|
Hello! I decided that I might have a little time to spare today so I present to you the second part in my series! Shouldn't be too long of a writeup!
Today we shall talk about...
Not the perfect banner but.. ah what the heck. Thought I don't mind if someone would make one for me. + Show Spoiler +
Origins I am not exactly sure who devised this but it was particularly noted when Effort used this to great success again Flash. He did not follow the exact representation of this but the idea is still the same.
Though we cannot deny that someone else might have had a part in this. + Show Spoiler +
Mentality By faking 2 hatch, you are giving the illusion that you are going to be aggressive and you should be able to prevent him from cutting corners. Meanwhile, you are completely side-stepping away from his mid-game advantage(pre-defiler timing) by moving right into hive tech with a 3 gas economy. This will give you the leverage for a nice defiler timing attack or a smooth transition into your 4th and 5th gas.
The absolute key is in denying him scouting of your third base while giving an illusion in your current main and natural of your setup to aggression. A few pointers would be low drone count in natural(maynard some natural drones to the third base) and second gas timing. We shall talk more on this in the later sections.
By the time he realizes what is going on, you should have more than enough to defend against his attacks.
To make things easier to understand, I shall explain each sequence in the build order list as we go along so you can catch with me.
Build Orderzzz So we start of pretty standard: 9 Overlord 12 Hatch 12th Drone Scout(i.e. 13 supply) 14 Gas 13 Pool 100% Gas - 3 guys on gas 14 Hatch (At third gas location) Save minerals and gas until pool completes 100% Pool - Lair + Show Spoiler +The brilliance begins here. If you never had the micro-macro or game sense abilities of a progamer, you have a part in the brilliance if you reached this step.
Gas first allows you to get the lair right when your pool completes. The whole idea in this is for you to gain extra drones while abusing the fake against him. He will be unable to tell the difference in your drone count but the advantage you get is noticable.
The 3rd hatch needs to be at a gas location otherwise, there is no point in faking as you will be rushing for hive. 4 player maps are advantageous for this build.
Larvae Spending + Show Spoiler +If you have followed all these steps exactly, you will have exactly 4 larvae. 2 at main, 2 at nat. Now the biggest decision is how to spend these 4.
To make things simple, a recommended setup is 3 drones and 1 set of lings to chase away the scv. If you see no expansion yet at this point, then you should pause droning for a while, make a few more lings or add sunkens.
50% Lair - Den 21 4 Hydras(Move first two to your 3rd base location)
+ Show Spoiler +The first two hydras move to the 3rd base asap. Everything should halt and making these 4 hydras are the key.
After that, you can resume droning and add a sunken or two if you like. Remember that each sunken you add will delay your lurker count.
Note: You would notice by now that you are still on one gas. This is where the importance of denying scouting lies. You have to keep the scout in your base long enough for him to expect aggression and remove the scout before your lair completes to maintain the illusion. If for some reason you fail to deny scouting, you need to make the natural gas to keep up the illusion.
As mentioned before, try to maynard drones from the natural to your 3rd base. But make sure the maynarding path is clear before you move. 4 Lurkers + Show Spoiler +Not much to say here except that your first two lurkers should be made at your natural and the 3rd and 4th at your third. Queens Nest(At third base) 2nd and 3rd gas
From here, it is up to you to utilize your resources with the fast hive. The first priority is getting defilers before anything else and you should build up lurker count as well.
EDIT: The rep I used http://www.teamliquid.net/replay/download.php?replay=2010 EDIT: My bad about the vod. Effort did in fact do a 12 hatch.
Hope you enjoyed this short write up!
|
why u have to tell world about this bo >8(
|
Really cool build. Thanks for posting this. Can definitely lead to some epic fails if you don't deny scouting properly though
|
That vod being corrupted pains me.
|
the only thing that comes up to me when I see people try to do tricky stuff is Drop and drop at his expo and pray I snipe off all his extractor and spawning pool . Nice observation and build orer.
|
I'm a big fan of builds like this. It pretty much exploits players that opt for a late academy as, even if they scout it, it's incredibly risky to try to attack a base with just marines against what can become 3 hatch speed lings. Also, a good player would always scout this base unless zerg has speedlings. Once speedlings are brought into the equation, terran figures the scouting scv would just be wasted so they won't scout, more times than not. Any build that makes it easier to eventually get a fourth and messes with your opponent's mind is great in my eyes. I'm curious to how it fares against good players that make an academy, quickly, if any do.
|
On November 16 2011 10:39 JMave wrote:Build OrderzzzSo we start of pretty standard: 9 Overlord 12 Hatch + Show Spoiler +The analysed rep used a 12 hatch variant. If you watched the Effort game earlier, you would see that he went for a 9 pool gas. 9 pool gas will give you earlier ling speed, which you can use to threaten a runby and to deny scouting. But if you choose this route, you need to be careful with the way you spend larvae and take care of your timings. I wouldn't recommend unless you have good larvae management. Didn't watch rep yet, but the vod used 12 hatch. Does 9 pool give a strong enough economy?
|
damn dude! I tried to copy what effort was doing a few months back but never got the feel to it. Can't wait to read this through with time and test it out many thanks man!
|
9 pool gas means he did 12 hatch down to 11, build pool down to 10 and gas down to 9. so when he did this he have 3 larva left. this build is basically a gamble. i did this build in fish , a timing push will make you behind and if he scouted your 3rd after that , the game is over lol but if he did not scouted yet , as time pass , you're leading.
|
9 pool gas always means 9pool (without overlord), then relatevely quick gas (9pool, 8gas or 9pool 9 drone 9gas). Calling 12 hatch 11pool 10 gas opening a "9pool gas" is ridiculous and confusing because timings are so different.
9pool gas is agressive low eco opening which gives you map control and allows to deny any scouting. Being blind, opponent (only t or p of course) is forced to defend against everything and timings of those threats are very hard to match. Common transitions from 9 pool gas are 2 hatch muta/lurker/hydra or even 1 hatch lurker/ling all-in.
I've been experimenting with 9pool speed/lair opening in ZvT and must say there is no point in going 3 hatch something once you've gotten that early gas. Also, the build you described gets pool at 13 drone after 14 gas. I cant believe this can be left unpunished vs C- and higher terrans if they scout you first. Maybe this was a metagame assumption, "ok Flash wont go early rax and hopefuly will not scout me with first scv", but still a bit risky on ladder, in my opinion.
|
On November 17 2011 17:24 gu-val wrote: 9 pool gas always means 9pool (without overlord), then relatevely quick gas (9pool, 8gas or 9pool 9 drone 9gas). Calling 12 hatch 11pool 10 gas opening a "9pool gas" is ridiculous and confusing because timings are so different.
9pool gas is agressive low eco opening which gives you map control and allows to deny any scouting. Being blind, opponent (only t or p of course) is forced to defend against everything and timings of those threats are very hard to match. Common transitions from 9 pool gas are 2 hatch muta/lurker/hydra or even 1 hatch lurker/ling all-in.
I've been experimenting with 9pool speed/lair opening in ZvT and must say there is no point in going 3 hatch something once you've gotten that early gas. Also, the build you described gets pool at 13 drone after 14 gas. I cant believe this can be left unpunished vs C- and higher terrans if they scout you first. Maybe this was a metagame assumption, "ok Flash wont go early rax and hopefuly will not scout me with first scv", but still a bit risky on ladder, in my opinion.
ok my bad on the 9 pool gas. it might have been a different game where he went 9 pool gas. the vod showed he went 12 hatch. my bad.
well.. no point theory-crafting. it is just like saying how a terran should not go unpunished by going 14cc against zerg.
|
I watched that game many times, and Effort didn't fake a 2 hatch muta: he faked a 2 hatch lurker all-in. You can tell even if you don't understand Korean commentators like me by looking at Flash's response: 3 bunkers at his natural. Basically, Effort made flash waste 3 bunkers by showing a low drone count in his main and natural with an early hydra de'n. This was further enhanced by Effort being very aggressive with his lings, constantly moving lings in and out of Flash's Vision. Effort, while Flash was holed up in his base preparing for the lurkers that never came, got a hidden 3rd base and teched to hive extremely fast, so by the time Flash realized he was fooled and moved out, Effort got defilers. The gas saved from having to produce mutas and large numbers of lurkers was spent on ultras and upgrades, hitting flash before he was ready to deal with them.
First time in a long time flash was completely duped like that.
|
On November 18 2011 22:53 jpak wrote: I watched that game many times, and Effort didn't fake a 2 hatch muta: he faked a 2 hatch lurker all-in. You can tell even if you don't understand Korean commentators like me by looking at Flash's response: 3 bunkers at his natural. Basically, Effort made flash waste 3 bunkers by showing a low drone count in his main and natural with an early hydra de'n. This was further enhanced by Effort being very aggressive with his lings, constantly moving lings in and out of Flash's Vision. Effort, while Flash was holed up in his base preparing for the lurkers that never came, got a hidden 3rd base and teched to hive extremely fast, so by the time Flash realized he was fooled and moved out, Effort got defilers. The gas saved from having to produce mutas and large numbers of lurkers was spent on ultras and upgrades, hitting flash before he was ready to deal with them.
First time in a long time flash was completely duped like that. err.. i never said this was a fake 2 hatch muta? this is a fake 2 hatch build where you go into a 3rd gas with a fast queens nest to hive.
|
I think he meant that the key is faking zergling + lurker all in. It forces terran to waste minerals on setting up defenses.
I am thinking that if terran was just stupid and/or did not think about z's all in and just make more marine + medic, it might have resulted different result.
So Z has to act it out and show intentions of all-in. Much like fake hydra bust to lurker contain for Protoss.
|
Stuff like this makes bw much more interesting for weaker players. The linked vod was about 10 times more fun to watch after reading your explanation of what Effort was doing. Can you make your next post in the series one about Terran strategy? :D
|
On November 18 2011 22:53 jpak wrote: I watched that game many times, and Effort didn't fake a 2 hatch muta: he faked a 2 hatch lurker all-in. You can tell even if you don't understand Korean commentators like me by looking at Flash's response: 3 bunkers at his natural. Basically, Effort made flash waste 3 bunkers by showing a low drone count in his main and natural with an early hydra de'n. This was further enhanced by Effort being very aggressive with his lings, constantly moving lings in and out of Flash's Vision. Effort, while Flash was holed up in his base preparing for the lurkers that never came, got a hidden 3rd base and teched to hive extremely fast, so by the time Flash realized he was fooled and moved out, Effort got defilers. The gas saved from having to produce mutas and large numbers of lurkers was spent on ultras and upgrades, hitting flash before he was ready to deal with them.
First time in a long time flash was completely duped like that. actually to add on, the way you described effort's play doesn't give him the due credit he deserves for that brilliance. flash was more than ready to deal with the ultralisk threat head-on but the way effort went about by doing multiple drops and constantly cutting off flash's movements was the deal sealer.
|
On November 20 2011 13:26 mtwow789 wrote: I think he meant that the key is faking zergling + lurker all in. It forces terran to waste minerals on setting up defenses.
I am thinking that if terran was just stupid and/or did not think about z's all in and just make more marine + medic, it might have resulted different result.
So Z has to act it out and show intentions of all-in. Much like fake hydra bust to lurker contain for Protoss.
Yup I understand. But I did not say that the build I showed is the exact representation of Effort's build. The concept is still the same to feign aggression while gassing and teching up very fast.
|
I just wanted to check...do you leave the three drones on gas from the very beginning? I realize now that I didn't catch the rearrangement of the initial building times, but when I tried something along these lines I was floating gas early on. Should this be the case?
|
if you decide to go and apply ling pressure with speed, then you can take guys off gas for a short while until you can get sufficient lings before putting them back again.
is it okay to be floating gas because once your eco is up and running, you should be able to use it real fast.
|
On November 21 2011 14:15 JMave wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2011 22:53 jpak wrote: I watched that game many times, and Effort didn't fake a 2 hatch muta: he faked a 2 hatch lurker all-in. You can tell even if you don't understand Korean commentators like me by looking at Flash's response: 3 bunkers at his natural. Basically, Effort made flash waste 3 bunkers by showing a low drone count in his main and natural with an early hydra de'n. This was further enhanced by Effort being very aggressive with his lings, constantly moving lings in and out of Flash's Vision. Effort, while Flash was holed up in his base preparing for the lurkers that never came, got a hidden 3rd base and teched to hive extremely fast, so by the time Flash realized he was fooled and moved out, Effort got defilers. The gas saved from having to produce mutas and large numbers of lurkers was spent on ultras and upgrades, hitting flash before he was ready to deal with them.
First time in a long time flash was completely duped like that. actually to add on, the way you described effort's play doesn't give him the due credit he deserves for that brilliance. flash was more than ready to deal with the ultralisk threat head-on but the way effort went about by doing multiple drops and constantly cutting off flash's movements was the deal sealer.
Flash tried to catch up by taking both 6 and 5 o'clock bases at the same time, which made him spread his forces very thin. Plus, the majority of his army was out in the middle cutting effort's fifth when effort hit him with those drops.
Effort didn't actually need a fifth base for a while ( no gas spent on mutas + only a few lurkers). He just planted those hatches to draw flash out. All brilliantly thought out and executed by effort. As Ver said, he completely dissected flash in savior fashion.
|
|
|
|