• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:15
CEST 09:15
KST 16:15
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments0[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence10Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12
Community News
BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch0Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups4WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments1SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia8Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues29
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy SpeCial on The Tasteless Podcast Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around
Brood War
General
NaDa's Body Soulkey on ASL S20 BW General Discussion A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group D [ASL20] Ro16 Group C [Megathread] Daily Proleagues BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Borderlands 3 General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
I <=> 9
KrillinFromwales
The Personality of a Spender…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1905 users

[G] Griffith's Magic Box

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 Next All
Griffith`
Profile Joined September 2010
714 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-22 16:42:27
February 21 2011 20:54 GMT
#1
----------------------------------------
| GRIFFITH'S MAGIC BOX |
----------------------------------------

I've written an iterative script in the map editor that accurately and precisely determined the size of the magic box. Note that the mutalisk magic box is only a special case of the general property of magic boxes, so for the sake of clarity, the general magic box will be referred to as "Griffith's Magic Box".

As long as your units are within Griffith's Magic Box, they will move in formation, so long as they avoid tight choke points like ramps. A bit of note for attack move on the bottom.

The following values are accurate to 0.02 precision decimals for pure unit compositions:

Mutalisk, Medivac, Phoenix, Banshee: 6.480
Overlord: 5.980
Carriers: 5.401
Zerglings, Marines, High Templars, Ghosts, Banelings: 5.241
Zealots, Roaches, Sentries: 4.990
Marauder: 4.862
Stalkers : 4.742
Hellion: 4.380
Tanks: 4.241

For example, so long as your marines are within a 5.241x5.241 box they will always move in formation. To provide you with a feeling of how big the 5.241x5.241 box is:

http://i.imgur.com/VQm8h.png

Mixed unit groups are rather complicated to deal with with varying results, but in general, the mixed magic box inherit the size of the smallest pure unit magic box.

Implications:

The Key Crux of the magic box is that you no longer have to split units a million ways during the fight. Instead, you can preparing your splitting long before the fight by assigning the setup groups to hotkeys.

TvZ
The marine magic box can roughly fit ~10 marines that are spread out. Meaning it is MUCH MUCH easier to deal with banelings and fungal growths because you can split marines way ahead of time.

PvT
The HT and Sentry magic box provides ample room for to spread out sentries and HTs. This will make it much harder for ghosts to roffle-EMP an entire group of spellcasters.

ZvT
Spread banelings will prove to be extremely useful against siege tanks.

TvP
Hard to say. For bio based play it will make storms and colossi splash less effective.

About Attack Move
I you attack move - the instant an enemy is within attack range, you will lose formation and units will arrange in a formation to attack the units. You can avoid this by M - moving to the ideal point then either A-move or Stop.



griffith.583 (NA)
Toxi78
Profile Joined May 2010
966 Posts
February 21 2011 20:58 GMT
#2
OMG HE INVENTED THE MAGIC BOX I HOPE TASTOSIS USES THE TERM "GRIFFITHING" TOMORROW!!!

User was warned for this post
iEchoic
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1776 Posts
February 21 2011 20:59 GMT
#3
The use I'm seeing is when the opponent has infestors and you need to stim ahead a small bundle of units in order to kill the infestors so they can't fungal you while you're moving.

Not at home at the moment so I can't test this, but pre-emptive high-five if this works, I'll give it a try later.
vileEchoic -- clanvile.com
xiaofan
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States513 Posts
February 21 2011 21:02 GMT
#4
that's pretty cool. in bw the only magic box size distinction is whether the unit is air or ground
falstag
Profile Joined November 2010
United States55 Posts
February 21 2011 21:07 GMT
#5
Seems solid... need to test it out. FG, storm and splash damage come to mind where this can be useful.
If he looks weird, its his placement match
nihlon
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden5581 Posts
February 21 2011 21:08 GMT
#6
On February 22 2011 05:58 Toxi78 wrote:
OMG HE INVENTED THE MAGIC BOX I HOPE TASTOSIS USES THE TERM "GRIFFITHING" TOMORROW!!!


Are you really born in 78?
Banelings are too cute to blow up
Keifru
Profile Joined November 2010
United States179 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-21 21:14:05
February 21 2011 21:12 GMT
#7
Although just a tad egotistical to just name something that's been known (in general; for one unit) for awhile now, having the exact size of the box is pretty good information.

Do speed upgrades affect the size of the Magic Box (For zerglings/banelings)?
You give the numbers for pure unit combinations- is this because mixed unit comps don't work, or did you just not test them?
Does going on/coming off creep affect the Magic Boxing of zerg units? (I would think it would break it- but you're the one with the tester.)
Conflict is the gadfly of thought. It stirs us to observation and memory. It instigates us to invention. It shocks us out of sheeplike passivity, and sets us at noting and contriving. - John Dewey
Griffith`
Profile Joined September 2010
714 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-21 21:15:11
February 21 2011 21:15 GMT
#8
On February 22 2011 06:12 Keifru wrote:
Although just a tad egotistical to just name something that's been known (in general; for one unit) for awhile now, having the exact size of the box is pretty good information.

Do speed upgrades affect the size of the Magic Box (For zerglings/banelings)?
You give the numbers for pure unit combinations- is this because mixed unit comps don't work, or did you just not test them?


Speed upgrades have no effect. The box sizes seem to be a function of Movement - Radius property. Unit comps will generally inherit the smallest pure magic box size. But there were some weird exceptions where it averages (like 1 marauder and 3 marines)
griffith.583 (NA)
Ponyo
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States1231 Posts
February 21 2011 21:17 GMT
#9
so you just split up your army into different hotkeys..?
ponyo.848
Keifru
Profile Joined November 2010
United States179 Posts
February 21 2011 21:19 GMT
#10
This is also pretty useful for making staggard lines of zerglings/marines to engage colossi- you can arrange them so that only one zergling takes the alpha strike- just set them up in a zig-zag pattern.
Hrm.
Conflict is the gadfly of thought. It stirs us to observation and memory. It instigates us to invention. It shocks us out of sheeplike passivity, and sets us at noting and contriving. - John Dewey
KevinIX
Profile Joined October 2009
United States2472 Posts
February 21 2011 21:21 GMT
#11
Holy shit. This is quite interesting... could be very useful knowledge for the early game.
Liquid FIGHTING!!!
Griffith`
Profile Joined September 2010
714 Posts
February 21 2011 21:21 GMT
#12
On February 22 2011 06:17 Ponyo wrote:
so you just split up your army into different hotkeys..?


Yes, my key is set up so I have 4 groups (1-4) for army control
griffith.583 (NA)
Dudemeister
Profile Joined July 2010
Sweden314 Posts
February 21 2011 21:24 GMT
#13
OMG it actually works! This is huge! Bye bye tanks splashing my banes
Phee
Profile Joined November 2010
United Kingdom29 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-21 21:25:56
February 21 2011 21:25 GMT
#14
This may seem like a noob question. But how do you magic box? I'm a 3.3K+ masters Zerg and don't know how to oO lol
Phee - MaximusBrood
iChau
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1210 Posts
February 21 2011 21:28 GMT
#15
On February 22 2011 06:25 Phee wrote:
This may seem like a noob question. But how do you magic box? I'm a 3.3K+ masters Zerg and don't know how to oO lol


With mutas you press hold pos.
us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1688911/1/SaniShahin/ | http://teamenvy.net/
freetgy
Profile Joined November 2010
1720 Posts
February 21 2011 21:28 GMT
#16
this is actually huge, to keep units spread on ground properly!
OmNomSpy
Profile Joined August 2010
United States68 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-21 21:30:35
February 21 2011 21:29 GMT
#17
Griffith's Magic Box™ should be used in conjunction with Griffith's 4OC Pressure Push™. That way, when you build Grififth's Marines™ you can completely decimate ling/baneling until you have enough factories to produce Griffith's Tanks™. Eventually, I think Griffith's Magic Box™, and really Griffith's ZvT Strategy™ in general will revolutionize Griffith's Starcraft 2™.

Edit: all joking aside this is actually a pretty cool find.
Mindflow
Profile Joined November 2010
Korea (South)320 Posts
February 21 2011 21:32 GMT
#18
nice -.- pro mode now
Dudemeister
Profile Joined July 2010
Sweden314 Posts
February 21 2011 21:32 GMT
#19
On February 22 2011 06:29 OmNomSpy wrote:
Griffith's Magic Box™ should be used in conjunction with Griffith's 4OC Pressure Push™. That way, when you build Grififth's Marines™ you can completely decimate ling/baneling until you have enough factories to produce Griffith's Tanks™. Eventually, I think Griffith's Magic Box™, and really Griffith's ZvT Strategy™ in general will revolutionize Griffith's Starcraft 2™.

Edit: all joking aside this is actually a pretty cool find.


Haha couldn't resist could you?


Anyway, this only seems practical in the early stages of the game where unit counts are low and they can fit in the box.
Phee
Profile Joined November 2010
United Kingdom29 Posts
February 21 2011 21:33 GMT
#20
On February 22 2011 06:28 iChau wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 22 2011 06:25 Phee wrote:
This may seem like a noob question. But how do you magic box? I'm a 3.3K+ masters Zerg and don't know how to oO lol


With mutas you press hold pos.



And is the hold button used with all of the other units as well?
Phee - MaximusBrood
1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 45m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech77
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 1863
JulyZerg 60
HiyA 51
Nal_rA 48
Dewaltoss 34
ToSsGirL 26
ajuk12(nOOB) 21
Bale 17
SilentControl 6
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm127
League of Legends
JimRising 571
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K636
shoxiejesuss164
Other Games
summit1g7943
C9.Mang0315
XaKoH 143
Trikslyr19
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick664
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 41
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 4
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1073
• Stunt521
• HappyZerGling55
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
2h 45m
Maru vs Reynor
Cure vs TriGGeR
Map Test Tournament
3h 45m
The PondCast
5h 45m
RSL Revival
1d 2h
Zoun vs Classic
Korean StarCraft League
1d 19h
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Online Event
3 days
[ Show More ]
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
LiuLi Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-10
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL World Championship of Poland 2025
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.