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[M][N] Default Suspicions Mafia

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
1 2 3 Next All
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 17 2014 11:18 GMT
#4
/in
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-17 12:00:05
February 17 2014 11:50 GMT
#5
Roleblock chains resolve from the last roleblock in the chain. For example: A->B->C->D->Medic, A will roleblock B, so B doesn't block C, so C blocks D, which means the Medic power resolves.

That shouldn't be that way. Night actions should all happen at the same time in 2 stages. First everything that is a RB happens, all RB's happen at the same time. Then everything that is not an RB happens, all at the same time. At least that's how it got explained to me, because it's the same with other nightactions as well:

If vig A shoots Vig B who shoots C, C should not be saved because both shots happen at the same time. Same with RB's. If RB A roleblocks B, who roleblocks C, C should not be saved. So basicly if A roleblocks B who roleblocks C, who roleblocks D, who roleblocks A all 4 of them should end up being roleblocked. Just saying in case this isn't on purpose for some reason.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 17 2014 16:16 GMT
#12
On February 18 2014 00:01 HiroPro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 17 2014 20:50 Toadesstern wrote:
Roleblock chains resolve from the last roleblock in the chain. For example: A->B->C->D->Medic, A will roleblock B, so B doesn't block C, so C blocks D, which means the Medic power resolves.

That shouldn't be that way. Night actions should all happen at the same time in 2 stages. First everything that is a RB happens, all RB's happen at the same time. Then everything that is not an RB happens, all at the same time. At least that's how it got explained to me, because it's the same with other nightactions as well:

If vig A shoots Vig B who shoots C, C should not be saved because both shots happen at the same time. Same with RB's. If RB A roleblocks B, who roleblocks C, C should not be saved. So basicly if A roleblocks B who roleblocks C, who roleblocks D, who roleblocks A all 4 of them should end up being roleblocked. Just saying in case this isn't on purpose for some reason.


There is nothing wrong with resolving roleblocks (unlike other night actions) as least conflict. There are plenty of setups that work like this (c9++ is a good example). There's nothing illegitimate about it: a site like mafiascum even has it as their preferred way of dealing with resolution (Roleblocker).

And in a mini setup like this that has town roleblockers, I'd actually argue that it's better to have it as least conflict over simultaneous. It's not a very strong role as it is.

it's a weak role but neither way of resolving actually buffs it. You could argue that not simultaneous makes it even worse, as a Town-RB is an incredibly hard role to play as. Probably one of the hardest powerroles there is to play and mafia has an information advantage over the Town-RB, so the benefits are more likely to help mafia than town simply because Mafia won't RB themselves while the mafia-RB will at least always hit into town.

So if you want a somewhat more useful Town-RB I'd actually make it simultaneous to make sure that on the rare occastions when he actually does something that isn't anti-town it'll go through. But I didn't know there's both options to resolve this. Whatever host wants is fine as long as it's clear
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 19 2014 12:14 GMT
#58
time to claim catwoman I guess
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-19 13:05:02
February 19 2014 13:04 GMT
#62
oh same as last game that I got ouf off once I saw Marv joining: I'm not going to play like I usually do no matter of alignment or role. Trying to post a bunch less and keep the hypnotoad down a little. Like I said, I'm going to (try) and do that no matter what. Shouldn't be a problem saying so, right?
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-19 14:02:17
February 19 2014 14:00 GMT
#76
Koshi you might want to read up on this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=272547&currentpage=5#89

It's only been last week and the answers in question clear it up quite nicely, which is the reason the Model-OP was changed so that it can only be interpreted in one way. Like Marv said, it's normal "this" way but could have been interpreted both ways before
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 19 2014 14:51 GMT
#81
It sometimes gets annoying that I always have to be the guy telling people how it's done correctly because I'm so smart and can't leave stupid shit alone. I know, I should be happy that I'm so gifted but sometimes it just feels like I'm cursed to walk this world, always knowing there's noone on equal terms to me.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 19 2014 18:07 GMT
#109
not knowing prplhz... going to be hard to get a mislynch on him if you don't know him
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 19 2014 23:57 GMT
#147
On February 20 2014 08:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:
The quoted below is in addition to votes cast on D1 correct?
Show nested quote +
On day 1 each player will be randomly assigned a vote on someone else. No one will have more than 3 votes on them to begin with.



##vote: raynpelikoneet
I have a plan and i am not sure if this is the best plan because i have not thought it through from every angle yet but does anyone know what i am doing?

sounds good to me, I like this

##vote: raynpelikoneet
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 00:03 GMT
#155
On February 20 2014 08:58 CuteFluffyPuppy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 08:57 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 08:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:
The quoted below is in addition to votes cast on D1 correct?
On day 1 each player will be randomly assigned a vote on someone else. No one will have more than 3 votes on them to begin with.



##vote: raynpelikoneet
I have a plan and i am not sure if this is the best plan because i have not thought it through from every angle yet but does anyone know what i am doing?

sounds good to me, I like this

##vote: raynpelikoneet

Why do you think Rayn voted for himself?

no idea
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 00:05 GMT
#157
On February 20 2014 09:03 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Okay so apparently the starting votes for the day don't mean shit if i read this correctly? Then it's... meaningless?
What's the point?

the point is that you're not allowed to unvote at any point during the game, thus you can not start "unvoted" because you'd stay "unvoted" until you vote someone.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 00:09 GMT
#162
Why are you actively looking for a way to pseudo-unvote? I don't even see a reason why someone should care about that.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 00:09 GMT
#165
On February 20 2014 09:09 Toadesstern wrote:
Why are you actively looking for a way to pseudo-unvote? I don't even see a reason why someone should care about that.

that was @rayn
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 00:22 GMT
#195
On February 20 2014 09:13 VIVAX420 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 09:09 Toadesstern wrote:
Why are you actively looking for a way to pseudo-unvote? I don't even see a reason why someone should care about that.


wait so you are implying that scum is going to be afraid of the default votes enough to come up with a plan like that?


somewhat. Not really the votes themselves but rather some reaction caused by those votes. It's not going to be just about the innitial votes, it's going to be for the entire game that you can't unvote.
Noone is taking these votes serious and I see no reason why he should be thinking about this if not for some weird paranoid reasons.

And I'm doing vocabs right now... I'm only going to f5 every 15 minutes or so...
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 00:38 GMT
#210
On February 20 2014 09:37 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 09:35 Palmar wrote:
I agree with what prplhz is saying, and to the extend that I don't understand why people care where votes are parked. It's completely irrelevant, there is no pressure in a vote that isn't being actively pushed as a lynch target. No one cares. I have no idea why rayn seems to think we need a plan to address that non-problem. It's an extremely bad opening discussion point and serves no purpose.

Do you agree with prplhz's vote on me?

Actually this goes to everyone.

If you read my posts, you'll find that I actually said the exact same thing and that I as well have my vote on you. So yes.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 00:43 GMT
#221
On February 20 2014 09:39 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 09:38 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:37 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:35 Palmar wrote:
I agree with what prplhz is saying, and to the extend that I don't understand why people care where votes are parked. It's completely irrelevant, there is no pressure in a vote that isn't being actively pushed as a lynch target. No one cares. I have no idea why rayn seems to think we need a plan to address that non-problem. It's an extremely bad opening discussion point and serves no purpose.

Do you agree with prplhz's vote on me?

Actually this goes to everyone.

If you read my posts, you'll find that I actually said the exact same thing and that I as well have my vote on you. So yes.

So why is your vote not on me?


On February 20 2014 08:57 Toadesstern wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 08:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:
The quoted below is in addition to votes cast on D1 correct?
On day 1 each player will be randomly assigned a vote on someone else. No one will have more than 3 votes on them to begin with.



##vote: raynpelikoneet
I have a plan and i am not sure if this is the best plan because i have not thought it through from every angle yet but does anyone know what i am doing?

sounds good to me, I like this

##vote: raynpelikoneet


I didn't feel the need to vote myself and revote you for a more dramatic expression of my desire to get you lynched.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 01:30 GMT
#268
On February 20 2014 10:20 marvellosity wrote:
Let's go with this:

##unvote
##Vote: Toadesstern


His +1 on prplhz's vote is super-weak. Why is Toad agreeing with prplhz that rayn is looking for a way not to take stands? Toad is passingly familiar enough with rayn to know that's not how rayn operates.

Naughty toad.


I voted him because I like voting rayn after the last game we had together, just look at the post I quoted while voting him. I think that was the first game we had together so no I don't really know how he plays considering that I ragequited because of him on d2. At least I don't recall any other game.

Do you honestly think I'm going after him in all seriousness right now instead of just taking sidestabs at him for last game?
After posts like these:
On February 20 2014 09:43 Toadesstern wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 09:39 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:38 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:37 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:35 Palmar wrote:
I agree with what prplhz is saying, and to the extend that I don't understand why people care where votes are parked. It's completely irrelevant, there is no pressure in a vote that isn't being actively pushed as a lynch target. No one cares. I have no idea why rayn seems to think we need a plan to address that non-problem. It's an extremely bad opening discussion point and serves no purpose.

Do you agree with prplhz's vote on me?

Actually this goes to everyone.

If you read my posts, you'll find that I actually said the exact same thing and that I as well have my vote on you. So yes.

So why is your vote not on me?


Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 08:57 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 08:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:
The quoted below is in addition to votes cast on D1 correct?
On day 1 each player will be randomly assigned a vote on someone else. No one will have more than 3 votes on them to begin with.



##vote: raynpelikoneet
I have a plan and i am not sure if this is the best plan because i have not thought it through from every angle yet but does anyone know what i am doing?

sounds good to me, I like this

##vote: raynpelikoneet


I didn't feel the need to vote myself and revote you for a more dramatic expression of my desire to get you lynched.

?

I had the same idea as prplhz had and said I can't think of a reason why a town would want to proppose this and I'd still like to see his reasoning for all this.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 01:34 GMT
#271
On February 20 2014 10:32 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 20 2014 10:30 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 10:20 marvellosity wrote:
Let's go with this:

##unvote
##Vote: Toadesstern


His +1 on prplhz's vote is super-weak. Why is Toad agreeing with prplhz that rayn is looking for a way not to take stands? Toad is passingly familiar enough with rayn to know that's not how rayn operates.

Naughty toad.


I voted him because I like voting rayn after the last game we had together, just look at the post I quoted while voting him. I think that was the first game we had together so no I don't really know how he plays considering that I ragequited because of him on d2. At least I don't recall any other game.

Do you honestly think I'm going after him in all seriousness right now instead of just taking sidestabs at him for last game?
After posts like these:
On February 20 2014 09:43 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:39 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:38 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:37 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On February 20 2014 09:35 Palmar wrote:
I agree with what prplhz is saying, and to the extend that I don't understand why people care where votes are parked. It's completely irrelevant, there is no pressure in a vote that isn't being actively pushed as a lynch target. No one cares. I have no idea why rayn seems to think we need a plan to address that non-problem. It's an extremely bad opening discussion point and serves no purpose.

Do you agree with prplhz's vote on me?

Actually this goes to everyone.

If you read my posts, you'll find that I actually said the exact same thing and that I as well have my vote on you. So yes.

So why is your vote not on me?


On February 20 2014 08:57 Toadesstern wrote:
On February 20 2014 08:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:
The quoted below is in addition to votes cast on D1 correct?
On day 1 each player will be randomly assigned a vote on someone else. No one will have more than 3 votes on them to begin with.



##vote: raynpelikoneet
I have a plan and i am not sure if this is the best plan because i have not thought it through from every angle yet but does anyone know what i am doing?

sounds good to me, I like this

##vote: raynpelikoneet


I didn't feel the need to vote myself and revote you for a more dramatic expression of my desire to get you lynched.

?

I had the same idea as prplhz had and said I can't think of a reason why a town would want to proppose this and I'd still like to see his reasoning for all this.

you can't say

1) "I'm not going after him seriously"
and
2) "but I need to hear from him about this"

1) is backing out of it and yet you're pushing it with 2)

my vote stands while I go to bed

you don't seem to have gotten the timeline of events correct.
First I voted him, then I asked him about this and why he's doing that. So yeah I actually can say that because that's how it went down
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 01:40 GMT
#275
@rayn: Can't be #1 because I have no idea how someone could have come to that conclusion based on the phrasing from our lovevly host. Can't be #2 either for same reason. Therefore I was asking myself if it's #3, #4 the "I'm paranoid" or #5 the "I'm missing something"

On February 20 2014 10:36 VIVAX420 wrote:
toad you are backtracking so hard. it's not serious, yet you gave shitty but serious reasons for it.

well sorry, but that's usually how it ends up looking if I vote someone for fun and end up having issues with him that I want cleared afterwards.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 20 2014 01:48 GMT
#279
On February 20 2014 10:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Palmar the problem is not that if you make it clear or not. It's if other people think you are being clear or not which is not always so easily said. You know how this shit works, scum misrepresent everything people do because that's how you lynch townies. Why not reduce the possible amount of misrepresentations by an easy policy that does no harm in any case?

there's plenty of people throwing around votes in every single game, for fun, for policy, for random reasons or whatever else.
So if it's not a problem in any other game, why do you think it's going to be a problem in this one to the point that you think we should make a "no voting someone else unless you're super certain" policy?
Do you actually think it's something that should be policy in every game?
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
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