? Opening muta is very common zvt but if it's 2 base muta it can be risky doing it but it can also be very good as well.
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On December 11 2013 22:30 blade55555 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2013 21:49 THAmarx wrote:+ Show Spoiler + hey blade, I am watching a lot of gm streams. I noticed a lot of gm open muta in tvz. They go instead of fast upgrades for a spire and make around 10 mutas. Getting map control over the hellion reaper / sometimes banshee. And then getting upgrades more bases and stuff. Is this a style you would recommend?
edit: when i asked the gm when he would do this he replied, only if they opened reaper. Um like fast 2 base muta? Opening muta is very common zvt but if it's 2 base muta it can be risky doing it but it can also be very good as well.
i would like to do the standard opener version. I like to have mapcontrol vs the reaper hellion and doing some presure forcing them to invest in missleturrets. My only problem is i dont know the optimal timings.
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Standard opener is a 3rd around 6 minutes but you will have to make speedlings to defend against hellion reaper with that. If you want to push back the terran with mutas only you have to stay on 2 base. In any case you should start your lair at 100 gas and add 3 more gases imidiatly, you will have enaugh gas for 10 mutas when the spire finishes. For 2 base muta the earliest lair can start at 5:00 before that you hurt your mineral income too much. It is up to you how greedy you are going to be (skipping ling speed, late spine crawler, no 3rd queen). I personally dont like the risk/reward of 2 base muta but i'm just a low master scrub who likey theorycrafting so feel free to coppy the pros, i have seen scarlett do it and she is very good. If you want to go for the more standard 3 base opener and just skip the upgrades get your lair at 6:30. You will need speedlings to defend the early harass but you will have mutas earlier than most terrans expect it.
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On December 11 2013 23:39 THAmarx wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2013 22:30 blade55555 wrote:On December 11 2013 21:49 THAmarx wrote:+ Show Spoiler + hey blade, I am watching a lot of gm streams. I noticed a lot of gm open muta in tvz. They go instead of fast upgrades for a spire and make around 10 mutas. Getting map control over the hellion reaper / sometimes banshee. And then getting upgrades more bases and stuff. Is this a style you would recommend?
edit: when i asked the gm when he would do this he replied, only if they opened reaper. Um like fast 2 base muta? Opening muta is very common zvt but if it's 2 base muta it can be risky doing it but it can also be very good as well. i would like to do the standard opener version. I like to have mapcontrol vs the reaper hellion and doing some presure forcing them to invest in missleturrets. My only problem is i dont know the optimal timings.
the OP has a standard zvt muta build that I still do today and most zergs do some sort of variation of it.
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ZvT vs reaper into cc. When do I take gas 3,4,5,6? I'm so gas starved always TT
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A really cool guide giving players a solid base to reach the next league. i especially like the gameshow feeling at the end.
Ding Ding Ding the guide is finished - but wait theres more, whats that? a BONUS ALL in vs protoss?? order one solid game plan vs Aiur get one free!
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On December 13 2013 22:07 straycat wrote: ZvT vs reaper into cc. When do I take gas 3,4,5,6? I'm so gas starved always TT
Hm a good timing is when you have 2 bases to start gas 3/4 (or when you start lair), I get my 5th/6th gas as my 3rd is about to be saturated.
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I have a question regarding ZvZ. I actually kinda like the matchup when muta/ling vs muta/ling. But I'm a bit lost currently now that there are a lot more players going for some kind of 2 base roach timing where they get +1/+1 quite early and can push out vs my mutas which won't arrive in time to defend. Is it even possible to defend these timings going muta? Or should I get a roach warren myself once I scout very early double evolution chambers?
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