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Canada's Government To Be Ousted?

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a-game
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Canada5085 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-12-05 00:32:12
November 28 2008 19:38 GMT
#1
Summary: Only 54 days after the last Federal Election, the Conservative government of Canada on Nov. 27 put forward a motion that would strip the opposition parties of their public funding, crippling them, and that did little to address the economic anxiety that is gathering steam across the country. Following this, in a moment of unprecedented and historical portent, an agreement has been reached between all 3 opposition parties to kick out the Conservative government and in it's stead have 2 of the opposition parties form a new, coalition government.

The opposition parties consist of the left-leaning New Democratic Party, the centre-left Liberal Party (the largest of the three opposition parties), and the separatist Bloc Quebecois Party. The proposed coalition would consist of a Liberal-NDP government, which would survive Budget votes with the promised tacit support of the Bloc.

Update: PM Stephen Harper has suspended Parliament until January 26, 2009, to avoid being toppled by the Liberal-NDP coalition.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/reuters/081204/canada/international_us_politics_canada_14?printer=1

Canadian PM wins suspension of Parliament

59 minutes ago

By Randall Palmer and David Ljunggren

OTTAWA (Reuters) - Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper won a rare suspension of Parliament on Thursday, managing to avoid being ousted by opposition parties angry over the minority Conservative government's economic plans and an attempt to cut off party financing.

Governor General Michaelle Jean -- the representative of Queen Elizabeth, Canada's head of state -- agreed to Harper's request to shut down Parliament until Jan 26. Parliament was reconvened just weeks ago after the October 14 election.

Harper's request for suspension was unprecedented. No prime minister had asked for Parliament to be suspended to avoid a confidence vote in the House of Commons.

Such a vote had been set for Monday and the Conservatives almost certainly would have lost it, and faced the possibility of being replaced by a coalition of opposition parties.

After a two-hour meeting with the governor general, Harper reaffirmed his promise to present a budget on Jan 27 and called on the opposition to work with the government over the next few weeks to tackle the effects of the global financial crisis.

"Today's decision will give us an opportunity -- and I'm talking about all the parties -- to focus on the economy and to work together," he told reporters.

The opposition Liberals, New Democrats and the separatist Bloc Quebecois -- all to the left of the Conservatives -- had signed a deal to defeat the Conservatives and put forward a Liberal-New Democrat coalition to form a new government.

The Bloc, which wants to take French-speaking Quebec out of Canada, pledged to back the coalition's budgets and general policy direction.

The governor general's role in government, as representative of the Crown, is largely ceremonial, though she has the final word on constitutional matters. Should the government be defeated in a confidence vote, she would decide whether to call a new election or allow the opposition to form a coalition government.

CONSTITUTIONAL BATTLE

Harper's gambit was the latest development in a constitutional battle that erupted last week after he tried to eliminate direct subsidies of political parties, a move that would have hit the opposition particularly hard.

He backed down on that, but the opposition parties also say they are upset that the government has not dealt adequately with the economic crisis and said it had lost the confidence of the House of Commons.

Liberal leader Stephane Dion, who would have become prime minister under the opposition's coalition plan, said nothing he heard from Harper on Thursday had changed his mind about trying to bring down the government.

However, he did appear to open the door a crack to not proceeding with such a plan.

"This is about replacing Stephen Harper unless he made a monumental change," he told a news conference. "It means a recovery plan, a real recovery plan."

The New Democrats and Bloc maintained their insistence that Harper could not be trusted and must be removed, as did some members of Dion's Liberal caucus.

"You can run but you can't hide," said Bob Rae, who is looking to become Liberal leader when Dion steps down early in May. He predicted the opposition would topple Harper early next year.

However the front-runner in the Liberal leadership race, Michael Ignatieff, said he imagined Jean may have told Harper "to have a think" and that would be good advice for all politicians on both sides of the dispute.

Liberal legislator Keith Martin told reporters after a caucus meeting that bringing the Conservatives down was "not at all" a done deal.

In the back of their minds may be the fact that in much of the country the idea of a formal agreement with the separatists did not go down well.

An Ekos opinion poll taken as the crisis reached its peak showed the Conservatives had shot up in popularity to 44 percent, enough to get a parliamentary majority if an election were held today, up from the 37.6 percent they received in the October 14 vote.

Liberal support dropped to 24.1 percent from 26.2 percent, the New Democrats fell to 14.5 percent from 18.2 percent and the Bloc edged down to 9.2 percent from 10.0 percent.

The poll, released late on Thursday by CBC television, covered 2,536 respondents from December 2-3 and carried a 1.9 point margin of error, 19 times out of 20.
you wouldnt feel that way if it was your magical sword of mantouchery that got stolen - racebannon • I am merely guest #13,678!
HumbleZealot
Profile Joined February 2006
Canada508 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-28 19:48:21
November 28 2008 19:47 GMT
#2
When I heard about this last night I was shocked at how retarded the tories are being about this. It's as if they don't understand their own situation; the liberal party clearly stated it was no longer going to support the tory government and then they (the tories) respond by proposing a "fiscal" update that is clearly engineered to piss the opposition off. I suppose the conservatives believe they can either force the liberals to back down or force a snap election that will result in a majority government, but it seems apparent that neither of these things will happen and for a year or two we'll be stuck with a coalitian government. I doubt any of these things will happen though, the conservatives (I hope) are atleast smart enough to realize that this is one issue where they'll have to be the ones who back down.

EDIT: And if they don't, atleast we won't have harper as a prime minister anymore.
a-game
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Canada5085 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-28 19:50:46
November 28 2008 19:49 GMT
#3
note, i don't expect the americans or europeans to care much about this event, this is pretty much a thread that only canadians will care about

@humblezealot: i agree the conservatives will probably back down, but with jean chretien and ed broadbent already negotiating the coalition, it seems like it will be hard to stop this ball now that it's started rolling. what do you think

what i mean to say is, i think the situation may just be out of the conservatives hands now, unless they can turn this into a public relations disaster for the opposition
you wouldnt feel that way if it was your magical sword of mantouchery that got stolen - racebannon • I am merely guest #13,678!
Shadowfury333
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada314 Posts
November 28 2008 19:54 GMT
#4
I'm really quite surprised at this. I mean, the conservatives would theoretically suffer as well, unless I missed something about a clause exempting the government in power. Not to mention that they've basically shot themselves in the foot with a Siege Tank by proposing this in the first place.
Darkness called...but I was on the phone, so I missed him. I tried to *69 darkness, but his machine picked up. I yelled "Pick up the phone, Darkness", but he ignored me. Darkness must have been screening his calls.
a-game
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Canada5085 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-28 19:58:38
November 28 2008 19:57 GMT
#5
On November 29 2008 04:54 Shadowfury333 wrote:
I'm really quite surprised at this. I mean, the conservatives would theoretically suffer as well, unless I missed something about a clause exempting the government in power. Not to mention that they've basically shot themselves in the foot with a Siege Tank by proposing this in the first place.

the conservatives don't rely on public funding at all actually, their fund raising prowess massively outshadows that of the opposition parties. they're kind of the canadian version of barack obama when it comes to their fundraising advantage over the other parties haha.

the opposition parties, on the other hand, have essentially no fundraising at all. they rely almost exclusively upon public funding for their survival, that's why this thing blew up so fast
you wouldnt feel that way if it was your magical sword of mantouchery that got stolen - racebannon • I am merely guest #13,678!
Durak
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Canada3684 Posts
November 28 2008 19:59 GMT
#6
This is retarded. The conservatives think their cut to GST will increase public spending enough to cover the current economic crisis? I'm pretty sure msot people are going to be saving that money instead of spending it. Worst fiscal policy I've ever seen.
chobopeon
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
United States7342 Posts
November 28 2008 20:02 GMT
#7
This seems ridiculous but, alas, I don't know much of the situation up north. However, I have to say, it's pretty funny that the party is known as the Tories.

Do keep the thread updated with what happens, though. I'm interested to know/see the process.
:O
GGQ
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Canada2653 Posts
November 28 2008 20:06 GMT
#8
It is true that Canada is not hurting as badly as America. At least not yet. And I just don't like the idea of a coalition government. Especially with the Bloc as part of it.

To be completely honest, I wouldnt mind not having to fund parties full of dumbass politicians like Dion, but I think that motion was just to try to get yet another re-election with a shot at majority. Just give it up, Harper, it's not gonna happen. Canada doesn't trust you that much yet.

Anyways, I hope there's no big upheaval. I don't think that's what Canada needs right now.
Krohm
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Canada1857 Posts
November 28 2008 20:07 GMT
#9
This doesn't really surprise me. After I heard what they were planning on the news last night. I just knew shit was going to hit the fan. I just can't wait to see how it unfolds.
Not bad for a cat toy.
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32051 Posts
November 28 2008 20:11 GMT
#10
Important Questions:

1) How will this effect hockey?
2) Public funding? All this nonsense over cut backs on their free maple syrup and Canadian bacon?
3) How the hell do parties receive public funding, and how can the group in power vote to suspend that funding for everyone but them?

PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
a-game
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Canada5085 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-28 20:11:56
November 28 2008 20:11 GMT
#11
On November 29 2008 05:06 GGQ wrote:
I think that motion was just to try to get yet another re-election with a shot at majority. Just give it up, Harper, it's not gonna happen. Canada doesn't trust you that much yet.

they were saying this on the cbc too, that this could be a plot by harper to give the reigns of government to the coalition and then watch as they bicker and tear themselves apart, then the conservatives can ride in to save the day and win a majority in a new election.

that's quite a lot of far fetched extrapolation from the facts we've got so far, but then again harper doesn't seem like the kind of guy who screws up very often. we'll just have to see how this all unfolds i guess!
you wouldnt feel that way if it was your magical sword of mantouchery that got stolen - racebannon • I am merely guest #13,678!
a-game
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Canada5085 Posts
November 28 2008 20:15 GMT
#12
On November 29 2008 05:11 Hawk wrote:
Important Questions:

1) How will this effect hockey?
2) Public funding? All this nonsense over cut backs on their free maple syrup and Canadian bacon?
3) How the hell do parties receive public funding, and how can the group in power vote to suspend that funding for everyone but them?

haha

1) if the canadian dollar takes a dive then the canadian teams could go into cardiac arrest, thus rendering 90% of the nhl's revenues to dust and dooming hockey... or something

3) similar to how in the US election, john mccain received public funding to conduct his campaign. in this case, the group in power is not suspending funding for everyone but them, they are voting to suspend public financing for all the parties, it just so happens that the governing party has barack obama-like fundraising powers and doesn't need public money, so they can afford this move, while the other parties cannot.
you wouldnt feel that way if it was your magical sword of mantouchery that got stolen - racebannon • I am merely guest #13,678!
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32051 Posts
November 28 2008 20:25 GMT
#13
Oh, I thought you meant public funding, like it's taken from taxes and divided up or something, haha.

I don't even see how suspending it would do anything but benefit the dominating party. When they're up for reelection, they'll have name recogniztion, and the other guys will have nada. It's a pretty overt attempt to put a strangle hold on politics.

And when they say get rid of the conservatives, I assume they just mean forming that coalition and just voting every single thing down that passes through the Canadian house or whatever?? They can't have them removed any way, right?
PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
ZERG_RUSSIAN
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
10417 Posts
November 28 2008 20:27 GMT
#14
Fuck yeah, go Canada!

Do what we Americans are too impotent to do and overthrow your government.
I'm on GOLD CHAIN
Kennigit *
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
Canada19447 Posts
November 28 2008 20:30 GMT
#15
No don't do it i love stephen ;_;
a-game
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Canada5085 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-28 20:48:32
November 28 2008 20:37 GMT
#16
@hawk

complicated question, let me give you a primer first. think of canada's government like the US congress, except in canada, speaker nancy pelosi would be the "president" (prime minister), of the entire country, not just congress.

currently, the conservatives control canada's "congress", and thusly, the leader of their party is the prime minister of canada. however, if the opposition parties form a coalition, then they would control congress, and consequently the leader of the coalition would become prime minister.

if they did this, the current leader of canada, would be removed from power and he would become the equivalent of american minority leader john boehner, someone with a paycheque and a stool in congress, but no particular say in what happens going forward.
you wouldnt feel that way if it was your magical sword of mantouchery that got stolen - racebannon • I am merely guest #13,678!
GGQ
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Canada2653 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-28 20:42:07
November 28 2008 20:38 GMT
#17
And when they say get rid of the conservatives, I assume they just mean forming that coalition and just voting every single thing down that passes through the Canadian house or whatever?? They can't have them removed any way, right?


If they form a coalition, they intend to vote down the first thing that the government tries to pass, then then can call for a vote of no confidence, and yes they will remove the conservatives and form their own government
L
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Canada4732 Posts
November 28 2008 21:11 GMT
#18
They can only obtain a vote of no-confidence if the failed vote is a confidence matter. Budgets are confidence matters, and thus this 'mini-budget' prompts a vote of confidence if its shot down.
The number you have dialed is out of porkchops.
a-game
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Canada5085 Posts
November 28 2008 21:19 GMT
#19
On November 29 2008 06:11 L wrote:
They can only obtain a vote of no-confidence if the failed vote is a confidence matter. Budgets are confidence matters, and thus this 'mini-budget' prompts a vote of confidence if its shot down.

well, monday is opposition day so all the opposition has to do is table a non-confidence motion on monday and voila~ the government will be brought down

this is completely in the opposition's hands now
you wouldnt feel that way if it was your magical sword of mantouchery that got stolen - racebannon • I am merely guest #13,678!
HumbleZealot
Profile Joined February 2006
Canada508 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-28 21:34:59
November 28 2008 21:31 GMT
#20
On November 29 2008 04:49 a-game wrote:
note, i don't expect the americans or europeans to care much about this event, this is pretty much a thread that only canadians will care about

@humblezealot: i agree the conservatives will probably back down, but with jean chretien and ed broadbent already negotiating the coalition, it seems like it will be hard to stop this ball now that it's started rolling. what do you think

what i mean to say is, i think the situation may just be out of the conservatives hands now, unless they can turn this into a public relations disaster for the opposition

Thats true, and its also part of the reason why I think the Conservatives are such retards. They should have realized that they can't keep on calling votes of confidence and getting their legislation passed with these, quite frankly, undemocratic methods. That's why I'd love to see the Harper government fall, I'm tired of their (and the opposition's) immature behaviour in parliament.

On November 29 2008 05:11 Hawk wrote:
Important Questions:

1) How will this effect hockey?
2) Public funding? All this nonsense over cut backs on their free maple syrup and Canadian bacon?
3) How the hell do parties receive public funding, and how can the group in power vote to suspend that funding for everyone but them?


1) As stated in an earlier post, a low Canadian dollar is bad for sports teams.
2) Stop trying to bash Canada at every conceivable opportunity, I've seen u post retarded shit like this several times before and it throughly demostrates your lack of knowledge.
3) Thats not exactly whats happening, why don't you try doing what 99.9% of Americans don't and actually learn about the rest of the world?
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