EPTSeriously who the fuck still plays on python? Ya I know not many people but it still considered the “standard map” a lot of the strategies on python are VERY viable on many other maps with the center plain. And what’s also good about python is that mech sucks on that map. YES bitches…….. I hate mech, so you’ll see NOTHING on this guide that teaches you how to use mech, so folks put a big grin on your face because that mech garbage won’t be here.
Table of content..
- Standard Hive timing push.
- Pressure build to Hive timing push
- 5 Rax before factory (pimp rush)
For each of the scenarios I will be covering how to deal with 2 hatch/3hatch mutas transitioning to hive.
9:30 Timing push
I’m sure you’ve all heard of stylish’s 9min push, I totally think it’s great and all, but I want to share a variation of it. For me in my personal opinion I believe that my build is better and I’ll explain why in just a moment. However I do fully respect other people’s preferences, and I’ve compared both I just personally like mine better… XD
Here is the general build order for my 9:30 hive push.
=====ASSUME 3 HATCH MUTAS====
-9 supply
-11 rax
-12 scout
-15-19 CC (notice how fast you can get your CC, if you scout your opponent on your first try like on 12 vs 9, or 12 vs 3, you can just skip your 2nd depot and use that SCV that finished the barrack to make the CC)
- Based on your scouting, if you see 12 hatch by zerg and he only has 1 larvae by the time his pool finishes you can delay your marine production and go tech faster. However if you see 3 larvae before pool is finished play safe and make marines.
-20-23 Refinary (the faster you got your CC the faster you should get your refinery)
-23-25 Academy/Ebay at the same time.
- After academy and ebay are finished Research +1 attack, and Stim on each.
-After you’ve invested in the money for the Stim and Range, add 2 more Rax to a total of 3 rax whenever money allows.
- Factory should be placed between psi 40-45. And since with limited gas, it should be gotten with the next 100 gas AFTER you’ve researched stim, and Before you research range.
- 40-45 SCANNERS.
-52 TURRETS
-Mutas should come when you have about 1 group of rines and 4 medics in your main, and 1 bunker + 5-7 marines at your nat. When you see the mutas you should also be getting your starport.
-Start tank production
-2nd gas comes at the same time you put down your starport
- After starport is finished add Another ebay and science facility at the same time.
- You should find yourself with some surplus at this point, so add 3 more additional rax to make a total of 6.
-Make a science vessel. By the time the vessel pops you should have 3 tanks, and when the vessel is Half way to complete research siege mode.
-Before you move out make sure you ask him “Where you from?” so he starts typing while you pound on his lurkers with your tanks.
-when you move out add a 2nd starport.
When you move out you should have about 85-100 psi, with 1-1 upgrade done. And the +2 half way to finishing.
Now I’ll show some good rax/turret placements that I use often on the different positions on python.
3 o'clock positioning
![[image loading]](http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/8961/3clockrax.png)
The numbers on the rax means which one i placed down first... Also take notice where my tech is placed, its at a location that mutas can't or have a hard time getting to. Now if i switched the location of my tech/rax, my scv making my starport/facility will always die.
6 o'clock positioning
![[image loading]](http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/8115/6clocktechj.png)
Notice again that the tech is at the bottom of the map again, very hard for mutas to hit.
9 o'clock rax positioning
![[image loading]](http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/3614/9clockrax.png)
rax are positioned neatly, and enough room to add a lot more rax if needed. Also the starport is just above the factory, its not on the screenshot.
9 o clock tech
![[image loading]](http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/4027/9clocktech.png)
12 o'clock positioning
![[image loading]](http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/9561/12clocktechrax.png)
Again pay attention to the tech positioning
Now that you know the basic structure of the 9:30 push, I’d like to explain the concepts of it in detail some more.
You must be able to adjust this build according to your scouting, if you scout him with pool morphing with an extractor it means 2 hatch which in this case you want your 2nd rax faster than usual, and delay your tech a bit, and then eventually transition to the pimp rush (aka 5 rax before fac) Or a more delayed factory, and still do the timing push. I’ll explain more on this later.
So assuming you scouted 3 hatch mutas, the next thing is to make your scouter scv in his base for as long as possible… (NO WAI??). Some people like to just keep their scv in the zergs base for as long as possible but don’t know what to look for. I’ll list a few things to look for
1. Do you see extractor building at the same time pool is building? If so it’s 2 hatch. If you eee the pool is finished and the extractor is still not put down yet, AND you see no 3rd hatch. The 3rd hatch is hidden so go scout the map.
2. How many larvae did he save before his pool is complete? 3 means 6 lings poping, 1 larvae means probably 2 ling, and 2 means 4 lings. If you see 1 larvae, don’t make any marines until his pool is finished, and use that mineral to tech instead.
3. Then you’d want to look to see if he’s going lair, if he’s been mining gas for a while, and you still see no lair, assume 3 hatch all-in lings, so in that case after the scouter dies you’d want to send in a new scouter to look for speedlings. Or perhaps he just thought you were a dumbass and made the lair at his nat under the ramp.
4. If your micro is so magnificent and its STILL alive after the lair is finished, obv you want to see if he puts down spire or Den.
So after your scouter dies, (assuming it died cuz it got killed by the 4 early lings, and you didn’t see spire or den). Go send another SCV out to scout, if you see speedlings, here’s how you respond.
1. Make a bunker, and place 1-2 firebats in it.
2. Hotkey SCVs in your natural and block your ramp and guard your bunker with it
3. Repair your bunker if he ever wants to attack. (If he’s 3 hatch all-in lings he MUST attack or else he is hellas behind).
4. Laugh and call him a noob, but make sure you don’t BM him too much or he’ll report you on iccup admin forums…..
5. If you lose to his all-in lings, /Clearstats YES, and Alt f4.
So if assuming everything goes as planned, no speedlings, after your 1st rax, add Ebay/Academy, and research stim/+1 attack as soon as they are complete. The reason you want to get the +1 attack so fast is because right as the mutas come, after like 10 seconds, your +1 attack will be done, and it’ll help with clearing mutas A LOT. You can’t really pressure with this build due to your low rax count.
Here is the MAJOR difference between mine and stylish’s build. He gets fast 2 rax, and a bit slower tech, but more marines. Mine gets FASTER tech, and lower marine count. I think my build is better because it allows me to deal with mutas easier, even though its like 30seconds slower to get the 1st vessel than stylish’s but nowadays zergs don’t get hive that fast anyways, and you don’t need to push out so fast IF you scan and see no hive morphing. However know that you cannot make a mistake while microing vs mutas with my build due to your small rine count, if you not pay attention and marines pick off all 12 of your rines (you gotta screw up pretty bad for that to happen) you'll be WAY behind.
Turret Timing
I’ve noticed that with my build the standard psi to get turrets is around 52 psi. But I still like to delay it as much as possible by scanning and see his spire progress. A cute trick you can do to get your turrets up at a PERFECT time is by counting.
A spire has 600 health, and when you put it down, each 100 health takes approximately 13 seconds to grow. That means if you scout a spire at 400 health, start counting from 1 to 13 2 times, and then begin adding turrets.
You should place about 3 turrets at places that’s hard for your marines to get to, 1 turret near your rax, and 2 turrets to the side of your base where the marines can help too.
*cute trick* some players I’ve noticed only harasses the main base, so you can be lazy on your turrets at your nat. If you don’t see mutas harassing your main anymore, immediately at 1-2 more turrets at your nat.
Here is my other thread about turret timing if you want to know in depth.
+ Show Spoiler +
Turret timing an important thing to know in TvZ, you don't want to make them to early because you'll sacrifice economy for something that don't do anything until mutas come. So you can get a better economy if you time the turrets exactly at when the mutas will arrive.
Assuming no lag in game, and the game is played in fastest speed. Mutas take 25 seconds to build. And turrets take 19 seconds, thats not including dragging out the SCV from mining and finding a good location to place the turret, i suppose if you want to add the time it takes for you to drag it out of mining and placing the turret in a good position it would take ~22 seconds? So what does this info mean? It means that the turrets do not need to be build UNTIL the spire is complete.
I also did a timing on the speed of the spire. The spire has 600 health, and the time for completing each 100 health takes approximatley 13 seconds. This means that lets say you scan and see a spire at 400health, which would mean the spire wouldn't be complete until the other 200hp is complete. Since 100HP takes 13 seconds to complete, 200hp would take about 26 seconds. So next time when you scan the spire, see what health it is at and count to your head, and you'll know approximately when the spire would be done.
We must also consider the traveling time for the mutas to get to the borders of your base close enough to cause damadge. ASSUMING PYTHON: The time for the muta to travel from 6 oclock's starting location to 12 o'clock's BASE BORDERLINE NOT 12'S STARTING LOCATION (AKA where your command center is), is approximately 21 seconds. If you guys are on positions of 9 and 3 on python the travel time would be 19 seconds, or something along the lines of that. I didn't check the time it takes for them to travel on positions like 12/3, and 6/9, but you should be able to adapt to that anyho.
---
Considering all 3 of these factors, I conclude the best time to drag your scv's away from mining to build turrets is the time that the spire is JUST done. The exception to this is if you're cross positions, and in that case you can start making it when mutas are half way done, or if you are confident enough, you can make turrets when the mutas are done. But for positions like 12/3, and 6/9, you definatly want to make them right when the spire is complete.
---
PS: A helpful tip is if the Zerg is 3 hatching muta, the best time for you to put down turrets is at terran's 52 psi. If your at cross positions maybe at 54 psi. However if you know for sure zerg 3 hatched muta, and didn't come to your base when you are at 63-65psi, either
A) He is hid a hatchery somewhere before he put down his spire, or half way till spire was finished. The normal timing is right when the mutas pop the zerg immediatly takes his 3rd.
B). He fooled you and actually went lurkers, in that case i would scan his Nat again to scout for lurkers, if he has them attempt contain asap.
C). He's a noob, and his timings are off, and probably forgot to get 2nd gas at his expo.
This of course is assuming the zerg didn't try some 3 hatch mass ling, and you didn't move out with your rine/medic army and got slamed by speedlings while on your way out.
basically it assumes you didn't lose many unnecessary units, a few scouter scv's is okay.
------
2 hatch muta is more complicated, because zerg can either get ling speed first or get lair tech first with his 100gas, and the amount of Zlings he creates also has a impact on his muta timing, so the best way to find the timing is ofcourse with scanner and seeing his spire health, and including his travel time..etc.
GG GL
Assuming no lag in game, and the game is played in fastest speed. Mutas take 25 seconds to build. And turrets take 19 seconds, thats not including dragging out the SCV from mining and finding a good location to place the turret, i suppose if you want to add the time it takes for you to drag it out of mining and placing the turret in a good position it would take ~22 seconds? So what does this info mean? It means that the turrets do not need to be build UNTIL the spire is complete.
I also did a timing on the speed of the spire. The spire has 600 health, and the time for completing each 100 health takes approximatley 13 seconds. This means that lets say you scan and see a spire at 400health, which would mean the spire wouldn't be complete until the other 200hp is complete. Since 100HP takes 13 seconds to complete, 200hp would take about 26 seconds. So next time when you scan the spire, see what health it is at and count to your head, and you'll know approximately when the spire would be done.
We must also consider the traveling time for the mutas to get to the borders of your base close enough to cause damadge. ASSUMING PYTHON: The time for the muta to travel from 6 oclock's starting location to 12 o'clock's BASE BORDERLINE NOT 12'S STARTING LOCATION (AKA where your command center is), is approximately 21 seconds. If you guys are on positions of 9 and 3 on python the travel time would be 19 seconds, or something along the lines of that. I didn't check the time it takes for them to travel on positions like 12/3, and 6/9, but you should be able to adapt to that anyho.
---
Considering all 3 of these factors, I conclude the best time to drag your scv's away from mining to build turrets is the time that the spire is JUST done. The exception to this is if you're cross positions, and in that case you can start making it when mutas are half way done, or if you are confident enough, you can make turrets when the mutas are done. But for positions like 12/3, and 6/9, you definatly want to make them right when the spire is complete.
---
PS: A helpful tip is if the Zerg is 3 hatching muta, the best time for you to put down turrets is at terran's 52 psi. If your at cross positions maybe at 54 psi. However if you know for sure zerg 3 hatched muta, and didn't come to your base when you are at 63-65psi, either
A) He is hid a hatchery somewhere before he put down his spire, or half way till spire was finished. The normal timing is right when the mutas pop the zerg immediatly takes his 3rd.
B). He fooled you and actually went lurkers, in that case i would scan his Nat again to scout for lurkers, if he has them attempt contain asap.
C). He's a noob, and his timings are off, and probably forgot to get 2nd gas at his expo.
This of course is assuming the zerg didn't try some 3 hatch mass ling, and you didn't move out with your rine/medic army and got slamed by speedlings while on your way out.
basically it assumes you didn't lose many unnecessary units, a few scouter scv's is okay.
------
2 hatch muta is more complicated, because zerg can either get ling speed first or get lair tech first with his 100gas, and the amount of Zlings he creates also has a impact on his muta timing, so the best way to find the timing is ofcourse with scanner and seeing his spire health, and including his travel time..etc.
GG GL
So basically after the mutas stopped harassing, your vessel should be almost out. Get irradiate as soon as his hive is finished, because you want to have that ability by the time his defilers pop. You don’t want to get it too early because having the early irradiate to kill 1 lurker won’t change much, and its pretty expensive for that upgrade also.
I like to follow up my first vessel with a 2nd vessel, but some people like to get a dropship instead, but its up to the user. If you do decide to get a dropship YOU MUST MAKE SURE YOUR 1st VESSEL DOESN”T DIE. If it does, and his defilers pop, it’ll be hell for you.
IF someone your timing push fails, gather up your rallied troops, and gather up the vessels that you produced from the 2 starports, and use that force to delay defiler push to your choke.
*IMPORTANT* Do NOT use those hotkeyed units to attack his expos RIGHT AFTER YOUR FIRST PUSH DIES, OR ELSE HE’ll HAVE SWARMS UP YOUR ASS, AND IT’LL BE TOO LATE TO CALL A DOCTOR TO CLEAR UP ALL THAT DIRTY SWARMY MESS.
As the game goes on, yes you can use your hotkeyed units to attack expos at the naturals of other starting locations, but don’t go up ramps with those forces, its not worth it. The best way to kill his expos is with your rallied units, and dropships. I’ve lost many games cuz I tried to kill his expos with my main force, and had swarms up my ass…
Late game TvZ is VERY hard to play. Because now if you think about it here are the important things you have to carry out.
1. Use your hotkeyed units to delay his defiler push, and constantly dodge scourage and snipe defilers with your vessels.
2. Use rallied units to attack his expos, with dropship harass.
3. Macro/adding extra rax
4. Expoing and defending that expo
5. Paying attention of his army so you don’t surprisingly find a swarm up your choke.
You should generall send about 8 marines and 1 medic at each expo, I personally like to take the closest starting location as my 2nd nat because it has a ramp. Also once you get your 3rd gas, you should have about maybe 8-9 Rax, 2 facs and 2 ports.
Many people have trouble playing late game TvZ, i do too, and there’s no trick to get better at it all of a sudden without mass gaming practice.
Pressure build to Hive push
This build is designed to knock out the zerg’s 2nd natural, that way it’ll delay his tech, but this build also delays your tech if it fails.
-9 supply
-11 rax
-12 scout
-15-19 CC (notice how fast you can get your CC, if you scout your opponent on your first try like on 12 vs 9, or 12 vs 3, you can just skip your 2nd depot and use that SCV that finished the barrack to make the CC)
- Based on your scouting, if you see 12 hatch by zerg and he only has 1 larvae by the time his pool finishes you can delay your marine production and go tech faster. However if you see 3 larvae before pool is finished play safe and make marines.
-23 Refinary
-25 2nd rax
-whenever money allows you Academy+ebay, stim/+1 attack.
-Whenever money allows 2 more rax.
-Basically by the time mutas come you should have like almost 2 control groups of Marines and like 4-5 medics. That’s the time you want to hunt down his 2nd nat.
-You want to place lots of turrets just incase he decides not to defend it and continues to harass you
-Fac/other tech before 60psi.
Basically with this build if you manage to kill his 2nd nat, and not take too much hits by his mutas, you’re VERY VERY Ahead. But if you took some damadge and you still killed his 2nd nat, its still about even because you delayed his 3rd gas, but you also delayed your tech at the same time.
Then after that just play like normal up to late game.
The major difference between this and the 9:30min push is that this allows you to make 4 rax before factory, and gets more marines before his mutas come.
5 rax before Fac (PIMP RUSH)
- This build is one of my favorites, its great on bluestorm, and average on python.
- Basically this is the BO
-9 supply
-11 rax
-12 scout
-15-19 CC (notice how fast you can get your CC, if you scout your opponent on your first try like on 12 vs 9, or 12 vs 3, you can just skip your 2nd depot and use that SCV that finished the barrack to make the CC)
-23 ref
-25 academy
-Add 2 more rax to a total of 3, and upgrade stim whenever you can
-After you put down the 2 rax, whenever you get money add your ebay and get +1
-Whenever you get money add 2 more rax, to make a total of 5.
-When his mutas come your 5th rax should just be about complete.
You should move out as soon as you get about exactly 2 control groups of mnm, make sure you scan his natural, if he don’t have enough sunks, break that and you win the game. If he does have enough sunks, go hit his 2nd nat before hi s lurker tech comes.
If his mutas delay you enough and he got lurkers up his ramp at his 2nd nat, you’ll be behind tech wise, he’ll get defilers faster than you’ll be able to get your vessel.
Things NOT to do…
- If you’re doing the standard 9:30 push, don’t go out with all your rines up to his choke, cuz you’ll just get backstabbed… Go out of your choke a bit to scare him to make sunks and then go back to your choke again.
- Don’t get a dropship before your 1st vessel unless his hive is really delayed.
- Don’t be a robot and move out as soon as you get ur first vessel, if he doesn’t have hive you’ll get eaten alive.
- Don’t sit in the middle of the map with 3 sieged tanks, and mnm… You’ll get flanked so hard you might take it out on your headsets and keyboard.
- If you happen to out play the other player, don’t just continue playing normal if he doesn’t leave. Make a couple of command centers in his base. (I don’t suggest doing this to people in your clan XD).
All in all, I think TvZ is a VERY mechanical demanding match up, the concept is fairly easy after you know it, the rest is just practice your mechanics.
pimp rush: http://repdepot.net/replay.php?id=14079
![[image loading]](http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/2884/awesomekitty.jpg)
