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Greetings!
Recently I have updated MorroW's version of Micro Tournament. It had gone for a long time without an update and many of the matchups had become broken and bugged. What I have done is altered them slightly to balance them based on my experience of the particular matchups within the map itself.
But now it comes time to improve the map further by adding in updated matchups, ones which have a chance of actually being seen in real games. This includes fights from all parts of every racial matchup. Currently for example there are things like, 7 blink stalker vs 7 blink stalker, MMM viking vs colossus stalker sentry zealot, lings vs zealots, etc...
I'm going to try and personally create a few interesting and relevant large scale battles, but as they are hard to balance i'm not going to be able and create very many. This is why I would like to ask for help and to start a discussion regarding typical army compositions and micro situtions given the current metagame, and to humbly ask for suggestions of actual army size, composition and unit detail.
Micro is a signifigant part of the strategy of starcraft and it is intrinsically tied into choices of army composition. I think that a discussion of the current compositions we are seeing at the pro levels combined with discussion and potentially debate on the proper control of said army compositions could turn out to be very worthwhile.
If you want to suggest micro matchups, the map is called "Micro Tournament 1.27" and you should be able to find it on EU and SEA (some people said they published it there sa well) so you can have an idea of the arena size. I'm not doing this to promote the map or myself, I didn't make it and I'm a shitty map maker, All the credit goes to MorroW. That said i am doing this for myself because i simply love the map and want to improve it.
TL;DR : What is your favorite (realistic) early, mid or late game micro situation (Ex: blink stalker vs blink stalker), How do you micro it?
Example response (my favorite micro situation)
+ Show Spoiler +
Response Ex: Controlling blink stalkers in general is my favorite micro situation. The way I micro it is A, make sure my stalkers aren't clumped and get an equal or greater arc to my opponent, and B, instead of blinking back stalkers only when i see they are injured (their shield is gone and are about to take actual damage) but i also time the blink so that they dodge the next shot or shots from the opposing stalkers (if more than one atalker are shooting at the same time at that particular stalker). The stalker(s) shoot atmy stalker, but just like tank lift micro if it gets blinked at the right moment, the incomming shot will hit the ground and damage nothing, effectively wasting the shot from one or more stalkers. In a situation where we start with equal numbers of blink stalkers and I time blinks correctly in order to both save weakening stalkers and to dodge and waste the shots of enemy stalkers, often times I will lose only 1-2 stalkers (sometimes none) in a situation where we both began with 7.
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slings vs marines
slow raoches aginst marines / marauders
helions vs slings / speedlings
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against protoss....well early game I go 1 rax FE so I have only unupgraded marines which suck against early game stalkers.
However in the mid game I do watching stalkers melt using stim :D That's always fun!
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Muta/Ling/Bane vs. Marine/Tank/Thor would be a nice one
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Speedling vs marine seems hard to balance in my mind, but i think it would certainly be a good one. Do the marines have any ups? And I assume this takes place off creep?
Also, roach vs marauder, do the marauders have concussive shell? do the marines have any ups? creep or no creep? and how big is the fight ? :D
Hellions vs speedlings I shall certainly try to create, but stim rines vs stalker is hard to make because the arena is too small for stalkers to kite properly.,. But there is a 5 marine 2 stalker one
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small amounts of stalkers sentries and zealots vs. small amounts of marines and marauders
stalkers sentries collo vs. roaches and bane drops
noncharge zealots vs. unspeed roaches
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my favorite for each race are unupgraded phoenix vs. mutas, infestor baneling vs marines, and viking vs corrupter/brood. phoenix are fun to micro injured ones behind full shield ones while moving in a big circle around chasing mutas, infestor baneling is great to see stim units trapped and banelings used to their full effectiveness, and mass vikings vs mass corrupters is fun to kite when you can scan for vision and decimate their army off screen.
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You should also try late game comps. Like 30 marines 10 marauders 6 media 10 ghosts 10 Viks vs stalker colossus zealot etc.
Also make sure both people have to micro. So not slow lings vs stalkers etc.
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ling bling muta vs marine tank off creep is what i love doing (as terran)
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I'm not sure, these might already be in the original.
I think zealot versus slow lings would be a good one. Im not sure how many lings because im not that good but the protoss would try to studder step and avoid surround, while target firing the weak lings if possibe, while the zerg would try getting the surround and pulling weak lings. Probably somewhere between 4-6 lings. or if you want to do 2 zealots versus even more lings, but i think in general that would be a fun micro game.
There is a lot of popularity with the Immortal sentry in PvZ so you could do a large ball of immortal sentry stalker vs a lot of roaches and lings. You would have to make the areana carefully in this one because you dont want FFs to be too strong but you dont want them to be a waste either. Maybe add a few cliffis to the inside part. Again balancing would be not easy. I think 3 immortals 1 shot a roach so that would be a good starting point. 5-6 sentries, and then the stalker/zealot would be relative to the roach/ling amount. Id say a good idea for this would be mostly stalker with a few zealots, and give the zerg mostly roaches. I'm not sure about creep or no creep here.
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On August 14 2012 05:33 FlilFlam wrote:
Speedling vs marine seems hard to balance in my mind, but i think it would certainly be a good one. Do the marines have any ups? And I assume this takes place off creep?
Also, roach vs marauder, do the marauders have concussive shell? do the marines have any ups? creep or no creep? and how big is the fight ? :D
Hellions vs speedlings I shall certainly try to create, but stim rines vs stalker is hard to make because the arena is too small for stalkers to kite properly.,. But there is a 5 marine 2 stalker one
Something I'd like to add-
I can't stand challenges where one side can micro and the other side can only A-move and hope for the best. You should consider taking out challenges where if one side has perfect micro they win 100% of the time regardless of how well the other side plays.
Thank you for updating the map though, I play it pretty frequently and always have fun with it!
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On August 14 2012 10:23 Carmine wrote:
I'm not sure, these might already be in the original.
I think zealot versus slow lings would be a good one. Im not sure how many lings because im not that good but the protoss would try to studder step and avoid surround, while target firing the weak lings if possibe, while the zerg would try getting the surround and pulling weak lings. Probably somewhere between 4-6 lings. or if you want to do 2 zealots versus even more lings, but i think in general that would be a fun micro game.
There is a lot of popularity with the Immortal sentry in PvZ so you could do a large ball of immortal sentry stalker vs a lot of roaches and lings. You would have to make the areana carefully in this one because you dont want FFs to be too strong but you dont want them to be a waste either. Maybe add a few cliffis to the inside part. Again balancing would be not easy. I think 3 immortals 1 shot a roach so that would be a good starting point. 5-6 sentries, and then the stalker/zealot would be relative to the roach/ling amount. Id say a good idea for this would be mostly stalker with a few zealots, and give the zerg mostly roaches. I'm not sure about creep or no creep here.
1 zealot vs 4 lings should be micro-able on the zerg's side to keep all four of the lings alive while killing the zealot. It's a micro battle I've done fairly often (9 pool vs gateway openings :D) and without a choke to back in to, the zealot will lose handily every time. The micro for zerg gets exponentially more APM intensive if you start adding more zealots, so it would be really cool to see 3 sets of 4 ling vs 1 zealot all happening simultaneously in the same arena, and if the protoss kills two zerglings, he wins :D
Also really cool and along the ling vs gateway battle would be 7-9 lings vs a stalker and a zealot. Not actually sure how many zerglings the zerg would need to actually be able to win, but there's enough interaction between the zealot / stalker (1 stalker shot + 2 zealot attacks = dead zergling) that further complicates both sides' micro that both sides have micro they should be performing to optimize performance..
Lastly (WOULD NEVER HAPPEN :D), 10 spine crawlers and 15 changelings vs 8 zealots. The catch? The spine crawlers start unburrowed, and the zealots are standing on the other side of the arena, on the only patch of creep. Use changelings to block and confuse your opponent while trying to get spine crawlers to burrow... might be impossible to balance, because 10 spine crawlers is a LOT, but if the number of spines < number of zealots, then all the protoss would have to do is tag one zealot to one spine and they could never burrow, I think.
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On August 14 2012 05:33 FlilFlam wrote:
Speedling vs marine seems hard to balance in my mind, but i think it would certainly be a good one. Do the marines have any ups? And I assume this takes place off creep?
Also, roach vs marauder, do the marauders have concussive shell? do the marines have any ups? creep or no creep? and how big is the fight ? :D
Hellions vs speedlings I shall certainly try to create, but stim rines vs stalker is hard to make because the arena is too small for stalkers to kite properly.,. But there is a 5 marine 2 stalker one
marines no ups, off creep. So it's kinda neutral that way..
Roach vs marauder isn't that fun in terms of micro...scratch it (just tried it hehe)
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O.K so i just updated the map and created some new matchups.
Keep in mind it will take a little while for me to balance them unless people actually test and post results
Ones I added are:
Speed ling vs Marine
Hellion vs speedlings
Muta/Ling/Bane vs. Marine/Tank/Thor
stalkers sentries collo vs. roaches and bane drops
ling bling muta vs marine tank
7-9 lings vs a stalker and a zealot
Sorry if you sugegsted one and I did not add it, I took the best/easiest suggestions to balance and also did not want to make too many new matchups at once.
In regards to some of the suggestions i did not implement:
Stim rines vs stalkers are difficult to create because of the small arena size, but there is currently a 2 stalker vs 5 marine matchup that fills the kiteing/stuttering role very well. No charge zealtos vs slow roaches, i was going to add this one but i figured that there would be too little micro from the zealot side. The roaches would be doing all the kiteing and all you could do with zealots is split and spead them in hopes of better position against the kiting roaches. Upgrades phoenix vs mutalisk i skipped over simply because i have no idea what would be a good amount fo either unit. f someone could play the map to see the arena size and then test this, i may add it. currently there is a 3 mutalisk vs an unupgraded phoenix, and this is one of the most boring and tedious matchups where the phoenix just run while the mutalisk try to hold position micro (to take quick pot shots) against the fleeing/jukeing phoenix. Viking vs corruptor brood would be a part of a larger matchup, one which i would liek to create but do not know where to start in terms of balance. I may create it and test it to see where it is but at this point ill wait until the other new matchups are balanced. Bling infestor vs marines is sort of already covered in a few of the matchups already and balancing this one is again very difficult, so i figured i would wait to add this one as well. There is already a zealot vs slow lings matchup, and the sentry immortal vs ling roach idea is good, but again very very hard to create and balance without some sort of starting point. Also i cannot modify the terrain as was suggested for this matchup, so i shall wait for this one as well. Regarding the spine crawler one, i am not sure if i can add spine crawlers so until someone else takes over the matintenance and advancement of this map, we will be stuck with unit matchups only.
If you cannot find the map on your local server, feel free to publish it, but be sure to check back here for updates and to report balance suggestions
Map file Link: (reupped, first version bugged)
http://www.filedropper.com/micro1
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EPT
